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Post by 2xfw 4 life on Feb 19, 2008 20:00:28 GMT -5
The Freebirds were freakin' awesome. That is all.
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Mother
Samurai Cop
Possibly a virgin... methinks he doth protest too much
There's no need for this
Posts: 2,437
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Post by Mother on Feb 19, 2008 20:18:25 GMT -5
No need to flame Saggy, he's absolutely right. Freebirds were innovative, but I'd go back even further to people such as Crusher and Bruiser, could probably go farther, it's all a set of certain kinks that fall into place, so in a way everyone is ripping off everyone. Dok is a dick.
In fact I don't know what reason anyone posts in a thread in order to try to set them right, as if your superior opinion is no doubt any better.
Instead of actually debating and pressing the issue, you jump all over the OPINION itself.
Now who's really being mature?
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Post by The Booty Disciple on Feb 19, 2008 21:35:02 GMT -5
No need to flame Saggy, he's absolutely right. Freebirds were innovative, but I'd go back even further to people such as Crusher and Bruiser, could probably go farther, it's all a set of certain kinks that fall into place, so in a way everyone is ripping off everyone. Dok is a dick. In fact I don't know what reason anyone posts in a thread in order to try to set them right, as if your superior opinion is no doubt any better. Instead of actually debating and pressing the issue, you jump all over the OPINION itself. Now who's really being mature? Well, saggyboyflair ain't exactly being the most eloquent cat on the block either...though that's hardly an excuse for everyone else to call him names and say various other unsavory things about him.
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Post by willywonka666 on Feb 19, 2008 21:43:17 GMT -5
Hayes did NOT have a mullet! How are people confusing the two hairstyles? Some of us have better things to worry about than the nuances of mullets vs. long hair? Just a guess... I wasn't trying to be bitchy, it's just a friend of mine pulled the same thing telling me I have a mullet. Which using his logic, 99% of the women in the world have mullets, because I infact had bangs. I dunno, the guy just pisses me off-you I have nothing against
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Post by The Booty Disciple on Feb 19, 2008 22:04:27 GMT -5
Some of us have better things to worry about than the nuances of mullets vs. long hair? Just a guess... I wasn't trying to be bitchy, it's just a friend of mine pulled the same thing telling me I have a mullet. Which using his logic, 99% of the women in the world have mullets, because I infact had bangs. I dunno, the guy just pisses me off-you I have nothing against Oh, I see how it is...you can have plenty against your "friend," but nothing against me. Yeah, well...when you laugh, we can see your uvula!
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Post by bitteroldman on Feb 19, 2008 23:05:05 GMT -5
If you look at some of his recent posts, the OP has been consistently trying to get a rise out of the community; he's slammed the Freebirds and Jim Cornette. Smells like a board troll to me, and if you'll just no-sell his threads he'll go elsewhere to get his jollies.
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Post by The Booty Disciple on Feb 20, 2008 1:42:34 GMT -5
If you look at some of his recent posts, the OP has been consistently trying to get a rise out of the community; he's slammed the Freebirds and Jim Cornette. Smells like a board troll to me, and if you'll just no-sell his threads he'll go elsewhere to get his jollies. Dude, the entire thread already got told to cool it with the "he's a troll remarks" right here, so I don't think that this kind of discussion is probably all that wise right now.
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Post by "Playboy" Don Douglas on Feb 20, 2008 1:45:23 GMT -5
Are you the same guy that's started 3 or 4 other topics bitching about Michael Hayes? I remember a while back, someone was dead sure he was a racist because he didn't want to push Bobby Lashley.
That doesn't look like such a bad decision on his part now, does it?
And Hayes absolutely deserves some credit for the draw in World Class. It's not like having the Von Erics vs jobbers would pack them in night after night. Even a strong face needs a strong opponent, and the Freebirds (led by Michael Hayes) were that. Who do you think drew the most heat out of that group? Terry was the workhorse, Buddy was the guy who could work, talk a bit, and do a job without it hurting him. Hayes was the instigator, the guy who got the crowd all riled up.
Like him or not, that feud would not have been as big without him.
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Post by Just "Dan" is Fine, Thank You on Feb 20, 2008 1:50:07 GMT -5
Are you the same guy that's started 3 or 4 other topics bitching about Michael Hayes? I remember a while back, someone was dead sure he was a racist because he didn't want to push Bobby Lashley. That was someone else, who equated all Lashley dislike with racism.
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Post by sexualvanilla on Feb 20, 2008 2:38:10 GMT -5
The only real thing I could say about Hayes is that he annoys the hell out of me on the Legends roundtables since he always interrupts people and never expresses his own opinions, just the companies. Not quite on Briscoe's level of sucking up, but not too far off
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Post by "Nature Boy" Ric Moranis on Feb 20, 2008 3:01:21 GMT -5
Jeesh. This guy is a total mark for himself. If you guys have had a chance to watch the WWE 24/7 Legends of wrestling shows hosted by Ross or watch the WCCW dvd. You will know what im talking about. This guy acts like he is on hogan level drawing. He thinks he was the draw for world class. When it reality it was the von erichs. This jerk is so full of himself. How long was actually in the business? I dont remember him making a much of a splash in NY for any long period of time. He couldnt work a lick in the ring. Just had some decent mic skills and was a big loudmouth. It was Gordy and Roberts who carried the workload. He's got every right to feel like he was a hell of a big deal. He was. No, not Hogan big, but still a far bigger deal than most acts from the 1980s, especially from 1980-86. -When Hayes was like 21 or 22, he drew a Superdome record crowd of 30,000+, main-eventing against JYD in a steel cage dog collar match to pay off the famous "JYD blinded by Freebird Hair Cream" angle. Hayes' match was the big drawing event on the August 2, 1980 card in New Orleans also featuring Andre the Giant, Hulk Hogan, Dusty Rhodes, Ted DiBiase, and Paul Orndorff. Attendance-wise, no heel outdrew Michael Hayes for a Superdome show until maybe WCW Monday Nitro during the NWO days. -After blowing off the JYD feud, Hayes almost immediately stepped onto national TV, and on the Freebirds' first run as stars of WTBS' Saturday Night show, they drew national ratings in the 10s. Those numbers sound insane/false compared to the Monday Night War era ratings, but keep in mind, there were far less TV channels/viewing options. Being on cable, SuperStation WTBS had the only true national wrestling show, and the 'Birds were the hottest act on that show...because of Hayes' weekly interviews, not because Gordy and Roberts showcased their "carrying the workload" in two minute squashes. -In late-82, his stable was the major reason that WCCW became the hottest territory in the country...pretty much at the same level as New York and the Carolinas, at least leading up until the first Starrcade and WrestleMania. -In '84, Vince brought Hayes and the 'Birds, paired them with Cyndi Lauper and David Wolff, and were going to push them into the moon if Gordy and Roberts wouldn't have ditched the place. They were even in Highlander. Any other wrestling factions in Highlander? Hayes could've made a "splash in NY" if he wouldn't have ditched McMahon went he wanted to turn him into a singles star, instead rejoining the Birds for another good run in WCCW and UWF before Gordy pretty much split for Japan full-time in 1988. ...I could get how Hayes comes off like an obnoxious mark for himself if you only knew him from his lame WCW "Fauxbirds" run with Jimmy Garvin, Humperdink, and DDP, or his even lamer time as Dok Hendrix. But come on, the guy was a pretty damn big deal during his peak years, mostly by his talent for interviews, unique charisma, and almost unrivaled ability to draw heat...not by proxy of his faction being stuck in a long feud with the Von Erichs in Texas, nor because he says he's so great on WWE 24/7 and WWE DVD releases.
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Post by strykerdarksilence on Feb 20, 2008 3:14:07 GMT -5
Jeesh. This guy is a total mark for himself. If you guys have had a chance to watch the WWE 24/7 Legends of wrestling shows hosted by Ross or watch the WCCW dvd. You will know what im talking about. This guy acts like he is on hogan level drawing. He thinks he was the draw for world class. When it reality it was the von erichs. This jerk is so full of himself. How long was actually in the business? I dont remember him making a much of a splash in NY for any long period of time. He couldnt work a lick in the ring. Just had some decent mic skills and was a big loudmouth. It was Gordy and Roberts who carried the workload. He's got every right to feel like he was a hell of a big deal. He was. No, not Hogan big, but still a far bigger deal than most acts from the 1980s, especially from 1980-86. -When Hayes was like 21 or 22, he drew a Superdome record crowd of 30,000+, main-eventing against JYD in a steel cage dog collar match to pay off the famous "JYD blinded by Freebird Hair Cream" angle. Hayes' match was the big drawing event on the August 2, 1980 card in New Orleans also featuring Andre the Giant, Hulk Hogan, Dusty Rhodes, Ted DiBiase, and Paul Orndorff. Attendance-wise, no heel outdrew Michael Hayes for a Superdome show until maybe WCW Monday Nitro during the NWO days. -After blowing off the JYD feud, Hayes almost immediately stepped onto national TV, and on the Freebirds' first run as stars of WTBS' Saturday Night show, they drew national ratings in the 10s. Those numbers sound insane/false compared to the Monday Night War era ratings, but keep in mind, there were far less TV channels/viewing options. Being on cable, SuperStation WTBS had the only true national wrestling show, and the 'Birds were the hottest act on that show...because of Hayes' weekly interviews, not because Gordy and Roberts showcased their "carrying the workload" in two minute squashes. -In late-82, his stable was the major reason that WCCW became the hottest territory in the country...pretty much at the same level as New York and the Carolinas, at least leading up until the first Starrcade and WrestleMania. -In '84, Vince brought Hayes and the 'Birds, paired them with Cyndi Lauper and David Wolff, and were going to push them into the moon if Gordy and Roberts wouldn't have ditched the place. They were even in Highlander. Any other wrestling factions in Highlander? Hayes could've made a "splash in NY" if he wouldn't have ditched McMahon went he wanted to turn him into a singles star, instead rejoining the Birds for another good run in WCCW and UWF before Gordy pretty much split for Japan full-time in 1988. ...I could get how Hayes comes off like an obnoxious mark for himself if you only knew him from his lame WCW "Fauxbirds" run with Jimmy Garvin, Humperdink, and DDP, or his even lamer time as Dok Hendrix. But come on, the guy was a pretty damn big deal during his peak years, mostly by his talent for interviews, unique charisma, and almost unrivaled ability to draw heat...not by proxy of his faction being stuck in a long feud with the Von Erichs in Texas, nor because he says he's so great on WWE 24/7 and WWE DVD releases. Well said, I agree Hayes can be off on 24-7, but nothing compared to Brisco, as a previous poster mentioned. (I laugh every time he speaks on the Monday Night War DVD), but the dude achieved A LOT in the 80s, and was one of the biggest draws of that period. He can give himself some credit in my eyes. Plus he taught Austin the Stunner.
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Post by Bobby Womack on Feb 20, 2008 3:35:07 GMT -5
i cant stand listening to hayes talk about anything because he is indeed a huge mark for himself and has an overinflated sense of self-importance, but i dont think the OP is giving him enough credit for what hes done, he probably was the weakest worker out of the 'birds, but as saggy knows, workrate gets you nowhere without charisma/mic skills/the look/etc, all of which hayes brought to the table
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Post by A Dubya (El Hombre Muerto) on Feb 20, 2008 4:52:12 GMT -5
He couldnt work a lick in the ring. Just had some decent mic skills and was a big loudmouth. It was Gordy and Roberts who carried the workload. Ha. I remember MVP saying this same thing in his segment with Michael Hayes a few months ago on Smackdown, when the WCCW dvd first came out.
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Post by tinaturner on Feb 20, 2008 5:30:55 GMT -5
Dear me, this whole subject just reinforces the MTV, high sugar content high fat, fast food, catchphrase ridden, too cool for my very nice school character of the newer fans of this sport.
THE USUAL TRAITS
Dont diss Cena, he is gangsta (even if he the dislike does go on a little too much) Kennedy is a god Who needs psychology Ring skills are for oldz skoolz Ricky Steamboat is boring More High spotzzzz I dont want working the body parts logically, I want POWERBOMBZZZZ NOW!!!!!!!!
I never feel embrassed about wrestling usually, but this kind of adolescent crap does my head in.
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Post by A Dubya (El Hombre Muerto) on Feb 20, 2008 5:33:28 GMT -5
Dear me, this whole subject just reinforces the MTV, high sugar content high fat, fast food, catchphrase ridden, too cool for my very nice school character of the newer fans of this sport. THE USUAL TRAITS Dont diss Cena, he is gangsta (even if he the dislike does go on a little too much) Kennedy is a god Who needs psychology Ring skills are for oldz skoolz Ricky Steamboat is boring More High spotzzzz I dont want working the body parts logically, I want POWERBOMBZZZZ NOW!!!!!!!! I never feel embrassed about wrestling usually, but this kind of adolescent crap does my head in. That sounds just like my younger cousin whenever we're watching wrestling. He can appreciate some of the older stars, but still...
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Post by tinaturner on Feb 20, 2008 5:36:46 GMT -5
Dear me, this whole subject just reinforces the MTV, high sugar content high fat, fast food, catchphrase ridden, too cool for my very nice school character of the newer fans of this sport. THE USUAL TRAITS Dont diss Cena, he is gangsta (even if he the dislike does go on a little too much) Kennedy is a god Who needs psychology Ring skills are for oldz skoolz Ricky Steamboat is boring More High spotzzzz I dont want working the body parts logically, I want POWERBOMBZZZZ NOW!!!!!!!! I never feel embrassed about wrestling usually, but this kind of adolescent crap does my head in. That sounds just like my younger cousin whenever we're watching wrestling. He can appreciate some of the older stars, but still... Its not completly his fault, he has been conditioned to think that way. Buy the Merch, act stupid, forget the wrestling and ask no questions.
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Mac
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Sigs/Avatars cannot exceed 1MB
Posts: 16,502
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Post by Mac on Feb 20, 2008 8:09:36 GMT -5
I think an apt comparison of another wrestler on the same level as Michael Hayes would be Larry Zbyszko. Whos overinflated sense of self importance to the industry was a little off putting at times.
While he's got his place in history he was never as great as he thought he was.
The Von Erichs v. Adams/Hernandez/Roberts etc sold better than the Von Erichs v. The Birds
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Post by Kash Flagg on Feb 20, 2008 8:17:32 GMT -5
I think an apt comparison of another wrestler on the same level as Michael Hayes would be Larry Zbyszko. Whos overinflated sense of self importance to the industry was a little off putting at times. While he's got his place in history he was never as great as he thought he was. The Von Erichs v. Adams/Hernandez/Roberts etc sold better than the Von Erichs v. The Birds First I wanna thank Natch Moranis for bringing up the mid South stuff. I had completely forgotten about that and amend my thoughts about him being a couple rungs below the Hogans and Flairs. I think he has a right to be that egotistical to a point, moreso than say Larry Z or Jerry Brisco. Larry was handed the AWA title because of his marriage to Verne's daughter, and outside of his early feud with Bruno, didn't make a real impact anywhere. Brisco just pisses me off. Jack Brisco has every right to have an ego, being one of the best NWA champs ever...Jerry or Gerald or whatever doesn't. Other than being a stooge and helping screw Ole Anderson out of the Georgia area, he's really done nothing of note.
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Mac
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Sigs/Avatars cannot exceed 1MB
Posts: 16,502
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Post by Mac on Feb 20, 2008 8:25:27 GMT -5
The issue with Hayes, especially once wrestling became more about WCW and WWF than any of the indies no matter how succesful they were "back in the day" the more history moves away from the 80's the less they'll see World Class, Mid South or any of the other Indies and their top stars considered on the same par as what WWF and NWA/Turner was doing at the time.
I compare Zbyszko to hayes where he had a big run with the top star of a company and mild mid card success in the early reaches of WCW.
His AWA stint I really could haev cared less about, that promotion was dead by the time Larry was champ. I'm shocked you'd think Verne Gagne would ever put over a member of his family though.
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