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Post by Racksman on Jul 5, 2014 10:35:45 GMT -5
I am by no means a TNA fan currently, but stop giving this asshole any sort of limelight. He's never been a good booker. SMW sucked and he almost killed Ring of Honor. He's just as bad if not worse in certain aspects than Russo. I hope that's there for its comedic value, and not because you think Jim Cornette was actually ever a good pro wrestling booker. There is definitive proof aside from SMW, WWF, OVW & ROH that he's terrible. Go watch his RF Video Guest Booker. He literally made the InVasion angle worse. A MILLION times worse, I didn't think it was possible.
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Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Jul 5, 2014 11:05:22 GMT -5
She's been involved in wrestling for about 10 years now. Other than "Duhhhh, purty girl's don't know about rasslin'", what is the argument for not giving her a chance? I have no idea if she has any writing experience or not. How much experience writing wrestling shows did Jim Cornette have when he was put on WCW's booking team? How much did Dusty? How much did Jerry Jarrett? How much did Vince McMahon? Everyone has to get their start somewhere to gain writing experience, and people forget, being on a team with others to provide a different perspective and ideas is not the same as writing the whole show herself... At the very least, Hemme can provide the experience of someone that had her career cut short through injury so can stop people with no in-ring experience like Lagana booking people to do stupid s**t that puts their health at risk.
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Tony Schiavontay
Dennis Stamp
This is the greatest post in the history of this board!
Posts: 4,083
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Post by Tony Schiavontay on Jul 5, 2014 11:07:26 GMT -5
I hope that's there for its comedic value, and not because you think Jim Cornette was actually ever a good pro wrestling booker. There is definitive proof aside from SMW, WWF, OVW & ROH that he's terrible. Go watch his RF Video Guest Booker. He literally made the InVasion angle worse. A MILLION times worse, I didn't think it was possible. I literally used it because I don't think there's ever been a better opportunity to use it. I don't think Cornette is worse than Russo but both have a lot more wrong in their vision than right. I'm a Cornette fan but I'm not going to pretend his old, dated vision of wrestling isn't boring. Honestly, though, it's not like wrestling any kind of breeding ground for great creative minds in general.
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Chainsaw
T
A very BAD man.
It is what it is
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Post by Chainsaw on Jul 5, 2014 19:30:05 GMT -5
Right..."making" him insane.
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andrew8798
FANatic
on 24/7 this month
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Post by andrew8798 on Jul 5, 2014 21:24:18 GMT -5
Always thought it funny he blames other people for failings
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Woo
Hank Scorpio
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Post by Woo on Jul 6, 2014 3:18:48 GMT -5
Everyone has mentioned that his ROH run was a massive failure but nobody has yet said that when Cornette left TNA in mid-2009 the company, under Russo (freaking Russo!) improved almost instantly becoming the best TNA had been since 2005 and the best it's been since too. You had AJ as champion fighting Joe and Daniels, Desmond Wolf's feud with Angle, Matt Morgan and Hernendez ready to break the glass ceiling, the Pope looking like he was going to be a massive star and Scott Stiener somehow made Bobby Lashley interesting for a while. You also had a great tag team division and the Knockouts were at it's peak featuring some of the best womens wrestlers in the world such as Amazing Kong, Hamada, Sarah Stock and Cheerleader Melissa. The KO's were so good and so over that they created tag team titles for them. This all happened once Cornette left.
Were it not for the Hogan arrival who knows how good things could have ended up being.
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Post by El Cokehead del Knife Fight on Jul 6, 2014 3:30:36 GMT -5
Everyone has mentioned that his ROH run was a massive failure but nobody has yet said that when Cornette left TNA in mid-2009 the company, under Russo (freaking Russo!) improved almost instantly becoming the best TNA had been since 2005 and the best it's been since too. You had AJ as champion fighting Joe and Daniels, Desmond Wolf's feud with Angle, Matt Morgan and Hernendez ready to break the glass ceiling, the Pope looking like he was going to be a massive star and Scott Stiener somehow made Bobby Lashley interesting for a while. You also had a great tag team division and the Knockouts were at it's peak featuring some of the best womens wrestlers in the world such as Amazing Kong, Hamada, Sarah Stock and Cheerleader Melissa. The KO's were so good and so over that they created tag team titles for them. This all happened once Cornette left. Were it not for the Hogan arrival who knows how good things could have ended up being. It was only that good because TNA were going through a holding pattern and didn't need to do anything amazing.
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Post by Hobby Drifter on Jul 6, 2014 5:22:42 GMT -5
I love Jim Cornette. The guy is awesome. He's funny. He's well spoken. He's got a great mind for the business. His contributions to wrestling over the past few decades are many, indeed.
That said, his booking style isn't one I've ever found particularly engaging. BUT, I think he'd be the perfect "filter". He *does* know what NOT to do. He may not be the best at coming up with his own compelling, cutting-edge storylines, but he has an almost super-human grasp of what will NOT work. JR's kinda the same way, but he seems to be too *polite* to out-and-out say it.
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Woo
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 5,279
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Post by Woo on Jul 6, 2014 5:58:07 GMT -5
Everyone has mentioned that his ROH run was a massive failure but nobody has yet said that when Cornette left TNA in mid-2009 the company, under Russo (freaking Russo!) improved almost instantly becoming the best TNA had been since 2005 and the best it's been since too. You had AJ as champion fighting Joe and Daniels, Desmond Wolf's feud with Angle, Matt Morgan and Hernendez ready to break the glass ceiling, the Pope looking like he was going to be a massive star and Scott Stiener somehow made Bobby Lashley interesting for a while. You also had a great tag team division and the Knockouts were at it's peak featuring some of the best womens wrestlers in the world such as Amazing Kong, Hamada, Sarah Stock and Cheerleader Melissa. The KO's were so good and so over that they created tag team titles for them. This all happened once Cornette left. Were it not for the Hogan arrival who knows how good things could have ended up being. It was only that good because TNA were going through a holding pattern and didn't need to do anything amazing. Not quite sure I follow, but regardless the storylines, angles and matches all improved dramatically when Cornette left.
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JoDaNa1281
Crow T. Robot
Jackie Daytona, Regular Human Bartender. #BLM
Posts: 40,131
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Post by JoDaNa1281 on Jul 6, 2014 6:09:42 GMT -5
Everyone has mentioned that his ROH run was a massive failure but nobody has yet said that when Cornette left TNA in mid-2009 the company, under Russo (freaking Russo!) improved almost instantly becoming the best TNA had been since 2005 and the best it's been since too. You had AJ as champion fighting Joe and Daniels, Desmond Wolf's feud with Angle, Matt Morgan and Hernendez ready to break the glass ceiling, the Pope looking like he was going to be a massive star and Scott Stiener somehow made Bobby Lashley interesting for a while. You also had a great tag team division and the Knockouts were at it's peak featuring some of the best womens wrestlers in the world such as Amazing Kong, Hamada, Sarah Stock and Cheerleader Melissa. The KO's were so good and so over that they created tag team titles for them. This all happened once Cornette left. Were it not for the Hogan arrival who knows how good things could have ended up being. It was only that good because TNA were going through a holding pattern and didn't need to do anything amazing. Though, some of the stuff that they did do during that time was amazing.
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Jul 6, 2014 6:37:40 GMT -5
I never stop finding it amusing that in wrestling more than any other industry, you gave guys living up to that metaphor from the Bible - don't take the speck out of your neighbour's eye before taking the log out of yours.
Cornette is absolutely right about a lot of this, but as established, he's shown he knows absolute dick about wrestling these days. Other guys are the same, people like Nash who clearly knows how the business works but rather than doing good business has only ever used it to benefit himself.
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Jul 6, 2014 16:35:00 GMT -5
I love Jim Cornette. The guy is awesome. He's funny. He's well spoken. He's got a great mind for the business. His contributions to wrestling over the past few decades are many, indeed. That said, his booking style isn't one I've ever found particularly engaging. BUT, I think he'd be the perfect "filter". He *does* know what NOT to do. He may not be the best at coming up with his own compelling, cutting-edge storylines, but he has an almost super-human grasp of what will NOT work. JR's kinda the same way, but he seems to be too *polite* to out-and-out say it. That's my biggest issue with Cornette's booking. Whereas Russo is too over the top and Vinnie Mac is too stubborn, he's way too safe. Under him you'll get wrestlers fighting over belts and feuds based on simple pride, but you need a lot more than that to make a compelling product. Maybe not a reverse battle royale, but something. The reason that worked in TNA was because the roster was loaded down with charismatic stars at the time, whereas in ROH it....wasn't.
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Post by Hobby Drifter on Jul 6, 2014 17:24:57 GMT -5
I think Corny would be the guy to go to with "We want to from point A to point B. Here is how we're going to do it. Is any of this going to wind up as a punch line twenty years from now"?
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Post by benstudd on Jul 7, 2014 23:14:52 GMT -5
And it always baffles me that there's always some hero that defends Christy. I think what Corny means in all this is that all these guys have little experience in running a company and make it work. Two of them are writers, yes. But again, TNA doesn't have a true booker. Someone who's goal is thinking about the bottom line to generate money. Not writing these little stories. TNA has had a parade of old school bookers that did nothing for them, Jerry Jarrett, Dusty Rhodes (Remember how much fun that was to watch?), Cornette, Mantell (Ring Ka King was all him and it was a throwback booked around Matt freskin' Morgan)... They've also had 90s guys like Jeff Jarrett, Russo, Ferrara and Bischoff and that didn't help either so TNA has little to lose by trying something fresh. Cornette seems to have a huge chip on his shoulder when it comes to people on booking teams that didn't compete for the NWA at some point in the 1980s or didn't get into wrestling the right way... like being discovered at a bar or gym, bodybuilding, failing at football and needing a plan B or being someone's son. I'm yet to see a compelling reason why Christy shouldn't get a shot on creative from the likes of Cornette or anyone. I think they managed a tight ship when it was JJ, Mantel and Russo. It wasn't brilliant but TNA had their shit together and they averaged 1.3. They also had better attendances and their PPV numbers were not at a "must kill level" such as when Hogan was there. JJ knew that PPV was TNA's bread and butter and they always delivered great matches. People were buying them cause it was worth it. More Importantly they knew how to maintain that business and book the weekly shows so that people would get that PPV. It's pretty simple really. When you have a bunch of writers and no bookers to see the big picture, all they do is write for TV and don't think about generating money.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Jul 8, 2014 8:53:45 GMT -5
It's easier to make a list over the people in wrestling Jim likes in pro wrestling. That list seems to be... whoever is paying me at the time
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Death by Pickles!
Don Corleone
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Post by Death by Pickles! on Jul 10, 2014 6:57:15 GMT -5
I hope that's there for its comedic value, and not because you think Jim Cornette was actually ever a good pro wrestling booker. There is definitive proof aside from SMW, WWF, OVW & ROH that he's terrible. Go watch his RF Video Guest Booker. He literally made the InVasion angle worse. A MILLION times worse, I didn't think it was possible. Holy shit, what did he do to f*** it up?
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Post by Racksman on Jul 10, 2014 16:03:51 GMT -5
I hope that's there for its comedic value, and not because you think Jim Cornette was actually ever a good pro wrestling booker. There is definitive proof aside from SMW, WWF, OVW & ROH that he's terrible. Go watch his RF Video Guest Booker. He literally made the InVasion angle worse. A MILLION times worse, I didn't think it was possible. Holy shit, what did he do to f*** it up? Suddenly everything became a worked shoot and there was an MMA feel to everything because that gets him hard (see: Severn, Edwards, Richards). Terry Funk, while I love him, somehow was the main focal point of the whole thing. The Undertaker randomly reverted back to being the devil and was on his own side. And he extended it past Survivor Series and made it go all the way to WrestleMania 18...and had WCW win.
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Jul 10, 2014 16:42:02 GMT -5
lol you forgot to mention his idea to have Dusty Rhodes, in 2001, feud with Hogan, other highlights of that guest booker where when he refused to use Goldberg in the invasion because he lacked passion, only booking Balls Mahoney for the ECW side, and having Brock Lesnar as part of the alliance lolz.
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Death by Pickles!
Don Corleone
R.I.P. Derek Boogaard (1982-2011). Long Live the Boogey Man.
Posts: 1,314
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Post by Death by Pickles! on Jul 10, 2014 20:58:14 GMT -5
Holy shit, what did he do to f*** it up? Suddenly everything became a worked shoot and there was an MMA feel to everything because that gets him hard (see: Severn, Edwards, Richards). Terry Funk, while I love him, somehow was the main focal point of the whole thing. The Undertaker randomly reverted back to being the devil and was on his own side. And he extended it past Survivor Series and made it go all the way to WrestleMania 18...and had WCW win. So many questions. Why would WCW win? Why was Terry the focal point? Why would Lesnar be in the Alliance?
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Jul 10, 2014 21:59:04 GMT -5
Ok if I remember correctly....Lesnar was gonna be with heyman I think after injuring Ric Flair on his debut, Terry Funk was gonna beat the Undertaker on a fluke, and WCW would win the the feud on wrestlemania 18 so they could get their own show replacing smackdown (which was the original plan before buff-booker t debacle). The funny part is that 411mania gave the DVD a 10 out of 10.
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