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Post by SickFlipPiledriver on Jul 2, 2009 18:41:15 GMT -5
There's another common factor in those matches, you know...
In any case, a few incidences aside, Triple H is loved by 90% of the crowds they visit.
No one does anymore. Cena is the only person who is clearly a bigger draw than Triple H, and Triple H put him over.
Only that's not what happened at all. I'm not going into the whole thing again because it's been done a number of times but to summarize: MVP dominated most of the match, made a mistake and lost. Triple H sold MVP's offense the whole match and into the post-match.
But here's a thought: maybe the match wasn't booked to help MVP.
If you were following the thread you'd know I already said it was stupid to book the match how it was booked. But Triple H didn't book the match, and they still went out and made the most of it.
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Post by skiller on Jul 2, 2009 18:42:14 GMT -5
I'd say Jeff Hardy's a bigger draw than Trips too.
And probably Batista.
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Post by SickFlipPiledriver on Jul 2, 2009 18:43:10 GMT -5
I don't know if I'd say Batista is. Hardy probably is but what good does it do when they never know if he's coming or going?
In any case, Triple H put both of them over, too.
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Post by MGH on Jul 2, 2009 18:44:34 GMT -5
I'd say Jeff Hardy's a bigger draw than Trips too. I'd say that indisputable at this point. Even for the people who cling to the "crowd pop" argument.
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Post by skiller on Jul 2, 2009 18:44:57 GMT -5
What about Edge? I'm not sure how a heel draws.
Orton looked to be getting there earlier this year. But it looks like he's stunted again.
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Post by skiller on Jul 2, 2009 18:45:42 GMT -5
I don't know if I'd say Batista is. Hardy probably is but what good does it do when they never know if he's coming or going? In any case, Triple H put both of them over, too. I'd say Batista gets bigger reactions from the crowds.
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Post by MGH on Jul 2, 2009 18:47:25 GMT -5
What about Edge? I'm not sure how a heel draws. Orton looked to be getting there earlier this year. But it looks like he's stunted again. Crowd wise Orton definitely was, but he has a black mark in that ratings have always slipped without fail each time he's gotten the belt. Once or twice, coincidence maybe. 3-4 times, pattern.
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Post by SickFlipPiledriver on Jul 2, 2009 18:49:21 GMT -5
I don't know if we can use Edge's first title win as a basis for saying he's a draw; that was a special moment in wrestling that they won't be able to re-duplicate, with Edge or anyone else.
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spagett
Hank Scorpio
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Post by spagett on Jul 2, 2009 18:54:26 GMT -5
Of their big 6 babyfaces
HBK Undertaker Cena Batista Jeff Hardy Triple H
Triple H is the least popular and yet booked the strongest.
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Post by MGH on Jul 2, 2009 18:57:01 GMT -5
Of their big 6 babyfaces HBK Undertaker Cena Batista Jeff Hardy Triple H Triple H is the least popular and yet booked the strongest. I'll actually switch sides on this one. I don't agree with it for other reasons, but I can understand why they would feature him more than 4 of those guys. All except Cena are constantly hurt, taking time off here and there, or don't know what their future is going to be. I think it's a horrible idea for him to ever, EVER, be booked stronger or ahead of Cena at this point, but the other four I can at least understand. I'm not saying I AGREE with it, because for other reasons and factors I don't, but I at least see where th argument could be made.
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spagett
Hank Scorpio
Great Job!
Posts: 5,649
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Post by spagett on Jul 2, 2009 19:02:44 GMT -5
Of their big 6 babyfaces HBK Undertaker Cena Batista Jeff Hardy Triple H Triple H is the least popular and yet booked the strongest. I'll actually switch sides on this one. I don't agree with it for other reasons, but I can understand why they would feature him more than 4 of those guys. All except Cena are constantly hurt, taking time off here and there, or don't know what their future is going to be. I think it's a horrible idea for him to ever, EVER, be booked stronger or ahead of Cena at this point, but the other four I can at least understand. I'm not saying I AGREE with it, because for other reasons and factors I don't, but I at least see where th argument could be made. No you are right 4 of those are unable to be trusted properly although this should mean the WWE are desperate to make new stars but it doesn't look like they are. I will say that the only argument the Triple H defenders have not even attempted to answer is why is HHH booked stronger than John Cena? It makes no sense. I dont like Cena but he should be the superhero of this generation not Triple H.
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Post by DamnYankee on Jul 2, 2009 19:12:42 GMT -5
I could care less of HHH's "politics" backstage and am more concerned with him continuing to put on great matches.
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Post by SickFlipPiledriver on Jul 2, 2009 19:13:03 GMT -5
I don't really see how Triple H is booked stronger than Cena.
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Post by MGH on Jul 2, 2009 19:20:11 GMT -5
I don't really see how Triple H is booked stronger than Cena. I can't see how you can't at all. Just look at Cena from his Rumble return in 08 onward and compare it to HHH's run in that same time frame. They're in two different universes. Cena came back, won the Rumble, then took the fall at Mania. Took a fall at Backlash, then he took a slide down the card. He feuded midcard with JBL for months and lost the feud. Then he and Batista feuded AWAY from the World Title on Raw with Batista winning. He came back from his next injury and won the belt, then lost it to Edge. Won it back ... lost it to him again. Then he slid down the card again has been feuding with Big Show this entire time. Hunter ... won the belt at Backlash. Feuded with Orton over the belt, beat him. Feuded with Cena over the belt, beat him. Went to Smackdown and feuded with Hardy over the belt, beat him. I don't even want to bring up Shelton and Kendrick during that Scramble phase. Having just lost the belt, he wins it back at No Way Out by pinning Undertaker of all people. Came back to Raw and feuded with Orton over the title, beat him. Lost it to Orton, came back, and now has been killing Orton left and right every chance they have to book him to do it.
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Post by skiller on Jul 2, 2009 19:22:14 GMT -5
I also don't think Cena's ever lost in a main event of a PPV and ended up standing tall over his opponent.
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Post by MGH on Jul 2, 2009 19:26:36 GMT -5
I don't really see how Triple H is booked stronger than Cena. I can't see how you can't at all. Just look at Cena from his Rumble return in 08 onward and compare it to HHH's run in that same time frame. They're in two different universes. Cena came back, won the Rumble, then took the fall at Mania. Took a fall at Backlash, then he took a slide down the card. He feuded midcard with JBL for months and lost the feud. Then he and Batista feuded AWAY from the World Title on Raw with Batista winning. He came back from his next injury and won the belt, then lost it to Edge. Won it back ... lost it to him again. Then he slid down the card again has been feuding with Big Show this entire time. Hunter ... won the belt at Backlash. Feuded with Orton over the belt, beat him. Feuded with Cena over the belt, beat him. Went to Smackdown and feuded with Hardy over the belt, beat him. I don't even want to bring up Shelton and Kendrick during that Scramble phase. Having just lost the belt, he wins it back at No Way Out by pinning Undertaker of all people. Came back to Raw and feuded with Orton over the title, beat him. Lost it to Orton, came back, and now has been killing Orton left and right every chance they have to book him to do it. I'll add one damning stat to this. Number of pinfall loses, clean or otherwise, HHH took in 2008. Ready? TWO. Thanks to interference from Kozlov, Hardy got a pin on him on Smackdown. At Survivor Series, a Jeff Hardy chair shot gave Edge the pin. I can think of multiple Cena losses off the top of my head where he took the fall.
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
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Post by Mecca on Jul 2, 2009 19:32:42 GMT -5
I could care less of HHH's "politics" backstage and am more concerned with him continuing to put on great matches. Other than he really doesn't have great matches anymore.
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Post by SickFlipPiledriver on Jul 2, 2009 19:37:23 GMT -5
Beating Orton doesn't make Triple H look all that strong to me because Orton is and always has been a punk and a chump. Cena on the other hand has been spending the last few months getting his ass kicked by the strongest, "biggest" wrestler on the roster, but still coming back despite his massive injuries and 7000-watt searchlights and beating Show, FU'ing him, tapping him out, everything. He always looked strong against Edge despite losing.
That's all incidental, though. The most important thing is how they look versus each other and when the two meet up, they're even so far. Though I would argue that Cena won the more important and memorable match.
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
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Post by Mecca on Jul 2, 2009 19:41:18 GMT -5
Orton looks like a punk champion because in todays world of WWE, no heel can look strong ever.
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Post by skiller on Jul 2, 2009 19:41:36 GMT -5
Orton looks like a punk champion because in todays world of WWE, no heel can look strong ever. Except Triple H.
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