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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2014 10:36:48 GMT -5
I think what really confused me was that John Cena beat down Bray, Rowan, and Harper in that cage match.
He beat 3 men. It was practically a handicap match.
Bray relying on his child follower to win may have made sense if they followed through/said it was the entire point with it but...they didn't after two weeks. Then Cena won again, which isn't a problem if the writing for Bray reflected it as-may-as-well-have-won but...that didn't happen?
Hell in the current feud Jericho isn't worried about losing his fanbase, Jericho's saying he'll just be as crazy as Wyatt is, whilst Wyatt rambles on about Jericho being a false icon. Jericho doesn't CARE that you think that, Bray, he said he'll come down to your level to beat you.
I've only just realized that whilst thinking on it for 5 seconds. The inconsistency is deafening!
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Jul 28, 2014 10:38:58 GMT -5
Bray relying on his child follower to win may have made sense if they followed through/said it was the entire point with it but...they didn't after two weeks. I maintain they realized how stupid that thing was and dropped it... because they seemingly went out of their way not to mention the demon voice child whenever it was brought up afterwrads.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2014 10:40:45 GMT -5
Bray relying on his child follower to win may have made sense if they followed through/said it was the entire point with it but...they didn't after two weeks. I maintain they realized how stupid that thing was and dropped it... because they seemingly went out of their way not to mention the demon voice child whenever it was brought up afterwrads. In a way it was wise as the idea was HORRENDOUS and the way it was done just sucked (like the latter half of that feud), but it leads me to think the Wyatts are a bigger non-threat than RVD in kayfabe. 3 savages couldn't beat Cena, relying on a child to win, which was never mentioned again...add in Bray losing most matches, and Harper/Rowan doing the same. *scratches head* Yeah, come on, WWE.
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mizerable
Fry's dog Seymour
You're the lowest on the totem pole here, Alva. The lowest.
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Post by mizerable on Jul 28, 2014 10:43:32 GMT -5
Bray should try to just manage. There's so much life in that tank and could keep a rotating door when it comes to family members and brainwashing them to do his deeds for him, you know...like a real cult leader. It won't matter if they lose because he could always get someone new and then try again. On top of that, the eventual breakaway face turn for a member would always keep the Wyatt family busy.
And Bray should always be a heel, even if the fans rally behind him. His gimmick has nothing face about it.
So yeah...Bray should swallow his pride and manage. He's a less than mediocre wrestler and having him lose in the ring is always going to hurt him. Having others lose for him will always protect him and the gimmick.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2014 10:51:00 GMT -5
People are finally picking up on the fact that Bray never really says anything. It's all style and no substance and he pretty much says the same thing weekly.
The booking doesn't help either really though, after he beats Jericho he'll just be accusing someone else of being the fans hero and feud with them for little reason. Such a half assed cult leader.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2014 10:54:20 GMT -5
I really, really don't get where this "Wyatt sucks as a wrestler" notion came from, because it's frankly not true. He's been an integral part of three or four of the best PPV matches this year, one of which is almost certainly a lock for WWE's Match of the Year. His only really poor outings this year have been the Extreme Rules cage match, which was 100% the fault of the godawful booking, and the Jericho match at Battleground, which was from a show where pretty much everyone was off their game.
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mizerable
Fry's dog Seymour
You're the lowest on the totem pole here, Alva. The lowest.
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Post by mizerable on Jul 28, 2014 10:55:31 GMT -5
And that's exactly why having someone do his bidding for him will at least let the story progress.
If his minion loses, he canturn on them or bring someone else in. It's certainly better than recycling the same storyline that will inevitably go nowhere. I mean, does beating Jericho accomplish anything? Is Jericho going to change?
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Post by xxshoyuweeniexx on Jul 28, 2014 10:58:47 GMT -5
Why don't they brainwash anybody? I mean aren't they supposed to be a cult? Undertaker took a ton of guys who weren't doing anything and transformed them into his followers. I get that trios are a thing, but a cult with just 2 followers isn't much of a cult.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Jul 28, 2014 11:03:36 GMT -5
I still love them, but they've been completely ineffectual in every feud they've ever been in. Not one person or team they've battled has come out any worse for wear.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2014 11:03:58 GMT -5
I really, really don't get where this "Wyatt sucks as a wrestler" notion came from, because it's frankly not true. He's been an integral part of three or four of the best PPV matches this year, one of which is almost certainly a lock for WWE's Match of the Year. His only really poor outings this year have been the Extreme Rules cage match, which was 100% the fault of the godawful booking, and the Jericho match at Battleground, which was from a show where pretty much everyone was off their game. Outside of tag matches where he serves as a really good surprisingly agile power brawler, he's had: A HORRENDOUS inferno match with Kane A crowd silencingly poor singles match with Reigns on Raw Two bad Cena matches after their decent 'Mania match A sloppy/dull/badly paced/built match with Jericho. And outside of that he's only had 2/3 other singles matches, one against Bryan (excellent), one against Cena at 'Mania (solid/decent) and I'm probably forgetting one otherwise. He was a much more competent wrestler on NXT as he had a few more interesting moves and could not have 15+ minute matches due to the 1 hour length of the weekly show, so his style/speed/power high spots were done in a smaller time allowing less of a chance for dull rest holds/multiple taunting spots in a match which really ruined the flow of the bad matches. Not saying it's all him, but if more than half your few and far between singles matches have been crap the last 12 months and your flaws are only hidden in tag matches, either get in tag matches, or stop wrestling and become a super effective manager. Not that it's Bray's choice, but the creative people should fix that. It's making him look much worse in kayfabe & in actual matches.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2014 11:18:22 GMT -5
Outside of tag matches where he serves as a really good surprisingly agile power brawler, he's had: A HORRENDOUS inferno match with Kane A crowd silencingly poor singles match with Reigns on Raw Two bad Cena matches after their decent 'Mania match A sloppy/dull/badly paced/built match with Jericho. And outside of that he's only had 2/3 other singles matches, one against Bryan (excellent), one against Cena at 'Mania (solid/decent) and I'm probably forgetting one otherwise. He was a much more competent wrestler on NXT as he had a few more interesting moves and could not have 15+ minute matches due to the 1 hour length of the weekly show, so his style/speed/power high spots were done in a smaller time allowing less of a chance for dull rest holds/multiple taunting spots in a match which really ruined the flow of the bad matches. Not saying it's all him, but if more than half your few and far between singles matches have been crap the last 12 months and your flaws are only hidden in tag matches, either get in tag matches, or stop wrestling and become a super effective manager. Not that it's Bray's choice, but the creative people should fix that. It's making him look much worse in kayfabe & in actual matches. The Inferno match was awful, but I think that was more due to the gimmick than anything else, since I can't recall ever seeing a good Inferno match - even Taker/Kane was terrible save for some cool visuals. For all my problems with the feud, I still thought the Cena LMS match was a fun spotfest. The Extreme Rules match sucking was, again, due to the booking being a complete mess. And the Jericho match was sloppy and a bit dull but was by no means bad, just very average. That really only leaves the Reigns match was a legitimately bad performance, which I'll grant you. But to act like Wyatt is on the level of Ryback or something where he simply cannot work a decent singles match is a complete exaggeration.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2014 11:21:58 GMT -5
Outside of tag matches where he serves as a really good surprisingly agile power brawler, he's had: A HORRENDOUS inferno match with Kane A crowd silencingly poor singles match with Reigns on Raw Two bad Cena matches after their decent 'Mania match A sloppy/dull/badly paced/built match with Jericho. And outside of that he's only had 2/3 other singles matches, one against Bryan (excellent), one against Cena at 'Mania (solid/decent) and I'm probably forgetting one otherwise. He was a much more competent wrestler on NXT as he had a few more interesting moves and could not have 15+ minute matches due to the 1 hour length of the weekly show, so his style/speed/power high spots were done in a smaller time allowing less of a chance for dull rest holds/multiple taunting spots in a match which really ruined the flow of the bad matches. Not saying it's all him, but if more than half your few and far between singles matches have been crap the last 12 months and your flaws are only hidden in tag matches, either get in tag matches, or stop wrestling and become a super effective manager. Not that it's Bray's choice, but the creative people should fix that. It's making him look much worse in kayfabe & in actual matches. The Inferno match was awful, but I think that was more due to the gimmick than anything else, since I can't recall ever seeing a good Inferno match - even Taker/Kane was terrible save for some cool visuals. For all my problems with the feud, I still thought the Cena LMS match was a fun spotfest. The Extreme Rules match was, again, due to the booking being a complete mess. And the Jericho match was sloppy and a bit dull but was by no means bad, just very average. That really only leaves the Reigns match was a legitimately bad performance, which I'll grant you. But to act like Wyatt is on the level of Ryback or something where he simply cannot work a decent singles match is a complete exaggeration. I actually think Ryback with the right pacing is a solid power wrestler, in the tag divisions he plays crowds well to chant for him too. I feel there is a link between both of them in that with longer matches they often appear sloppy/weird/full of unnecessary rest or taunting spots. Both Bray (as proven by NXT) and Ryback (as proven by squashes and less than 10 minute matches with non-squash people) work better in shorter matches. Sort of the opposite of John Cena, who works MUCH better in longer matches than he does in shorter ones as he doesn't cram all his signature spots into shorter time and attempts to sell. I mean, from watching Wyatt on NXT he's better than his matches on the main shows have shown, they need to work him into shorter matches. He's not a bad wrestler, but in comparison to most guys on the main shows he's one of the worst on the roster if we're judging him solely on his work over the last year.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2014 11:28:24 GMT -5
I actually think Ryback with the right pacing is a solid power wrestler, in the tag divisions he plays crowds well to chant for him too. I feel there is a link between both of them though, in that with longer matches they often appear sloppy/weird/full of unnecessary rest or taunting spots. Both Bray (as proven by NXt) and Ryback (as proven by squashes and less than 10 minute matches with non-squash people) work better in shorter matches. Sort of the opposite of John Cena, who works MUCH better in longer matches than he does in shorter ones as he doesn't cram all his signature spots into shorter time and attempts to sell. I mean, from watching Wyatt on NXT he's better than his matches on the main shows have shown, they need to work him into shorter matches. He's not a horrendous wrestler, but in comparison to most guys on the main shows he's one of the worst. We're just gonna' have to agree to disagree on him being worse than most of the roster. Scrolling through the roster now, I can say with the utmost confidence he's better than: Adam Rose, Big Show, Bo Dallas, Damien Sandow, Darren Young, David Otunga, Erick Rowan, Great Khali, Kane, Mark Henry, Miz, the Matadores, R-Truth, Rusev, Ryback, Titus O'Neil, and Zack Ryder. But I do agree that he's better served by shorter matches, though I think that also holds true for a lot of people.
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Post by Indiana Miz on Jul 28, 2014 11:28:29 GMT -5
They should've saved the feud with Cena for later. There's nowhere to go but down once you've faced the top dog a year into your main roster run.
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Post by Bang Bang Bart on Jul 28, 2014 11:53:00 GMT -5
I still love them, but they've been completely ineffectual in every feud they've ever been in. Not one person or team they've battled has come out any worse for wear. Even the one guy they did beat (Bryan) just ended up becoming stronger than ever after he lost to Bray
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Post by joeiscool on Jul 28, 2014 12:20:31 GMT -5
I really, really don't get where this "Wyatt sucks as a wrestler" notion came from, because it's frankly not true. He's been an integral part of three or four of the best PPV matches this year, one of which is almost certainly a lock for WWE's Match of the Year. His only really poor outings this year have been the Extreme Rules cage match, which was 100% the fault of the godawful booking, and the Jericho match at Battleground, which was from a show where pretty much everyone was off their game. Outside of tag matches where he serves as a really good surprisingly agile power brawler, he's had: A HORRENDOUS inferno match with Kane A crowd silencingly poor singles match with Reigns on Raw Two bad Cena matches after their decent 'Mania match A sloppy/dull/badly paced/built match with Jericho. The last man standing match was excellent... One of the top matches of the year...
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2014 12:22:02 GMT -5
Outside of tag matches where he serves as a really good surprisingly agile power brawler, he's had: A HORRENDOUS inferno match with Kane A crowd silencingly poor singles match with Reigns on Raw Two bad Cena matches after their decent 'Mania match A sloppy/dull/badly paced/built match with Jericho. The last man standing match was excellent... One of the top matches of the year... Ah, I thought people'd know that was just a list of my opinions, but just for clarity I've not taken a poll to prove that the majority think they're naff, solely my personal opinions are held in all my posts unless stated otherwise.
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Ben Wyatt
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I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Jul 28, 2014 12:24:04 GMT -5
Harper and Rowan should have won the belts, but that said, they're in a fine spot. They're very capable henchmen who put on great matches.
Thet can fix Bray., they just have to let him loose on people. Have him beat Jericho at Summerslam and during what I assume will be a rubber match, have him *destroy* Jericho. His next feud, he needs to really go over the line and take out whoever it is.
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Post by joeiscool on Jul 28, 2014 12:24:19 GMT -5
The last man standing match was excellent... One of the top matches of the year... Ah, I thought people'd know that was just a list of my opinions, but just for clarity I've not taken a poll to prove that the majority think they're naff, solely my personal opinions are held in all my posts unless stated otherwise. well this is my opinion of your opinion,you're wrong. Welcome to the internet.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2014 12:28:23 GMT -5
Ah, I thought people'd know that was just a list of my opinions, but just for clarity I've not taken a poll to prove that the majority think they're naff, solely my personal opinions are held in all my posts unless stated otherwise. well this is my opinion of your opinion,you're wrong. Welcome to the internet. Erm, I wasn't being snipey there, mate, I was just letting you know that I wasn't taking any formal step on it. The follow up in my posts give my logic so everyone can understand where I'm coming from.
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