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Post by Orange on Mar 25, 2013 22:57:38 GMT -5
And to think, I was fully ready to cast a vote for Yami, but I wanted to hear him out. Guess that's what I get for being a nice guy! But that's something that could also win the game for Town. If the roles were reversed, and Produce was the Godfather and I was the Townie, wanting to hear me out first would have been beneficial. It's good to hear both sides first. I gave the people I ended up voting for a chance to speak and defend themselves before I voted. I mean, I'm sure you were saying that tongue-in-cheek, but it's still some good advice nonetheless, even if it is pretty obvious. You made the right move, but the wrong choice (well, wrong for Town). I guess this has somewhat screwed me in any future mafia games I participate in where I am in fact Town. lol Oh, yeah, I was just messin' around. I felt that, given your circumstances as I had said before, I just didn't think it was fair to vote without hearing your side first. I mean, if it was a situation that you had warned about or saw coming, that might be one thing, but something like that? I just thought it was fair to give you a chance to speak your mind. Unfortunately, you did so a little too well.
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RKTaker
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 16,311
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Post by RKTaker on Mar 26, 2013 8:00:48 GMT -5
i already said this in the star wars aftermath thread but in case you guys didn't see it i'm done with mafia games they're just not for me.
also SNS before i got lynched i said don't blame jazzman you asked why and i never answered you so here's my answer
i didn't want you you guys to blame jazzman because it was my decision to leave and i didn't think jazzman should of been blamed for something i decided to do yeah jazzman made that comment i could of stayed regardless and tried to fix up my game but obviously that never happened so that's my explanation
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Post by Triple H buried SnS on Mar 26, 2013 8:12:30 GMT -5
i already said this in the star wars aftermath thread but in case you guys didn't see it i'm done with mafia games they're just not for me. also SNS before i got lynched i said don't blame jazzman you asked why and i never answered you so here's my answer i didn't want you you guys to blame jazzman because it was my decision to leave and i didn't think jazzman should of been blamed for something i decided to do yeah jazzman made that comment i could of stayed regardless and tried to fix up my game but obviously that never happened so that's my explanation That was layering, no way did I ever believe jazzman would come out day 1 and point a finger so vehemently at you as scum if you were indeed town. The only way that he was scum was if you were also scum(mentioned this in the thread). It layed the groundwork for me to convert him right after your death.
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pegasuswarrior
El Dandy
Three Time FAN Idol Champion
@PulpPictionary
Posts: 8,748
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Post by pegasuswarrior on Mar 26, 2013 21:29:53 GMT -5
Game Timeline: =================================================
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Day Phase 1:
Playing the game as always. Nothing new. ----------Clarifications with Mason (game mod)----------- Focus on the last paragraph of my flavor text character write-up: Arkham Asylum in a prison break? You don’t want to go in there as experts are calling it the most bloody and dangerous situation ever. But why do you go in? Because James Gordon hand picks you out of the rest of the police force. Your character and reputation will always be in question because of your past. Prove to him that have changed and solve whoever is keeping the inmates of Arkham trapped while letting them kill each other.
“Harvey Bullock is a Detective in the Gotham City Police Department working underneath James Gordon. His rough slovenly demeanor and willingness to do what it takes have given him a mean reputation, although he's one of the few honest cops on the force. Because of his position he often works alongside Batman, although their relationship began as adversarial.”
Notes to self: Keep this in mind as my role in the game grows and grows. Still willing to be a fall guy if necessary as in most games where information uncovering is more important than living.
Also, clarification on what the role actually does. Thought I might have to take a bullet to preserve a role at first. Was clarified that I basically steal any one role in the game that I choose once the TOWN member has died.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Night Phase 1: Dead doctor. ENTICING! Would I play my go-to card immediately? Having a better feel for definite Town members who are going to contribute would be a plus in this situation. BIG gamble and I expressed this to Mason, but I was going to wait and see what happened if another power role was outed. Tracker, Cop, Jack-of-All-Trades, Roleblocker were all primary targets that I could be even more beneficial with. Plus, people in these games can’t keep their secrets to themselves so no doubt another power role will be outed and killed sooner than later.
---“In what has got to be the dumbest move in the history of Mafia, I'm going to pass on Heroic Doctor. Not sure what it does exactly. (I know what a doctor does, but thinking this might be a variation.) I suspect death tonight for me anyway since I didn't mask in the crowd of Batman lynchers. One of the non-RK voters should be the one to get night killed if they're strategizing.
I might try to steal Serial Killer (if there is one) for the challenge later. Haha. Stupid move and I probably won't do it, but I think the challenge would be right up my alley--haha.
No reply necessary. I'm just babbling and giving the omniscient narrator something to laugh at. ”---
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Day Phase 2: I still got it? LodiRulz being roleblocked confirms my intuition about how posts come across. Keeping this same approach to reading posts as people play through the day phase. Yami Redgrave standing out in his “chummy” vibe. Night Phase 2: Nothing. Success all the way around. Except Cageking doesn’t die, so I can’t take his role. Delayed a day in getting the most powerful role I’ve ever had in one of these games. I’m drooling. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Day Phase 3: SnS or Yami Redgrave is a MUST lynch. SnS OR Asher suspicions—one or the other; therefore, information to be gained. I preach “lynch for the most information possible” in every game. The distraction of Moonie is frustrating. I kinda just want to say “Just play the game.” No information to be gained from Moonie. People trying to win the game on Day Three. Just not going to happen. Not enough detractors to make me think this lynch is anywhere close to a good idea. I vote and avoid a no lynch and go ahead and get this distraction out of the way. Most reluctant lynch of the game.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Night Phase 3: No surprise. Cageking’s gone. Now I have to wait until the next night phase to become roleblocker. At first, misread and thought Mason offered me Roleblocker (I was already assuming Cageking was going to be dead; I could only become bodyguard that night phase though.) No way I’m taking bodyguard. The plan: push hard for the common sense lynch of Yami or SnS; if one is Town, I roleblock the other ASAP, I’m thinking at this stage.
---“If I take roleblocker, do I get to enact it tonight?
If I roleblock ANY mafia, does it (in theory) negate the night kill. Or does it have to be the goon doing the actual killing? I guess what I'm asking without wanting to cheat is that Mafia members all probably have "abilities." So I would block an actual specified ability? Or would it be a killing negate IF there is a Mafia member I target who is "vanilla mafia?" “---
The answer: No, I would have to wait until the next night to become it/use it. I get confirmation that blocking Godfather OR Mafia member sent for the kill negates the night kill.
---“I guess I'll accept roleblocker. I can't wait around for townies to get picked off. Time to see how good at this game I am. (Not very?)”---
(I would have to wait until Night Phase 4 to do this, however.) ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Day Phase 4: Unbelievable. Absolutely unbelievable. How do we not lynch SnS? How is this possible? A new game approach must be made. I’ve never tried to make it a point to stay alive in these games. I try to break a piece of the game open by Day 4 and give my teammates some shots at scum. But now, I’m committed to taking this Town by the reins. Two days without a lynch of the two most suspicious people in – the – game. Had asked Mason about the role flavor text earlier. I always jazz up each game with something new. Sooooo . . . 2 + 2 = a heel is born. Commence infancy of the character I was going to become.
Produceman, Wolf Hurricane, and ritt are unclaimed characters who I feel 100 percent about being Town. (I would go back and forth on ritt during Days 5 and 6, it should be noted.)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Night Phase 4: No brainer. Give. Me. Roleblocker. (More on this below.)
3 deaths? 3 deaths? No way we have a Vigilante. Or do we? Jazzman perhaps? He takes things to heart and did us a favor by eliminating Brad, who was being a little fickle about continuing the game. Showed some malice toward his gameplay earlier. I could see that as a possibility (meta-gaming a bit there). So Vigilante perhaps? A poisoner also maybe? But why would they wait until Night 2 to poison knowing it’ll take a full day for it to kick in. And why target Double H? Also, poisoner can’t be Cult. Confused there. Really didn’t consider Serial Killer because why had there been no kill during Night 1 and 2. And Mafia kills Cageking obviously.
And, yeah, Cult? We have a Cult? I hate Cult if it’s not done right. I hate Cult, period. I hate this game. (Last sentence said with a bit of sarcasm at the time, but you get the point. Hating Cult is legit though.)
So yeah, before all that was revealed …
---“ If I'm allowed, I would like to assume the roleblocker Mr Freeze role during night phase (via Cageking's death last night phase) and my target would be Asher.”
Now, here was the strategy. There weren’t enough people combating SnS so he had to be something with a little help from his friends. Asher had butted heads with him. Asher wasn’t getting all the love SnS was. I was going to take my chances on preventing a nightkill so I’d know who was who at that point. (i.e., suspicions of Asher as Mafia at the time – more on that in next paragraph…)
The order of roleblock intentions at this stage: Asher (fail), Latino Meat (would’ve succeeded), Yami Redgrave (would’ve succeeded; although I wouldn’t have really needed to go after him once I discovered Latino Meat).
Once I could secure who Mafia was, I could revert back to being “regular me” because the game would be on temporary lockdown (i.e., I would’ve bought myself much more time). Reverting back to regular me = getting SnS the heck out of this game via lynch! Then, Yami Redgrave.
However, Mason revealed I’d have to wait a day to use the ability, and then I become a little frustrated that I’m going to have to go into bad guy mode full force to keep Mafia off my rear end …
---“Ok, so I misunderstood. I assumed from that that I would have had the full day to learn to become the roleblocker and then assume the role completely the next night. In essence, if someone is night-killed I have to wait two complete cycles in order to use it. I should've been the doctor on night 1 then. I'll never live to see another night phase.
I'll have to commit to roleblocker. I can't wait for another night kill and then wait two more full day cycles to use whatever it is that might pop up. The game will be over by then. In order for bad cop to be of any use, you have take a role in the first two days at the latest. Live and learn. I botched that.---
Mason reveals my attempt to become roleblocker failed.
Immediately, I knew I was roleblocked by another roleblocker. {Post-Game observation--Haha@there being a possible five roleblockers at some point in this game (Lodi, Cageking, Orange, Wolf Hurricane, me)}
And in a future Day Phase, I had referenced over and over how much the Orange roleblock did at that moment in the game. See above for my roleblock order and intentions. So I would’ve failed on the next night phase against Asher. HOWEVER, Latino Meat would’ve been uncovered, so I could’ve really used that information to a)prevent a kill on that particular night and b)use the bait and switch to lure out some other suspects while playing dumb about the failed nightkill from the night before (Yami Redgrave at the top of that short list of suspects and Jazzman in the next day phase was with him; note: I would still be watching Asher carefully).
It should be noted that I DID think I would’ve had the game on lockdown at that point (which I stated during of the late days in the game to plead my case about how bad that roleblocking of me affected the game) because I was thinking we had a Vigilante. I was thinking that if I could successfully roleblock, I could do enough during the Day Phase to give the Vigilante targets, effectively becoming a Town version of what Mafia is intended to do. It wasn’t until after Wolf Hurricane’s reveal that my retrospective confidence in a “game over” situation was really not accurate after all.
Street Spartan is revealed as night-killed. So, since I’m roleblocked from being roleblocker …
----------------------------------------------------------------- Day Phase 5: I. HAVE. TO. STAY. ALIVE. LONG. ENOUGH. TO. BECOME. COP. Uber manipulation mode. The bad cop infancy has become a wiry adolescence. Fellow Town members, after I got information I needed for us to win, I revealed all of this without overtly role-revealing. Yami Redgrave confirmed at Mafia during this day phase. Easy at this point. Knailsic is going down. But I HAVE to keep Latino Meat and Asher and Redgrave and SnS off my rear end long enough to prove stuff. Jazzman’s already on me. Either he or Yami is Godfather. Street Spartan noted him as straight up Town. That means he would’ve popped up Town during an investigation if he were Godfather. No way that Jazzman is Vigilante, so I’m confused on the “why would anyone freaking kill Brad when they did???” Do we even have a Vigilante then? He’s terrible if so because Brad makes no sense and you killed our cop. ---haha@me--- Anyway, back to keeping Mafia off my rear. Jazzman is trying to get me lynched. I’ve just got to confirm Yami as Town or at least neutralize him for the others so he doesn’t see me as threat. Same with SnS. Go ahead and buddy up (at this point, not sure if he’s Mafia or Cult, honestly). And Latino Meat doesn’t know I’ve been suspecting him at all. At this point, I could believe that Latino Meat is a GREAT Cult accomplice with whoever Cult Leader is (Asher maybe???) But at the same time, he might very well be Mafia. Either way, Meat’s on the radar big time. Again, the numbers there show me more or less that Asher is less likely to be Mafia at this point IF Yami or Meat was Mafia, but he still was on that Yami, Latino Meat, Jazzman, SnS shortlist. (Yes, remember, I didn’t get a chance to roleblock Asher, so Asher was still on my “to be considered” list. Although, Yami’s gameplay on this day did more for me separating Asher from him than any other previous day.) Absolute confidence in Wolf Hurricane and Produceman at this point. Fully expecting Knailsic to flip Cult after a lynch. Maybe we’ll get the leader. (Kudos in retrospect to Mason for that role that he created for Knailsic.)
------------------------------------------------------------------ Night Phase 5: I tried to take roleblocker again (haha!) but said I’ll take cop if roleblocker is off the table.
----------------------------------------------------------------- Day Phase 6: More of the same. Except this time, Merle from Walking Dead heel mode. Only way to stay alive (I felt) was to appear stupid as stupidly possible. Ritt must die. Why ritt? Well, while he was a Townsperson, he was the least contributing member to our side in terms of voting or committing to the cause like I personally felt he should’ve been by Day 6. He’s a “big name player” too so I thought this would entice scum. I did need more of him in this game, but it was clear—so it seemed—that he was going to be a little less active than I needed him to be. Hayden, the consummate inactive, was creeping onto the radar more and more. No idea how many Cult there are, so I thought maybe some of those who were scummy and on my shortlist may be Cult while “under the radar” Hayden could go Godfather. Just toyed with that thought but trying to hold firm with my original suspects. Back to ritt: this was just the safest Townperson to sacrifice, I felt. (Now, Hayden would’ve been a good target too, like I said, but more on that in a minute …) I’m keeping SnS and Yami happy and hopefully I’ll get to use this freaking role.
Also, Jonathan Michaels is legit concerned by my attacks and gameplay. I can’t give in just yet, but I did try to make a point to maybe switch it up and take another player or two down my tirade alley. (Notice that I did back off of him after being a straight up butthole under the “bad cop” character. We do butt heads in a lot of games, so it was only fair to back off THIS confirmed Townie and try to go another route.) I think my spats with Redgrave are taken with a grain of salt, as I’m trying to come across a little whiny to him while still showing my “insecurity” on what to really do about him.
Via PM, I let Jazzman know my inside scoop. I had to compliment him on confusing me the most up to this point. And I just tell him who I am and that I was least sure about where he stood on all this scum business.After I tell him what my role is and how I’m playing “the bad cop” from here on out …
---“I'm investigating Latino Meat during this night phase, I think. He's the slippery one and someone I could see recruiting you and SnS. I'm trying to think if there is a candidate who might have recruited H though. Latino doesn't seem to fit the mold for that, so I may change my night investigation target. I'm thinking maybe Yami Redgrave could've targeted H. I just see H as a bit of a loose cannon based on previous games and I can't see Latino Meat or SnS targeting him as a convert. Yami Redgrave or Latino Meat has got to be my target for investigation though.---“
Even though Yami Redgrave was primary Mafia in the game, we still weren’t any closer to nabbing Cult Leader. I did NOT like sweating it out and thinking that only a three-Cult scumlist was running around out there. I NEEDED that to happen. But later, once it became clear that Cult was a freaking machine, I had to do EXACTLY WHAT I WAS TELLING YOU TOWNSPEOPLE: eliminate scum and—what I wasn’t telling you—hope that Mafia might help me accidentally kill Cult. Remember Yami and Latino Meat were on my radar at this point BIG TIME. It’s all right there in the PM to Jazzman, which I had already in mind well before Day 6. In short, that Day 4 was pivotal. Out of character, I wasn’t hateful about it, but it was clear as crystal that I couldn’t even trust my own teammates to do what was right. Flat out, it made zero sense to lynch Knailsic over SnS or Yami (heck, it made no sense to me to lynch Moonie over them on Day 3). The role I chose for myself was to blend in with the misled/misguided and go along with it. And I had to keep heat on myself while I did it so as to keep Mafia happy. (And again, all of this can be confirmed via PM; it’s not “bull” like some of you all claimed in the thread. And I’m looking at a couple of you specifically when I say that.) But yeah, I wasn’t hateful about it out of character. I just turned it into that for the sake of doing what I had to do. Like I said, I had zero percent trust in anyone but Produceman and Wolf Hurricane after Day 4’s failure to lynch to two most obvious lynch candidates. (I don’t include ritt on the list, because while I can say I felt he was town at times, he wasn’t even really voting. What good was that to me at the time when I needed Yami or SnS lynched? So I tried to convince myself he really was Mafia. If he was, added bonus if I accidentally lynched him as an intended Town sacrifice. I kinda talked myself into wanting him to be Mafia and be wrong about him since Day 4’s confirmation of him. I legit bounced from him being straight up Town—75% of the time—to straight up great-player Mafia. )
To Jazzman: ---It'll be interesting [from here on out]. Obviously, I put up a front for so many of these players. It never pays to show overtrust, and a lot of times I'll show faith in players just to see how they'll react and I say I can't stand some players just to see how others start reacting to that.
I thought you were the Vigilante at one point and I was trying to protect you from being discovered and felt like I was offering a nudge nudge your way at a couple of points. Pretty funny in retrospect. It was after I figured out there was no Vigilante (I assume there isn't one) that I thought you could be scum because of some of the tendencies. I know you're going to be you no matter what the role, so I didn't try to look for any discrepancies in your tones. I just had to look at the messages itself. A couple of day phases in a row, I was at the point that I really did think you were Godfather with a Spartan misread on you. I was flat out wrong about that.
The three MVPs of the game (I would say) have been you for your team (I misread you twice), Latino Meat (IF he's the Cult Leader as I suspect), and ritt as Mafia. I kept a little quiet on ritt because he never stuck his neck out, and I knew he wouldn't. No way was I going to convince anyone of anything regarding him. I think he's the best Mafia player in the game overall from the games I've seen. But I knew we had one really smart Mafia player and that there was no way I was getting killed with all the controversies surrounding me (and the same for SnS). I usually don't care to die in the games, but I've needed to stay alive this game for power role reasons.---“
(The “really smart Mafia player” referred to above was either ritt or Latino Meat. Now, I would add Yami Redgrave there, but I mean, I was all over that guy since Day 2. So don’t sell him short. I just didn’t included him because I was so positive on him being scum. I just wished at the time I could trust my teammates. You can’t say I didn’t try to get everyone on board.) Let me reiterate: the scope of Meat and Redgrave being Cult buddies or Mafia buddies was changing all the time based on who was being considered. When I thought Hayden might actually flip Mafia (and Asher too actually at this point), I had to by default move Meat—and by association--Redgrave to Cult leader and primary accomplice.)
----------------------------------------------------------------------- Night Phase 6: BINGO! Latino Meat is scum. Now time to really really headscratch. Is he Goon or is he Cult since SnS was confirmed Leader? Also, move Yami Redgrave to Mafia since SnS is now Cult. Maybe I just misread the Redgrave/Meat connection by disassociation theory I was believed to be true. (So yeah, the funny thing was that I was playing dumb when I had Redgrave and Meat most on my radar as Mafia/scum partners, and as I got closer to endgame, I somehow talked myself into believing well, they both might be scum but they don’t HAVE to be on the same team, I guess.) Legit MVP mode: Wolf Hurricane at this point forward in the killing of Latino Meat COMBINED with the retrospective services he was offering during night phases to begin with.
------------------------------------------------------------------------ Day Phase 7: This was a day of two halves. Two names were on my “have to be lynched” list: Asher and Hayden. Again, I wanted Asher (just look back). Cult Leader was toast. Now, truth be told, it was a fingers crossed game about how many Cult remained. I metagamed a bit when Mason posted that thing which basically implied “I know what I’m doing, guys.” So, even though I didn’t want to believe it, I kinda gave a little benefit of the doubt and thought we may have 5 total Cult but surely not more than that. Latino Meat, again, COULD have been one of those master-minded leftovers with a power role. But, just in case, I wanted to make sure that if I got night-killed that Town looked his way. (This was also a protective measure to keep from being targeted. I know he’s scum, so IF he’s Mafia, no way they can nightkill me with me pointing right at him. I’m a l-i-t-t-l-e more OK with being lynched on Day 8 IF IF IF Cult isn’t running too wild, because I figure we have the numbers to go get Meat and Yami Redgrave and/or Asher if need be. (You remember that tirade I went on right after my lynch? Same thing would’ve happened on Day 8 with me going nutsoid about Yami Redgrave and Latino Meat and Asher.)
Back to the two halves story. I knew I was effed halfway through in terms of living to see the next Day Phase. NO WAY Hayden was Mafia Godfather. I was (out of character even) mad that Hayden had just now decided to start playing this way. Why didn’t you play prior to this day phase??? Argh argh argh. (Eh, I got over pretty quick; no worries now.) Well, forget strategy now. It was straight up rolling the dice and putting my faith in Mason not to screw us with more Cult than we could handle. (Keep in mind, Wolf and Produceman were the only ones I trusted. Orange was Town in my book and hopefully not leftover Cult, but I had already decided from way early in the game that I couldn’t work alongside him as a fellow Townsperson based on several mis-fires. So yeah, I had to hope to goodness that BoilerRoomBrawler and Orange had not been cult converted.)
I know I’m dead meat after Hayden goes Town. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Night Phase 7:
Wolf Hurricane for the win. Confirmation that I can stay alive and do more investigating. Who is least likely to be Godfather? Based on Asher’s most recent posts/attitude, let’s go for him as Goon; Yami’s got to be the Godfather OR heck, he’s just a really good power role that’s been kept secret and Asher really is the Godfather. Does that mean I was wrong about Produceman? (My first doubt on Produceman since Day 1. Again, I just entertained the thought. The unfolding events due to Wolf Hurricane’s nightkill of Latino Meat put me back on track a bit.) However, before that reveal of Latino Meat’s death even, I worked up the craziest post yet. I even submitted it to Jazzman so he could laugh if he so chose to read it all in its entirety. MAJOR MAJOR re-working had to be done after Wolf Hurricane made the play of the game.
Also, I PMed JoNO to let him know my role and what had been going on. The likes of which echo most of what I’ve already revealed here concerning “playing bad on purpose,” “lack of faith,” “SnS, Latino Meat, Asher suspicions,” AND getting ticked that Hayden proved to be Town midway through that past Day Phase when it was already too late for me to waffle.
I later role revealed to a lot of the deceased so they could see my “bad cop” routine wasn’t for real. (I figured SnS and some others could see through it anyway, but just in case, I wanted to make sure JoNo and Street Spartan and some others didn’t judge me too harshly since they were already out of the game. Also, I figured they could get a lot of lawls from how “mean” I was as they all knew I was playing my character. The Asher situation was confusing. I didn’t see him flipping Cult during this night phase. I really used that metagaming of that Mason post to convince myself that he might be Goon instead of having so many freaking Cult in the game.
To Street Spartan talking about having the bad cop mentality take its toll on me outside the game: --- Not actually "stressed" stressed. The thing that's taking its toll is playing bad cop to Orange (who believes it's actually real) and Yami Redgrave (same thing) and BoilerRoomBrawler.
The funny thing is, I haven't roughed up a single Mafia member (Knailsic or Latino Meat or Asher).---
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Day Phase 8: Hahaha@my accidental deletion of a post. I was seriously ticked at myself. That was a first.
Curse you Mason and your too many Cult! (Ahem, as it turns out, rightfully so, curse all these Town players and their inability to keep their mouths shut. More on that in the overall thoughts on the game below. Mason knew what he was doing. Town really did screw us over, even moreso than I was first giving them credit for.)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Night Phase 8: (and Day Phase 9)
I wanted Yami Redgrave so bad. So bad. Mason can confirm from my waffling. I chose Wolf Hurricane at first. But I KNEW KNEW KNEW KNEW he’d be nightkilled, so it was going to be a wasted target. I knew he was Cult (since Asher was Cult, which again, by the way, made me sweat it out, because the numbers were showing there was no room for error). But Mafia was surely going to kill Wolf to paint me as scum. So Wolf as Cult could be confirmed via investigation, but I figured it would be a wasted investigation. Again, Mason can confirm this. I put in to switch my investigation to Yami, even though I already solidly knew he was Godfather by default at that point. Long story short, in the name of fair play and in fairness to Mason who was under his own time pressures, I told Mason just to keep it and that I had made the mistake to begin with, so just let it go. The thought DID cross my mind to go after BoilerRoomBrawler. But, here’s the deal. I wanted Yami close by side and Produceman (who I could trust) to help go along get Orange to lynch BRB. Yami could nightkill me and I could unleash on Yami right as I BRB went to the gallows to give the other two a heads up. At least, that was my theory. (REMEMBER, right before the quick lynch, I was working up a day-by-day framing of Yami Redgrave, which I quit as soon as the third lynch went by.)
IF BRB was Cult (which it seemed to be), I decided to “Samson” on everyone at the end, as I told Jazzman via PM in a laugh. I first had to make it clear that Yami was Godfather. (by the way, humongous forehead slap at Orange on that one in the following day). I laughed at the idea of planting the seed in Yami’s mind that he would die if he targeted BRB. It was just designed to be chaos really. The truth is that I really did think at one point that BRB was a timebomb so I just rolled with that as quickly as possible before the lynch write-up was commenced. If Yami killed Produceman by default, where would that leave BRB and Orange? I mean, yes, it was a Town loss, but again, look at it from my perspective: I worked my butt off and darn it if I’m not allowed a moment to tear down what everyone else had torn apart since Day 3. Not really mad about it all, but it was tit for tat. Orange and BRB hadn’t been on my team for the longest time (even though they were on my team in actuality—they just didn’t do the lynches for information that would’ve been so critical), so I decided to go on my own Philistine-havoc moment there at the end, all the while making sure to beat whoever was left over the head with the fact that Yami was Mafia. In short, I already felt defeated as soon as I was sent to the gallows.
OVERALL THOUGHTS ON THE GAME:
MVPs were Latino Meat and Wolf Hurricane. No question in my mind.
Most underrated player: ritt (knew he had to be Town, and people seemed to really downplay how many “Mafia common sense” posts he made; well, if you’re watching, ritt, I saw them, and I appreciated it)
Sympathy award: stinger4christ . No one will make a big deal about this, but I notice how badly this game sucked for you. I hated that you didn’t have that much of a shot after Nights 1 and 2. It’s hard enough to avoid nightkills from Mafia over the course of the game WHILE not getting lynched. But to have fruitless efforts for reasons beyond your control really really sucks, dude. I’m sorry if the game seemed discouraging for you. I can certainly see why you would be frustrated for no other reason than just darn bad luck/fate. Gosh, the start to this game was epic awful for you, and you certainly didn’t play it wrong, so it wasn’t your fault. But I’m refreshed to see how all that play out, because a Serial Killer randomly appearing in the middle of the game was such a major head-scratcher for me.
Apologies to the likes of ritt and Street Spartan and Hayden for not pulling it out for you in the clenches. I tried my darndest. It was a heavy task and a challenging one that I personally chose for myself. So yes, I did get hard-headed after that Day 4, but hopefully you can see it from my frustrated player perspective. I’d like to think the result would’ve been different if I had cranked out that post against Yami before BRB and Orange got the chance to drop the hammer. It was bad timing. I was RIGHT in the middle of trying to pull the ol’ switch-a-roo on Yami Redgrave.
Roleclaims and character hints once again are the bane of my existence in these games. This has had no further truth than this particular game. All the roleclaimers and “hinters” who were being cute or thought they were being clever and needed the attention just about ruined the game because of the SnS cult-recruiting stipulation. In fact, one of the two major downsides of the game was the character hinting, because it made my gameplay infinitely harder because of how easy it was making the Cult Recruiter’s life in the game. After I got lynched and found out why in the blue Hades there were so many Cult, it made it clear just how EASY SnS had it in this game. Town MADE the Cult. When are people going to learn to quit revealing their characters on Days 1-3? (I actually understand one or two important roleclaims or hints more toward the endgame, because that’s the whole point if you play the game correctly up to that point. But, like Street Spartan did, he didn’t just announce everyone that he’d investigated and that he was the investigator after the first two or three nights; that’s how you do it.)
Mason ROCKED the setup of this game. His timing and ability to keep it moving was something I tried to PM him and compliment him about regularly. A poster child for my philosophy of “if you’re going to sign up for a game on these boards that EVERYONE knows is going to take a long while to complete, then be willing to stick it out before you sign up.” Mason, quite honestly, is the man. (#MarvelCharactersTournamentGreatness)
In many ways, I could say best Mafia game I’ve ever been in.
Best Mafia game I’ve been a part of in terms of players not being “flaky” about participating. The two replacements (except Moonie because of the wild goose chase lynch) were total non-factors in negatively impacting the game via their replacement posts. EVERYONE stuck it out practically. You don’t know how much I am thankful for that. I’ll be honest: whether I’m in the game or dead by that point, if a replacement is called in on Day Four or Five, I’m pretty much done with the game. If it’s a former player who’s already been nightkilled or lynched, the replacement being called in is just a flat out dealbreaker for me. It’s like hitting the reset button on the way I play and try to uproot scum. THANK YOU ALL FOR ACTUALLY PLAYING! That is truly what made this particular game a hit.
Inactivity wasn’t all that bad. Hayden was the only player who hurt the way I play due to his inactivity. But overall, it was NOTHING—NOT EVEN IN THE BALL PARK—as bad many Mafia games I’ve been a part of. He still tried to play once he finally started posting more than once or twice a day phase.
Ecstatic not to have been converted to Cult. I NEVER EVER want to be Cult or Mafia in these games. I love having a Town role. I once thought it would be great to be Serial Killer (used to want it badly, in fact) but I would never make it to endgame in ANY game after all this.
Along those lines, I’ll never live to see Day Three in any other game I play. I don’t sign up for every Mafia game (one or maybe two a year is about right for me). I try to let my gameplay wear off before becoming involved again. I’m pretty well convinced that this game blackballed me with every Mafia combo that will ever be put together for future games.
Back to Mason. One more praise is how he didn’t create a role where the character just flat out didn’t know something about himself. More than anything, I would flat out hate to play this game being led to believe that I can do one thing, when in fact the game mod is having an omniscient laughfest because he/she screwed me over with a “swerve role.” I. HATE. THE. IDEA. OF. SWERVE. ROLES. IN. THIS. GAME. Knailsic knew he would become Mafia once killed, so he was never misled on anything. I love that about this particular game design! I know Wolf Hurricane had a “chance role” but at least he would’ve known that up front. I really hate the idea of mods blindsiding competitors with gimmicky roles, and that would be the one thing that would make me swear off Mafia forever in the hands of such a mod. Mason, again, you rule, sir.
Biggest mistakes (not as much as Orange and BRB still want to believe--I've got all kinds of PMs to back this up): a)Believing Mason would cap the number of Cult which led to ... b)Being OK with lynching Hayden--whether Mafia or not--and letting Latino Meat get a pass because I figured I could get Asher as Mafia and we'd deal with Meat in due time
And ironically, "A" was totally preventable and in actuality had nothing to do with me, but instead, several of the teammates who were calling me out.
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MasonK565
El Dandy
Biggest Damian Wayne fan on FAN.
Posts: 8,577
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Post by MasonK565 on Mar 26, 2013 21:44:11 GMT -5
Thank you for the compliment but I need to clarify the Judas Role.
Knailsic, at first, was not aware he was a Judas. This was done to mimic Dent's actual character progression in the Bat-verse. When Dent was fighting as a DA, he was not aware of what his actions would lead him to be Two-Face. So Knailsic was to be unaware of his Judas role UNTIL he was lynched.
This was done for a few reasons: 1. Already stated, just for story purpose. 2. I did not want him to roleclaim as a way to get out of lynching. 3. I did not want him to urge a lynching so he could switch.
So hiding the Judas until he was lynched to him was the only thing that worked for me and my balancing.
I apologize if this upsets anyone.
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pegasuswarrior
El Dandy
Three Time FAN Idol Champion
@PulpPictionary
Posts: 8,748
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Post by pegasuswarrior on Mar 26, 2013 21:58:07 GMT -5
I said it once already, but it needs its own post:
Massive props to all participants. Actually participating made it worthwhile. It's never any fun when just a few are doing their part.
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MrBRulzOK
Wade Wilson
Mr No-Pants Heathen
Something Witty Here.
Posts: 26,719
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Post by MrBRulzOK on Mar 26, 2013 22:32:31 GMT -5
Agreed.
As for my performance I'll admit I didn't really do much in this particular game aside from lead the lynch on our Judas in disguise. Granted I was a Vanilla Townie so there wasn't much I could do other than try to search out who I felt was scum. And more often than not I really on my instincts as to who I feel is scum amongst the town. And something about Knailsic must've rubbed me the wrong way.
Though once I was gone I thoroughly enjoyed watching the rest of the game play out. It was frustrating at times though watching mislynch after mislynch. Though don't me wrong: I went along with plenty of questionable lynches myself when I was still around.
Definitely glad I participated in this one as well.
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Oak: Certified Jade Hater
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Edgier than Wayne Brady, Harder than Chinese Arithmetic, and Higher than the ratings for Blade: The Series
TOP ROPE CATCH A VIBE YEAH I SWERVE WHEN I DRIVE
Posts: 15,412
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Post by Oak: Certified Jade Hater on Mar 26, 2013 22:43:32 GMT -5
Just some thoughts.
I really enjoyed this game, even during my bouts of inactivity. I took on too much at a time, both on here and in real life, and it affected me pretty badly. Once things were settled and I was able to get some semblance, I was able to actually play the game as opposed to simply being here. Ironic that it happened when I was fighting a lynch.
Peg voting for me after I sided with him, at the time, hurt. But as the game progressed, I was able to see that he needed it to happen. Yeah, it hurt him a bit in everyone's eyes, but he played to survive, and my sudden activity was just cause for concern. No real hard feelings, though I wonder what would have happened had things played out differently.
I followed the game after my death, just to see how things were going along. I was happy that I was right to trust Peg and vote Zack, and that proved he was town in my eyes. To see people still doubting him sucked, as he went after Mafia and Cult. I was surprised so many still didn't trust him due to his play style. Losing him sucked for the town and really hurt our chances of winning.
I was amazed that BRB stayed in as long as he did in his first game. I figured he was town and Mafia would eliminate him after a certain amount of days. Would not have expected him to be Cult.
Stupid Yami Redgrave....
Losing Batman on our first night f***ing sucked. I was legitimately upset that RKTaker said he was mafia just to get voted out, especially considering his role and the power it has. It really set town back, and moving past Day One with that handicap really hurt.
I would have loved to hear Cage's thoughts after the bodyguard protected him, but sadly we never did.
All in all, it was a fun game. I may have to take a break with these games for a bit, but I'd love to join in if you're running another game.
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TOO SWEET
Grimlock
Not a doctor, nor do I play one on tv.
Posts: 13,109
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Post by TOO SWEET on Mar 26, 2013 22:46:08 GMT -5
This game was very close to the end. I think Peg said it best that early role/identity claims are what did Town in at the end. I heard people argue that they find it fun and there's no harm in it, but it is giving away info to everyone. And smart players like SNS are wise to take advantage of it. Anyway, a very balanced game (Good work Mason) and a very fun to read game. It was very entertaining to see Peg's craziness (in a good way) and seeing some of the newer players pushed into the big end game decisions. This one didn't go town's way, but it came very close. Good work to all involved. Only note for next game: Lets try to cut back a little bit on the cut throat attitude. I'm guilty of this just as much as everyone else, and I understand heated tensions, arguments, and all that, and don't expect anyone to need to sugarcoat things... but lets all remember that we're talking to real people of various ages/personalities and should be sure to properly think through everything we say. "Say what you mean, don't say it mean" We're all nice people here (except that SNS jerk ), and infuriated or not, I think there are ways to word things better. "You're wrong about me X, and I'll tell you why" vs "Stop being an idiot X". Sometimes little changes like that can not only be more effective in swaying others, but also are less likely to lead to hurt feelings. But like I said, overall it was a fun game and I was glad that someone caught onto to the trail I left (even if it was the cult leader).
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Post by Brandon Walsh is Insane. on Mar 27, 2013 1:20:11 GMT -5
Awesome notes.
I really wish I kept some notes on the game.
The Quick Topic did explain why we had to leave SNS and pegasus in the game though... looking back, they both played it magnificently. However, if they weren't both so harsh against Yami, they would have been killed first chance we had, haha.
Street's list became an asset to us as well, and BRB was the wildcard I feel.
I did feel that Knailistic COULD have survived the second lynch if he would not have posted that day phase, however. He posted something, and I can't remember what it was, but hinting at his role... and then the votes came in. I think if he didn't try to hint, he may have survived. Many people seemed to be on the thought process of a governor. And that would have helped immensely.
Peg, I had to give you reciporcal props during the game whenever you built me up as a MVP, but I don't see what I did, really. In all honesty, I thought I was being TOO vague with only really posting voting patterns and what not. I didn't really jump on any side, except for mafia. Lodi I felt I HAD to vote for, and early on because I saw the writing on the wall for him. Knail, too. I didn't want to lynch any town, which is why I didn't vote for them. I also wanted to stay away from the bandwagons.
I guess, in the end, peg, Hayden, and Wolf (DAMNIT AGAIN, WOLF! Haha) caught on to my game. BTW, way to go SNS, converting just about everyone I investigated each night, haha.
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Dub H
Crow T. Robot
Captain Pixel: the Game Master
I ❤ Aniki
Posts: 47,939
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Post by Dub H on Mar 27, 2013 1:33:18 GMT -5
I still don't know why kill me,i'm such a harmless fly Also to awser the Mafia,i HAD to give a hint that i was the mad hatter.
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Post by Triple H buried SnS on Mar 27, 2013 9:20:44 GMT -5
(except that SNS jerk ), I've been mafia where everyone believed I was town, and cult leader who was able to converted 5 people before I left the game. I'm taking a long break, but if in future games people don't give me serious consideration(cop, roleblock, or even killed) before night 3, I will be highly disappointed. I'm so-so as town, but I kick some butt as scum. j/k. Roleblocking - One point to peg. With Mason's setup, rolebocking scum only prevents the kill if you correctly choose who they send to perform the kill. In essence, one mafia member gets a "killer" role that they can use that night. So Cage's roleblock on lodi would not have prevented the kill if they had sent latino instead. The other setup is that the mafia night kill is a faction type activity, meaning no one mafia member has the "killing role", and thus cannot be roleblocked. This vastly neuters the roleblocker role, and is not used very much, if at all(at least on officialfan). I wondered at the time why mafia sent their own roleblocker out to perform the kill(thinking we were dealing with 5+ mafia). That is a very useful role and they put him in danger by sending him out(roleblocker, watcher, bomb, tracker, etc). Made sense later as you realized they were much smaller.
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Yami Daimao
Patti Mayonnaise
Really, really wants to zigazig ah!
Posts: 31,784
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Post by Yami Daimao on Mar 27, 2013 10:43:30 GMT -5
Yeah, it was only either me (Godfather), Lodi (Roleblocker), or Zack/Latino (Cop) to choose from. We agreed that sending the Godfather out was the most risky, and to only resort to it when absolutely necessary (like when we thought Cage was definitely going to roleblock Lodi, or when I was the only Mafia left, obviously). With a big player pool, I thought the Cop would come more in handy in the later days, and it did, especially when the Cult came into the picture. So our roleblocker was the only chance. Would he have been useful in the later half of the game? Absolutely. A roleblocker is never useless. But in hindsight, I thought preserving our Cop was the better move.
So if I were roleblocked even if I sent someone else for the kill, the kill could still have been prevented? Normally I would have asked "then what's the point of sending others for the kill if I can still be targeted?", but considering the Godfather's investigation and kill immunity, having the kill blocked if I were targeted sounds like a fair trade. Don't want to OP the Godfather. Luckily, no one had roleblocked me the entire game. The only one to come close to doing so was Wolf, but his Skitzo ability decided to protect me instead, to my luck.
Once again, great job on balancing the game, Mason.
Although, considering all of the crazy power roles the Town was given in their favor (Doctor, Bodyguard, Skitzo, Roleblocker, Cop, Inventor, whatever the hell you call Pegasus' role), I'm honestly surprised Town lost. Especially with Peg's role, which looks more like a "Back-up anything" as opposed to a Back-up for a certain role.
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Post by Triple H buried SnS on Mar 27, 2013 10:54:46 GMT -5
So if I were roleblocked even if I sent someone else for the kill, the kill could still have been prevented? That is wrong. If someone else performed the kill and you were roleblocked, the kill still would have gone through. Only the sent killer can be roleblocked to prevent the kill attempt. Obviously, a doctor/bodyguard/jailkeeper can protect the person from dying, but that's a completely different topic. The godfather night kill immune is a rarity, as it protects the godfather from everything but from a lynch. Not that it mattered since it didn't come into play. But with a mafia size like you had, it made sense.
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Yami Daimao
Patti Mayonnaise
Really, really wants to zigazig ah!
Posts: 31,784
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Post by Yami Daimao on Mar 27, 2013 11:21:28 GMT -5
Hm, I thought Peg was referring to the opposite.
And my night kill immunity did actually come into play, when stinger4christ (Serial Killer) attempted to kill me on Night 2. It's that he didn't take advantage of the information for some reason. He had 3 solid days to use that information against me. I know that would have possibly outed him as a killer, but in hindsight, he could have tried to claim Vigilante. I know he was under the assumption that there was one, I'm sure most of us were, but man, that would have been a game-changer for sure.
EDIT: On second thought, I just remembered Cageking was still around during that time, so stinger probably assumed he was roleblocked.
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Big Bad Brad
Wade Wilson
Big Bad Brad
Tournament Master
Posts: 27,407
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Post by Big Bad Brad on Mar 27, 2013 14:37:32 GMT -5
So if I were roleblocked even if I sent someone else for the kill, the kill could still have been prevented? That is wrong. If someone else performed the kill and you were roleblocked, the kill still would have gone through. Only the sent killer can be roleblocked to prevent the kill attempt. Obviously, a doctor/bodyguard/jailkeeper can protect the person from dying, but that's a completely different topic. The godfather night kill immune is a rarity, as it protects the godfather from everything but from a lynch. Not that it mattered since it didn't come into play. But with a mafia size like you had, it made sense. If the Godfather got roleblocked the kill would of been stopped regardless of who he sent for the kill. Proof (from Pegs long post this was a PM Peg sent to Mason) It says in the answer Mason sent Peg blocking Godfather OR the Mafia member sent for the kill will stop the kill.
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Post by Triple H buried SnS on Mar 27, 2013 14:52:17 GMT -5
That's odd. Very beefed up roleblocker than normal then if that was the case. Hit any of the mafia and you KNOW you've got mafia. Kind of a cop/roleblocker combo... and can circumvent the godfather investigation immunity.
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Post by Triple H buried SnS on Mar 27, 2013 15:43:12 GMT -5
Or for that matter... once you got one mafia, don't lynch him... leave him alive and keep roleblocking him. Cause by not lynching him you are preventing the mafia night kill every night. Then let all the power roles weed out all but the mafia godfather.
A roleblocker that prevents any mafia night kill by correctly targeting any of the mafia is potentially game breaking.
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Big Bad Brad
Wade Wilson
Big Bad Brad
Tournament Master
Posts: 27,407
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Post by Big Bad Brad on Mar 27, 2013 15:46:00 GMT -5
Or for that matter... once you got one mafia, don't lynch him... leave him alive and keep roleblocking him. Cause by not lynching him you are preventing the mafia night kill every night. Then let all the power roles weed out all but the mafia godfather. A roleblocker that prevents any mafia night kill by correctly targeting any of the mafia is potentially game breaking. Well its not really any mafia just the Godfather and the one performing the kill. Say Yami decided to do the kills each night and Zack or Lodi got roleblocked well the kill would go through. Also if Zack Morris got roleblocked instead of Lodi that night the kill would of went through since Zack wasn't the one performing the kill. So the safe bet for the Godfather would be to perform the kill himself that way if Lodi or Zack got roleblocked it meant nothing.
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Yami Daimao
Patti Mayonnaise
Really, really wants to zigazig ah!
Posts: 31,784
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Post by Yami Daimao on Mar 27, 2013 15:48:33 GMT -5
So I was right.
On second thought, considering our low numbers, I don't know how to feel about that mod.
Again, it shocks me that Town lost when this game felt like it was almost set to Town's favor.
I'd like to know Mason's reasoning for it before I go any further.
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