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Post by BorneAgain on May 12, 2009 22:12:09 GMT -5
He is guilty of taking the wrestlers who made him rich and allowing (and even encouraging) them to die at extremely young ages. He lied about creating a drug testing program in 1994 and needs to take a major share of the responsibility for all WWF wrestlers who have since had their lives shortened or ended by the drug abuse that he turned a blind eye to. I recognize that the wrestlers need to share responsibility themselves, but he bought good publicity with his fake testing program and has their blood on his hands. He is also a lousy hypocrite when it comes to health care for the employees who made him rich. If they're not employees, they need to be free to wrestle for any company at any time. If they're employees, he needs to arrange for adequate health care. Furthermore, he has taken an industry that used to showcase wrestlers and used it to serve his own ego. Linda, Shane, Stephanie, and Vince have taken time away from actually wrestling in the mistaken belief that they're even remotely entertaining. Because of this, none of his monopoly is worth watching. Speaking of monopolies, Vince's hypocrisy shines through again. Far from the anti-monopoly views that he claimed to hold during the Time Warner merger, he has cornered the market on professional wrestling. Does he still believe that such companies should be forced to split up? Strangely enough, no. Go figure. In addition, he has played a major role in the moral decline of society. Nowhere in the late 1990s was the sharp decline of standards on television (both in terms of language and what could be shown) more obvious than WWF programming. I hold hope for people like Jeffrey Dahmer and Adolf Hitler that they could repent prior to death and escape eternal damnation. I have no doubt, however, that Satan has had a spot reserved for Vince McMahon for many years now. ...This is satirical right? I can't tell on the internet anymore.
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h
Hank Scorpio
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Post by h on May 12, 2009 22:36:53 GMT -5
...This is satirical right? I can't tell on the internet anymore. Touché. No satire intended. I'm just not the world's biggest Vince McMahon fan.
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on May 12, 2009 22:56:07 GMT -5
He is guilty of taking the wrestlers who made him rich and allowing (and even encouraging) them to die at extremely young ages. Wait? What? I find it very hard to believe that Vince ever openly encouraged someone's death. I can't picture Vince sitting at home with an Eddie Guerrerro Voodoo doll saying "When you die, my plan will be complete!! Evidence please From what I've heard, the drug testing was legit but it lapsed in the late 90's. I really can't buy into the "blood on his hands" thing anymore then I hold owners responsible for baseball players being roided to the gills. There's no shared responsibility, the wrestlers who used have no one to blame but themselves. While I do kind of agree to this point, at the same time if it's not mandatory for an employer to offer health care, then he really isn't doing anything wrong. That one is mostly me playing Devils Advocate. That is entirely opinion based. Ratings tend to spike when he shows up, so it's apparently working. Even if it is small/temporary gains. Find me a business man who isn't a hypocrite, who doesn't want to see their business become as big as possible. Everyone gets into business hoping they're going to become Wal*Mart This again, is opinion. And I think any negative effects wrestling had on the moral fabric of the world were short term and that most of us grew beyond the Attitude Era. Even now, lots of people who were teenagers then condemn the shock value aspects of it. ........Wow.......just wow
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h
Hank Scorpio
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Post by h on May 12, 2009 23:05:11 GMT -5
I hold hope for people like Jeffrey Dahmer and Adolf Hitler that they could repent prior to death and escape eternal damnation. I have no doubt, however, that Satan has had a spot reserved for Vince McMahon for many years now. ........Wow.......just wow While I feel no need to justify any of my other statements, I suppose this one could use some clarification. Historically speaking, there is speculation about the possibility of remorse in the final days of Dahmer and Hitler. I see little to no possibility of anything of the sort coming from Vince McMahon. I certainly don't mean, however, to put a lousy wrestling product on a level with serial murder or genocide. The crimes of those two are infinitely worse, but I have an easier time believing that they could see the error of their ways than I do that Vince McMahon will do the same.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2009 23:16:48 GMT -5
........Wow.......just wow While I feel no need to justify any of my other statements, I suppose this one could use some clarification. Historically speaking, there is speculation about the possibility of remorse in the final days of Dahmer and Hitler. I see little to no possibility of anything of the sort coming from Vince McMahon. I certainly don't mean, however, to put a lousy wrestling product on a level with serial murder or genocide. The crimes of those two are infinitely worse, but I have an easier time believing that they could see the error of their ways than I do that Vince McMahon will do the same. . . . you do know Vince has offered all former WWF employees free rehab right?
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Post by vidalia on May 12, 2009 23:21:06 GMT -5
I think he no longer cares or has lost perspective on how his fans react.
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Lancers
El Dandy
Oh you
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Post by Lancers on May 12, 2009 23:22:23 GMT -5
I hold hope for people like Jeffrey Dahmer and Adolf Hitler that they could repent prior to death and escape eternal damnation. I have no doubt, however, that Satan has had a spot reserved for Vince McMahon for many years now.
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h
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 5,734
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Post by h on May 12, 2009 23:40:05 GMT -5
you do know Vince has offered all former WWF employees free rehab right? Yes, I recognize that, after lying about creating a drug testing program that surpassed the one used by the IOC and then waiting for 20 or so well-known WWF wrestlers to die of drug-related causes, Vince McMahon put out an offer, knowing that almost nobody would be willing to take him up on it. Furthermore, I recognize that he publicized the hell out of the offer. Please forgive me if I don't see a ton of sincerity there. Don't get me wrong. The offer is a wonderful thing. The motivation is suspect at best.
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MAGGLE
Dennis Stamp
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Post by MAGGLE on May 12, 2009 23:43:35 GMT -5
Vince McMahon was good in the 80s and he knew what he was doing. But after that he did not have a clue from anything. Every Single Idea that came after the 80s was not his Idea, the new guys Era, the Attidute Era, NOTHING! Quite honestly I am sure that he is doing nothing at the moment then saying Yes or No.
For example the writers think of something and Steph brings the Ideas to Vince and he decides Yes or No and he does a very bad job at it, because LIKE I SAID this guy had his last Idea in the 80s and he doesnt know what the Audience wants to see anymore.
What I think of Vince, just 1 Word:
RETIRE!
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Post by weekendwarrior on May 12, 2009 23:48:06 GMT -5
Vince McMahon no sold two torn quads. He recovered faster than Trips with his two quad operations combined. And as for people saying that he should step down or he is nearing the end, S. Robson Walton is still the head of Walmart, so what does that tell you?
Who paid for the rehab of wrestlers that requested it? Vince McMahon did.
Who took care of Freddy Blassie and took care of his medical bills untill the day he died? Vince McMahon did.
Who gave Vickie Guerrero a job because her husband didn't leave her with enough to survive? Vince McMahon did.
Paul Bearer was broke and out of the business, weighed five hundred pounds, and needed gastric bypasss surgery, but had no insurance. Who paid for it? Vince did.
Who paid for Bam Bam's funeral? McMahon did.
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Post by weekendwarrior on May 12, 2009 23:50:42 GMT -5
you do know Vince has offered all former WWF employees free rehab right? The motivation is suspect at best. Who cares what the motivation is, the fact that the offer is on the table is what matters.
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Post by teamjd on May 12, 2009 23:56:50 GMT -5
Best star to come out of/my favourite part of the attitude era and he always entertains me.
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MAGGLE
Dennis Stamp
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Post by MAGGLE on May 13, 2009 0:02:42 GMT -5
Vince McMahon no sold two torn quads. He recovered faster than Trips with his two quad operations combined. And as for people saying that he should step down or he is nearing the end, S. Robson Walton is still the head of Walmart, so what does that tell you? Can you please tell me what beeing in a good shape and just beeing bad for business have to do with each other? He should retire because he cant connect with the Audience since 1989!
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Post by rchi84 on May 13, 2009 0:18:07 GMT -5
this is a personal opinion and not weighing in facts. Vince is greatest sports promoter in history. give him all the flak you want, fact is, without his vision to make wrestling a cultural phenomenon, we would still be watching countless wrestling promotions with shoddy production values and slow action.
the killing of territories is a bad thing for wrestling i agree. but how else could vince have made wrestling maintstream, when there were 20 competing companies? like it or not, this is where the Tiger Woods syndrome comes in. without woods playing, TV ratings for PGA fall down. while it's good for the purists to have an open field, general public needs a "Legend" to watch. same with wrestling. a big dominant company like WWE makes wrestling a more familiar term for the general audience, who might watch indy wrestling out of curiousity as a result of WWE.
of course he's had a huge role in wrestlers roiding up. but ultimately, who shaped his opinion? wrestling fans themselves. when a guy like hogan creates more ratings than non gassed champs like bret/michaels etc, then of course vince has to give the audience what they want.
remember how we give mc cool flak for being booked as a dominant champ, because beth is more credible. in a choreograhphed programme, the credibility rests sorely on the "Look" of a wrestler. a non dominant champ is bad business (*Cough* punk, mysterio *cough*) so what option does he have other than "Credible dominant champs" like taker, batista, hhh, cena etc..
people hate him because he is rich. really? take a look at your job and your salalry and compare it to the money the boss is making. it's the rule of the world folks. bosses get 10 times what you get. end of story.
vince is out of touch. obviously. how can you expect a man in his 60s to be in tune with popular culture, when even i cant keep track with whats hip now, 2 years after graduating?
if anything, giving more scripting power to steph is acknowledgement that he values her judgement on making wrestling contemporary. if his son and daughter cant make wrestling more in tune with our times, its not fair to blame vince for the same shortcoming.
he is arrogant and rude. successful people invariably tend to be. business is a cold beast to master and there are tons of hard decisions that must be taken. being on friendly terms with everyone would make it impossible to make those decisions. and from what i've read, vince usually does take efforts to help out wrestlers who had major contributions to the development of WWF/E when they are in bad shape.
i have huge respect for vince the chairman of WWE. too many of us confuse the on screen character with the guy who runs the business.
/Force Fields Activated/
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Post by Slingshot Suplay on May 13, 2009 0:39:41 GMT -5
Great business man and promoter, very shrewd, but behind on the times.
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on May 13, 2009 0:53:15 GMT -5
........Wow.......just wow While I feel no need to justify any of my other statements, I suppose this one could use some clarification. Historically speaking, there is speculation about the possibility of remorse in the final days of Dahmer and Hitler. I see little to no possibility of anything of the sort coming from Vince McMahon. I certainly don't mean, however, to put a lousy wrestling product on a level with serial murder or genocide. The crimes of those two are infinitely worse, but I have an easier time believing that they could see the error of their ways than I do that Vince McMahon will do the same. With all do respect bro, you made some pretty outrages claims. I think I'm totally justified in asking for some legitimate explanations behind some of those. I mean, you claimed you think Vince encouraged people to die. That deserves an explanation man. And that he has a major role in the downfall of moral fiber. I really feel these claims need some sort of explanation.
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Post by Hanz Moleman on May 13, 2009 1:51:29 GMT -5
Even through all the discussion and truth about how he pretty much put other companies out of business, I think he made the industry better. I just wish he would have faith in his workers and allow them to control their promos and everything.
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Post by i.Sarita.com on May 13, 2009 3:12:52 GMT -5
I f***ing hate him just for the fact that he bought WCW. I would have much perfered someone who would have actually done something with it to buy it. But no, old Vince just had to get his paws on it and "prove" how much better the WWF was by having a terrible Invasion storyline that lead to most of the WCW guys being made into fools.
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sloride
Unicron
Doesn't Suck Up. Or Does She?
The Greatest Entertainer to have ever Lived
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Post by sloride on May 13, 2009 3:30:13 GMT -5
Vince McMahon is a phenomenal businessman and promoter. To do what he did in such a short amount of time is extraordinary. But he is now showing his age and should contemplate passing the reigns on or at least letting Shane and Steph have more say in things.
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Mozenrath
FANatic
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Speedy Speed Boy
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Post by Mozenrath on May 13, 2009 3:43:28 GMT -5
He is guilty of taking the wrestlers who made him rich and allowing (and even encouraging) them to die at extremely young ages. He lied about creating a drug testing program in 1994 and needs to take a major share of the responsibility for all WWF wrestlers who have since had their lives shortened or ended by the drug abuse that he turned a blind eye to. I recognize that the wrestlers need to share responsibility themselves, but he bought good publicity with his fake testing program and has their blood on his hands. He is also a lousy hypocrite when it comes to health care for the employees who made him rich. If they're not employees, they need to be free to wrestle for any company at any time. If they're employees, he needs to arrange for adequate health care. Furthermore, he has taken an industry that used to showcase wrestlers and used it to serve his own ego. Linda, Shane, Stephanie, and Vince have taken time away from actually wrestling in the mistaken belief that they're even remotely entertaining. Because of this, none of his monopoly is worth watching. Speaking of monopolies, Vince's hypocrisy shines through again. Far from the anti-monopoly views that he claimed to hold during the Time Warner merger, he has cornered the market on professional wrestling. Does he still believe that such companies should be forced to split up? Strangely enough, no. Go figure. In addition, he has played a major role in the moral decline of society. Nowhere in the late 1990s was the sharp decline of standards on television (both in terms of language and what could be shown) more obvious than WWF programming. I hold hope for people like Jeffrey Dahmer and Adolf Hitler that they could repent prior to death and escape eternal damnation. I have no doubt, however, that Satan has had a spot reserved for Vince McMahon for many years now. Did you just compare him to Adolf Hitler? You haven't the slightest idea how skewed your perspective is, do you? A Holocaust survivor would slap the taste right out of your mouth as soon as look at you.
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