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Post by Final Countdown Jones on May 7, 2022 13:40:11 GMT -5
I can't imagine how difficult and annoying it must be to be a mod on a large wrestling forum and have to deal with the more extreme fans. I remember on Reddit during that 24 hour period last year when CM Punk debuted in AEW on Friday then Summerslam was on Saturday the place was a cesspool. The Summerslam live thread was filled with AEW/Punk fans downvoting all the actual discussion and trying to hijack the thread talking about AEW and how much they supposedly didn't care about Summerslam despite specifically clicking and commenting on a thread about it. About halfway threw the show a stickied mod message was put at the top of the page saying to knock it off and if you're here just to talk shit and not commenting on the actual show you'll be banned and what do you know, the live thread was a pleasant experience for the rest of the show. It must have been too much work though because I'm pretty sure it went right back to normal the next day/week. AEW stans downvote WWE show threads and go in to talk shit while WWE stans do the same, going into clearly marked AEW threads just to be negative. And to clarify, I'm not talking about people who genuinely watch a show and have complaints. I'm talking about the people who admit they rarely if ever watch but still can't help but constantly add negativity I guess just to pass time or amuse themselves. If you don't watch WWE/AEW there's really no reason for you to even be in their section surely unless there's some huge story you feel you have to comment on. It wouldn't surprise me if some were poking the bear just to their reaction just to say "see how cringy WWE/are/wrestling fans are unlike fans of WWE/aew/mma/MY-combat-sport-of-choice." Just to keep the toxic cycle going. That aboslutely happens. I can't say for sure how many were doing it on reddit that night or anything, but there is an entire thing online where you create a sockpuppet account saying stuff as cartoonish as you think you can get away with, and then accounts that screencap "outrageous things SJWs/fans of this thing/gaming journalists/etc say" take those and they say "Look here's how sincerely crazy the people I'm talking about are! They're awful" and that perpetuates the cycle. It's been going on for years and it's so painfully simple to do on social media where there's no hands-on moderation with people who can see IPs and call foul, where the effort to make a new account is so low, and where the volume of people active is so great that few are likely to scope you or your information out if they just want a guy to be mad at. All it takes is a few very bored trolls to easily populate the feeds of cherry pickers with all the shit they could need. Which is another reason to not put too much stock into isolated nightmare takes.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on May 7, 2022 13:42:21 GMT -5
If you want to know about weirdly toxic and defensive fans, try opening up a OTT competitor in Ireland with the ability to pay talent more than they were anywhere else and you’d even get the people in that promotion itself being toxic turds about it.
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Post by 06vwgti on May 7, 2022 14:54:01 GMT -5
I generally am negative toward WWE because the product is just boring yet they keep turning more and more profit. They literally have zero incentive to ever put on a good show. Some people think they do put on good shows. If it’s not what you like, that’s fine, but that doesn’t mean everyone else doesn’t like it. I think the expectation is it could be even better than what it is with the talent they have
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Post by oxbaker on May 7, 2022 15:12:56 GMT -5
Some people think they do put on good shows. If it’s not what you like, that’s fine, but that doesn’t mean everyone else doesn’t like it. I think the expectation is it could be even better than what it is with the talent they have That would be true of basically anything, right? What I was responding to was a person saying ‘they have zero incentive to every put on a good show.’ I believe a lot of people who watch it every week think it is a good show. (And I think it’s beyond lazy to say ‘well they’re all brainwashed,’ which seems to be a kneejerk reaction for some — I watch WWE and like a lot of it, but my favorite promotion pre-shutdown for about 10 years was ROH, so I don’t think I’m brainwashed. I’ve been to as many or more indie shows in person than WWE. I’ve been to AEW. Liking WWE doesn’t mean you’ve never been exposed to anything else, nor does it mean you don’t like other wrestling.) I don’t like everything WWE does. I like some of what AEW does and don’t like other aspects of it. I tried TNA/Impact numerous times over the years when people would say it was good/getting better but it never clicked with me. And as much as I liked ROH, I didn’t like everything about it all the time. I think WWE could do better. I think every wrestling company could do better. That’s why we criticize things sometimes. But I don’t think it’s utter and complete garbage, and I don’t understand people who feel compelled to post that sentiment every time someone discusses something about WWE that they like, or who say they don’t watch anymore but dump on it. If you hate something, move on man.
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The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
AGGRESSIVE Executive Janitor of the Third Floor Manager's Bathroom
Posts: 37,379
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Post by The Ichi on May 7, 2022 15:36:18 GMT -5
If social media existed during the Monday Night War, that shit woulda been absolutely awful. There are completely toxic fans on both sides of the aisle when it comes to this debate. There are absolutely completely ridiculous AEW fans that take shit way to far and they are met with the Edrones that populate twitter that go so far as to attack people like Dave and SRS because they say anything bad about WWE. Personally it'd be nice if both products were good, I have no desire for wrestling monopolies or terrible shows. I'll also say this the absolute worst thing about wrestling fans/some companies is the overwhelming desire to shit on people who know about the product. Calling them basement dwellers etc etc. NFL fans don't shit on each other for knowing about their teams, the draft etc. Baseball fans don't shit on each other for knowing about the top minor league prospects. The whole thing gets really stupid after awhile. Neither company is gonna go out of business anytime soon, they're both doing well in todays ratings spectrum and turning profits. I personally will flip shit at WWE though for turning their business model into Walmart. Maybe. I personally have Twitter, and never will. But I have yet to see a take like this from a WWE hardcore fan. Like I said, I don't ever even see WWE hardcore fans. This kind of stuff is always from AEW fans. Sorry to say. Imagine threatening someone with physical violence because he or she doesn't like your favorite television show. I'm sorry that what happened happened, but let me stop you with the "AEW fans are the only people that will do this" attempted narrative. I've been racially abused, doxxed, mocked for my dads death to cancer (as a result of being doxxed), had joke accounts made about me, had numerous death threats. You name it, it's happened. Why? For making the mildest criticisms about WWE between the years 2003 and 2008 in chat rooms and on social media. This was when I was a huge fan but commited the crime of being young and sarcastic, even towards stuff I liked. I dread to think what my current feelings towards the company would get me if I ventured from the safety of this website, but you and I both know it wouldn't be good. This kind of thing isn't unique to any fanbase. I haven't experienced it with AEW, just like you haven't experienced it with WWE. But to say it doesn't exist? You know better than that. Again, sorry for your experience. But don't lie.
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Post by Raw is Doodie101 on May 7, 2022 15:46:53 GMT -5
Maybe. I personally have Twitter, and never will. But I have yet to see a take like this from a WWE hardcore fan. Like I said, I don't ever even see WWE hardcore fans. This kind of stuff is always from AEW fans. Sorry to say. Imagine threatening someone with physical violence because he or she doesn't like your favorite television show. I'm sorry that what happened happened, but let me stop you with the "AEW fans are the only people that will do this" attempted narrative. I've been racially abused, doxxed, mocked for my dads death to cancer (as a result of being doxxed), had joke accounts made about me, had numerous death threats. You name it, it's happened. Why? For making the mildest criticisms about WWE between the years 2003 and 2008 in chat rooms and on social media. This was when I was a huge fan but commited the crime of being young and sarcastic, even towards stuff I liked. I dread to think what my current feelings towards the company would get me if I ventured from the safety of this website, but you and I both know it wouldn't be good. This kind of thing isn't unique to any fanbase. I haven't experienced it with AEW, just like you haven't experienced it with WWE. But to say it doesn't exist? You know better than that. Again, sorry for your experience. But don't lie. I don't think he's lying and I definitely think there are people out there who will harass people for anti-WWE viewpoints I just don't think that's the overwhelming majority of hate these days is pro WWE fans. I just don't see that and I am on all the Twitter, Reddit, this site, etc to talk about wrestling. I do not see that. It's decidedly anti WWE/pro AEW I totally understand that you got a lot of hate from the online community but that hate you got is almost 20 years ago and for the most part, the internet has moved decidedly towards a negative WWE view where I doubt your comments would get any hate these days unless go and give critique on the most pro-WWE sections of the internet and even then I don't think you would get much of the stuff that you faced back then.
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The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
AGGRESSIVE Executive Janitor of the Third Floor Manager's Bathroom
Posts: 37,379
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Post by The Ichi on May 7, 2022 15:51:25 GMT -5
I'm sorry that what happened happened, but let me stop you with the "AEW fans are the only people that will do this" attempted narrative. I've been racially abused, doxxed, mocked for my dads death to cancer (as a result of being doxxed), had joke accounts made about me, had numerous death threats. You name it, it's happened. Why? For making the mildest criticisms about WWE between the years 2003 and 2008 in chat rooms and on social media. This was when I was a huge fan but commited the crime of being young and sarcastic, even towards stuff I liked. I dread to think what my current feelings towards the company would get me if I ventured from the safety of this website, but you and I both know it wouldn't be good. This kind of thing isn't unique to any fanbase. I haven't experienced it with AEW, just like you haven't experienced it with WWE. But to say it doesn't exist? You know better than that. Again, sorry for your experience. But don't lie. I don't think he's lying and I definitely think there are people out there who will harass people for anti-WWE viewpoints I just don't think that's the overwhelming majority of hate these days is pro WWE fans. I just don't see that and I am on all the Twitter, Reddit, this site, etc to talk about wrestling. I do not see that. It's decidedly anti WWE/pro AEW I totally understand that you got a lot of hate from the online community but that hate you got is almost 20 years ago and for the most part, the internet has moved decidedly towards a negative WWE view where I doubt your comments would get any hate these days unless go and give critique on the most pro-WWE sections of the internet and even then I don't think you would get much of the stuff that you faced back then. If I gave my opinion on Twitter I would definitely be met with the same. I can't tell you how confident I am of that. It only takes a passing glance of some accounts there.
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on May 7, 2022 15:57:30 GMT -5
"The problem is tribalism, because people who aren't us but are the other side of the fandom are the toxic ones and do most of the hate" doesn't even need to be presented with a comment. Like on its face it's so already speaking for itself.
Anyway AEWBotches has over 20,000 followers on twitter, neat fact.
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Post by Cyno on May 7, 2022 15:58:09 GMT -5
I just avoid wrestling discourse on Twitter and social media in general. It's a shit show. I'd say I see a lot more of it from WWE stans, but you can likely chalk that up to there being a lot more WWE fans than AEW fans. So I can't really say one fanbase is more toxic than the other.
I am amused by the amount of people decrying tribalism while simultaneously perpetrating tribalism, though. You want to complain about hypocrisy? Look in the mirror first.
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
Posts: 25,128
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Post by Mecca on May 7, 2022 15:59:28 GMT -5
I'm sorry that what happened happened, but let me stop you with the "AEW fans are the only people that will do this" attempted narrative. I've been racially abused, doxxed, mocked for my dads death to cancer (as a result of being doxxed), had joke accounts made about me, had numerous death threats. You name it, it's happened. Why? For making the mildest criticisms about WWE between the years 2003 and 2008 in chat rooms and on social media. This was when I was a huge fan but commited the crime of being young and sarcastic, even towards stuff I liked. I dread to think what my current feelings towards the company would get me if I ventured from the safety of this website, but you and I both know it wouldn't be good. This kind of thing isn't unique to any fanbase. I haven't experienced it with AEW, just like you haven't experienced it with WWE. But to say it doesn't exist? You know better than that. Again, sorry for your experience. But don't lie. I don't think he's lying and I definitely think there are people out there who will harass people for anti-WWE viewpoints I just don't think that's the overwhelming majority of hate these days is pro WWE fans. I just don't see that and I am on all the Twitter, Reddit, this site, etc to talk about wrestling. I do not see that. It's decidedly anti WWE/pro AEW I totally understand that you got a lot of hate from the online community but that hate you got is almost 20 years ago and for the most part, the internet has moved decidedly towards a negative WWE view where I doubt your comments would get any hate these days unless go and give critique on the most pro-WWE sections of the internet and even then I don't think you would get much of the stuff that you faced back then. There's an entire subreddit dedicated to shitting on AEW and it's fans while white knighting WWE...it's called SCJerk... It exists on both sides.
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Bo Rida
Fry's dog Seymour
Pulled one over on everyone. Got away with it, this time.
Posts: 23,804
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Post by Bo Rida on May 7, 2022 15:59:47 GMT -5
I'm just glad we're finally at a point in time when wwe, aew and fans of many other promotions can unite and find common ground. All join together for one worthy cause.
Mocking Control Your Narrative.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2022 16:05:13 GMT -5
I guess what's just so wild to me about all of this is that it's really just deciding which billionaire who doesn't know you or give a shit about you that you like best. It's no different than fanboying for Exxon-Mobil's, Verizon's, or Walmart's quarterly reports. Just seems weird.
This isn't talking about booking, the wrestling, the characters or any of that, just profitability.
The WWE is borderline bulletproof as a business entity. I only give a shit about AEW's business dealings in so far as it increases the likelihood that I'll have more AEW to watch in the years to come.
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Post by Raw is Doodie101 on May 7, 2022 16:07:47 GMT -5
I don't think he's lying and I definitely think there are people out there who will harass people for anti-WWE viewpoints I just don't think that's the overwhelming majority of hate these days is pro WWE fans. I just don't see that and I am on all the Twitter, Reddit, this site, etc to talk about wrestling. I do not see that. It's decidedly anti WWE/pro AEW I totally understand that you got a lot of hate from the online community but that hate you got is almost 20 years ago and for the most part, the internet has moved decidedly towards a negative WWE view where I doubt your comments would get any hate these days unless go and give critique on the most pro-WWE sections of the internet and even then I don't think you would get much of the stuff that you faced back then. There's an entire subreddit dedicated to shitting on AEW and it's fans while white knighting WWE...it's called SCJerk... It exists on both sides. I went and checked that sub out. God damn.
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Post by 06vwgti on May 7, 2022 16:56:00 GMT -5
I think the expectation is it could be even better than what it is with the talent they have That would be true of basically anything, right? What I was responding to was a person saying ‘they have zero incentive to every put on a good show.’ I believe a lot of people who watch it every week think it is a good show. (And I think it’s beyond lazy to say ‘well they’re all brainwashed,’ which seems to be a kneejerk reaction for some — I watch WWE and like a lot of it, but my favorite promotion pre-shutdown for about 10 years was ROH, so I don’t think I’m brainwashed. I’ve been to as many or more indie shows in person than WWE. I’ve been to AEW. Liking WWE doesn’t mean you’ve never been exposed to anything else, nor does it mean you don’t like other wrestling.) I don’t like everything WWE does. I like some of what AEW does and don’t like other aspects of it. I tried TNA/Impact numerous times over the years when people would say it was good/getting better but it never clicked with me. And as much as I liked ROH, I didn’t like everything about it all the time. I think WWE could do better. I think every wrestling company could do better. That’s why we criticize things sometimes. But I don’t think it’s utter and complete garbage, and I don’t understand people who feel compelled to post that sentiment every time someone discusses something about WWE that they like, or who say they don’t watch anymore but dump on it. If you hate something, move on man. If you say so, but Im surprised you do like AEW stuff, most of your posts in there are quite negative and the opposite over here. I guess the disconnect for some was the enjoyment several got out of NXT Black and Gold pre 2019ish and then watch a Raw or SD and feel things could be better, its like people were hoping what was going on pre AEW NXT would light a spark to the main roster bc it was coming from the same company I get why people feel like they aren't trying to put a good show, they'll pull off good stuff at Wrestlemania or Summer Slam and the Rumble, but between that it does feel like a lull.
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Post by oxbaker on May 7, 2022 17:26:59 GMT -5
That would be true of basically anything, right? What I was responding to was a person saying ‘they have zero incentive to every put on a good show.’ I believe a lot of people who watch it every week think it is a good show. (And I think it’s beyond lazy to say ‘well they’re all brainwashed,’ which seems to be a kneejerk reaction for some — I watch WWE and like a lot of it, but my favorite promotion pre-shutdown for about 10 years was ROH, so I don’t think I’m brainwashed. I’ve been to as many or more indie shows in person than WWE. I’ve been to AEW. Liking WWE doesn’t mean you’ve never been exposed to anything else, nor does it mean you don’t like other wrestling.) I don’t like everything WWE does. I like some of what AEW does and don’t like other aspects of it. I tried TNA/Impact numerous times over the years when people would say it was good/getting better but it never clicked with me. And as much as I liked ROH, I didn’t like everything about it all the time. I think WWE could do better. I think every wrestling company could do better. That’s why we criticize things sometimes. But I don’t think it’s utter and complete garbage, and I don’t understand people who feel compelled to post that sentiment every time someone discusses something about WWE that they like, or who say they don’t watch anymore but dump on it. If you hate something, move on man. If you say so, but Im surprised you do like AEW stuff, most of your posts in there are quite negative and the opposite over here. I guess the disconnect for some was the enjoyment several got out of NXT Black and Gold pre 2019ish and then watch a Raw or SD and feel things could be better, its like people were hoping what was going on pre AEW NXT would light a spark to the main roster. I get why people feel like they aren't trying to put a good show, they'll pull off good stuff at Wrestlemania or Summer Slam and the Rumble, but between that it does feel like a lull. Most of my posts on any of the forums here are obvious jokes — like quipping about Tony Khan on social media or how Ezekiel isn’t Elias. I don’t think they’re positive or negative. On the AEW forum those are taken much more seriously as ‘bashing’ than they are elsewhere — unless you’re in ‘the club’ and then it’s OK. The ‘negative’ things I’ve posted on that forum have been in agreement with threads and posts others have started — booking of the women’s division, agreeing that Sky’s slut-shaming line wasn’t necessary and wasn’t in character with the rest of his promo, that BCC needs something to do. If I’m negative, what about the others on those same threads? On the AEW forum I’ve also been very vocal about how the ratings are fine (NBA playoffs, duh) and that any fretting over the future of the promotion with the merger is overblown. I’ve praised Jericho’s booking and Wardlow’s, etc. I honestly don’t see how anyone could think I’m an AEW hater. I like it. I don’t think it’s perfect. I don’t preface every critical comment with ‘AEW is the greatest thing ever to happen to professional wrestling and I LOVE almost everything they do, but ..’ because I think that’s kind of silly and unnecessary. Maybe I should. EDIT: To address the lower part of your comment, that’s fair but people have also said the same things about AEW — right now they’re a few weeks out from a PPV and have very few storylines going to build matches … we don’t even know what some of the matches are. Which also happens in WWE. But nobody says ‘AEW isn’t trying because they’re good in the demo and know they’re not going to get canceled.’ And while people constantly post in the WWE forum that WWE is garbage and horrible, if you did the same in the AEW forum you’d be booted. Post the exact same thing in a thread in each — just sub AEW for WWE and vice versa — and see what you get.
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Malcolm
Grimlock
Wanted something done about the color of his ring.
May contain ADHD
Posts: 13,488
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Post by Malcolm on May 7, 2022 18:33:59 GMT -5
I don't even understand this weird need to play the "toxic Olympics" anyway.
So your fandom is less shit. You want a medal or something?
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Post by 06vwgti on May 7, 2022 18:35:23 GMT -5
If you say so, but Im surprised you do like AEW stuff, most of your posts in there are quite negative and the opposite over here. I guess the disconnect for some was the enjoyment several got out of NXT Black and Gold pre 2019ish and then watch a Raw or SD and feel things could be better, its like people were hoping what was going on pre AEW NXT would light a spark to the main roster. I get why people feel like they aren't trying to put a good show, they'll pull off good stuff at Wrestlemania or Summer Slam and the Rumble, but between that it does feel like a lull. Most of my posts on any of the forums here are obvious jokes — like quipping about Tony Khan on social media or how Ezekiel isn’t Elias. I don’t think they’re positive or negative. On the AEW forum those are taken much more seriously as ‘bashing’ than they are elsewhere — unless you’re in ‘the club’ and then it’s OK. The ‘negative’ things I’ve posted on that forum have been in agreement with threads and posts others have started — booking of the women’s division, agreeing that Sky’s slut-shaming line wasn’t necessary and wasn’t in character with the rest of his promo, that BCC needs something to do. If I’m negative, what about the others on those same threads? Mostly the mass hysteria over the ROH buyout I saw from you. Guess its hard to see some of your sarcasm on the threads since its over text. No thanks
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Post by oxbaker on May 7, 2022 18:41:10 GMT -5
Most of my posts on any of the forums here are obvious jokes — like quipping about Tony Khan on social media or how Ezekiel isn’t Elias. I don’t think they’re positive or negative. On the AEW forum those are taken much more seriously as ‘bashing’ than they are elsewhere — unless you’re in ‘the club’ and then it’s OK. The ‘negative’ things I’ve posted on that forum have been in agreement with threads and posts others have started — booking of the women’s division, agreeing that Sky’s slut-shaming line wasn’t necessary and wasn’t in character with the rest of his promo, that BCC needs something to do. If I’m negative, what about the others on those same threads? Mostly the mass hysteria over the ROH buyout I saw from you. Guess its hard to see some of your sarcasm on the threads since its over text. No thanks Fair enough. I’ve shared my passion for ROH and I don’t want to see it messed over with Tully Blanchard and a washed-out NBA giant who is there only to appease the network … they have their place in wrestling and may do fine, but that’s not the ROH that I know and love. You may also have missed my post on Ian Riccaboni and how I hope he’s assigned as the voice of ROH and not a crossover guy and how that would go a long way toward getting people like myself more on board with the product. (I think that was in the not-worthy-of-a-thread thread.) Maybe some of my sarcasm doesn’t go over. Some of it should be obvious, like my quips about Cody, Ezekiel and Gacy. To me Tony Khan on twitter is a meme by now. Not something someone should take offense to someone goofing on. And if you don’t think I joke on WWE, read some of my ‘books no one will buy’ in the Rest of Wrestling forum.
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Post by stoptheclocks on May 8, 2022 3:16:12 GMT -5
We sort of had this discussion not long ago on the AEW board. I think AEW being good and WWE being bad is basically seen as the default 'correct' opinion, which leads to there being a whiff of double standards (people posting about the WWE in a way that would see them warned or banned if they did the same for AEW). I wouldn't want to stop anyone shitting on something they dislike, but just have a little more self-awareness about it.
One thing that would definitely help this board however, is for people to stop using strawmen from Twitter/Reddit to prop up their own arguments. If you want to argue with weirdo AEW/WWE stans, go and do it on those platforms.
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
Posts: 25,128
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Post by Mecca on May 8, 2022 11:23:06 GMT -5
Now that I'm not working today I'll expound on some of what I said earlier. I'm critical of the WWE in the same way I'm critical of the sports teams I like. I want those teams to succeed and do well and when they make poor moves, bad decisions and end up sucking, I'll absolutely complain and critique them.
I'm a Kansas City Chiefs fan, for years and years they were terrible. I bitched about their stupid moves over and over why because they sucked. Then they finally got the right people in place and have become one of the best teams in the league, I no longer bitch about them. They have a proven track record that they know what they're doing in their results. That's how I feel about WWE, there is so much more there yet we don't see that, they make moves that are head scratchers etc.
I also do not give a shit if WWE turns a 400 million dollar quarterly profit just like I don't care how much profit the Chiefs turn, I care if they have an enjoyable product to consume.
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