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Post by Dr. Bunsen Honeydew on Apr 4, 2010 8:47:14 GMT -5
Yes. But the oinly one getting ripped for it is Cena. Kind of hypocritical if you ask me. And this thread is solely about Cena ... soooo ... go make a thread about Hogan and bash him there. I don't need to bash Hogan becuase I didn't have a problem with it just as I don't have an issue with him either. My point is is that the only one who ever gets ripped for this on this forum is Cena. And that is hypocritical when others to the exact same thing and nothing is said.
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Post by Pooh Carlson on Apr 4, 2010 9:43:18 GMT -5
And this thread is solely about Cena ... soooo ... go make a thread about Hogan and bash him there. I don't need to bash Hogan becuase I didn't have a problem with it just as I don't have an issue with him either. My point is is that the only one who ever gets ripped for this on this forum is Cena. And that is hypocritical when others to the exact same thing and nothing is said. If somebody obviously no-sells after a match, I'll vocalize it ... maybe not on this board, but I'll usually talk about it with a friend or something. Shawn looked as though he didn't just jump through a table after the match at Mania, and that bugged me, too. Like I said, others do it, too. Cena just does it more consistently, so he gets called out for it because you see him do it ALL THE TIME.
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Post by primetime110 on Apr 4, 2010 10:51:12 GMT -5
And this thread is solely about Cena ... soooo ... go make a thread about Hogan and bash him there. I don't need to bash Hogan becuase I didn't have a problem with it just as I don't have an issue with him either. My point is is that the only one who ever gets ripped for this on this forum is Cena. And that is hypocritical when others to the exact same thing and nothing is said. Amen. I'm not a Cena fan. But your spot on with your post. HHH gets alot flack on here as well. Like when Jeff Hardy pinned him and Trips got up and smiled and the board had a near meltdown. Only for a IWC favorite to do the exact samething monthes later and not a peep about it.
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SAJ Forth
Wade Wilson
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Post by SAJ Forth on Apr 4, 2010 12:42:25 GMT -5
It's how WWE/F always books its top babyfaces. I thought it was a crock load of crap back in the day that Bret Hart never lost definitively to Diesel. I share this sentiment, though to be fair, Hogan's big thing was Selling everything until a big time comeback.
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Post by Jason on Apr 4, 2010 13:20:28 GMT -5
Let's get fair here. Hogan sold alot in segments, you didn't need to go to extreme lengths to keep him down. I truly believe that if Swagger came out and hit Hogan with the briefcase during Hulkamania, Hogan would be out for the night and would be helped to the back by refs.
It's not fair to compare those two to Cena, that was 3 decades ago. It is like going back to the plain tights for everybody and doing a 60 minute adominal stretch. My point is, Cena is never made to look bad and I just don't think it's neccessary. If he's as popular as they say he is, he won't suffer by getting beat down, losing or taking a step away from the title, will he?
And Cena has had the belt way too much. It's like WWE can't further a feud anymore without the automatic rematch clause storyline. That's why guys like him and Orton have the belt too much, they keep trading it to give them an excuse to fight again.
Cena wins. Next night - Orton: "I want my rematch clause" Orton wins. Next night - Cena "I want my rematch clause" Cena wins. Next night - Orton: "I want my rematch clause" Orton wins. Next night - Cena "I want my rematch clause"
And so on.
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SAJ Forth
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Post by SAJ Forth on Apr 4, 2010 15:25:25 GMT -5
Let's get fair here. Hogan sold alot in segments, you didn't need to go to extreme lengths to keep him down. I truly believe that if Swagger came out and hit Hogan with the briefcase during Hulkamania, Hogan would be out for the night and would be helped to the back by refs. It's not fair to compare those two to Cena, that was 3 decades ago. It is like going back to the plain tights for everybody and doing a 60 minute adominal stretch. My point is, Cena is never made to look bad and I just don't think it's neccessary. If he's as popular as they say he is, he won't suffer by getting beat down, losing or taking a step away from the title, will he? And Cena has had the belt way too much. It's like WWE can't further a feud anymore without the automatic rematch clause storyline. That's why guys like him and Orton have the belt too much, they keep trading it to give them an excuse to fight again. Cena wins. Next night - Orton: "I want my rematch clause" Orton wins. Next night - Cena "I want my rematch clause" Cena wins. Next night - Orton: "I want my rematch clause" Orton wins. Next night - Cena "I want my rematch clause" And so on. This is true. There are times where it seems like they've forgotten how to do Feuds without either a Championship or some goofy, mindless Booking.
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AriadosMan
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Post by AriadosMan on Apr 4, 2010 15:31:40 GMT -5
I think WWE is trying to increase the audience taste for edgy faces (Edge, Orton) so that they can eventually turn Cena heel without a huge fanbase revolt.
However, it has to be done slowly and subtly enough so that the fans will accept it. I'm not complaining because the WWE is finally starting to use edgy faces again, even though I find Cena himself boring.
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Post by foreveryoung on Apr 4, 2010 16:34:58 GMT -5
One problem with the booking.. Cena ISNT Hogan. Nor is this the 80s. This is an era where that formula will not be overly successful. Hogan could do it due to the perfect timing, his charisma, and due to the fact that this was before wrestling became outright fake and before every knew every damn thing about the business. Cena does ok considering the circumstances. But wrestling just doesnt have the mainstream appeal anymore.. And truth be told. It may never again like it did in the 80s and late 90s.. Unless we see some competition.
Im actually very surprised the audience isnt even more sick of Cena.. The intelligence of the fans should be insulted. You cant do business today like you did 25 years ago.
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Post by hajimenoippo on Apr 4, 2010 16:48:47 GMT -5
It pissed me off that Bret never lost to Diesel or Sid clean. I mean Bret always had these playing possum moments and would win with a small package.
It made me mad because Diesel was way cooler than hitman.
to say this type of booking is only relevant to Cena is tunnel vision.
I mean Austin stunned the entire roster at one point.
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Post by Kash Flagg on Apr 4, 2010 17:21:48 GMT -5
I've always felt that Cena is the kind of guy who does what he's told, no matter what. He has the look and the work ethic, so Vince gave him the ball and Cena let him be the puppet master. I truly believe that Cena can actually wrestle if they would let him (repeat in caps for emphasis IF THEY WOULD LET HIM) but they won't. And a heel turn isn't necessarily the answer. Yes, the return of heel Cena would rock all hell, but it would be bad for business. Face Cena taking some time off, then returning as Face Cena With Attitude would be better (think Cena right before being drafted to Raw). On his own, Cena could be the next Rock, but Vince wants him to be the next Hogan. Cena wants to stay in the driver's seat on the gravy train, so he's gonna listen to the boss, move for move, word for word, smile for smile. Exactly. With more and more TV and Movie appearances, he's a Hulk Hogan type that Vince can control.
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Post by Jason on Apr 4, 2010 18:17:50 GMT -5
It pissed me off that Bret never lost to Diesel or Sid clean. I mean Bret always had these playing possum moments and would win with a small package. It made me mad because Diesel was way cooler than hitman. to say this type of booking is only relevant to Cena is tunnel vision. I mean Austin stunned the entire roster at one point. But Austin put people over and normally gave a good match. Cena has yet to put anybody over, fully. I'm not talking about making them look good, I mean really lose to somebody clean. The only people I can remember are HBK and HHH. Sheamus won with an excuse for Cena.
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Post by hajimenoippo on Apr 4, 2010 18:23:20 GMT -5
You mean put over people like who? The Rock and HHH. Guys on his own level. Hell Kane and Undertaker could never get a clean pin on the guy, and the guy more often then not made Big Show his bitch.
Cena has put over Batista and Orton. Guys on his own level. Hell Khali and Umaga could never get a clean pin on the guy, and the guy more often then not makes big show his bitch.
Bret has put over HBK and Goldberg, hell Undertaker and Diesel could never get a clean pin othe guy, and he more often than not makes Isaac yankem his bitch.
You mean like Hogan? He put over Warrior, hell Randy Savage and Andre the Giant could never get a clean pin on the guy, and more often than not makes Hercules his bitch.
you mean like HBK? Sure he's put over Sid and Austin, guys on his level, but then Undertaker and Diesel couldn't get a clean pin on the guy, and he makes Vader his bitch...
See how that works?
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Post by Dr. Bunsen Honeydew on Apr 4, 2010 18:34:36 GMT -5
It pissed me off that Bret never lost to Diesel or Sid clean. I mean Bret always had these playing possum moments and would win with a small package. It made me mad because Diesel was way cooler than hitman. to say this type of booking is only relevant to Cena is tunnel vision. I mean Austin stunned the entire roster at one point. But Austin put people over and normally gave a good match. Cena has yet to put anybody over, fully. I'm not talking about making them look good, I mean really lose to somebody clean. The only people I can remember are HBK and HHH. Sheamus won with an excuse for Cena. Batista says "Ahem"
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Post by Pooh Carlson on Apr 4, 2010 18:36:32 GMT -5
Last one doesn't really work though ... Taker just got two clean pins two years in a row
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spagett
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Post by spagett on Apr 4, 2010 18:40:17 GMT -5
One problem with the booking.. Cena ISNT Hogan. Nor is this the 80s. This is an era where that formula will not be overly successful. Hogan could do it due to the perfect timing, his charisma, and due to the fact that this was before wrestling became outright fake and before every knew every damn thing about the business. Cena does ok considering the circumstances. But wrestling just doesnt have the mainstream appeal anymore.. And truth be told. It may never again like it did in the 80s and late 90s.. Unless we see some competition. Im actually very surprised the audience isnt even more sick of Cena.. The intelligence of the fans should be insulted. You cant do business today like you did 25 years ago. Exactly. John Cena doesn't have half the corwd support Hogan had or a 1/10th of the charisma Hogan had. Now I wouldn't class myself as a Cena hater. Far from it in fact but that is the truth.
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Post by Dynamite Kid on Apr 4, 2010 18:59:21 GMT -5
Foley wrote explicitly in his book that when he beat Austin for the title in '99 it was the first clean pin over Austin in over a year and a half.
This is what happens with top guys. Deal with it. Moaning about it on a message board will change sweet f*** all.
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Mangs
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Post by Mangs on Apr 4, 2010 21:37:07 GMT -5
As of late I'm starting to doubt whether I really hate Cena or not.
I really did hate him some time back, and that was before I got involved in the WWE community so I wasn't really influenced by other peoples opinions, or the "Cena bandwagon" as some people call it.
My hate for Cena started when he last feuded with JBL. He had like a series of matches where JBL was beating the crap out of him for 15-20 minutes, then Cena got up, hit one FU (which it was called back then, not Attitude Adjustment) and won the match. It pissed me off every time.
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Post by ChitownKnight on Apr 4, 2010 22:05:44 GMT -5
But Austin put people over and normally gave a good match. Cena has yet to put anybody over, fully. I'm not talking about making them look good, I mean really lose to somebody clean. The only people I can remember are HBK and HHH. Sheamus won with an excuse for Cena. Batista says "Ahem" As does Orton
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