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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on May 15, 2022 17:54:10 GMT -5
Flat no to rematches and repetitive booking. I could care less about these plans of theirs. No rematches ? You have to have some rematches otherwise there’d be no feuds in wrestling. So you could care more then ? Problem is with WWE from a narrative standpoint there's no reason why these rematches should be happening. It would be one thing if say the heel cheats to beat the face in the first match leading to a rematch where you want to see the face get even. Or some kind of double count out or double DQ finish where nothing was settled and they have to run it back to see who truly is the superior athlete. It's usually just a case where one person beats the other clean over and over. From a narrative standpoint it should be a total dead issue as one wrestler has decisively beaten the other decisively multiple times so therefore there's no reason why the feud should be continuing. However we keep getting things like these Bianca Belair "feuds" where she just keeps beating the crap out of these sad sack heels over and over again yet they keep doing them even though the heels pose absolutely no threat what so ever to her and they do absolutely nothing to make us think they are any kind of threat to her. It's just simply lazy booking because they don't give a crap. As mentioned they are still making money hand over fist no matter what crappy product they put out so I guess therefore they don't think it's important to be creative or put any thought into anything so they just run the same things over and over with either one of their top guys/girls constantly beating people they don't care about or two of their top guys/girls constantly fighting on PPV month after month in high profile matches when they easily could be mixing it up and giving some different people a chance instead.
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Post by mistery on May 15, 2022 19:56:46 GMT -5
No rematches ? You have to have some rematches otherwise there’d be no feuds in wrestling. So you could care more then ? Problem is with WWE from a narrative standpoint there's no reason why these rematches should be happening. It would be one thing if say the heel cheats to beat the face in the first match leading to a rematch where you want to see the face get even. Or some kind of double count out or double DQ finish where nothing was settled and they have to run it back to see who truly is the superior athlete. It's usually just a case where one person beats the other clean over and over. From a narrative standpoint it should be a total dead issue as one wrestler has decisively beaten the other decisively multiple times so therefore there's no reason why the feud should be continuing. However we keep getting things like these Bianca Belair "feuds" where she just keeps beating the crap out of these sad sack heels over and over again yet they keep doing them even though the heels pose absolutely no threat what so ever to her and they do absolutely nothing to make us think they are any kind of threat to her. It's just simply lazy booking because they don't give a crap. As mentioned they are still making money hand over fist no matter what crappy product they put out so I guess therefore they don't think it's important to be creative or put any thought into anything so they just run the same things over and over with either one of their top guys/girls constantly beating people they don't care about or two of their top guys/girls constantly fighting on PPV month after month in high profile matches when they easily could be mixing it up and giving some different people a chance instead. Honestly Bianca constantly bulldozing women is one of the reasons why I think she's starting to cool off. She just runs over the same person nonstop for several months. And no one benefits from feuding with her, because she pretty much never actually looks weak or in any sort of danger. I don't think she's had a 100% clean non-rollup pinfall loss to anyone on the main roster except for Charlotte and Becky.
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gl83
Dennis Stamp
Posts: 4,930
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Post by gl83 on May 15, 2022 20:05:07 GMT -5
Problem is with WWE from a narrative standpoint there's no reason why these rematches should be happening. It would be one thing if say the heel cheats to beat the face in the first match leading to a rematch where you want to see the face get even. Or some kind of double count out or double DQ finish where nothing was settled and they have to run it back to see who truly is the superior athlete. It's usually just a case where one person beats the other clean over and over. From a narrative standpoint it should be a total dead issue as one wrestler has decisively beaten the other decisively multiple times so therefore there's no reason why the feud should be continuing. However we keep getting things like these Bianca Belair "feuds" where she just keeps beating the crap out of these sad sack heels over and over again yet they keep doing them even though the heels pose absolutely no threat what so ever to her and they do absolutely nothing to make us think they are any kind of threat to her. It's just simply lazy booking because they don't give a crap. As mentioned they are still making money hand over fist no matter what crappy product they put out so I guess therefore they don't think it's important to be creative or put any thought into anything so they just run the same things over and over with either one of their top guys/girls constantly beating people they don't care about or two of their top guys/girls constantly fighting on PPV month after month in high profile matches when they easily could be mixing it up and giving some different people a chance instead. Honestly Bianca constantly bulldozing women is one of the reasons why I think she's starting to cool off. She just runs over the same person nonstop for several months. And no one benefits from feuding with her, because she pretty much never actually looks weak or in any sort of danger. I don't think she's had a 100% clean non-rollup pinfall loss to anyone on the main roster except for Charlotte and Becky. Bayley beat her before the Royal Rumble, but that was with a rake of the eyes followed by the Rose Plant, so it was still sorta dirty.
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on May 15, 2022 20:54:06 GMT -5
Honestly Bianca constantly bulldozing women is one of the reasons why I think she's starting to cool off. She just runs over the same person nonstop for several months. And no one benefits from feuding with her, because she pretty much never actually looks weak or in any sort of danger. I don't think she's had a 100% clean non-rollup pinfall loss to anyone on the main roster except for Charlotte and Becky. Bayley beat her before the Royal Rumble, but that was with a rake of the eyes followed by the Rose Plant, so it was still sorta dirty. How many times has Bianca been pinned since she's been on the main roster? There's that Bayley loss and then the two Becky losses (Summerslam, a Raw last November I think). And I think that's it right? I don't think Charlotte ever pinned her at least on the main roster as IIRC their matches ended in some kind of DQ schmoz. I remember her and Sasha losing to Nia and Shayna in the lead up to Mania 2021 but I think Sasha ate the pin. So unless I'm forgetting something she's only been pinned three times in two years. That's insane. I don't think even Becky during her OP summer 2018-early 2020 run was protected that much.
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Post by mistery on May 15, 2022 21:05:32 GMT -5
Bayley beat her before the Royal Rumble, but that was with a rake of the eyes followed by the Rose Plant, so it was still sorta dirty. How many times has Bianca been pinned since she's been on the main roster? There's that Bayley loss and then the two Becky losses (Summerslam, a Raw last November I think). And I think that's it right? I don't think Charlotte ever pinned her at least on the main roster as IIRC their matches ended in some kind of DQ schmoz. I remember her and Sasha losing to Nia and Shayna in the lead up to Mania 2021 but I think Sasha ate the pin. So unless I'm forgetting something she's only been pinned three times in two years. That's insane. I don't think even Becky during her OP summer 2018-early 2020 run was protected that much. Bianca ate a pin clean in a tag title match, with her and Sasha up against Charlotte and Asuka (who were the tag champs at the time), with Charlotte pinning Bianca clean.
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on May 15, 2022 21:24:19 GMT -5
How many times has Bianca been pinned since she's been on the main roster? There's that Bayley loss and then the two Becky losses (Summerslam, a Raw last November I think). And I think that's it right? I don't think Charlotte ever pinned her at least on the main roster as IIRC their matches ended in some kind of DQ schmoz. I remember her and Sasha losing to Nia and Shayna in the lead up to Mania 2021 but I think Sasha ate the pin. So unless I'm forgetting something she's only been pinned three times in two years. That's insane. I don't think even Becky during her OP summer 2018-early 2020 run was protected that much. Bianca ate a pin clean in a tag title match, with her and Sasha up against Charlotte and Asuka (who were the tag champs at the time), with Charlotte pinning Bianca clean. Mid 2020 to early 2021 is a big blind spot for me as I wasn't watching or even keeping hardly any track of it so I kind of figured there was maybe one or two during that period I wasn't aware of. Should've known that they would have Charlotte beat her at some point. Still only four pinfall losses in two years is some very strong booking. Bianca, Charotte, Becky, and Ronda are booked so much stronger then everyone else it's insane. It's kind of challenging actually to determine who is the most OP of the four in that it seems like they all can pretty much only lose to one another at this point.
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Post by theironyuppie on May 15, 2022 22:08:43 GMT -5
Bayley beat her before the Royal Rumble, but that was with a rake of the eyes followed by the Rose Plant, so it was still sorta dirty. How many times has Bianca been pinned since she's been on the main roster? There's that Bayley loss and then the two Becky losses (Summerslam, a Raw last November I think). And I think that's it right? I don't think Charlotte ever pinned her at least on the main roster as IIRC their matches ended in some kind of DQ schmoz. I remember her and Sasha losing to Nia and Shayna in the lead up to Mania 2021 but I think Sasha ate the pin. So unless I'm forgetting something she's only been pinned three times in two years. That's insane. I don't think even Becky during her OP summer 2018-early 2020 run was protected that much.
Their two singles matches last year each had Bianca winning via DQ when she was presented as clearly about to win the match otherwise. The first one had Becky interfering after she hit the KOD, the second one had Charlotte DQing herself. The only one-on-one match where Charlotte won was back in NXT in early 2020. Bianca's only 'fall' loss this year was getting eliminated in the Rumble, after being the Iron Woman for the third year in a row. And yeah, the level of protection to her booking is really something, though the EST gimmick becomes a lot easier to sell when you always win and never look weak in feuds. It's tricky because she's best at just getting to show off her strength and do a lot of flips, as the one time she won while having to try and play underdog at Survivor Series ended up being a flop because her selling was unconvincing, and there was never any doubt that she'd be able to eliminate the rest of the SD team. At the same time though, all Bianca matches just being her showing off her strength and flips and winning while never facing any real adversity also becomes redundant, and deprives her of the chance to work on her weaknesses.
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Post by theironyuppie on May 15, 2022 22:30:16 GMT -5
Bianca ate a pin clean in a tag title match, with her and Sasha up against Charlotte and Asuka (who were the tag champs at the time), with Charlotte pinning Bianca clean. Mid 2020 to early 2021 is a big blind spot for me as I wasn't watching or even keeping hardly any track of it so I kind of figured there was maybe one or two during that period I wasn't aware of. Should've known that they would have Charlotte beat her at some point. Still only four pinfall losses in two years is some very strong booking. Bianca, Charotte, Becky, and Ronda are booked so much stronger then everyone else it's insane. It's kind of challenging actually to determine who is the most OP of the four in that it seems like they all can pretty much only lose to one another at this point.
If I had to currently guess, and you're right that it's tricky, I'd say this is most OP through least OP though I'm more confident on 1/2 than 3/4.
1. Bianca. (Has had super-protected booking ever since her early 2020 main roster debut, has 'feuds' which are her winning over and over, and is booked stronger than anyone else against Becky.The one time Becky got one over on her this year by 'injuring' her, it was followed up by Bianca hitting two KODs and cutting Becky's hair on the go-home, then winning at Mania. Also recently won what was in effect a 3-on-1 handicap with ease.)
2. Becky. (Bianca at Mania was her first completely clean singles loss in more than three years, and even the Asuka one at Royal Rumble 2019 was to set up her winning the Rumble on the same night. She did lose to Sasha on SD last year, but that was meant to be via Bianca interference though it wasn't well-executed. With the exception of Bianca, always wins in the end.)
3. Charlotte. (Loses rarely but does lose sometimes and occasionally gets comeuppance for her actions. Just coming off a long reign, but before that had a period of three years with very short reigns usually designed to set up other women as champ. Also booked as relatively weaker than Becky, never beating her clean on the main roster. Another good example is their 2019 feud with the Kabuki Warriors, where each had a handicap match. Charlotte lost hers clean after 15 minutes, Becky won after her opponents DQed themselves out of frustration.)
4. Ronda. (Loses very rarely but often gets beaten up in segments, and based on her SD match with Raquel, is going to have competitive matches even as champ.)
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Post by mistery on May 15, 2022 22:37:07 GMT -5
I'd honestly put Rhea on the list of most OP talents as well. Yeah she's eaten a clean pin here or there, but otherwise is incredibly well protected, and likely will be as long as she's part of The Judgement Day. She also has a very, very vocal fanbase.
But I do think Bianca's biggest problem is that she's booked head and shoulders above every other woman right now outside of the other three you listed, to the detriment of the rest of the women. And her reactions are definitely starting to cool off, especially with women like Asuka coming back and getting hotter reactions. That's ignoring potential callups like Io Shirai who will potentially usurp even more of Bianca's heat/hype.
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Post by theironyuppie on May 15, 2022 22:52:28 GMT -5
I'd honestly put Rhea on the list of most OP talents as well. Yeah she's eaten a clean pin here or there, but otherwise is incredibly well protected, and likely will be as long as she's part of The Judgement Day. She also has a very, very vocal fanbase. But I do think Bianca's biggest problem is that she's booked head and shoulders above every other woman right now outside of the other three you listed, to the detriment of the rest of the women. And her reactions are definitely starting to cool off, especially with women like Asuka coming back and getting hotter reactions. That's ignoring potential callups like Io Shirai who will potentially usurp even more of Bianca's heat/hype.
I think Rhea might get to that point, but it depends on how this singles run goes. Over the last few months she's definitely taken losses even if there's usually a level of protection added to them when she takes the fall. (See Survivor Series and Elimination Chamber where she only got pinned after multiple women hit moves on her, or the gauntlet loss to Bianca being covered by her having been in the ring for 45 minutes. She also randomly got pinned by Zelina on Raw last year, but that was presented as being due to Nikki A.S.H, with Rhea squashing Zelina the week after.)
And with Bianca, some of it is limiting potential feud options by her having decisively beaten so many people already. At the moment she's in a triple-threat feud where the main storytelling is between Becky/Asuka.
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on May 15, 2022 23:08:33 GMT -5
Mid 2020 to early 2021 is a big blind spot for me as I wasn't watching or even keeping hardly any track of it so I kind of figured there was maybe one or two during that period I wasn't aware of. Should've known that they would have Charlotte beat her at some point. Still only four pinfall losses in two years is some very strong booking. Bianca, Charotte, Becky, and Ronda are booked so much stronger then everyone else it's insane. It's kind of challenging actually to determine who is the most OP of the four in that it seems like they all can pretty much only lose to one another at this point. If I had to currently guess, and you're right that it's tricky, I'd say this is most OP through least OP though I'm more confident on 1/2 than 3/4. 1. Bianca. (Has had super-protected booking ever since her early 2020 main roster debut, has 'feuds' which are her winning over and over, and is booked stronger than anyone else against Becky.The one time Becky got one over on her this year by 'injuring' her, it was followed up by Bianca hitting two KODs and cutting Becky's hair on the go-home, then winning at Mania. Also recently won what was in effect a 3-on-1 handicap with ease.)
2. Becky. (Bianca at Mania was her first completely clean singles loss in more than three years, and even the Asuka one at Royal Rumble 2019 was to set up her winning the Rumble on the same night. She did lose to Sasha on SD last year, but that was meant to be via Bianca interference though it wasn't well-executed. With the exception of Bianca, always wins in the end.)
3. Charlotte. (Loses rarely but does lose sometimes and occasionally gets comeuppance for her actions. Just coming off a long reign, but before that had a period of three years with very short reigns usually designed to set up other women as champ. Also booked as relatively weaker than Becky, never beating her clean on the main roster. Another good example is their 2019 feud with the Kabuki Warriors, where each had a handicap match. Charlotte lost hers clean after 15 minutes, Becky won after her opponents DQed themselves out of frustration.)
4. Ronda. (Loses very rarely but often gets beaten up in segments, and based on her SD match with Raquel, is going to have competitive matches even as champ.)
That's probably not the best example in that while Becky was booked stronger in her handicap match and presented as harder to beat she was also the one that ate the pin in both of their tag losses to the Kabuki Warriors (albeit after green mist to the face) so that kind of evens it out for Charlotte imo. However you're right that in general Becky seems to be booked slightly stronger with her usually winning when they face each other including their most recent match at Survivor Series. It is hard to rank them though. As strong as Bianca has been booked I don't know if I would have her #1 just because she hasn't been that effective (at least yet anyways) against the rest of the Big 4 despite probably being the most dominant against competition outside it. She's never fought Ronda so you can't really hold that against her but she's never beat Charlotte and while she has beaten Becky and at Mania no less she's also lost to her twice as well with one coming in embarrassing fashion with the super quick loss at Summerslam. As crazy as it sounds I think Charlotte is probably #4 as while she's been given the most she's isn't booked quite as dominant as the other three either in that she jobs the most and I can't recall her ever really outright squashing someone like Ronda or Bianca have. Ronda has lost to both Becky and Charlotte but both were tainted (although in the formers case it wasn't supposed to be) but she got her win back on Charlotte in the most decisive way possible by making her say I Quit. She's also been protected the most as far as losses go as those two are the only two she's ever had. Although in the other three's defense she's also spent the least amount of time in the company. Becky holds the edge over Ronda with her win over her at Mania 2019, has pretty much owned Charlotte, and while she did lose to Bianca at Mania 2022 still holds the all time score over at 2-1. So therefore I think she's probably #1. I think I would rank them Becky>Ronda>Bianca>Charlotte.
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on May 15, 2022 23:17:46 GMT -5
I'd honestly put Rhea on the list of most OP talents as well. Yeah she's eaten a clean pin here or there, but otherwise is incredibly well protected, and likely will be as long as she's part of The Judgement Day. She also has a very, very vocal fanbase. But I do think Bianca's biggest problem is that she's booked head and shoulders above every other woman right now outside of the other three you listed, to the detriment of the rest of the women. And her reactions are definitely starting to cool off, especially with women like Asuka coming back and getting hotter reactions. That's ignoring potential callups like Io Shirai who will potentially usurp even more of Bianca's heat/hype. I think Rhea might get to that point, but it depends on how this singles run goes. Over the last few months she's definitely taken losses even if there's usually a level of protection added to them when she takes the fall. (See Survivor Series and Elimination Chamber where she only got pinned after multiple women hit moves on her, or the gauntlet loss to Bianca being covered by her having been in the ring for 45 minutes. She also randomly got pinned by Zelina on Raw last year, but that was presented as being due to Nikki A.S.H, with Rhea squashing Zelina the week after.) And with Bianca, some of it is limiting potential feud options by her having decisively beaten so many people already. At the moment she's in a triple-threat feud where the main storytelling is between Becky/Asuka.
I would say Rhea is more in that second tier with Bayley, Sasha, Alexa, and Asuka as far as kayfabe powers in the women's division goes. Possibly the top of that tier but still in that tier since she's never beat any one in Tier 1 on the main roster. She did beat Bianca but that was NXT pre OP Bianca. She's definitely booked strong and is protected to an extent but nowhere near the level of the Big 4. There's that Zelina loss which while it was kind of negated with her getting her win back the next week, it still happened and it's not something I would ever see them doing that to Charlotte/Becky/Ronda/Bianca shenanigans or not. Then there's also the fact that she's always booked as Charlotte's bitch whenever they go to head.
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Post by theironyuppie on May 15, 2022 23:31:05 GMT -5
I think Rhea might get to that point, but it depends on how this singles run goes. Over the last few months she's definitely taken losses even if there's usually a level of protection added to them when she takes the fall. (See Survivor Series and Elimination Chamber where she only got pinned after multiple women hit moves on her, or the gauntlet loss to Bianca being covered by her having been in the ring for 45 minutes. She also randomly got pinned by Zelina on Raw last year, but that was presented as being due to Nikki A.S.H, with Rhea squashing Zelina the week after.) And with Bianca, some of it is limiting potential feud options by her having decisively beaten so many people already. At the moment she's in a triple-threat feud where the main storytelling is between Becky/Asuka.
I would say Rhea is more in that second tier with Bayley, Sasha, Alexa, and Asuka as far as kayfabe powers in the women's division goes. Possibly the top of that tier but still in that tier since she's never beat any one in Tier 1 on the main roster. She did beat Bianca but that was NXT pre OP Bianca. She's definitely booked strong and is protected to an extent but nowhere near the level of the Big 4. There's that Zelina loss which while it was kind of negated with her getting her win back the next week, it still happened and it's not something I would ever see them doing that to Charlotte/Becky/Ronda/Bianca shenanigans or not. Then there's also the fact that she's always booked as Charlotte's bitch whenever they go to head.
Interestingly she does have a pin over Charlotte, but it was in a SD triple-threat during the build to Survivor Series 2019. (Where she also had her only televised match with Becky, which went to a no-contest. She beat Sasha at the PPV but it was heavily protected.) I felt the feud last year was more even than their 2020 NXT one, especially given the way that HIAC paralleled Super Showdown 2018 (champion Becky/Rhea lightly DQs themselves, then beats up Charlotte after the match) and how they presented the MITB loss as only because Charlotte played possum then used the stairs to attack her leg, but it's a perception that's going to linger until Rhea does get that big win.
In terms of your other points, I use clean wins as a key indicator just because so often people get protected by not taking the fall, or interference, or whatever. The Summerslam one last year was Bianca being 'surprised' rather than just a normal match, though I do think it was effective in providing cover for her super-booking all the way up to Mania. People would just point to that as proof she was being BuRiEd and ignore all her other matches/accomplishments. Also, Becky's dominance over Charlotte goes back to even before The Man. She won their 2017 and 2018 SD TV 'friendly' matches clean, and the wins in the 2015/16 feud were always dirty (the closest is WM 32, but even then Ric interfered by holding Sasha back to stop her from breaking the Figure 8). Even Survivor Series 2016 had Becky eliminating Nia and only losing due to Bayley saving Charlotte. (Who then turned on her after the match anyway, cause her character's a jerk.)
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on May 15, 2022 23:52:11 GMT -5
I would say Rhea is more in that second tier with Bayley, Sasha, Alexa, and Asuka as far as kayfabe powers in the women's division goes. Possibly the top of that tier but still in that tier since she's never beat any one in Tier 1 on the main roster. She did beat Bianca but that was NXT pre OP Bianca. She's definitely booked strong and is protected to an extent but nowhere near the level of the Big 4. There's that Zelina loss which while it was kind of negated with her getting her win back the next week, it still happened and it's not something I would ever see them doing that to Charlotte/Becky/Ronda/Bianca shenanigans or not. Then there's also the fact that she's always booked as Charlotte's bitch whenever they go to head. Interestingly she does have a pin over Charlotte, but it was in a SD triple-threat during the build to Survivor Series 2019. (Where she also had her only televised match with Becky, which went to a no-contest. She beat Sasha at the PPV but it was heavily protected.) I felt the feud last year was more even than their 2020 NXT one, especially given the way that HIAC paralleled Super Showdown 2018 (champion Becky/Rhea lightly DQs themselves, then beats up Charlotte after the match) and how they presented the MITB loss as only because Charlotte played possum then used the stairs to attack her leg, but it's a perception that's going to linger until Rhea does get that big win. In terms of your other points, I use clean wins as a key indicator just because so often people get protected by not taking the fall, or interference, or whatever. The Summerslam one last year was Bianca being 'surprised' rather than just a normal match, though I do think it was effective in providing cover for her super-booking all the way up to Mania. People would just point to that as proof she was being BuRiEd and ignore all her other matches/accomplishments. Also, Becky's dominance over Charlotte goes back to even before The Man. She won their 2017 and 2018 SD TV 'friendly' matches clean, and the wins in the 2015/16 feud were always dirty (the closest is WM 32, but even then Ric interfered by holding Sasha back to stop her from breaking the Figure 8). Even Survivor Series 2016 had Becky eliminating Nia and only losing due to Bayley saving Charlotte. (Who then turned on her after the match anyway, cause her character's a jerk.)
The Summerslam loss was definitely a protected loss despite the duration and I agree that it was done as cover for potential backlash to the super-booking up to Mania in a rare shrewd move on their part ("well yeah she wins all the time and beat four of the five members of a Survivor Series team by herself but she still got buried by losing in 28 seconds at Summerslam"). However at the same time it only took a sucker punch and Rock Bottom to put her down for a three count. In an age where it takes eight billion finishers to put main eventers down for the count that did in a sense make her look kind of weak. You are right in that Becky has always been booked to have Charlotte's number even pre 2018 when she wasn't pre mega push The Man Becky yet. I always kind of thought maybe that since they were best friends IRL at the time that it was maybe Charlotte offering to put her over to help her friend out who at that time was a decent bit below in the pecking order then the company's decision. I believe both of those 2017 and 2018 face matches were in the build up MITB which as a Becky fan annoyed me in that it gave away she wasn't going to win. However with 2018 it worked out for the best as they ended up giving her a win streak push to build her up instead by having her steam roll all the midcard Smackdown heels (IIconics, Mandy, Sonya) which I thought was an effective way of elevating and getting her back in the title picture with her eventually beating Charlotte for it after the detour at Summerslam with Charlotte beating her in the three way and the heel turn that the fans refused to buy.
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asuka007
Fry's dog Seymour
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Post by asuka007 on May 15, 2022 23:53:31 GMT -5
Rhea has two tap out losses to Charlotte in big title matches (Charlotte also tossed her out of the RR this year as well). And does not have any DECISIVE wins over the HW yet (and has yet to face Ronda).
So she’s definitely a tier below those others. This run SHOULD elevate her ideally. But we’ll see if WWE does that.
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Post by theironyuppie on May 16, 2022 0:07:20 GMT -5
Interestingly she does have a pin over Charlotte, but it was in a SD triple-threat during the build to Survivor Series 2019. (Where she also had her only televised match with Becky, which went to a no-contest. She beat Sasha at the PPV but it was heavily protected.) I felt the feud last year was more even than their 2020 NXT one, especially given the way that HIAC paralleled Super Showdown 2018 (champion Becky/Rhea lightly DQs themselves, then beats up Charlotte after the match) and how they presented the MITB loss as only because Charlotte played possum then used the stairs to attack her leg, but it's a perception that's going to linger until Rhea does get that big win. In terms of your other points, I use clean wins as a key indicator just because so often people get protected by not taking the fall, or interference, or whatever. The Summerslam one last year was Bianca being 'surprised' rather than just a normal match, though I do think it was effective in providing cover for her super-booking all the way up to Mania. People would just point to that as proof she was being BuRiEd and ignore all her other matches/accomplishments. Also, Becky's dominance over Charlotte goes back to even before The Man. She won their 2017 and 2018 SD TV 'friendly' matches clean, and the wins in the 2015/16 feud were always dirty (the closest is WM 32, but even then Ric interfered by holding Sasha back to stop her from breaking the Figure 8). Even Survivor Series 2016 had Becky eliminating Nia and only losing due to Bayley saving Charlotte. (Who then turned on her after the match anyway, cause her character's a jerk.)
The Summerslam loss was definitely a protected loss despite the duration and I agree that it was done as cover for potential backlash to the super-booking up to Mania in a rare shrewd move on their part ("well yeah she wins all the time and beat four of the five members of a Survivor Series team by herself but she still got buried by losing in 28 seconds at Summerslam"). However at the same time it only took a sucker punch and Rock Bottom to put her down for a three count. In an age where it takes eight billion finishers to put main eventers down for the count that did in a sense make her look kind of weak. You are right in that Becky has always been booked to have Charlotte's number even pre 2018 when she wasn't pre mega push The Man Becky yet. I always kind of thought maybe that since they were best friends IRL at the time that it was maybe Charlotte offering to put her over to help her friend out who at that time was a decent bit below in the pecking order then the company's decision. I believe both of those 2017 and 2018 face matches were in the build up MITB which as a Becky fan annoyed me in that it gave away she wasn't going to win. However with 2018 it worked out for the best as they ended up giving her a win streak push to build her up instead by having her steam roll all the midcard Smackdown heels (IIconics, Mandy, Sonya) which I thought was an effective way of elevating and getting her back in the title picture with her eventually beating Charlotte for it after the detour at Summerslam with Charlotte beating her in the three way and the heel turn that the fans refused to buy.
It was even more beneficial for Becky in that she didn't have to deal with Carmella (and got to build her winning streak) while Charlotte and Asuka both lost 'twice' with Carmella yelling about it in every promo for months afterwards. Plus while Charlotte needed time off after MITB to fix ruptured implants she'd been working with for three months, fans read her coming back for Summerslam as proof she 'stole Becky' match' and was female Roman rather than WWE wanting her back as soon as possible to build that story with Becky.
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Post by sunnytaker on May 16, 2022 7:01:17 GMT -5
how does that song go? "these are the feuds that never end. they go on and on again. no other title feuds my friend. cause these are the feuds that never end."
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Post by BlahBlah on May 16, 2022 12:16:32 GMT -5
The original post irrationally annoys me because I get almost of of my newz from here since I love and trust ya'll so much. Given the way everything was presented we should change the thread title or edit the post or something, I can't imagine I'm the only one.
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