the2ndevil
Grimlock
Super Seducer Survivor
Where Is Your Santa, Now?
Posts: 13,637
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Post by the2ndevil on Feb 9, 2024 10:09:24 GMT -5
This quote from the Observer summarizes this whole mess: "We’ve been told, as have most insiders, many things that contradict each other so the absolute truth is pretty much impossible to decipher." I am reminded of Game Of Thrones, when Tyrion told each of Cersei's three advisors he was going to betroth Myrcella to three different kingdoms' heirs to find out which one was leaking information to her by seeing which one she yelled at him about. |
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Post by Finish Uncle Muffin’s Story on Feb 9, 2024 10:09:45 GMT -5
Right before he chose Roman, Cody said that he and Rock had a wonderful conversation but he'd also had other conversations. It might be as easy as Cody explaining that he'd talked to people in the aftermath of Friday who made it clear to him that he'd been manipulated by the Rock, he heard the fan support and then seeing Roman/Rock at the press conference completely sealed it. Is it the cleanest explanation? No. But it's not the worst either Yeah, but they didn't really do that yesterday. They need to be clear about it on Smackdown. |
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Feb 9, 2024 10:10:40 GMT -5
I'm not gonna give credit to em for being forced to do what fans want. That's nuts.
That said, I don't watch so I don't care haha
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on Feb 9, 2024 10:10:58 GMT -5
"If they did storytelling things and showed us the story happening, people would have realized it was a story" is what you're saying. Like boiled down to its core. And I agree, yeah. If they did storytelling things, people would have seen a story. If characters interacted, if intentions were foreshadowed, if character motivations were being put into place and the twist was being communicated to the audience, people would have not shit on it as much and it would have been seen as a real story. But I think the absence of those things and the fact that six days into the story we've already blasted through all of these plot points while skipping all the before and middle parts, is a big part of why this kind of has to be a pivot. People are backreading what we see now into the previous two segments on the matter, but they don't actually form a cohesive narrative taken as a whole. Those prior segments don't really make sense in light of what we have now, and everyone's motivations remain pretty shaky with the need to answer those questions in hindsight and built a story retroactively. I'm not arguing interest, that's subjective. I'm saying that it has to be a pivot because as a story they planned from the beginning, it doesn't track, and I think to say "This was what they planned all along" is in implication to gravely insult them and call WWE inept at telling stories with harsher implications than critics ever could. Which part of how I laid it out wouldn’t narratively make sense? It’s a bit more tell than show given they speedran to the heel turn, but it can make sense that Rock gaslit Cody into thinking he needed to get to Roman first to knock him off the Head of the Table and then Cody sees them being chummy at the press conference and hugging and talking about the Bloodline headlining Wrestlemania and flips and changes his mind. No see again the issue isn't what we're getting now or in the future to wrangle the story together. It's that it's all retroactive. The story is being told in hindsight. Meaning attributed to that Smackdown segment in the weeks after it happened. Cody came out, said "I'm going to take everything from you, I want the title", hugged Dwayne, and left while the two had a big, angry staredown in the ring. Like even if we take out the metanarrative and stuff like them reposting the Smackdown clip but editing out Cody being sad, none of that segment contains the things that they'll add in in the weeks before. They can make this story make sense now, but it's a retcon. Those segments did not contain these elements, no groundwork was laid for any of it. I've seen WWE PPVs that have multiple segments of Paul Heyman sitting to the side of an angry Roman Reigns just to massage his thighs and tell him he's cool. If they wanted to lay the groundwork for 'Rock is manipulating Cody', they could have had Cody and Rock so much as speak to one another ever. They could have shown them talking backstage on their TV show where they develop stories. We could have seen Cody being called into Rock's locker room. Could have had Cody say a single word about something happening before that promo on Smackdown. These 'conversations' Cody had are important they spent literally zero time on any of them. We didn't know they happened until Cody ceded his spot because nobody saw them or got to notice they were there. Cody went directly from the motivation of "It's Roman, it's only Roman" to "actually it's not gonna be Roman" overnight. It's bad storytelling if it's taken on its face. Like, the defense against it being a retcon is "They added stuff later" and that's just what a retcon is. |
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Post by SneakMan on Feb 9, 2024 10:15:42 GMT -5
I’d push back on the pointless part. They’ve increased interest in the story and Mania, and reinvigorated the Bloodline story when it’s kind of been limping along for months. It feels fresher now than if Cody simply called out Roman in a rinse and repeat of last year. A lot of the interest in the story until last night was “they can’t possibly be this f***ing stupid.” On the off-chance this was the plan from the beginning, playing on your history of screwing the pooch by going “hey, we might screw the pooch again here, aren’t you hoping we don’t do that?” isn’t some storytelling masterstroke. |
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Fade
Patti Mayonnaise
Posts: 38,629
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Post by Fade on Feb 9, 2024 10:17:10 GMT -5
Bloodline Rock is a new one. Excited to see where this goes “Bloodline Rock” even sounds cool, Damnit Dwayne! All this talk about the worst Rock movies, and yet no one has brought up Baywatch. That movie legitimately made me angry. It didn’t make me angry, but it just made me feel bad. I think because I was expecting a funny, cool, lighthearted flick and it was whatever the f*** it was. Right before he chose Roman, Cody said that he and Rock had a wonderful conversation but he'd also had other conversations. It might be as easy as Cody explaining that he'd talked to people in the aftermath of Friday who made it clear to him that he'd been manipulated by the Rock, he heard the fan support and then seeing Roman/Rock at the press conference completely sealed it. Is it the cleanest explanation? No. But it's not the worst either Austin or ‘Kishi cameo would have been cool: “Don’t trust this sum bitch”. Though I guess the latter would side with him. |
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Post by polarbearpete on Feb 9, 2024 10:19:41 GMT -5
I’d push back on the pointless part. They’ve increased interest in the story and Mania, and reinvigorated the Bloodline story when it’s kind of been limping along for months. It feels fresher now than if Cody simply called out Roman in a rinse and repeat of last year. A lot of the interest in the story until last night was “they can’t possibly be this f***ing stupid.” On the off-chance this was the plan from the beginning, playing on your history of screwing the pooch by going “hey, we might screw the pooch again here, aren’t you hoping we don’t do that?” isn’t some storytelling masterstroke. Coming out of last night though (and again it’s only 6 days after the story started, it’s not something they were dragging out over the audience’s heads for months), the interest is back on the story and now we know that part of the story is the Rock as a heel Bloodline and Board member throwing his weight around. |
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Sparkybob
King Koopa
I have a status?
Posts: 11,005 
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Post by Sparkybob on Feb 9, 2024 10:40:02 GMT -5
Even if it was planned out from the beginning, it's pointless, incoherent, and treading on ground I'm utterly tired of having to deal with in wrestling. I'm personally far more inclined to say they pivoted, because what all has happened in the past week genuinely just does not make any sense for where they wound up, but if it was a work the whole time then great, whatever, it sucks either way but at least they wound up where they should have just gone in the first place. I’d push back on the pointless part. They’ve increased interest in the story and Mania, and reinvigorated the Bloodline story when it’s kind of been limping along for months. It feels fresher now than if Cody simply called out Roman in a rinse and repeat of last year. Yea Roman right now is pretty flat as a character, just a vessel that holds the title Cody needs to beat. At least adding heel Rock can add more spice to the feud (depending how often he will be on TV) than just repeating last year's story. |
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Tom Turkey
Ozymandius
The King of North America
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Post by Tom Turkey on Feb 9, 2024 10:44:44 GMT -5
I’d push back on the pointless part. They’ve increased interest in the story and Mania, and reinvigorated the Bloodline story when it’s kind of been limping along for months. It feels fresher now than if Cody simply called out Roman in a rinse and repeat of last year. Yea Roman right now is pretty flat as a character, just a vessel that holds the title Cody needs to beat. At least adding heel Rock can add more spice to the feud (depending how often he will be on TV) than just repeating last year's story. Roman’s real role in whatever long term story Rock has been banging on about will absolutely come once Cody defeats him at WM40. |
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mcstoklasa
Hank Scorpio
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Post by mcstoklasa on Feb 9, 2024 10:45:55 GMT -5
Someone suggested adding Austin (not to wrestle) in the story to help Cody against Roman and Rock and I love it
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Fade
Patti Mayonnaise
Posts: 38,629
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Post by Fade on Feb 9, 2024 10:55:18 GMT -5
Someone suggested adding Austin (not to wrestle) in the story to help Cody against Roman and Rock and I love it I really won’t know what to do with myself if Austin & Rock square up again. Even a few tossed punches would make me lose my mind. |
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Post by Jindrak Mark on Feb 9, 2024 10:57:26 GMT -5
Someone suggested adding Austin (not to wrestle) in the story to help Cody against Roman and Rock and I love it When Cody said last night Rock wasn't the only person he spoke to Austin was the first person I thought of. Could also be someone like DDP who Cody is close to but if they're going to reveal who it was on TV it makes more sense to be someone who has history with Rock who would warn against trusting him. |
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Tom Turkey
Ozymandius
The King of North America
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Member is Online
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Post by Tom Turkey on Feb 9, 2024 10:58:26 GMT -5
Someone suggested adding Austin (not to wrestle) in the story to help Cody against Roman and Rock and I love it When Cody said last night Rock wasn't the only person he spoke to Austin was the first person I thought of. Could also be someone like DDP who Cody is close to but if they're going to reveal who it was on TV it makes more sense to be someone who has history with Rock who would warn against trusting him. Maybe Orton? He did cut a promo promising he’d come after every single member of the Bloodline when he returned. |
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Feb 9, 2024 11:00:14 GMT -5
When Cody said last night Rock wasn't the only person he spoke to Austin was the first person I thought of. Could also be someone like DDP who Cody is close to but if they're going to reveal who it was on TV it makes more sense to be someone who has history with Rock who would warn against trusting him. Maybe Orton? He did cut a promo promising he’d come after every single member of the Bloodline when he returned. It would be kind of hilarious if Cody decided, "Oh yeah, you know who I can trust, Randy Orton, that makes sense!" |
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Post by Finish Uncle Muffin’s Story on Feb 9, 2024 11:01:26 GMT -5
I feel like the Austin story ended on a good note, I’m not sure he needs to show up.
If they’re genuinely just looking for mainstream buzz right now, you’d do Cena and Cody vs. Rock and Roman. I think it’s still gonna be Seth, though.
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Fade
Patti Mayonnaise
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Post by Fade on Feb 9, 2024 11:01:54 GMT -5
Maybe Orton? He did cut a promo promising he’d come after every single member of the Bloodline when he returned. It would be kind of hilarious if Cody decided, "Oh yeah, you know who I can trust, Randy Orton, that makes sense!" Rock: My daddy was better! Cody: Mine was! Randy: M- ..yea ok I feel like the Austin story ended on a good note, I’m not sure he needs to show up. If they’re genuinely just looking for mainstream buzz right now, you’d do Cena and Cody vs. Rock and Roman. I think it’s still gonna be Seth, though. I didn’t even consider Cena popping his head in but he might be busy. |
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Post by Urn Anderson on Feb 9, 2024 11:03:35 GMT -5
It's going to turn out that Cody and Rock were in cahoots the entire time, with Rock letting Roman think he's on the Bloodline's side so he can act as Cody's secret weapon against Bloodline interference.
The Rock isn't going to let himself come out of this as anything but a clever babyface who is technically responsible for Cody's big win. Mark my words.
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Post by Jindrak Mark on Feb 9, 2024 11:12:11 GMT -5
It's going to turn out that Cody and Rock were in cahoots the entire time, with Rock letting Roman think he's on the Bloodline's side so he can act as Cody's secret weapon against Bloodline interference. The Rock isn't going to let himself come out of this as anything but a clever babyface who is technically responsible for Cody's big win. Mark my words. Not sure if that will happen but Rock and Cody would be the smartest babyfaces ever if this is all a plan to stop the Bloodline from screwing Cody over again. Imagine Roman thinking he has Rock, Solo and Jimmy all in his corner for 2 months with little hints of dissension between Roman/Rock then on the night there's a ref bump and Roman laughs thinking they're all going to take out Cody but Rock slowly turns, deals with Solo and Jimmy and Roman is left alone to face and lose to Cody. If they want Rock to come out of this being cheered by the end of Mania that would be the way to do it and also lead into Roman/Rock non-title at either Summerslam or next Mania. Typing that made me realize if that happened Rock would basically be Mike Tyson in 98. Acting friendly towards the heels for 2 months then at Mania he refuses to help them and raises the faces hand in the end. |
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Mochi Lone Wolf
Fry's dog Seymour
Development through Destruction.
Posts: 24,185
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Post by Mochi Lone Wolf on Feb 9, 2024 11:15:47 GMT -5
I don’t believe for even a millisecond that this was the initial plan. I wholeheartedly believe this became the new plan after the fan response. Which is fine. If the fans want something other than what you put in front of them, you change things to appease them. Simple as.
“Well it doesn’t make much sense narratively” Who gives a f***? Wrestling is a fan-driven industry and they have final say in what plays out.
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Post by Snaptastic on Feb 9, 2024 11:19:20 GMT -5
Even if it was planned out from the beginning, it's pointless, incoherent, and treading on ground I'm utterly tired of having to deal with in wrestling. I'm personally far more inclined to say they pivoted, because what all has happened in the past week genuinely just does not make any sense for where they wound up, but if it was a work the whole time then great, whatever, it sucks either way but at least they wound up where they should have just gone in the first place. I’d push back on the pointless part. They’ve increased interest in the story and Mania, and reinvigorated the Bloodline story when it’s kind of been limping along for months. It feels fresher now than if Cody simply called out Roman in a rinse and repeat of last year. Not to mention, what's the point in any creative, if we just end up with the end result immediately? Yes, it can miss its mark as it did with this one I'd suggest. But I'd rather a cluster with some added spice over a cookie cutter build. |
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