Jiren
Patti Mayonnaise
Hearts Bayformers
Posts: 35,163
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Post by Jiren on Oct 2, 2014 22:43:43 GMT -5
I'd maybe have Cena/Rollins for the MITB briefcase on RAW and Ambrose costs him the match as he doesn't care about the case but as it's Seth's pride & joy it's another chance to screw with him, In Ambrose's mind at this point in time Revenge > Title.
Have Seth so pissed at Ambrose that he asks HHH for a match at HIAC with Ambrose IN the HIAC or have HHH so annoyed he makes the match to end the Bullcrap once and for all.
Have Cena use the MITB to cash in on Lesnar for Cena/Lesnar III @survivor Series (Have Cena sit out HIAC or have a Promo to keep him on the show)
At Survivor Series have lesnar win, At Rumble have the final four be Ambrose/Rollins/Bryan*/Reigns* and have either Ambrose/Bryan/Reigns win and face Lesnar at Mania
*If Fit
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Post by benstudd on Oct 2, 2014 22:46:58 GMT -5
It would have been simpler had the Authority given Cena a match against Rollins for the main event at RAW right off the bat, announce it right away. So that you kill the problem right away so that Cena doesn't look selfish for going after Ambrose's enemy and after the match, this little problem they have will be over and Seth can continue his feud with Ambrose afterwards. From an Authority standpoint, they book Cena-Rollins to fix the problem that was created at Night of Champions. And they can mastermind an interference by Orton and Kane on Cena during that match. Kane and Orton could even have had the same backstage promo that they had on RAW "we're tired of having to estinguish the fires that Seth creates". If Cena and Rollins were booked in a match on RAW, either Cena would lose or there would be shenanigans that would spur him to continue the chase, or he'd beat Rollins and people would complain that he "got Dean's revenge for him" the same way they did with Reigns. With the shenanigans you could always transfer Cena's hostility toward Rollins to another guy whether it's Kane or Orton(even if Orton and Cena met a gazillion of times). My solution though? Cena vs Rollins. There's interferences. Kane, Orton, Ambrose join in. And then the Authority use the opportunity to introduce a new member to their group, he does a number on Cena. Off Cena goes to his own feud.
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Post by benstudd on Oct 2, 2014 22:56:09 GMT -5
So what's the solution? Since one of those things has to happen eventually. At Hell in a Cell, I would do Ambrose/Rollins first in a Cell match (since this feud should be blown off in that type of match). The Authroity could deny Cena his revenge by saying he'd have to wait his turn. Cena would have to earn his shot at Rollins by defeating Kane, Orton or some other handpicked Authority opponent (they could arbitrarily throw this match in the Cell for the LOLZ if they wanted to). Cena could defeat the chosen heel and "cash in" to face Seth at Survivor Series. Well I like it but I was mainly talking about RAW and the whole "how could Cena could have been booked differently" on that show. Edit- at HITC, if Ambrose meets Rollins and Cena faces guys to meet Rollins, Cena would overshadow Ambrose, I think. So the only way it would work would be for the case that Rollins owns to get held up and that Ambrose win it.
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Post by Pooh Carlson on Oct 2, 2014 23:09:23 GMT -5
Cena's entire logic makes no sense. I In Cena's world, some people doubting him after he lost a one-sided (by his own admission) but ultimately a fair contest to Lesnar is just as serious as attempted murder. He's like the John Locke of WWE. Don't tell him what he can't do. You have no idea how bad I want Triple H to tell Cena he can't do something and have Cena yell back, "DON'T TELL ME WHAT I CAN'T DO!" now.
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Oct 3, 2014 1:26:56 GMT -5
The problem with the defense that he should be mad at Rollins is that John Cena the fictional character's feelings do not render a story immune to criticism. Writers had to give him those feelings. Writers had to decide that Seth should go into the match and start hitting Cena before the match was over even though he could have attacked the winner with a chair for like twenty minutes straight and cashed in with a near-guaranteed shot at winning. Writers put the title on a guy who they don't want to pay next month, and so the focal point of the show John Cena needs a non-title feud. Writers decided that the feud he should have is just inserting himself into the blood feud between two rising stars. Writers settled him into the exact same goddamn pattern no matter how tired it is, no matter how desperate people are for literally anything else. (Writers means "Vince)
John Cena is a puppet on strings being tugged on by writers. His feelings are not defense for bad writing. They could have maybe not written themselves into the corner. Had someone else interfere. Let him wander off into a different direction for one reason or another and feud with someone else. But don't write him into other peoples' storylines to hijack them. Don't take the only storyline I give a shit about right now and let Cena get into the middle of it to keep Ambrose from having what ought to be a huge moment in winning his very first singles feud. This shouldn't be difficult to understand. Beyond his anger being a load of shit, it's not justification for indefensible writing.
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Post by Hobby Drifter on Oct 3, 2014 2:49:42 GMT -5
Think of it like a comic book. Readers weren't angry at Spider-Man for what he did in One More Day, they were angry at the *writer*.
...and actually, that's not even true. The writer wanted his name taken off of the story because the editor-in-chief mangled it before the book went to print.
Huh. So it's EXACTLY like what happened.
Vince and Joe Q should do a project together...far away from wrestling and comics...
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Post by BRAINFADE on Oct 3, 2014 7:31:41 GMT -5
I have no idea who or what mrjl is or was. Was he someone who disagreed wtih your point of view? Now let's look at FACTS: I haven't tried to make it "equal" to Ambrose's "plight.:" I have clearly stated more than once that it doesn't have to be equal. NOBODY on earth thinks that way -- you wrong me, I don't care who else you wronged, that's their problem -- if I can make you, you're going to deal with me. That's where Cena is coming from. He's not comparing his situation to Ambrose's and he shouldn't. I can probably name a dozen, maybe even dozens, of feuds where one guy tried to "kill" the other guy and it didn't mean he always had first dibs. Over the course of quite a few unrelated threads you've gone off on this "he tried to murder Ambrose" thing as if (a) he tried to murder Ambrose, like literally kill him (in which case why did he not check his pulse and keep going until the guy was dead, or bring a gun, etc.) and (b) as if that matters. The guy shook it off with "that was cool," so Ambrose clearly, as I have shown you, is no more hot to get his hands on Rollins than he ever was before. That angle didn't start with Ambrose's head going through cinderblocks, it started long before, and Ambrose has done nothing to say, "OK, everything has changed now, I was just trying to stop you from cashing in your briefcase but you tried to kill me now and this is a blood feud that ends when one of us is DEAD." You deciding to impose more meaning on it is something in your interpretation, not in what has been presented to the viewers. As someone else brought up, why should Cena care what Ambrose thinks or what his "claim" on Rollins is? SInce when are these two best buds? Ambrose is out for himself, pretty clearly, and so is Cena. That sounds reasonable to me. mrjl was a poster that was so annoying in his inability to accept when he was wrong that he eventually had to be banned for it.As for your take -- that's your take. You keep using "if I was in this situation" etc. etc. etc. as if that somehow changes the logical imbalance in each character's plight. Your personal view in that case is irrelevant. What you would do means nothing to anyone but you. You are constructing your own narrative and going by your own morals in deciding whether something works or not. I'm not adding my own bias at all. (Believe me; you'd know. My personal bias is that the Cena character is a spoiled, protected idiot who actually deserved to be destroyed by Brock for his arrogance and bravado; and since he couldn't put Brock away in the rematch, he's constructed an excuse to target Seth to make up for his own failures and shortcomings.). But all of that is just stupid head-canon of mine. It means nothing. When I'm speaking of Cena and Dean, I'm trying to just judge the story on how its being literally presented, and their individual issues. I'm going on the fact that one is rife with betrayal and a 1st degree crime attempt, and the other was simply outside interference in a match said guy hasn't even been told was his last chance. I don't care how Cena sees it. Because as its presented Cena is selfish and hypocritical. He's a character who bilks children out of money by peddling a mass-marketed mantra; and he does not even live up to that last credo on his shirt because he figures his particular insignificant revenge attempt is more justified. And that is absolutely absurd. Hold it right there. mrjl was banned?? How and when did this happen? I'm actually a little disappointed, his refusal to accept logic and common sense was the stuff of legend, as was your absolute burials of him.
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ededdneddy
Hank Scorpio
ededdandembed
Posts: 5,697
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Post by ededdneddy on Oct 3, 2014 8:09:42 GMT -5
What's stopping Cena, in kayfabe, from getting the "redemption" against Brock again, though? Disregarding the reality that Brock just isn't working right now and the entire PPV finish was set up to protect Cena from doing two jobs in a row? What's stopping Cena from pursuing another title shot? Has he even mentioned interest in it? Has there been one mention that Cena won't ever get a chance at Brock or the belt again? Rollins is a dick, but he's not the endgame. Had Rollins brutally assaulted him during said match in an attempt to try and kill him like he did Ambrose, Cena absolutely would be justified in wanting Seth first, because his grievance would be at least equal. But as it stood, it absolutely was not. Cena'a quest for revenge no matter how much you want to keep spinning it is not equal to Ambrose's. And Dean being mentally unbalanced and not viewing an attempted homicide rationally does not in any way discount the fact that it was still an attempted homicide. And therefore, in the face of reason, it is absolutely a much more important and prevalent issue than Cena's anger towards a title shot he'll get a thousand more times anyway. I don't understand why you keep making excuses and beating a dead horse here. Cena has a right to be angry. True. But in the face of everything that we the audience have been shown, his slight is not as significant as Dean's. And therefore, John should refocus on Brock (in kayfabe) and maybe just make sure justice is done with Seth by helping Dean finally get him. Because as it is, Cena's coming across horribly selfishly by blocking the dude who's grievance renders his own insignificant in dramatic comparison. The Authority is what's stopping him. They don't want him to be champion. That's why Lesnar's here to begin with. However, Trips and Steph begrudgingly admit that Cena is their "moneymaker" (same reason Vince never simply fired Austin) so they'd rather not have Brock pound his face into jam and render it useless to them. And Cena needs to get away from Brock for a bit. Protecting Cena from doing two jobs in a row may seem ridiculous, but they're not just protecting Cena. They're protecting the entire full time roster. If Brock were to crush Cena again, for the second/third time at consecutive PPVs, then it sends the message that the entire roster is essentially worthless. I thought they don't want Cena to be champion because Cena didn't want to be a "Corporate Champion" and do things their way. In all fairness, its Cenas fault that these things are happening
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Post by Just call me D.j.m. on Oct 3, 2014 10:01:53 GMT -5
The whole Authority vs. Cena thing breaks reality.
John Cena is the most corporate Corporate Champion of all time. Regardless of how many times a heel as worn a suit and come out with the heel authority figure over the years (and it's a lot because they're not very good at their jobs) John Cena has done more for the WWE Brand than anyone since Hogan.
The question of why the Authority doesn't like Cena can't be answered. And don't give me the "He made fun of Stephanie that one time." bit, because there isn't a single person that watches this that wouldn't tell you John Cena, in WWE's eyes, is not just best for business but the only business they have.
In short...all of this is nonsense.
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mizerable
Fry's dog Seymour
You're the lowest on the totem pole here, Alva. The lowest.
Posts: 23,475
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Post by mizerable on Oct 3, 2014 10:19:08 GMT -5
Hold it right there. mrjl was banned?? How and when did this happen? I'm actually a little disappointed, his refusal to accept logic and common sense was the stuff of legend, as was your absolute burials of him. Agreed. He was so delusional that it was entertaining when about a dozen or so people would try to explain the fallacies of his comments, and he never ever ever once admitted to being wrong or misspeaking. I suppose it was for the best since sooner or later someone else could get banned for essentially calling him out and having it lead to a shouting match where that person gets banned instead. Oh well, there's still a few non-apologists who will not in any way shape or form see something from someone else' point of view.
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Post by BRAINFADE on Oct 3, 2014 11:27:59 GMT -5
Hold it right there. mrjl was banned?? How and when did this happen? I'm actually a little disappointed, his refusal to accept logic and common sense was the stuff of legend, as was your absolute burials of him. Agreed. He was so delusional that it was entertaining when about a dozen or so people would try to explain the fallacies of his comments, and he never ever ever once admitted to being wrong or misspeaking. I suppose it was for the best since sooner or later someone else could get banned for essentially calling him out and having it lead to a shouting match where that person gets banned instead. Oh well, there's still a few non-apologists who will not in any way shape or form see something from someone else' point of view. Was there any specific incident that got him the boot?
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Oct 3, 2014 11:37:12 GMT -5
*cough*
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Post by BRAINFADE on Oct 3, 2014 11:38:21 GMT -5
Apologies.
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Post by The Foreigner™ in Playoff Mode on Oct 3, 2014 23:27:35 GMT -5
The more I think about the Cena/Rollins/Ambrose logjam, the more I'm convinced that WWE planned to turn Ambrose heel at Night of Champions before the injury. That would have set up Reigns/Ambrose and Cena/Rollins in the Cell.
As frustrating as the storyline is now, at least it could be worse... right?
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Jiren
Patti Mayonnaise
Hearts Bayformers
Posts: 35,163
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Post by Jiren on Oct 4, 2014 4:30:35 GMT -5
The more I think about the Cena/Rollins/Ambrose logjam, the more I'm convinced that WWE planned to turn Ambrose heel at Night of Champions before the injury. That would have set up Reigns/Ambrose and Cena/Rollins in the Cell. As frustrating as the storyline is now, at least it could be worse... right? Don't do that WWE reads this board and they'll see that as a challenge and do something completely stupid like stick Big Show in there.
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khali
Dennis Stamp
Posts: 4,578
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Post by khali on Oct 4, 2014 16:09:06 GMT -5
I am so sick of these WWE storylines that occur because they book themselves into a corner and can't get out of it. They do this all the time. This whole thing came about because they they couldn't come up with a finish for Lesnar/Cena rematch, so they have to throw in Rollins interfering. So now that they did that, they're stuck with Cena being shoehorned into a different storyline, and is trying to be more sympathetic than a lovable face who has a bigger gripe than he does. And because of that, they've booked themselves into another corner, if the HIAC proposed card is true. Is Ambrose going to beat Cena in order to get to Rollins? He better, because if he doesn't the audience will probably crap all over it when it's Cena facing Rollins instead. And if he does beat Cena, will it be clean or just some other stupid cheap finish because they can't book their way out of it again?
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