JMA
Hank Scorpio
Down With Capitalism!
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Post by JMA on Feb 13, 2007 23:49:37 GMT -5
Incidentally, why is Matt Striker getting a push? I've never been entertained by him in any way; Striker doesn't impress me on the mic, his in-ring skills are subpar, and his gimmick is terrible. I like his mic skills, gimmick and, in ring ablility, so we cancel each other out and then Vince makes the decision. Maybe that is why he has a push. That's the trouble with opinions, isn't it? We all have them and they can't be proven. But I just can't get into Striker. I'd say that I want him off my TV screen, but since I don't watch ECW anymore that wouldn't be accurate. |
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bobolebowski
Don Corleone
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Post by bobolebowski on Feb 14, 2007 0:02:58 GMT -5
i think i would actually like "ecw" more if they just changed the name and didnt ruin the history of ECW
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Post by Tyfo on Feb 14, 2007 0:05:17 GMT -5
One argument against ECW that I hate is how they put "WWE rejects" on the show.
ECW was always a place for the misfits of the wrestling world basically. They took people that no one else was willing to push or even sign and make them their own.
Al Snow didn't just show up one day with a head. He was WWF jobber Leif Cassidy (and Avatar) and was shipped over to ECW. They turned him into a star.
Justin Credible wasnt "credible" at all until he hit ECW. Because he had a yellow jock strap on his face and was Aldo Montoya. He went on to be an ECW main eventer.
Rob Van Dam?......WCW job boy Robbie V. ECW turned him into Mr. PPV, Mr. Monday Night, etc. etc. etc.
Sabu and Jerry Lynn....WCW stuck them in a lower midcard feud with each other. They decided they couldnt work with Sabu, and they continued to job Jerry Lynn(Mr. JL).
Raven....Managed the Quebeccers in the WWF, and was a lightweight in WCW before he became a superstar in ECW.
Balls Mahoney.....WWF made him an evil Santa imposter from the South Pole. ECW made him the chair swinging freak we love.
Chris Candido....WWF stuck him with a shitty gimmick with not much chance to go far. ECW made him "No Gimmicks Needed" Chris Candido.
How about Shane Douglas....WWF f***ed him up both times they had him, WCW gave him a decent push in the tag division, but not much singles wise. He become THE man in ECW.
And theres many more im sure.
What im saying is, why is it bad that ECW is getting guys like Lashley, Snitsky, Test, Striker, Burke, etc. etc. I don't see how it's different from the real ECW. They would take in the guys no one wanted, and make them into something. That just looks like its continuing to me.
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JMA
Hank Scorpio
Down With Capitalism!
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Post by JMA on Feb 14, 2007 0:10:23 GMT -5
What im saying is, why is it bad that ECW is getting guys like Lashley, Snitsky, Test, Striker, Burke, etc. etc. I don't see how it's different from the real ECW. They would take in the guys no one wanted, and make them into something. That just looks like its continuing to me. But they have them keep the same bad gimmicks. Those guys you mentioned got over because they were presented DIFFERENTLY. Do you think that Aldo Montoya would've succeeded in ECW? Or how about Dean Douglas? |
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Post by Tyfo on Feb 14, 2007 0:13:20 GMT -5
What im saying is, why is it bad that ECW is getting guys like Lashley, Snitsky, Test, Striker, Burke, etc. etc. I don't see how it's different from the real ECW. They would take in the guys no one wanted, and make them into something. That just looks like its continuing to me. But they have them keep the same bad gimmicks. Those guys you mentioned got over because they were presented DIFFERENTLY. Do you think that Aldo Montoya would've succeeded in ECW? Or how about Dean Douglas? Snitsky seems to be different, Thorn has a different gimmick from his WWE run, Burke and Striker actually get time to do something as opposed to when they were on Raw or SD. Shannon Moore's different(but is a jobber so, eh). People like Test and Holly, nothing will get them over, but they've been squashed now, so who cares. |
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JMA
Hank Scorpio
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Post by JMA on Feb 14, 2007 0:20:02 GMT -5
But they have them keep the same bad gimmicks. Those guys you mentioned got over because they were presented DIFFERENTLY. Do you think that Aldo Montoya would've succeeded in ECW? Or how about Dean Douglas? Snitsky seems to be different, Thorn has a different gimmick from his WWE run, Burke and Striker actually get time to do something as opposed to when they were on Raw or SD. Shannon Moore's different(but is a jobber so, eh). From what I've read, Snitsky seems to be the typical monster heel. He doesn't seem to be unique at all, even his look is similar to another wrestler--Kane. Maybe they'll do something with Snitsky that makes him seem special, but right now I don't see it. I agree with you about Thorn. Plus, a vampire WAS in the original ECW, so there's a precedent there. Striker won't get over because he's presented like a one-dimensional cartoon character and isn't good in the ring. Burke is somewhat different, but they could do more with him. And yet, I still see WWE trying (and failing) to get them over. |
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Post by WoodStoner1 on Feb 14, 2007 0:39:44 GMT -5
Honestly Ecw lost its uniquness when it became the haven for every reject that couldnt get over on raw or smackdown. It started out by having big name non ecw wrestlers like Kurt Angle, and the Big show to brining in matt Striker, Terkay, Test, Snitsky, etc. i agree completely...i knew when WWE guys like Holly (who has never been over with the crowd) came in that it would be a way of Vince getting his guys over by making them make these guys that were badasses in ECW look like morons and weak About Holly...I will ask it yet again...when you say "never been over," I must revisit the super heavyweight gimmick. Did it only seem "over" because the IWC was fawning over it? I forget how the casual fans reacted. As for the rest, I can see how they are trying to get "new" guys over (as shown by the quotes, the definition of "new" is very much in question), but unless the Originals always losing is some ode to Dreamer never beating Raven or something, it comes off like inVasion II, which is probably more likely the intention (as seen by the original inVasion, killing off any traces of the competition is obviously more important than drawing money to them) |
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Chainsaw
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Post by Chainsaw on Feb 14, 2007 9:53:24 GMT -5
Losing?!
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Libertine
Unicron
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Post by Libertine on Feb 14, 2007 10:06:35 GMT -5
What shot ECW to s*** was RVD and Sabu getting arrested. I have no doubt that fudged up months worth of story, just because two guys can't keep their smoke in private. I blame those two majorly for the state of ECW today.
Losing Angle was a major blow. I think if everything had've gone to plan, we'd be enjoying an intense Angle vs RVD feud for the ECW title.
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BHB
Hank Scorpio
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Post by BHB on Feb 14, 2007 10:35:12 GMT -5
One argument against ECW that I hate is how they put "WWE rejects" on the show. ECW was always a place for the misfits of the wrestling world basically. They took people that no one else was willing to push or even sign and make them their own. Al Snow didn't just show up one day with a head. He was WWF jobber Leif Cassidy (and Avatar) and was shipped over to ECW. They turned him into a star. Justin Credible wasnt "credible" at all until he hit ECW. Because he had a yellow jock strap on his face and was Aldo Montoya. He went on to be an ECW main eventer. Rob Van Dam?......WCW job boy Robbie V. ECW turned him into Mr. PPV, Mr. Monday Night, etc. etc. etc. Sabu and Jerry Lynn....WCW stuck them in a lower midcard feud with each other. They decided they couldnt work with Sabu, and they continued to job Jerry Lynn(Mr. JL). Raven....Managed the Quebeccers in the WWF, and was a lightweight in WCW before he became a superstar in ECW. Balls Mahoney.....WWF made him an evil Santa imposter from the South Pole. ECW made him the chair swinging freak we love. Chris Candido....WWF stuck him with a crapty gimmick with not much chance to go far. ECW made him "No Gimmicks Needed" Chris Candido. How about Shane Douglas....WWF waxed him up both times they had him, WCW gave him a decent push in the tag division, but not much singles wise. He become THE man in ECW. And theres many more im sure. What im saying is, why is it bad that ECW is getting guys like Lashley, Snitsky, Test, Striker, Burke, etc. etc. I don't see how it's different from the real ECW. They would take in the guys no one wanted, and make them into something. That just looks like its continuing to me. Yea, but the difference is ECW took in guys with huge potential and made them what they should be. The "new breed" of ECW where used to their potential in their former roles as jobbers and midcarders. They don't deserve and simply can't be anything more than that. |
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Sajoa Moe
Patti Mayonnaise
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Post by Sajoa Moe on Feb 14, 2007 10:36:29 GMT -5
One argument against ECW that I hate is how they put "WWE rejects" on the show. ECW was always a place for the misfits of the wrestling world basically. They took people that no one else was willing to push or even sign and make them their own. Al Snow didn't just show up one day with a head. He was WWF jobber Leif Cassidy (and Avatar) and was shipped over to ECW. They turned him into a star. Justin Credible wasnt "credible" at all until he hit ECW. Because he had a yellow jock strap on his face and was Aldo Montoya. He went on to be an ECW main eventer. Rob Van Dam?......WCW job boy Robbie V. ECW turned him into Mr. PPV, Mr. Monday Night, etc. etc. etc. Sabu and Jerry Lynn....WCW stuck them in a lower midcard feud with each other. They decided they couldnt work with Sabu, and they continued to job Jerry Lynn(Mr. JL). Raven....Managed the Quebeccers in the WWF, and was a lightweight in WCW before he became a superstar in ECW. Balls Mahoney.....WWF made him an evil Santa imposter from the South Pole. ECW made him the chair swinging freak we love. Chris Candido....WWF stuck him with a crapty gimmick with not much chance to go far. ECW made him "No Gimmicks Needed" Chris Candido. How about Shane Douglas....WWF waxed him up both times they had him, WCW gave him a decent push in the tag division, but not much singles wise. He become THE man in ECW. And theres many more im sure. Yes, but that was more due to the influence of Paul Heyman, with his ability to hide weaknesses and expose strengths, and create better gimmicks and ideas. Today's ECW isn't run by Paul Heyman. |
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Post by royboy8 on Feb 14, 2007 10:49:59 GMT -5
One argument against ECW that I hate is how they put "WWE rejects" on the show. ECW was always a place for the misfits of the wrestling world basically. They took people that no one else was willing to push or even sign and make them their own. Al Snow didn't just show up one day with a head. He was WWF jobber Leif Cassidy (and Avatar) and was shipped over to ECW. They turned him into a star. Justin Credible wasnt "credible" at all until he hit ECW. Because he had a yellow jock strap on his face and was Aldo Montoya. He went on to be an ECW main eventer. Rob Van Dam?......WCW job boy Robbie V. ECW turned him into Mr. PPV, Mr. Monday Night, etc. etc. etc. Sabu and Jerry Lynn....WCW stuck them in a lower midcard feud with each other. They decided they couldnt work with Sabu, and they continued to job Jerry Lynn(Mr. JL). Raven....Managed the Quebeccers in the WWF, and was a lightweight in WCW before he became a superstar in ECW. Balls Mahoney.....WWF made him an evil Santa imposter from the South Pole. ECW made him the chair swinging freak we love. Chris Candido....WWF stuck him with a crapty gimmick with not much chance to go far. ECW made him "No Gimmicks Needed" Chris Candido. How about Shane Douglas....WWF waxed him up both times they had him, WCW gave him a decent push in the tag division, but not much singles wise. He become THE man in ECW. And theres many more im sure. What im saying is, why is it bad that ECW is getting guys like Lashley, Snitsky, Test, Striker, Burke, etc. etc. I don't see how it's different from the real ECW. They would take in the guys no one wanted, and make them into something. That just looks like its continuing to me. You are 100 percent correct. I think a lot of people on these boards really dont know at all what the old ecw was about. |
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Post by MNM's Official "Fixer" on Feb 14, 2007 10:52:42 GMT -5
ECW was the land of the misfits. ECW lost it's uniqueness the moment it was bought by Vince McMahon. He turned a company that started a revolution and made it into a joke. Bobby Lashley is about as extreme as a box of animal crackers. They can have the originals, they can have Joey Styles, hell they can even bring back Paul Heyman but the fact of the matter is that those three little letters that started a revolution are just a mere shell of what they once were. As long as Vinnie Mac is the boss, ECW is just going to keep dieng a slow painful death for the second (third time if you count the Alliance run) time.
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Chainsaw
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Post by Chainsaw on Feb 14, 2007 10:58:40 GMT -5
One argument against ECW that I hate is how they put "WWE rejects" on the show. ECW was always a place for the misfits of the wrestling world basically. They took people that no one else was willing to push or even sign and make them their own. Al Snow didn't just show up one day with a head. He was WWF jobber Leif Cassidy (and Avatar) and was shipped over to ECW. They turned him into a star. Justin Credible wasnt "credible" at all until he hit ECW. Because he had a yellow jock strap on his face and was Aldo Montoya. He went on to be an ECW main eventer. Rob Van Dam?......WCW job boy Robbie V. ECW turned him into Mr. PPV, Mr. Monday Night, etc. etc. etc. Sabu and Jerry Lynn....WCW stuck them in a lower midcard feud with each other. They decided they couldnt work with Sabu, and they continued to job Jerry Lynn(Mr. JL). Raven....Managed the Quebeccers in the WWF, and was a lightweight in WCW before he became a superstar in ECW. Balls Mahoney.....WWF made him an evil Santa imposter from the South Pole. ECW made him the chair swinging freak we love. Chris Candido....WWF stuck him with a crapty gimmick with not much chance to go far. ECW made him "No Gimmicks Needed" Chris Candido. How about Shane Douglas....WWF waxed him up both times they had him, WCW gave him a decent push in the tag division, but not much singles wise. He become THE man in ECW. And theres many more im sure. Yes, but that was more due to the influence of Paul Heyman, with his ability to hide weaknesses and expose strengths, and create better gimmicks and ideas. Today's ECW isn't run by Paul Heyman. I give you both that one. About the only "reject" that they've actually done something with character-wise in the new Extreme Nitro is the former Seven and Mordecai, Kevin Thorn. And he's basically doing Gangrel's gimmick. Hell, Snitsky is almost taking a step back, because instead of being a baby killing foot fetishist, all the indications are he's Crazy White Lashley. |
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Chainsaw
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Post by Chainsaw on Feb 14, 2007 10:59:12 GMT -5
Bobby Lashley is about as extreme as a box of animal crackers. That's a great line. |
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Sajoa Moe
Patti Mayonnaise
Did you get that thing I sent ya?
A man without gimmick.
Posts: 39,683
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Post by Sajoa Moe on Feb 14, 2007 11:00:50 GMT -5
Bobby Lashley is about as extreme as a box of animal crackers. That's a great line. Man, that's begging for a Photoshop. |
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Post by Person With A Hat on Feb 14, 2007 11:09:05 GMT -5
Was the new ECW ever unique to begin with? It seems like it's been Tuesday Night Heat from the start. Incidentally, why is Matt Striker getting a push? I've never been entertained by him in any way; Striker doesn't impress me on the mic, his in-ring skills are subpar, and his gimmick is terrible. Also, if Striker is a former Social Studies teacher then why is he constantly acting like an English teacher. Wrestling fans can't tell the difference. Or at least, that's what heel Striker'd tell you. |
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JMA
Hank Scorpio
Down With Capitalism!
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Post by JMA on Feb 14, 2007 11:10:43 GMT -5
You are 100 percent correct. I think a lot of people on these boards really dont know at all what the old ecw was about. Once again, ECW gave those rejects new, GOOD gimmicks and let them do more of what they wanted. Moving wrestlers from the Raw and SmackDown brands to the new ECW and keeping their gimmicks is NOT the same thing. It's not even close. Imagine if Paul Heyman took WWF and WCW rejects and had them keep the same gimmicks. Can you imagine Mr. JL, Aldo Montoya, Robbie V, and Johnny Polo headlining? Of course not. The mere idea is absurd. The real ECW was an oasis and a place for wrestlers to be reborn (whether for good or bad). The new ECW is a gulag for wrestlers WWE doesn't want to push on their other brands. |
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JMA
Hank Scorpio
Down With Capitalism!
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Post by JMA on Feb 14, 2007 11:11:51 GMT -5
Was the new ECW ever unique to begin with? It seems like it's been Tuesday Night Heat from the start. Incidentally, why is Matt Striker getting a push? I've never been entertained by him in any way; Striker doesn't impress me on the mic, his in-ring skills are subpar, and his gimmick is terrible. Also, if Striker is a former Social Studies teacher then why is he constantly acting like an English teacher. Wrestling fans can't tell the difference. Or at least, that's what heel Striker'd tell you. Maybe ignorance really is bliss. |
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Post by Arcane on Feb 14, 2007 11:29:40 GMT -5
nitro girls....i mean extreme expose...who really gives a rats ass about these girls? i mean once a month isnt that bad....but not every freaking week. snitsky, striker, holly, test, and knox for sabu, dreamer, rvd, punk, and sandman? how is it that guys that not a single fan in the world care about constantly kill the guys that are over and make them look retarded in the process. When you see the Nitro girls of EC-Dub, you can start to play a game of guessing who will interrupt them this week. The first time, the music just cut out and went to a Test promo, and this past week, Thorne interrupted them. As for killing the guys that are over, who knows? They may be developing a story where Heyman comes back, or the rebels rise up and start gaining the upper hand on the new blood, but you cant do it right away, it takes time. The 'hasbeens' should go through a period where they cant muster up enough to stave off the onslaught of the new blood; then they slowly start mounting their comeback, maybe a win here, maybe a slow dissension in some of the new blood, it could be anything. ...Or... the creative team just picks things out of a hat, like *NEW BLOOD* beats *ORIGINAL* and the part they pick is how they beat em... |
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