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Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Nov 2, 2022 15:30:37 GMT -5
Cena committed a cardinal sin in Vince's eyes (no he didn't sneeze in front of Vince.) he wanted to make money elsewhere. The Rock leaving and becoming an even bigger star heavily dented Vince's ego, and he wouldn't put his full weight behind someone else who had an eye on trying their hand at splitting their time between wrestling and films/tv again. look at how wwe treated Batista's acting career sure no one expected Guardians of the Galaxy to be the big hit it was but they barely mentioned any of his other film roles (well until the zombie thing but that was more a cross promotion deal with netflix than a hey look Batista is the big star in this.) and he was a big name star for wwe for years. Vince has always been a petty man, from the billionaire ted/hukster/nacho man skits to the self-destruction of the ultimate warrior dvd to people becoming persona non-grata the moment they leave the company there are multiple examples of him trying to drag people's worth down before they take the step towards becoming bigger than they currently are. The Rock is the exception for Vince to not doing any of his usual stuff. with someone else in charge of wwe, we'll see how their treatment of people leaving to go do other stuff goes in the future. I have no doubt if wwe were to give Cena a time frame of when they want him back for a short run that he could plan his film/tv work around that he would be back for it, but he wouldn't just be able to randomly do a few matches when he wants as possible injuries to him would mess up a lot of people's jobs. watch him turn up on Saturday for a quick squash match. But they still treated Rock and Batista better when they returned then they've treated Cena which is why it's a little weird. Also Brock walked out and made a bigger name for himself in UFC and Vince fell all over himself when re-signing him. (though with Rock it's probably more the WWE needed him more than he needed them at that point)
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Fade
Patti Mayonnaise
Posts: 38,521
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Post by Fade on Nov 2, 2022 15:38:52 GMT -5
Cena committed a cardinal sin in Vince's eyes (no he didn't sneeze in front of Vince.) he wanted to make money elsewhere. The Rock leaving and becoming an even bigger star heavily dented Vince's ego, and he wouldn't put his full weight behind someone else who had an eye on trying their hand at splitting their time between wrestling and films/tv again. look at how wwe treated Batista's acting career sure no one expected Guardians of the Galaxy to be the big hit it was but they barely mentioned any of his other film roles (well until the zombie thing but that was more a cross promotion deal with netflix than a hey look Batista is the big star in this.) and he was a big name star for wwe for years. Vince has always been a petty man, from the billionaire ted/hukster/nacho man skits to the self-destruction of the ultimate warrior dvd to people becoming persona non-grata the moment they leave the company there are multiple examples of him trying to drag people's worth down before they take the step towards becoming bigger than they currently are. The Rock is the exception for Vince to not doing any of his usual stuff. with someone else in charge of wwe, we'll see how their treatment of people leaving to go do other stuff goes in the future. I have no doubt if wwe were to give Cena a time frame of when they want him back for a short run that he could plan his film/tv work around that he would be back for it, but he wouldn't just be able to randomly do a few matches when he wants as possible injuries to him would mess up a lot of people's jobs. watch him turn up on Saturday for a quick squash match. But they still treated Rock and Batista better when they returned then they've treated Cena which is why it's a little weird. Also Brock walked out and made a bigger name for himself in UFC and Vince fell all over himself when re-signing him. (though with Rock it's probably more the WWE needed him more than he needed them at that point) If I had to guess it’s cuz Cena’s probably cool with it. He’s always been the quintessential soldier/company type guy. He’s the selfless type, probably more than ever now that he’s moved on.
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Post by "Trickster Dogg" James Jesse on Nov 3, 2022 22:42:02 GMT -5
the quintessential soldier Circling back to the heel turn idea, I'd love to see John Cena come back and do a WWE version of Peacemaker: a guy who thinks he's doing the right thing but is a total knobhead about how he does it and who comes across incredibly twatty to everyone around him.
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The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
AGGRESSIVE Executive Janitor of the Third Floor Manager's Bathroom
Posts: 37,655
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Post by The Ichi on Nov 4, 2022 0:31:21 GMT -5
I'm not a Cena hater or anything, but I don't think overness or merch sales should be relevant to whether someone enjoys his work or not. These are actually measurable things. In determining the greatest ever, these are the only things that actually matter. They're measurable things for WWE and explain why they pushed him. For a fan though, no. That's like saying your favourite movies are the ones that did the most at the box office (and if they happen to be, that's fine as long as it's not just for that reason).
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Nosnorb
El Dandy
Nachos and Fraggle Rock are TIMELESS.
Posts: 8,377
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Post by Nosnorb on Nov 4, 2022 4:26:31 GMT -5
If he does return for a few matches, then him teaming with Edge to fight Judgement Day could be interesting considering that his biggest and best WWE rivalry was with The Rated - R Superstar.
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Post by BayleyTiffyCodyCenaJudyHopps on Nov 4, 2022 5:25:58 GMT -5
As fun as Peacemaker is, I really don’t have any desire to see it played out on a wrestling show.
What’s the point? He’s going to get cheered regardless of how dickish or clueless that character acted. Remember last year when he signed Finn’s contract, and Balor’s fans were upset but Cena was largely still over with crowds? He’s reached that legend status where the audience is just happy to see him. You can criticize how Cena’s written sometimes, but he has a knack for getting over with crowds regardless of how he’s being depicted in a segment.
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Post by Lance Uppercut on Dec 10, 2022 3:16:03 GMT -5
Will he continue the streak on the final Smackdown of 2022?
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Nosnorb
El Dandy
Nachos and Fraggle Rock are TIMELESS.
Posts: 8,377
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Post by Nosnorb on Dec 10, 2022 4:34:27 GMT -5
Will he continue the streak on the final Smackdown of 2022? This is exactly why WWE needs a comedy heel goober, so that they could get their ass kicked in a short match with Cena.
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Eunös ✈
Dalek
Duck Feet Expert
Tolerated, just not practically liked.
Posts: 59,303
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Post by Eunös ✈ on Dec 10, 2022 6:19:29 GMT -5
Will he continue the streak on the final Smackdown of 2022?
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Post by flowercity on Dec 10, 2022 12:59:41 GMT -5
I've never thought he should turn heel. He never needed it. He was moving so much merch & bringing in so much money, they never needed to do it. Fans were buying tickets and ordering PPV's. Some to see him lose, others to see him win. The 50/50, (tho He got mostly cheers if we're being honest) made him heel to those who booed him. 50% + 50% = 100%, but the Cena years felt like 50% x 50% = 25%. The product, the show, and the character himself were all lesser for the fact that the booking and the fans couldn't get on the page. And it's not like WWE hasn't adjusted faces to become heels when the audience reaction started to turn (or likely would have turned in short order). The Rock became Hollywood Rock. Austin stayed ahead of the curve by embracing his sworn enemy, Vince McMahon. Bret Hart was vilified in the United States where the WWF ran most of its shows. Randy Savage exploded the Mega Powers because he was jealous of the Luster. I never saw anything in Cena that was beyond who those guys were and what they did in wrestling that meant that Cena could never, ever (forever ever?) turn heel. Cena moved tickets. Cena moved merch. Cena moved business. Look at the fall so many business metrics took once he bowed out of a full time role. Whatever they did with Cena during his run was a massive success.
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Post by Ganon83 on Dec 10, 2022 13:11:05 GMT -5
Hell, look at how quick house show business fell once he stopped doing house shows with any regularity. Then when he came back last year, look at how quick tickets went compared to prior to his announcement. The only people I'd put above Cena when it comes to being a draw would be Austin and Rock (who both had the luxury of a booming business with actual competition) and Hogan (who is Hogan). Flair isn't even on that level outside of the south.
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XIII
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 18,957
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Post by XIII on Dec 10, 2022 14:36:56 GMT -5
John Cena is probably the only guy to ever get a good match out of the Great Khali. That alone is an amazing accomplishment.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Dec 10, 2022 16:25:57 GMT -5
I’ll always find it bizarre, as others have mention, that WWE went out their way to take away Cena’s credibility as a returning act mostly because he was the one that saved them in the mid 00s.
Like, imagine a WWE where Cena wasn’t pushed how he was. It wouldn’t be dead but it sure wouldn’t be where it is now.
It’s sort of a miracle he still gets the reactions he does considering that weird stretch where he was basically treated like a goober.
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Post by ChitownKnight on Dec 10, 2022 17:24:36 GMT -5
I’ll always find it bizarre, as others have mention, that WWE went out their way to take away Cena’s credibility as a returning act mostly because he was the one that saved them in the mid 00s. Like, imagine a WWE where Cena wasn’t pushed how he was. It wouldn’t be dead but it sure wouldn’t be where it is now. It’s sort of a miracle he still gets the reactions he does considering that weird stretch where he was basically treated like a goober. He was totally misused the last few years, but it’s John f***ing Cena, he will always be over
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Post by Friday Night SmackOwn on Dec 10, 2022 17:27:08 GMT -5
I don’t think they’re diminishing Cena. The guy’s voice is literally the first thing you hear on WWE shows in the signature intro, after all.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Dec 10, 2022 17:30:32 GMT -5
I don’t think they’re diminishing Cena. The guy’s voice is literally the first thing you hear on WWE shows in the signature intro, after all. Now they’re not. He’s headline shows and people still love him. Survivor Series 2017 to WrestleMania the next year though? I keep mentioning it because I’m still not over it.
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Post by ChitownKnight on Dec 10, 2022 19:01:09 GMT -5
I don’t think they’re diminishing Cena. The guy’s voice is literally the first thing you hear on WWE shows in the signature intro, after all. Now they’re not. He’s headline shows and people still love him. Survivor Series 2017 to WrestleMania the next year though? I keep mentioning it because I’m still not over it. He Forsure needs a W. I think a match vs LA Knight, Austin Theory, or if he is available SCSA would do
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Post by ChitownKnight on Dec 16, 2022 22:06:35 GMT -5
Well talk about speaking too soon lol
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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Dec 16, 2022 22:08:39 GMT -5
Tha God saw this thread and he made a call to KO. Thanks OP! 😊
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Post by Friday Night SmackOwn on Dec 16, 2022 22:09:57 GMT -5
Tha God saw this thread and he made a call to KO. Thanks OP! 😊 I choose to believe KO saw this thread and decided to call Cena based on that.
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