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Post by Andrew is Good on Sept 25, 2009 12:57:35 GMT -5
I was listening to Mr. Kennedy's shoot interview, and he talked about how his Kennedy Declares segments on WWE.com were cut short because Vince McMahon thought they were too entertaining, and they couldn't have half the crowd cheering Kennedy while he was facing the Undertaker.
This has been brought up before about heels being funny or cool not being good heels, as heels are supposed to be hated and not cool. And I think a good example of this at the moment is the Pope in TNA.
On Impact last night, as usual, The Pope was getting his usual cheers and "Pope is Pimpin" chants and people were booing the babyface, Suicide (who is normally cheered) against The Pope. Now, this goes against what Dinero is supposed to be, and that's a heel. He is supposed to get people to hate him, and get people to like the babyface.
Now, this isn't me trying to bring down Pope, I think he's awesome. But, he's too awesome to be a heel. It's like the Machine Guns. They're really funny and entertaining on the commentary, and they can't be heels. The crowd loves them too much. So, you're swimming upstream with them.
So yeah, I think Dinero needs somewhat of a change in character in order to get heat as a heel, or needs to just keep the character the way it is, and be a babyface.
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Post by Arthur Digby Stamp on Sept 25, 2009 13:16:03 GMT -5
Suicide is probably the least likeable face on the entire roster, short of maybe Jessie Neal. There's not whole lot of guys on the roster who are going to get booed against a bodysuit wearing emo kid, honestly.
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comahan
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 17,899 
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Post by comahan on Sept 25, 2009 13:19:11 GMT -5
I know what youre saying, but the impact zone is such a hard place to judge stuff like this. That place is so weird when it comes to crowd reaction sometimes. I think as it goes along and they do more PPVs elsewhere (BFG for example), it'll answer your question.
I hate to keep going back to the well, but ill say this again. He reminds me of The Rock in early-mid 98. Thats not saying that hes going to turn into a megastar or anything, just that The Pope reminds me of that particular version of The Rock. And that particular version of The Rock got a lot of cheers as a heel, ESPECIALLY when he'd drop the peoples elbow.
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vanboxmeer
ALF
Starts threads that aren't about Edge or Cena
Posts: 1,057
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Post by vanboxmeer on Sept 25, 2009 13:19:28 GMT -5
Has he even been booed in any of his singles matches?
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Post by poi zen rana on Sept 25, 2009 13:21:10 GMT -5
Exactly what I came here to say. Someone getting cheered over Suicide doesn't mean they aren't doing a good job. Suicide is despised by many wrestling fans, whether I agree with that or not. I think Dinero is doing just fine and were he working with someone the fans loved the reaction would be much different. Granted this is TNA so many heels get quite a bit appreciation. I just think the real problem lies with the Suicide character.
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Post by hbk4ever09 on Sept 25, 2009 13:24:35 GMT -5
Suicide has been getting booed for a long time now. I consider Dinero more of a tweener than a heel anyways, and if the crowd wants him to be a face so be it.
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Post by gamblore on Sept 25, 2009 13:29:12 GMT -5
Since debuting, has Dinero done anything particularly heelish? In other words, does the crowd have any reason to see him as a heel, or has he just been a heel by default because he's been wrestling against faces?
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Post by Andrew is Good on Sept 25, 2009 13:35:35 GMT -5
Exactly what I came here to say. Someone getting cheered over Suicide doesn't mean they aren't doing a good job. Suicide is despised by many wrestling fans, whether I agree with that or not. I think Dinero is doing just fine and were he working with someone the fans loved the reaction would be much different. Granted this is TNA so many heels get quite a bit appreciation. I just think the real problem lies with the Suicide character. Well, it seems he's only been booed when facing Dinero, for awhile he was getting pretty good reactions. |
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comahan
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 17,899
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Post by comahan on Sept 25, 2009 13:37:56 GMT -5
House show reports always have Suicide get surprisingly big pops. So he could be a victim of the impact zones weirdness
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Post by Andrew is Good on Sept 25, 2009 14:07:14 GMT -5
House show reports always have Suicide get surprisingly big pops. So he could be a victim of the impact zones weirdness Yeah, but as well, Suicide has also for awhile gotten a great reaction in the impact zone, up until Pope started feuding with him. And again, I'm not taking away his ability. I think he's great, but he has to change it up, or become a babyface. |
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Sajoa Moe
Patti Mayonnaise
Did you get that thing I sent ya?
A man without gimmick.
Posts: 39,683
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Post by Sajoa Moe on Sept 25, 2009 14:18:23 GMT -5
I don't think it's necessarily the Impact Zone's fault that's he's getting cheers, it's just that he's a great character, no matter what his allegiance.
Than again, I am talking about the same Impact Zone that cheered a hated Jeff Jarrett a few years back.
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Post by poi zen rana on Sept 25, 2009 14:23:45 GMT -5
House show reports always have Suicide get surprisingly big pops. So he could be a victim of the impact zones weirdness Yeah, but as well, Suicide has also for awhile gotten a great reaction in the impact zone, up until Pope started feuding with him. And again, I'm not taking away his ability. I think he's great, but he has to change it up, or become a babyface. I don't really count the Impact Zone reactions as representative of TNA's audience as a whole and when I mentioned Suicide being relatively despised I was basing that off of the reactions the character has gotten here and on other wrestling message boards. I know he gets quite a bit of hate because I just started watching again this year after not watching any wrestling for about a year and I found it odd that everyone seemed to dislike him, where I thought the character was fun and interesting. I kept thinking maybe because I was not paying attention at the beginning of his run that maybe that is why my opinion varied so much from the others. |
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EJS
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 18,857
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Post by EJS on Sept 25, 2009 15:43:45 GMT -5
Yeah he's done absolutely nothing heelish.
Closest being the way he treats SoCal Val when she's taking his gear.
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Post by Djm Doesn't Find You Funny on Sept 25, 2009 16:00:01 GMT -5
I'm still trying to figure out why they booed Brother Ray after causing Rhino and D'Von to stop.
The rare time Ray isn't being an overbearing jerkass, they boo him.
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EJS
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 18,857
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Post by EJS on Sept 25, 2009 16:11:18 GMT -5
I'm still trying to figure out why they booed Brother Ray after causing Rhino and D'Von to stop. The rare time Ray isn't being an overbearing jerkass, they boo him. He still sounds like one no matter what he says. |
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Sajoa Moe
Patti Mayonnaise
Did you get that thing I sent ya?
A man without gimmick.
Posts: 39,683
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Post by Sajoa Moe on Sept 25, 2009 16:11:48 GMT -5
I'm still trying to figure out why they booed Brother Ray after causing Rhino and D'Von to stop. The rare time Ray isn't being an overbearing jerkass, they boo him. Because they wanted to see a fight, and Ray was trying to break it up. |
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Maniac Mitch
Mephisto
Mary Droppins? ...well I thought it was funny
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Post by Maniac Mitch on Sept 25, 2009 16:15:09 GMT -5
House show reports always have Suicide get surprisingly big pops. So he could be a victim of the impact zones weirdness Yeah, but as well, Suicide has also for awhile gotten a great reaction in the impact zone, up until Pope started feuding with him. And again, I'm not taking away his ability. I think he's great, but he has to change it up, or become a babyface. I think it's one of those cases where the character is so unique from anything else that's been done, that people are just drawn to it. It's fresh and exciting and new, so people are going to be interested in it. The problem is, his character is supposed to be a street preacher, and part of the reason people like him is that he can talk the talk. If they were to ask him to dial down his promos, it would take away from his character and his momentum. I think the way he would have to change would be to alter his wrestling style to be more heelish as he doesn't really do anything that despicable from bell to bell. |
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Post by ritt works hard fo da chickens on Sept 25, 2009 17:30:10 GMT -5
He really needs to take a page out of the CM Punk book. Go after someone popular for their character. Abyss is overdone for this stuff. Maybe call out Beer Money for being bad role morels. Or Chris Daniels for representing a fallen angel when the people need someone to rise up above the whatever it is he wants to be annoying about.
Although I agree the Impact zone is weird it is the reaction most people have to go by. We can dismiss it because we are generally smarkier then most fans but that stuff matters. That's why shows use laugh tracks and applause signs so the people at home know when to laugh or cheer along.
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Post by SickFlipPiledriver on Sept 25, 2009 17:34:04 GMT -5
It's pretty much impossible to debut in the Impact ZONE as a WWE guy and not get a heroes welcome. Which is funny since they boo any mention of WWE.
God I hate the Impact Zone.
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Post by The Scuba Guy on Sept 25, 2009 18:25:07 GMT -5
One thing I noticed last night was the crowd was cheering for the tambourine to be used.
Dinero used it, got cheered.
But Suicide, picked it up, and just tossed it. So basically, for the rest of the match because of that, he was the heel and Dinero was the face
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