Are There Really People Who Think AJ Cant Wrestle?

[Savage Gambino]

Mar 26, 2012 22:54:39 GMT -5 Tiger Maskooo said:

Mar 26, 2012 20:33:08 GMT -5 Sam Punk said:

As has been mentioned, all sports entertainers will have their haters. She is the best diva they have. Great worker + great on the mic + great charisma. Other than Sara Del Ray, I'd say she is the best womens' wrestler on the planet right now.

Charisma is the ability to inspire loud crowd reactions. That's something AJ is incapable of doing.

I'd say that other than the bella twins,she's the most useless womens wrestler of all time.

Really? Of all time? Don't you think that's a tad extravagant?

[Magic knows Black Lives Matter]

Cause when you're a women that moves up to the main roster in WWE, you lose any actual talent and become awful. DUH.

[Tiger Maskooo]

Mar 26, 2012 23:06:06 GMT -5 Krimzon said:

Mar 26, 2012 22:54:39 GMT -5 Tiger Maskooo said:

Charisma is the ability to inspire loud crowd reactions. That's something AJ is incapable of doing.

Except all the times the crowd has chanted "AJ" and how she gets heat for Bryan.

The fans facepopping when an abusive boyfriend character tells his girlfriend to shut up isn't really getting heat for him.

That highlights what a failure AJ is in her role. If fans are happy when the 98 pound girl with the sad face gets emotionally abused then somethings pretty wrong.

I havent heard these chants of her name either. I've just heard silence like any other divas match.

[Deleted]

Mar 26, 2012 13:35:19 GMT -5 @chrisc said:

Mar 26, 2012 13:24:01 GMT -5 Krimzon said:

Why can't it simply be that 2 good wrestlers had a good match?

It's because I don't just watch the Divas matches. I watch the guys wrestle, too, and in general, their matches are constantly better than the best Divas matches, let alone the average Diva match.

OH. MY. GOD.

THIS! THIS! THIS!

Seriously I feel the exact same way but have never been able to find a way to put it into words without fear of coming off predjudiced.

[kyromax]

She is still green, but already better than Kelly Kelly.

[HR]

Mar 27, 2012 0:03:47 GMT -5 Tiger Maskooo said:

Mar 26, 2012 23:06:06 GMT -5 Krimzon said:

Except all the times the crowd has chanted "AJ" and how she gets heat for Bryan.

The fans facepopping when an abusive boyfriend character tells his girlfriend to shut up isn't really getting heat for him.

That highlights what a failure AJ is in her role. If fans are happy when the 98 pound girl with the sad face gets emotionally abused then somethings pretty wrong.

I havent heard these chants of her name either. I've just heard silence like any other divas match.

You're going to tell me that he's doing a bad job as a heel because people have taken to the YES! YES! YES! thing? A reaction like "AJ, shut up" got doesn't mean she's not helping him get heat (ignoring the fact that it was more of a "did he really say that?" type reaction than a face pop) because she clearly is. Just look at what happened on tonight's Raw as an example.

AJ is a huge reason why Daniel's been able to move up to the main event so easily, because she helps add a whole dimension to his character. The "abusive" boyfriend character has been done plenty of times, but this is way better than most, because of the type of talent AJ is. They've got fantastic chemistry.

And your final comment just proves that you haven't watched very many of her matches, because it's happened on a number of occasions.

[Tiger Maskooo]

Mar 27, 2012 3:55:10 GMT -5 HR said:

Mar 27, 2012 0:03:47 GMT -5 Tiger Maskooo said:

The fans facepopping when an abusive boyfriend character tells his girlfriend to shut up isn't really getting heat for him.

That highlights what a failure AJ is in her role. If fans are happy when the 98 pound girl with the sad face gets emotionally abused then somethings pretty wrong.

I havent heard these chants of her name either. I've just heard silence like any other divas match.

You're going to tell me that he's doing a bad job as a heel because people have taken to the YES! YES! YES! thing? A reaction like "AJ, shut up" got doesn't mean she's not helping him get heat (ignoring the fact that it was more of a "did he really say that?" type reaction than a face pop) because she clearly is. Just look at what happened on tonight's Raw as an example.

AJ is a huge reason why Daniel's been able to move up to the main event so easily, because she helps add a whole dimension to his character. The "abusive" boyfriend character has been done plenty of times, but this is way better than most, because of the type of talent AJ is. They've got fantastic chemistry.

And your final comment just proves that you haven't watched very many of her matches, because it's happened on a number of occasions.

I'm not saying bryans doing a bad job as a heel. Quite to the contrary,I think bryan is great in the role of a jerk. I've known that since 2006.

I'm saying that I hardly think that AJ has really given him any of that heat. I think you could really replace her with anyone and it wouldn't hurt.

She doesnt seem to get much sympathy from the audience when she's on screen. Hell I remember when she came out with the neckbrace and the crowd didnt react to her.

I don't think that people were reacting positively to bryan telling her to shut up because they couldnt believe he said it either. I think they either wanted her to shut up or found it cool that bryan told her to. I wouldnt hope it was the former and not the latter but either way it forms a picture of someone the crowd isn't really extremely invested in caring about.

[HR]

Mar 27, 2012 4:10:57 GMT -5 Tiger Maskooo said:

Mar 27, 2012 3:55:10 GMT -5 HR said:

You're going to tell me that he's doing a bad job as a heel because people have taken to the YES! YES! YES! thing? A reaction like "AJ, shut up" got doesn't mean she's not helping him get heat (ignoring the fact that it was more of a "did he really say that?" type reaction than a face pop) because she clearly is. Just look at what happened on tonight's Raw as an example.

AJ is a huge reason why Daniel's been able to move up to the main event so easily, because she helps add a whole dimension to his character. The "abusive" boyfriend character has been done plenty of times, but this is way better than most, because of the type of talent AJ is. They've got fantastic chemistry.

And your final comment just proves that you haven't watched very many of her matches, because it's happened on a number of occasions.

I'm not saying bryans doing a bad job as a heel. Quite to the contrary,I think bryan is great in the role of a jerk. I've known that since 2006.

I'm saying that I hardly think that AJ has really given him any of that heat. I think you could really replace her with anyone and it wouldn't hurt.

She doesnt seem to get much sympathy from the audience when she's on screen. Hell I remember when she came out with the neckbrace and the crowd didnt react to her.

I don't think that people were reacting positively to bryan telling her to shut up because they couldnt believe he said it either. I think they either wanted her to shut up or found it cool that bryan told her to. I wouldnt hope it was the former and not the latter but either way it forms a picture of someone the crowd isn't really extremely invested in caring about.

I was using that as an example to show that your claim that there was a reaction other than total boos when he told her to shut up, demonstrated that she wasn't helping him get heat, was incorrect. I think Daniel is great too, but downplaying her role is unfair.

I agree that AJ doesn't seem like a sympathetic character, but I don't think she's supposed to be. The storyline is that she's head over heels in love for a guy, and it doesn't matter what douchey things he does to her, she'll still do whatever it takes (whether that be putting herself in the line of fire, or revealing information that she is uncomfortable talking about, etc.) to please and show her love for him. Why would the audience necessarily be sympathetic towards her when they can clearly see how immature or misguided she is being?

But none of that means that she isn't contributing to the story, or Daniel's character. He wouldn't be in the position he is in right now if he was only diatribe about the virtues of Veganism. While that's funny, and/or infuriating, his relationship with AJ is another (very large) piece of the pie, and choosing to ignore that is silly.

[vanboxmeer]

AJ is becoming Harley Quinn-esque by her facial expressions. Last night she puts herself in danger voluntarily without Daniel Bryan telling/signalling her to, and after he wins the match she is overjoyed that he won and clapping it up. Very heel-ish, and her sympathy as a girl being in a bad relationship is turning to annoyance at her now own personal actions to help Daniel in anyway.

Danny = Puddin'

[Deleted]

Any woman wrestler who has not wrestled in SHIMMER is a terrible wrestler who cant run the ropes. [/stereotypicalsmark]

[gl83]

Mar 27, 2012 8:36:30 GMT -5 vanboxmeer said:

AJ is becoming Harley Quinn-esque by her facial expressions. Last night she puts herself in danger voluntarily without Daniel Bryan telling/signalling her to, and after he wins the match she is overjoyed that he won and clapping it up. Very heel-ish, and her sympathy as a girl being in a bad relationship is turning to annoyance at her now own personal actions to help Daniel in anyway.

Danny = Puddin'

Funny, you say that because many people are drawing the comparison between AJ's relationship with Daniel Bryan to Zack Ryder's relationship with Eve. Both her and Ryder are both clueless lovers who keep coming back to their "significant others" and doing what they want despite how poorly both of them are being treated by them.

[vanboxmeer]

Zack Ryder isn't helping Eve win matches and Eve isn't helping Zack Ryder win matches. They don't come down to the ring together, the announcers don't refer to them as boyfriend and girlfriend and have a routine of pre-match kissing, and their relationship isn't portrayed as love but lust on Zack Ryder's side, i.e. "Friends with benefits". Zack Ryder has shown signs of doubt of Eve's advances, while AJ has only shown signs of disappointment that she isn't completely making Daniel happy. Even Daniel Bryan has very slight moments where he shows that he cares for AJ, and can justify in his heel mind that he is helping her improve, while Eve is blatantly shown as not caring for Zack Ryder as anything more than a keychain. AJ also doesn't "come back" to Daniel Bryan because she never has left his side to begin with as she's always there, Zack Ryder has already been in scenes where he made fun of Eve and he actually did "go back to her". So the two relationships really are not the same at all, and it's just a lazy comparison done because they happen to be 2 romance-style angles.

[Perpetual Nirvana]

Mar 27, 2012 2:34:16 GMT -5 @tagteamspecialist said:

Mar 26, 2012 13:35:19 GMT -5 @chrisc said:

It's because I don't just watch the Divas matches. I watch the guys wrestle, too, and in general, their matches are constantly better than the best Divas matches, let alone the average Diva match.

OH. MY. GOD.

THIS! THIS! THIS!

Seriously I feel the exact same way but have never been able to find a way to put it into words without fear of coming off predjudiced.

It kinda still does. And don't don't really see the point here anyway. The guys are having better matches than the divas but of course when you get more time and have better depth in your talent that's bound to happen. But so what if they are? Unless you have some irrational hatred of people actually enjoying women's matches then what the hell do you care?

[SAJ Forth]

Mar 26, 2012 1:21:57 GMT -5 Snaptastic said:

Not sure what to make of that really. Ok she's not a ring general but to imply she can't at least "go" in the ring is somewhat short sighted.

I agree.

[Deleted]

Mar 27, 2012 11:44:51 GMT -5 Perpetual Nirvana said:

Mar 27, 2012 2:34:16 GMT -5 @tagteamspecialist said:

OH. MY. GOD.

THIS! THIS! THIS!

Seriously I feel the exact same way but have never been able to find a way to put it into words without fear of coming off predjudiced.

It kinda still does. And don't don't really see the point here anyway. The guys are having better matches than the divas but of course when you get more time and have better depth in your talent that's bound to happen. But so what if they are? Unless you have some irrational hatred of people actually enjoying women's matches then what the hell do you care?

It was merely an explanation of why I personally don't enjoy Diva matches. I can't find their matches good because I find even the best Diva matches to be completely outclassed by the guys on a regular basis. I'll take a 4-minute Tyson Kidd vs. Justin Gabriel match on Superstars or NXT over a 7-minute Beth Phoenix vs. Tamina match on PPV any day.

[Dave at the Movies]

She is easily one of the best top female wrestlers in the WWE.

Just go on youtube and look up some of her matches she had with Naomi in FCW.

[Perpetual Nirvana]

Mar 27, 2012 12:01:36 GMT -5 @chrisc said:

Mar 27, 2012 11:44:51 GMT -5 Perpetual Nirvana said:

It kinda still does. And don't don't really see the point here anyway. The guys are having better matches than the divas but of course when you get more time and have better depth in your talent that's bound to happen. But so what if they are? Unless you have some irrational hatred of people actually enjoying women's matches then what the hell do you care?

It was merely an explanation of why I personally don't enjoy Diva matches. I can't find their matches good because I find even the best Diva matches to be completely outclassed by the guys on a regular basis. I'll take a 4-minute Tyson Kidd vs. Justin Gabriel match on Superstars or NXT over a 7-minute Beth Phoenix vs. Tamina match on PPV any day.

Why do you have to make a choice? Isn't it possible to enjoy both? It seems awfully narrow thinking. It's like saying any match that isn't a five star classic isn't enjoyable. But if that's how you feel then fair enough.

[corndog]

Mar 27, 2012 4:40:57 GMT -5 HR said:

Mar 27, 2012 4:10:57 GMT -5 Tiger Maskooo said:

I'm not saying bryans doing a bad job as a heel. Quite to the contrary,I think bryan is great in the role of a jerk. I've known that since 2006.

I'm saying that I hardly think that AJ has really given him any of that heat. I think you could really replace her with anyone and it wouldn't hurt.

She doesnt seem to get much sympathy from the audience when she's on screen. Hell I remember when she came out with the neckbrace and the crowd didnt react to her.

I don't think that people were reacting positively to bryan telling her to shut up because they couldnt believe he said it either. I think they either wanted her to shut up or found it cool that bryan told her to. I wouldnt hope it was the former and not the latter but either way it forms a picture of someone the crowd isn't really extremely invested in caring about.

I was using that as an example to show that your claim that there was a reaction other than total boos when he told her to shut up, demonstrated that she wasn't helping him get heat, was incorrect. I think Daniel is great too, but downplaying her role is unfair.

I agree that AJ doesn't seem like a sympathetic character, but I don't think she's supposed to be. The storyline is that she's head over heels in love for a guy, and it doesn't matter what douchey things he does to her, she'll still do whatever it takes (whether that be putting herself in the line of fire, or revealing information that she is uncomfortable talking about, etc.) to please and show her love for him. Why would the audience necessarily be sympathetic towards her when they can clearly see how immature or misguided she is being?

But none of that means that she isn't contributing to the story, or Daniel's character. He wouldn't be in the position he is in right now if he was only diatribe about the virtues of Veganism. While that's funny, and/or infuriating, his relationship with AJ is another (very large) piece of the pie, and choosing to ignore that is silly.

I think originally they did want to book as her as a sympathetic character, although lately those plans have gone out the window. Tiger Maskeroo is completely on point that people think that face AJ was way more over than alot of people have said. While she did have decent crowd reactions during her matches, the crowd wasn't exactly going nuts as some have claimed.

I will give AJ's involvement some credit, the way they are starting to book her is right and she has given an extra dimension to Bryan's character. But if anything I have to give Smackdown's booking(is Micheal Hayes still running it?) for making the adjustment to her character that fit it better and building on it. She is great at playing someone that is obsessed and almost too good at it because the fans have turned on her. Originally I believe they were going for a Savage/Elizabeth style relationship. Where they are going now is something completely different and original. AJ being too much of the cutesy type is what made this change necessary. I also liked what they did last week on Smackdown, absolute gold. Now she is a complete heel, without doing the normal things to become a heel. The fans are completely disgusted with both people. While before they hated Bryan and felt like she was just a nusiance.

[CH Punk]

Mar 27, 2012 12:53:43 GMT -5 corndog said:

Mar 27, 2012 4:40:57 GMT -5 HR said:

I was using that as an example to show that your claim that there was a reaction other than total boos when he told her to shut up, demonstrated that she wasn't helping him get heat, was incorrect. I think Daniel is great too, but downplaying her role is unfair.

I agree that AJ doesn't seem like a sympathetic character, but I don't think she's supposed to be. The storyline is that she's head over heels in love for a guy, and it doesn't matter what douchey things he does to her, she'll still do whatever it takes (whether that be putting herself in the line of fire, or revealing information that she is uncomfortable talking about, etc.) to please and show her love for him. Why would the audience necessarily be sympathetic towards her when they can clearly see how immature or misguided she is being?

But none of that means that she isn't contributing to the story, or Daniel's character. He wouldn't be in the position he is in right now if he was only diatribe about the virtues of Veganism. While that's funny, and/or infuriating, his relationship with AJ is another (very large) piece of the pie, and choosing to ignore that is silly.

I think originally they did want to book as her as a sympathetic character, although lately those plans have gone out the window. Tiger Maskeroo is completely on point that people think that face AJ was way more over than alot of people have said. While she did have decent crowd reactions during her matches, the crowd wasn't exactly going nuts as some have claimed.

I will give AJ's involvement some credit, the way they are starting to book her is right and she has given an extra dimension to Bryan's character. But if anything I have to give Smackdown's booking(is Micheal Hayes still running it?) for making the adjustment to her character that fit it better and building on it. She is great at playing someone that is obsessed and almost too good at it because the fans have turned on her. Originally I believe they were going for a Savage/Elizabeth style relationship. Where they are going now is something completely different and original. AJ being too much of the cutesy type is what made this change necessary. I also liked what they did last week on Smackdown, absolute gold. Now she is a complete heel, without doing the normal things to become a heel. The fans are completely disgusted with both people. While before they hated Bryan and felt like she was just a nusiance.

It seemed that they originally wanted to keep AJ a face and have her turn on Bryan at Mania, but someone in creative decided that turning her heel (or at least in more of a grey zone) was the thing to do and it will be interesting to see if she turns into a full fledged heel at Mania or if she will continue to be in the grey zone where it not sure if she's being forced by Bryan to act in a heel manner (brainwashed) and could snap out of it later or if she's playing the crowd and she's consciously joined up with Bryan.

As for the crowd, based on tweets during AJ segments and Facebook comments, most people were buying into AJ being abused/needing to be saved until her interference on Raw where most people turned on her and only a minority continued the original opinion.

And the current head writer for Smackdown is Ed Koskey (Hayes is now the head of agents/producers).

[Deleted]

Mar 27, 2012 12:21:42 GMT -5 Perpetual Nirvana said:

Mar 27, 2012 12:01:36 GMT -5 @chrisc said:

It was merely an explanation of why I personally don't enjoy Diva matches. I can't find their matches good because I find even the best Diva matches to be completely outclassed by the guys on a regular basis. I'll take a 4-minute Tyson Kidd vs. Justin Gabriel match on Superstars or NXT over a 7-minute Beth Phoenix vs. Tamina match on PPV any day.

Why do you have to make a choice? Isn't it possible to enjoy both? It seems awfully narrow thinking. It's like saying any match that isn't a five star classic isn't enjoyable. But if that's how you feel then fair enough.

It's not saying that at all. If I see a match and think it was 4-stars, then another match comes along and just blows it out of the water but is still not a 5-star match, my opinion of the first match is going to lower at least a little bit.