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Post by thelonewolf527 on Feb 1, 2013 19:18:56 GMT -5
This thread only boosts my opinion that Triple H may be the most underrated wrestler of all time
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Post by HMARK Center on Feb 1, 2013 20:30:08 GMT -5
Are you arguing that Trips has had nearly the impact on a generation of young wrestlers that Bret has had? Because that'd be blatantly false. Hmmmmmm..... put over the two next big WWE stars at WrestleMania in back to back years. Yeah, no impact at all You realize that's completely unrelated to the point I was making, right?
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Post by machomuta on Feb 1, 2013 20:42:00 GMT -5
Not really. The "match" felt more like a segment then a match. It was too overbooked. The match they had at WM 17 was way better. I remember a year ago everyone loved it, Dont you mean most instead of everyone?. I never liked it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2013 22:10:11 GMT -5
Not a parody, it is reality. He is decent at everything, but not great at anything. Always has been, and his career reflects that. If anyone wants to name all the great matches, promos, segments, etc he has had, then feel free to list them. It will hard to list things that don't exist, but have at it. . Great matches off the top of my head: vs. Cactus Jack (1997 Raw and RR 2000) vs. HBK (SS 2002, Armageddon 2002) vs. HBK vs. Benoit (WM XX and Backlash) vs. Cena (WM 22) vs. Undertaker (WM 17, WM 27, WM 28) And he has a great way of selling a match's importance with his promos. I will put it another way: how many of those matches will be remembered 20 years from now? Hogan, Rock, Austin, Savage, Flair, Bret, Shawn, Warrior, Andre, etc, have matches from the 80's and 90's that people can instantly recall. Is HHH going to have that with any of the matches you just mentioned?
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Post by MichaelMartini on Feb 1, 2013 22:15:49 GMT -5
Great matches off the top of my head: vs. Cactus Jack (1997 Raw and RR 2000) vs. HBK (SS 2002, Armageddon 2002) vs. HBK vs. Benoit (WM XX and Backlash) vs. Cena (WM 22) vs. Undertaker (WM 17, WM 27, WM 28) And he has a great way of selling a match's importance with his promos. I will put it another way: how many of those matches will be remembered 20 years from now? Hogan, Rock, Austin, Savage, Flair, Bret, Shawn, Warrior, Andre, etc, have matches from the 80's and 90's that people can instantly recall. Is HHH going to have that with any of the matches you just mentioned? I'm on your side of the argument, but I've got to point out that the Cactus Jack and Rock Ladder match are already 15-16 years old.
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Post by KofiMania on Feb 1, 2013 22:15:57 GMT -5
Great matches off the top of my head: vs. Cactus Jack (1997 Raw and RR 2000) vs. HBK (SS 2002, Armageddon 2002) vs. HBK vs. Benoit (WM XX and Backlash) vs. Cena (WM 22) vs. Undertaker (WM 17, WM 27, WM 28) And he has a great way of selling a match's importance with his promos. I will put it another way: how many of those matches will be remembered 20 years from now? Hogan, Rock, Austin, Savage, Flair, Bret, Shawn, Warrior, Andre, etc, have matches from the 80's and 90's that people can instantly recall. Is HHH going to have that with any of the matches you just mentioned? That's an odd argument to make. Why wouldn't people be able to remember these matches?
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Post by KofiMania on Feb 1, 2013 22:17:46 GMT -5
Hmmmmmm..... put over the two next big WWE stars at WrestleMania in back to back years. Yeah, no impact at all I hate how everyone thinks HHH "put over" John Cena. Batista, sure. Without a doubt. Made his career. But Cena? The whole feud was predicated on HHH saying Cena was a terrible wrestler, (which crowds started to harp on from there with the 'you can't wrestle' chant), and in the end, the entire crowd turned on John in favor of Trips, and forced a HHH babyface turn soon after. No one had any more positive a feelings for Cena after that match. He wasn't better off. And he was more hated than he was before. HHH did a job. There's a difference. I think Cena was much better off after that feud. It made Cena look more like an elite star who had taken the jump to that next level. It also helped create the mixed reaction from the crowd that Cena is famous for now. Not saying that it was HHH's intention or not, but I think Cena came out of that better than before.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2013 22:25:38 GMT -5
I will put it another way: how many of those matches will be remembered 20 years from now? Hogan, Rock, Austin, Savage, Flair, Bret, Shawn, Warrior, Andre, etc, have matches from the 80's and 90's that people can instantly recall. Is HHH going to have that with any of the matches you just mentioned? That's an odd argument to make. Why wouldn't people be able to remember these matches? The Ultimate Warrior was featured on a Canadian talk show recently (probably 2-3 years ago). He was introduced as "the man who beat Hulk Hogan in Toronto". So you can say whatever you want about Warrior's skills or talent, but he had a match that was so good that 20+ years later people still fondly remember it. Even casual wrestling fans will know about that match. It is part of wrestling history. I guess my point is, I don't think HHH has had that one match or one promo or one segment that people will instantly connect him with years from now. Maybe his body of work will compensate for that, but I personally don't see it. Hardcore fans may remember him, but he wasn't/isn't a guy that left a big mark on the business in one way or another. He existed. He was there.
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Post by thelonewolf527 on Feb 1, 2013 22:31:47 GMT -5
That's an odd argument to make. Why wouldn't people be able to remember these matches? The Ultimate Warrior was featured on a Canadian talk show recently (probably 2-3 years ago). He was introduced as "the man who beat Hulk Hogan in Toronto". So you can say whatever you want about Warrior's skills or talent, but he had a match that was so good that 20+ years later people still fondly remember it. Even casual wrestling fans will know about that match. It is part of wrestling history. I guess my point is, I don't think HHH has had that one match or one promo or one segment that people will instantly connect him with years from now. Maybe his body of work will compensate for that, but I personally don't see it. Hardcore fans may remember him, but he wasn't/isn't a guy that left a big mark on the business in one way or another. He existed. He was there. Yeah but Triple H has had plenty of good matches though so maybe that's better. People remember Warrior's two biggest matches because that's all he had, two big matches. Look at Ric Flair. How many SPECIFIC matches can people name nowadays? They just say "All of him vs Steamboat" but that's not specific at all.
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Post by KofiMania on Feb 1, 2013 22:36:15 GMT -5
That's an odd argument to make. Why wouldn't people be able to remember these matches? The Ultimate Warrior was featured on a Canadian talk show recently (probably 2-3 years ago). He was introduced as "the man who beat Hulk Hogan in Toronto". So you can say whatever you want about Warrior's skills or talent, but he had a match that was so good that 20+ years later people still fondly remember it. Even casual wrestling fans will know about that match. It is part of wrestling history. I guess my point is, I don't think HHH has had that one match or one promo or one segment that people will instantly connect him with years from now. Maybe his body of work will compensate for that, but I personally don't see it. Hardcore fans may remember him, but he wasn't/isn't a guy that left a big mark on the business in one way or another. He existed. He was there. Triple H vs. Cactus at the Rumble. The last two Taker matches. I think those will be fondly remembered years from now. The Cactus match is already 13 years ago. And he left a pretty big mark on the business by being one of the biggest stars of one of the biggest eras. He wasn't "the man" like Rock or Austin but he was up there with Taker, HBK, etc. He was also part of a group that will be remembered forever in DX. Not to mention he'll likely become the next "Mr. McMahon" both on the air and backstage for the next 20 years. I don't think anyone would argue he's on the level of Hogan, Flair, Rock, Austin but he's on the level right below with guys like HBK, Taker, Hart, Cena.
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mrjl
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,319
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Post by mrjl on Feb 1, 2013 22:42:39 GMT -5
Here's an odd thought, let's see if anyone agrees: Triple H is the Mr. Wonderful of the Attitude Era.
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Post by mjolnir on Feb 1, 2013 22:52:04 GMT -5
Here's an odd thought, let's see if anyone agrees: Triple H is the Mr. Wonderful of the Attitude Era. Yeah, pretty much. Only difference is that unlike Wonderful, HHH had a way of keeping himself on top even when his body started to go out on him.
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tms
Don Corleone
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Post by tms on Feb 2, 2013 0:25:33 GMT -5
Here's an odd thought, let's see if anyone agrees: Triple H is the Mr. Wonderful of the Attitude Era. I'd say Orndorff was more talented than most of the roster of the time, or a midcarder with main-event level talent. Triple H always seemed like the opposite. As has been mentioned; average at just about everything. Built like a power wrestler, but no feats of strength. Decent mat wrestler but nowhere even close to Guerrero/Benoit/Angle/Lesnar. To this day the fact that we were supposed to believe he could somehow get the best of a kayfabe monster in Lesnar is so out of left field it makes me laugh.
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saintpat
El Dandy
Release the hounds!!!
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Post by saintpat on Feb 2, 2013 0:36:09 GMT -5
What is this 'major impact/impression' Hart made on an entire generation of wrestlers? Did they refuse to put people over? Start using the same series of moves in the same exact order in every match? (Well, I'll give him that one.) Hand out sunglasses on their way to the ring? Seriously, what?
HHH, like it or not, had a major effect on numerous careers. Ask Londrick, for two.
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Post by HMARK Center on Feb 2, 2013 10:23:40 GMT -5
What is this 'major impact/impression' Hart made on an entire generation of wrestlers? Did they refuse to put people over? Start using the same series of moves in the same exact order in every match? (Well, I'll give him that one.) Hand out sunglasses on their way to the ring? Seriously, what? HHH, like it or not, had a major effect on numerous careers. Ask Londrick, for two. Way to not even have a discussion. This thread is done.
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