Yami Daimao
Patti Mayonnaise
Really, really wants to zigazig ah!
Posts: 31,784
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Post by Yami Daimao on Feb 1, 2014 12:17:04 GMT -5
Dolph is without a doubt speaking from his heart there. I liked it.
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Post by hossfan on Feb 1, 2014 12:19:30 GMT -5
I read some of the reactions (that he lost cleanly, why is he whining about how good he is?), and then watched the vid. I want to interject, for that particular point, that he had a nicely vague line there about "I'm pulled aside and told not to be so good." Ie, in kayfabe, he may be implying that he's being pressured by upper management to take a dive. Ie, he doesn't have to be interpreted as talking about straight-up pro wrestling booking... he could be interpreted as discussing fixing of otherwise legit matches, and that he's being pressured to do so in order to keep his job when he believes he could beat anybody out there if he was allowed to work to his full potential. Your mileage may vary, but that works for me within the kayfabe/in-show context that they've currently established, where we do talk about management and their preferences quite a bit. So I'm expected to root for a guy who throws matches and then screams like a banshee about it backstage? Not trying to start anything but, I couldn't help but notice that it's mostly the Anti IWCers knocking Ziggler's promo. Soooo......yeah. Could be some of us thought it was a poorly performed, nonsensical promo.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2014 12:25:26 GMT -5
Not trying to start anything but, I couldn't help but notice that it's mostly the Anti IWCers knocking Ziggler's promo. Soooo......yeah. So is anti-IWCers some new non-existent hive-mind group? Can people not just like or dislike something based on their own preferences without having it tied in to some fabricated idea of what an internet wrestling fan likes? I didn't like the promo. Too much screaming, nonsensical, and it's either blatantly at odds with kayfabe reality given that he just lost despite supposedly outdoing everyone or it's going into worked shoot territory which I don't like.
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Post by king1836 on Feb 1, 2014 12:32:20 GMT -5
The Top 5 Faces of WWE should be Daniel Bryan, Dolph Ziggler, Big E. Langston, Cody Rhodes, and Sheamus.
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Post by Piccolo on Feb 1, 2014 12:39:21 GMT -5
I read some of the reactions (that he lost cleanly, why is he whining about how good he is?), and then watched the vid. I want to interject, for that particular point, that he had a nicely vague line there about "I'm pulled aside and told not to be so good." Ie, in kayfabe, he may be implying that he's being pressured by upper management to take a dive. Ie, he doesn't have to be interpreted as talking about straight-up pro wrestling booking... he could be interpreted as discussing fixing of otherwise legit matches, and that he's being pressured to do so in order to keep his job when he believes he could beat anybody out there if he was allowed to work to his full potential. Your mileage may vary, but that works for me within the kayfabe/in-show context that they've currently established, where we do talk about management and their preferences quite a bit. So I'm expected to root for a guy who throws matches and then screams like a banshee about it backstage? I'm suggesting a potential interpretation of the promo. My interpretation implies no action on your part, nor any expectations of you on my part.
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Post by "Gentleman" AJ Powell on Feb 1, 2014 12:42:15 GMT -5
Not trying to start anything but, I couldn't help but notice that it's mostly the Anti IWCers knocking Ziggler's promo. Soooo......yeah. Seems to be a common schtick around here. Usually a poorly thought out one. Still, not as bad as those yelping on about Revolution.
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Post by Piccolo on Feb 1, 2014 12:44:29 GMT -5
I read some of the reactions (that he lost cleanly, why is he whining about how good he is?), and then watched the vid. I want to interject, for that particular point, that he had a nicely vague line there about "I'm pulled aside and told not to be so good." Ie, in kayfabe, he may be implying that he's being pressured by upper management to take a dive. Ie, he doesn't have to be interpreted as talking about straight-up pro wrestling booking... he could be interpreted as discussing fixing of otherwise legit matches, and that he's being pressured to do so in order to keep his job when he believes he could beat anybody out there if he was allowed to work to his full potential. Your mileage may vary, but that works for me within the kayfabe/in-show context that they've currently established, where we do talk about management and their preferences quite a bit. Technically he could be talking about being forced into dives by management, but that hasn't really been presented as a plot point on WWE TV as of yet, so breaking the fourth wall is all I'm left with to consider. That's certainly a choice that anyone's free to make. We can all consider whichever interpretations we want to consider.
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Post by Ishmeal Loves Kaseyhausen on Feb 1, 2014 12:55:09 GMT -5
I like it. I love Ziggler. He can work the mic, he can damn sure work in the ring. He's been ready to move up for years. Backstage is the one area I would love an all-seeing eye, so I can see for myself what they have against Bryan, Ziggler, and so many others.
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Post by Medicinal Thunder Liger on Feb 1, 2014 12:58:01 GMT -5
good promo, I dont know if ziggler is slowly working into a subtle heel or what but maybe this could work for him.
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Sparkybob
King Koopa
I have a status?
Posts: 10,990
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Post by Sparkybob on Feb 1, 2014 13:07:47 GMT -5
I just didn't really like it too much since the promo really wasn't being related back to the character Dolph Ziggler rather it was just the person lashing out. I mean in kayfabe he isn't being held down. He was in the rumble match, he just wasn't good enough to win. He had a prime opportunity to be in the chamber and become WWE champ but he lost clean as a sheet. And it wasn't like he had to beat the shield 3-1, he had a match against a fellow mid card power guy in Cesaro.
Ziggs saying how great of a wrestler he is and how he's better than everybody else, but losing clean as a sheet in any big match really turns me off from the promo. He really doesn't come off too well in kayfabe for it. If lets say Ziggler wasn't in the rumble or a qualify match for the Chamber, then I think this promo will have a lot more kayfabe juice. He can say he's being held down and what not and make it make sense in kayfabe as in reality. That's the best kind of worked-shoots in my opinion.
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Post by Hit Girl on Feb 1, 2014 13:13:50 GMT -5
Good promo, but it can't lead to anything.
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Allie Kitsune
Crow T. Robot
Always Feelin' Foxy.
Celestial Princess in Exile.
Posts: 46,106
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Feb 1, 2014 13:44:08 GMT -5
Well yeah, if enough people view it it will help Dolph out... With the word revolution, I was thinking people were trying to treat this like it's some underground movement that the man didn't want you to see or something... when again it's on their website... if they didn't want you to see it it wouldn't be there. "Revolution" is the most overstated and overrated word in our entire language...
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Allie Kitsune
Crow T. Robot
Always Feelin' Foxy.
Celestial Princess in Exile.
Posts: 46,106
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Feb 1, 2014 13:49:47 GMT -5
Great promo, I think it'll lead somewhere, Dolph has what it takes to be the next Punk, he does deserve so much more, change his style a bit in the ring or whatevs, for safety reasons, but the guy is incredible I wouldn't go that far. Dolph doesn't have the aloof, untouchable, mean-spirited snark attitude that Punk does. Which isn't to say that Dolph can't snark, but he's definitely 'closer to earth' than a guy like Punk.
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Post by The Beast Disincarnate on Feb 1, 2014 13:52:51 GMT -5
That promo did nothing to me really. I'm a little tired of these "i've been held down, i deserve more" promos. Punk did it better as a worked shoot, and Big Show did it better as a regular promo that time he turned from a goofy giant to a pissed of giant a few years ago.
To me it's pandering to the smarks, and I really don't see how it could make it to tv and interest casual fans.
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Post by kamero00 on Feb 1, 2014 13:56:44 GMT -5
TOM PHILLIPS had no idea that was coming.
Wow a promo with real emotion. That was Flair like.
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Post by kamero00 on Feb 1, 2014 14:03:00 GMT -5
Not trying to start anything but, I couldn't help but notice that it's mostly the Anti IWCers knocking Ziggler's promo. Soooo......yeah. So is anti-IWCers some new non-existent hive-mind group? Can people not just like or dislike something based on their own preferences without having it tied in to some fabricated idea of what an internet wrestling fan likes? I didn't like the promo. Too much screaming, nonsensical, and it's either blatantly at odds with kayfabe reality given that he just lost despite supposedly outdoing everyone or it's going into worked shoot territory which I don't like. It's the same people who are fans of Orton, bash Bryan, and defend the WWE at all costs. They are also the people who laughed at DX's lame jokes in 2008, and literally get mad at crowds if they cheer more for Bryan than Batista. One of the guys who did not like the promo had 11 posts about how the Royal Rumble crowd "ruined the PPV" for him and other WWE "loyalists". I mean WTH is that? There are people on here who actually think paying fans should act a certain way
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SEAN CARLESS
Hank Scorpio
More of a B+ player, actually
I'm Necessary Evil.
Posts: 5,770
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Post by SEAN CARLESS on Feb 1, 2014 14:13:52 GMT -5
It's a promo written specifically for the same core fanbase who see Bryan as misused and Punk as having legit gripes. It's not for John Q. Mouthbreather on RAW. It's meant to rile up that aforementioned fanbase and build heat toward "the evil corporation" losing in the end. Or at least that would be the hope. Never know with WWE. This is the same company after all amidst Occupy Wall Street that tried to lampoon that movement by portraying their talent as being ungrateful and the "haves" and rich elites as being "for the people".
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Allie Kitsune
Crow T. Robot
Always Feelin' Foxy.
Celestial Princess in Exile.
Posts: 46,106
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Feb 1, 2014 15:04:44 GMT -5
It's a promo written specifically for the same core fanbase who see Bryan as misused and Punk as having legit gripes. It's not for John Q. Mouthbreather on RAW. It's meant to rile up that aforementioned fanbase and build heat toward "the evil corporation" losing in the end. Or at least that would be the hope. Never know with WWE. This is the same company after all amidst Occupy Wall Street that tried to lampoon that movement by portraying their talent as being ungrateful and the "haves" and rich elites as being "for the people". I'm not sure giving a wrestler an actual "OWS" gimmick would get over, though. The first time he tries to poop on a car, on air, that's probably not going to go over so well. Although, I suppose it depends on if you're giving them the "Hipster" angle of the gimmick, or the "Black Bloc Anarchist" angle of the gimmick. A Black Bloc Anarchist gimmick MIGHT actually get over.
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Post by Mc Mc Mannequin on Feb 1, 2014 15:24:06 GMT -5
In my opinion Dolph Ziggler thinks he's alot better than he actually is.
You don't have the it factor Dolph if you did you would be main event by now.
If your main attribute is selling well and making other people look good and that attribute out weighs your others, then you will be midcard for life by default.
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Post by Andy Martin on Feb 1, 2014 15:26:09 GMT -5
And when you have in mind that wrestling is the 5th best thing he does... how awesome must Dolph Ziggler be? Beast. I wonder what the 1st - 4th best things he does are. Ask Amy Schumer.
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