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Post by mysterydriver on Jul 24, 2012 20:29:59 GMT -5
This Triple H stuff should be a stepping point to a real, solid, drawing feud.
Signing Brock Lesnar to the contract they've signed him to should literally be to bump 'B' level PPVs slightly (extra 30,000 for the Cena match) have a marquee appearance at 'A' PPVs (Triple H) with the sole intent being to remind people he's a unstoppable, unlikable war machine that spreads destruction, win, lose, or draw wherever he goes until he's stopped at the omega of PPVs, Wrestlemania.
Honestly, the Cena feud was okay-at best with the ending they chose (I'd enjoy seeing Cena eating and F-5 and Brock laughing evilly just the same) because at the end of the day, you point at how it was a complete fluke that Cena won.
Now, he's having a "legitimate" feud with a man who doesn't deserve a legitimate feud with him. Triple H should not be the Knight in Shining Armor. He should be that brave guy that all the commoners know who the freaking dragon melts with a shot of fire. He's that MOMENT that you go "Oh crap, we need a hero beyond the normal means!" (You don't have that Knight poke the dragon in the eye and shout "A-ha!" while the dragon whimpers away to battle him the next freaking day!)
Cena was that brave knight who stopped the beast by a complete luck. Managed to trick him into a cave and lodge it shut with a boulder. We need a hero to SLAY this sucker. Whether it be The Undertaker for a worrisome streak match, the original "knight" gulping down fear and "rising above" like we all know they can, or perhaps someone never expected who stands up when others are hunkering down...but you save it for the gigantic "Dragonmania" bout, darn it.
So...yeah....why pay someone so much money to be 'another guy' in 'another feud' and expecting it to sell better than most?
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Jul 24, 2012 20:37:21 GMT -5
I'm alright with HHH getting a smidgen of comeuppance against Brock ONLY if this isn't leading to a HHH win.
That'd just be insanity.
The sad thing is, it's looking more and more like that'll happen.
I hated the Cena loss, but that at least was defensible. HHH winning...
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kidglov3s
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Wants her Shot
Who is Tiger Maskooo?
Posts: 15,870
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Post by kidglov3s on Jul 24, 2012 20:38:55 GMT -5
But Brock has no respect for THISBUSINESS!
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Jul 24, 2012 20:41:48 GMT -5
It's also strange, not in just the HHH feud, but the post Cena win that Brock went from this outside FORCE to being eh, another dude on the roster, only he doesn't show up that much.
In the build-up to Brock/Cena, a couple of guys I work with who were lapsed fans that haven't watched since about '03 were excited, and really amped to see what happened with Brock.
Don't think they've watched since Extreme Rules.
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Post by Miss_Carol on Jul 24, 2012 21:36:19 GMT -5
You say THIS segment ruined it for you? HE ALREADY LOST A f***ING MATCH. You mean to tell me that losing to Cena didn't kill his mystique to you, but being on equal footing with Triple H, who is probably a bigger star than just about everyone in the WWE right now does? Come on now He lost a match because Cena wrapped a friggin chain around his fist and whacked him in the face with it, stunning him enough to deliver an AA on the steel steppes. Cena was getting brutally murdered throughout the entire match, and Cena won because he resorted to means he normally wouldn’t resort to, but was forced to because Lesnar was absolutely dominating him in every single way. It was an ending that made Lesnar look strong despite losing.
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Post by Miss_Carol on Jul 24, 2012 23:18:09 GMT -5
Now, he's having a "legitimate" feud with a man who doesn't deserve a legitimate feud with him. Triple H should not be the Knight in Shining Armor. He should be that brave guy that all the commoners know who the freaking dragon melts with a shot of fire. He's that MOMENT that you go "Oh crap, we need a hero beyond the normal means!" (You don't have that Knight poke the dragon in the eye and shout "A-ha!" while the dragon whimpers away to battle him the next freaking day!) Cena was that brave knight who stopped the beast by a complete luck. Managed to trick him into a cave and lodge it shut with a boulder. We need a hero to SLAY this sucker. Whether it be The Undertaker for a worrisome streak match, the original "knight" gulping down fear and "rising above" like we all know they can, or perhaps someone never expected who stands up when others are hunkering down...but you save it for the gigantic "Dragonmania" bout, darn it. So...yeah....why pay someone so much money to be 'another guy' in 'another feud' and expecting it to sell better than most? Haha, I love your dragon references! <3
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Post by HMARK Center on Jul 24, 2012 23:39:23 GMT -5
It's also strange, not in just the HHH feud, but the post Cena win that Brock went from this outside FORCE to being eh, another dude on the roster, only he doesn't show up that much. In the build-up to Brock/Cena, a couple of guys I work with who were lapsed fans that haven't watched since about '03 were excited, and really amped to see what happened with Brock. Don't think they've watched since Extreme Rules. I remember after WM this year somebody sent me a link to the video of Brock returning, and the sheer force that seemed to be at his back (granted, the hot crowd had a lot to do with it) did make it seem like a living tornado had just walked down and slammed Cena. Even with his poor exit in 2004, Brock still came in with a pretty big time aura about him, certainly not hurt by the fact that he had in the meantime become a MMA World Champion. They said it best in the popular "Best and Worst of Raw" column: if you have a guy like Brock for 20 dates in a given year, why wouldn't you spend the first 19 dates making him look like the most unstoppable force on Earth, before having him slain on the 20th one?
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Post by joebob27 on Jul 24, 2012 23:54:23 GMT -5
You say THIS segment ruined it for you? HE ALREADY LOST A f***ING MATCH. You mean to tell me that losing to Cena didn't kill his mystique to you, but being on equal footing with Triple H, who is probably a bigger star than just about everyone in the WWE right now does? Come on now He lost a match because Cena wrapped a friggin chain around his fist and whacked him in the face with it, stunning him enough to deliver an AA on the steel steppes. Cena was getting brutally murdered throughout the entire match, and Cena won because he resorted to means he normally wouldn’t resort to, but was forced to because Lesnar was absolutely dominating him in every single way. It was an ending that made Lesnar look strong despite losing. It doesn't matter, he shouldn't have lost. And in this case, it is imperative he doesn't lose. His final match is already diminished. Now it's a matter if they make it utterly worthless.
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Post by xCompackx on Jul 25, 2012 1:19:21 GMT -5
He lost a match because Cena wrapped a friggin chain around his fist and whacked him in the face with it, stunning him enough to deliver an AA on the steel steppes. Cena was getting brutally murdered throughout the entire match, and Cena won because he resorted to means he normally wouldn’t resort to, but was forced to because Lesnar was absolutely dominating him in every single way. It was an ending that made Lesnar look strong despite losing. It doesn't matter, he shouldn't have lost. And in this case, it is imperative he doesn't lose. His final match is already diminished. Now it's a matter if they make it utterly worthless. You can't always just look at the win/loss record though. Brock dominating Cena throughout the entire match built him up far more than Cena sneaking out a win. Am I saying that Brock could've won? Maybe, but sometimes a strong loss means more than a fluke win.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2012 1:36:14 GMT -5
I just didn't get why the two Triple H segments weren't combined into one somehow. Have the DX reunion, then have DX beat down Lesnar as a group instead of Sandow so Lesnar wouldn't have looked weak.
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Post by celticjobber on Jul 25, 2012 2:03:17 GMT -5
I just didn't get why the two Triple H segments weren't combined into one somehow. Have the DX reunion, then have DX beat down Lesnar as a group instead of Sandow so Lesnar wouldn't have looked weak. Lesnar getting beaten up by a whole group of ridiculously dressed, broken-down old guys, somehow seems even worse than what actually happened. And it wouldn't work well for the heel/babyface dynamic for the faces to gang up on one guy. Atleast, IMO.
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Dang!
Dennis Stamp
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Post by Dang! on Jul 25, 2012 4:33:07 GMT -5
Nooooooooooo, gotta protect Levesque! Don't make him look weak! He might have Warrior flashbacks and start to weep!
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Post by CATCH_US IS the Conversation on Jul 25, 2012 4:36:07 GMT -5
I just didn't get why the two Triple H segments weren't combined into one somehow. Have the DX reunion, then have DX beat down Lesnar as a group instead of Sandow so Lesnar wouldn't have looked weak. Agreed. But instead of a beat down, it should've been Lesnar making a beeline for HHH, the other members of DX trying to separate them, and Lesnar fighting off all five men to a stalemate before bailing the ring.
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Post by thelonewolf527 on Jul 25, 2012 5:05:18 GMT -5
It's also strange, not in just the HHH feud, but the post Cena win that Brock went from this outside FORCE to being eh, another dude on the roster, only he doesn't show up that much. In the build-up to Brock/Cena, a couple of guys I work with who were lapsed fans that haven't watched since about '03 were excited, and really amped to see what happened with Brock. Don't think they've watched since Extreme Rules. I remember after WM this year somebody sent me a link to the video of Brock returning, and the sheer force that seemed to be at his back (granted, the hot crowd had a lot to do with it) did make it seem like a living tornado had just walked down and slammed Cena. Even with his poor exit in 2004, Brock still came in with a pretty big time aura about him, certainly not hurt by the fact that he had in the meantime become a MMA World Champion. They said it best in the popular "Best and Worst of Raw" column: if you have a guy like Brock for 20 dates in a given year, why wouldn't you spend the first 19 dates making him look like the most unstoppable force on Earth, before having him slain on the 20th one? Logically speaking, guys like Cena and Triple H would not back down after one loss and if Lesnar isn't going to be around, it's hard to take these guys off the show until he comes back to reignite the feuds. Cena HAD to beat Lesnar at some point, it was just a matter of now or later and they went with now. The problem is that Lesnar doesn't have enough dates to justify rematches and if he beats Cena and Lesnar, now we have a 6 month period with no Lesnar and two guys who SHOULD want revenge on the guy themselves. It's also hard business wise to justify having a guy you know is going to leave after 1 year and could just take his ball and go home destroying all of your top guys. If Lesnar had more wrestling dates, he could at least go through someone like Orton or Kane to get that bigger win. Do I think Lesnar should win at SummerSlam? Yes, if they can find a way to get both him and Triple H off of tv. Do I think that Lesnar should look better than Triple H throughout the feud AND win? No because that's absolutely ridiculous. Let them each get a couple of good shots in so it doesn't look like Triple H has no chance in hell of winning, that way the match has some intrigue to it on a storyline level and not "Let's watch Lesnar kill someone for 10 minutes."
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2012 5:28:48 GMT -5
Come on man, this ain't the first time Triple H has done this. Remember Umaga? Cena had to choke him with a ring rope to win, and a ways down the road, Triple H was beating him cleanly.
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Post by HMARK Center on Jul 25, 2012 9:36:31 GMT -5
I remember after WM this year somebody sent me a link to the video of Brock returning, and the sheer force that seemed to be at his back (granted, the hot crowd had a lot to do with it) did make it seem like a living tornado had just walked down and slammed Cena. Even with his poor exit in 2004, Brock still came in with a pretty big time aura about him, certainly not hurt by the fact that he had in the meantime become a MMA World Champion. They said it best in the popular "Best and Worst of Raw" column: if you have a guy like Brock for 20 dates in a given year, why wouldn't you spend the first 19 dates making him look like the most unstoppable force on Earth, before having him slain on the 20th one? Logically speaking, guys like Cena and Triple H would not back down after one loss and if Lesnar isn't going to be around, it's hard to take these guys off the show until he comes back to reignite the feuds. Cena HAD to beat Lesnar at some point, it was just a matter of now or later and they went with now. The problem is that Lesnar doesn't have enough dates to justify rematches and if he beats Cena and Lesnar, now we have a 6 month period with no Lesnar and two guys who SHOULD want revenge on the guy themselves. It's also hard business wise to justify having a guy you know is going to leave after 1 year and could just take his ball and go home destroying all of your top guys. If Lesnar had more wrestling dates, he could at least go through someone like Orton or Kane to get that bigger win. Do I think Lesnar should win at SummerSlam? Yes, if they can find a way to get both him and Triple H off of tv. Do I think that Lesnar should look better than Triple H throughout the feud AND win? No because that's absolutely ridiculous. Let them each get a couple of good shots in so it doesn't look like Triple H has no chance in hell of winning, that way the match has some intrigue to it on a storyline level and not "Let's watch Lesnar kill someone for 10 minutes." Again though, I'm not getting where this extreme depiction is coming from. Yes, Brock should look unstoppable, but that doesn't mean he has to break another of Triple H's limbs every week, nor does it mean he has to squash him at SummerSlam...but it DOES mean that he should look legitimate and show dominant ability. When he first debuted, WCW basically let Vader dominate, and it worked. He didn't make Sting look like a loser, but he certainly looked like the scariest, baddest man in the company. You can't go THAT far with Brock since he's on a limited appearance rate, but you certainly can keep that aura around him until its time for him to be beaten by the "white knight" at Wrestlemania.
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Post by thelonewolf527 on Jul 25, 2012 12:05:50 GMT -5
Logically speaking, guys like Cena and Triple H would not back down after one loss and if Lesnar isn't going to be around, it's hard to take these guys off the show until he comes back to reignite the feuds. Cena HAD to beat Lesnar at some point, it was just a matter of now or later and they went with now. The problem is that Lesnar doesn't have enough dates to justify rematches and if he beats Cena and Lesnar, now we have a 6 month period with no Lesnar and two guys who SHOULD want revenge on the guy themselves. It's also hard business wise to justify having a guy you know is going to leave after 1 year and could just take his ball and go home destroying all of your top guys. If Lesnar had more wrestling dates, he could at least go through someone like Orton or Kane to get that bigger win. Do I think Lesnar should win at SummerSlam? Yes, if they can find a way to get both him and Triple H off of tv. Do I think that Lesnar should look better than Triple H throughout the feud AND win? No because that's absolutely ridiculous. Let them each get a couple of good shots in so it doesn't look like Triple H has no chance in hell of winning, that way the match has some intrigue to it on a storyline level and not "Let's watch Lesnar kill someone for 10 minutes." Again though, I'm not getting where this extreme depiction is coming from. Yes, Brock should look unstoppable, but that doesn't mean he has to break another of Triple H's limbs every week, nor does it mean he has to squash him at SummerSlam...but it DOES mean that he should look legitimate and show dominant ability. When he first debuted, WCW basically let Vader dominate, and it worked. He didn't make Sting look like a loser, but he certainly looked like the scariest, baddest man in the company. You can't go THAT far with Brock since he's on a limited appearance rate, but you certainly can keep that aura around him until its time for him to be beaten by the "white knight" at Wrestlemania. Yeah and he's got 4 weeks to look more dominant still. I'm sure he won't be on all of them, but at least once more he's going to look like a monster and as long as they do it on the go home show (depending on who's winning the match) then that's all they need to do in my book.
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Post by Savage Gambino on Jul 25, 2012 12:27:46 GMT -5
Come on man, this ain't the first time Triple H has done this. Remember Umaga? Cena had to choke him with a ring rope to win, and a ways down the road, Triple H was beating him cleanly. Yeah, I remember. I also remember how Kane used to no-sell chair shots, and then "a ways down the road" he just didn't. Welcome to almost every monster heel in the history of professional wrestling.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2012 12:31:16 GMT -5
I just didn't get why the two Triple H segments weren't combined into one somehow. Have the DX reunion, then have DX beat down Lesnar as a group instead of Sandow so Lesnar wouldn't have looked weak. Lesnar getting beaten up by a whole group of ridiculously dressed, broken-down old guys, somehow seems even worse than what actually happened. And it wouldn't work well for the heel/babyface dynamic for the faces to gang up on one guy. Atleast, IMO. So getting beat down by one ridiculously dressed, broken down old man is better than getting beaten down by five? Also, your heel/face argument doesn't work because they ganged up to beat down Sandow. DX can do heelish things and still be faces.
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Post by king031 on Jul 25, 2012 14:13:11 GMT -5
How is it a good idea for a guy who only shows up every 3-4 months and is leaving after a year to come in and straight decimate the WWE's top stars and then leave?Its not .
The IWC wants Lesnar to come in and straight squash the WWE's top stars.They want Lesnar to always have the upper hand,always be dominant,and then win the match while squashing the other guy.
How in the world does that make any sense much less any business sense considering also the guys he beats are still going to be there while he leaves a and was only there for two years in the first place.
Brock Lesnar should LOSE because he won't be there anymore and the way he's being booked he still looks dominant and like a legit threat no matter what win or lose while it helps give the people he's feuding with a boost and brings the most important thing in signing Lesnar more ppv buys.
If triple h,Cena,Orton or anybody that's a wwe star or hated by the IWC came and straight decimated all the top stars and was always dominant there would be massive hate and things spewed upon it but bc it's somebody who quit and left the wwe and hates it and bc he's going against people the IWC despises Cena,triple h, it's awesome and he should.
Really?Really?Really?
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