Crimson
Hank Scorpio
Thank you DWade
Posts: 6,511
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Post by Crimson on Oct 16, 2014 15:06:32 GMT -5
It's not Cena's fault that the Wyatt's cooled off because all throughout the feud, Bray had the crowd eating out of his hands. After their third match, creative just stopped pushing the guy. Samething with Ryback he has all these main even matches and even have two very competitive matches with Cena and then he's no longer in any main events. It gives this illusion that Cena buries everyone even though Cena never personally did. One thing I will say is the whole "Cena, give into the hate" storyline needs to not happen again. The did it with Kane, did it again with the Wyatts, and tried to do it a third time with the Lesnar/Cena rematch last month. Doing that storyline makes about as much sense as trying to base every CM Punk feud on his opponents trying to get him to drink alcohol. That's not his job. It's up to Creative to book these guys properly So you think if creative came forward with an idea to book him as a cowardly heel who can only win by cheating he would just go along with it? If he didn't have that Make-Wish stuff tied to his ankle, I'm actually willing to bet that he would.
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Post by Mid-Carder on Oct 16, 2014 15:08:25 GMT -5
That's not his job. It's up to Creative to book these guys properly So you think if creative came forward with an idea to book him as a cowardly heel who can only win by cheating he would just go along with it? No, he'd change it for his benefit, as would anybody who wants success. It's still not his job to look out for anybody else.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Oct 16, 2014 15:18:08 GMT -5
At best you could say it might've been inevitable; but that feud put it into overdrive.
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Post by KobashiChop on Oct 16, 2014 15:18:30 GMT -5
It's like Sheamus after 18 Secondsgate. People can't take their frustrations out on the idiots writing and/or f***ing around with the narrative, so they do the next best thing and blame the talent, even if they're just following orders. The sad truth about the 18 Seconds affair is that the fan revolt hurt Sheamus a lot due to him never really earning the belt as a babyface . The Extreme Rules match saved him a little but they really damaged him by gifting it to him.
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Post by Hit Girl on Oct 16, 2014 15:36:54 GMT -5
I blame Vince McMahon. He's booking their burials.
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Post by 1 Free Moon-Down with Burger on Oct 16, 2014 15:48:28 GMT -5
I'd say the roll down the hill began the second "Whole World In His Hands" became a thing.
All of a sudden he wasn't as much a violent cryptic cult leader as he was 'The guy that sings the song that the crowd sings with'. Every promo after Mania was just blah blah blah THE SONG. Hey Cena we're gonna fight but....THE SONG! It's the new YES! It's the new Fandango-ing!
Then he lost clean as a sheet to Jericho in a feud and match that didn't have much heat or reason. That's when the bucket of water was dumped on the fire for me.
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Post by xCompackx on Oct 16, 2014 16:00:45 GMT -5
It's not Cena's fault that the Wyatt's cooled off because all throughout the feud, Bray had the crowd eating out of his hands. After their third match, creative just stopped pushing the guy. Samething with Ryback he has all these main even matches and even have two very competitive matches with Cena and then he's no longer in any main events. It gives this illusion that Cena buries everyone even though Cena never personally did. One thing I will say is the whole "Cena, give into the hate" storyline needs to not happen again. The did it with Kane, did it again with the Wyatts, and tried to do it a third time with the Lesnar/Cena rematch last month. Doing that storyline makes about as much sense as trying to base every CM Punk feud on his opponents trying to get him to drink alcohol. So you think if creative came forward with an idea to book him as a cowardly heel who can only win by cheating he would just go along with it? If he didn't have that Make-Wish stuff tied to his ankle, I'm actually willing to bet that he would. Cena said himself that he does what they tell him to so he probably would.
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Post by xxshoyuweeniexx on Oct 16, 2014 16:09:40 GMT -5
While Cena doesn't write/book the shows, he does have enough juice to talk to them when they are damaging another wrestler. He knows well enough when the crowd is giving major babyface reactions to a cold cult leader that they shouldn't be writing Bray's "comeuppance". So while Cena shouldn't shoulder the blame, he is still has some responsibility for Bray's depush/need for repackaging. The same way he has responsibility for Wade Barrett, Dolph Ziggler & Damien Sandow. I don't really think he cares to be honest. He's gonna make his money, sleep on Nikki Bella's huge rack at night, and f*** everyone else. At best, I'm just glad he's not a coked up asshole or a dude who gets his buddies whatever program they wanted just because he could like HBK and Hogan did.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2014 16:18:31 GMT -5
The fact Cena doesn't put his foot down and stop them from just feeding an entire generation of wrestlers to him, and writes his own promos wherein he no-sells Wyatt's mindgames by making Margaritaville jokes at him, means there's got to be some blame on him. He clearly didn't really learn his lesson after the Nexus Summerslam match. Yeah, I'm not convinced at all that Cena's an idiot simply following orders like he tried to paint himself as on Austin's podcast. Guys with low wrestling IQs don't get to and stay at his level. I think he knows exactly what he's doing and furthering the divide between him and the rest of the roster is in his best interest.
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Post by Mondai Rogue on Oct 16, 2014 16:19:08 GMT -5
I blame Cena for 9/11, the 2008 credit crunch, and Freddos now being 25p.You seen this s**t, mate? Where was this and where are we meeting with pitchforks to right this wrong?
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Post by g1megatronfan on Oct 16, 2014 16:31:03 GMT -5
I think the Wyatt's are stupid so I'm glad it happened. Seriously...do you really want Wyatt as champion? Do you think he has the longevity to make it work? Do you really think he could help convince people to subscribing to the network for only $9.99?
I think he would get old real fast. As soon as the initial anyone but Cena or Orton buzz wore off...Wyatt would really plummet. In the end I don't blame Cena or WWE creative but am glad it happened.
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Post by xCompackx on Oct 16, 2014 16:34:55 GMT -5
For the record, I actually think Big Show did more damage to the Wyatts credibility than Cena did since they retconned that jobbing Bray did to Cena but the Wyatts were treated like shit when feuding with Big Show and Mark Henry.
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Post by molson5 on Oct 16, 2014 16:41:43 GMT -5
If as a heel, you can't survive the company's top babyface beating you up, there's probably not a lot of long-term hope.
But I don't think the Cena stuff hurt them at all. The promos got repetitive and boring and the live audience seemed to tune them out (as did I).
And the booking was not what I expected when they came up (I don't watch NXT). I thought they'd be storyline-driven weirdos. Instead they've been tag team work horses. Which is fine at some level, they've had great matches. Being competent workers won't really help you stand out though, almost everybody at that company is competent and can have good matches.
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4real
Wade Wilson
Posts: 27,652
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Post by 4real on Oct 16, 2014 16:47:35 GMT -5
You seen this s**t, mate? Where was this and where are we meeting with pitchforks to right this wrong? Has to be a photoshop surely, nobody could be that evil.
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Post by Martin: #TeamBella Treasurer on Oct 16, 2014 17:59:41 GMT -5
You seen this s**t, mate? Where was this and where are we meeting with pitchforks to right this wrong? Where was this and where are we meeting with pitchforks to right this wrong? Has to be a photoshop surely, nobody could be that evil. I really didn't wanna hijack the thread, lol but... Chomps too! Looks like a WHSmith or a convenience shop chain. They have 'conveniently' ordered the Freddos without the price on the individual wrappers.
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Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
advocates duck on rodent violence
Fed. Up.
Posts: 37,742
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Oct 16, 2014 18:19:57 GMT -5
While Cena doesn't write/book the shows, he does have enough juice to talk to them when they are damaging another wrestler. That's not his job. It's up to Creative to book these guys properly That excuse would work more if it weren't for the fact that other top guys have been known to go out of their way to put people over, without relying on the writers to come up with it. Rock insisted on putting Hurricane over. Jericho argues to put everyone over. Undertaker allegedly used to lobby to put guys over all the time during his SmackDown run. Who has Cena ever reportedly wanted to put over?
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Post by 1 Free Moon-Down with Burger on Oct 16, 2014 19:12:56 GMT -5
That's not his job. It's up to Creative to book these guys properly That excuse would work more if it weren't for the fact that other top guys have been known to go out of their way to put people over, without relying on the writers to come up with it. Rock insisted on putting Hurricane over. Jericho argues to put everyone over. Undertaker allegedly used to lobby to put guys over all the time during his SmackDown run. Who has Cena ever reportedly wanted to put over? Punk. Atleast that was the story going around right before the angle began.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2014 19:23:18 GMT -5
I always say this, Cena has a say in his angles. A big one. He might not be the one to say "I wanna make Wyatt look like shit", but it keeps happening in his feuds. We have the Nexus Summerslam situation, which I take as truth because Edge and Jericho simply wouldn't throw specific shade out there unless it's true. There's a history of on-the-cusp talents feuding with Cena and coming-out-worse for wear.
The talent have a certain idea of their character and what they want it be. A lot of wreslters are said to work with the writers, if they see something in a promo they don't like they'll go to the writers and try and get something better going. With Cena, he has the power to enforce it.
My guess is this: he's into protecting his character, because he realizes where his bread is buttered. His fans are fans of him because he 1. Never Gives Up 2. Is the nicest, greatest, most humblest son of a gun ever 3. Can come back from anything unscathed 4. He's a WINNER. Basically they like him because he's a super hero, and he's steering his character towards that and catering it to them. So he goes into these feuds, and he's thinking "well John Cena wouldn't let some backwoods hillbilly cult leader strip him of his ideals. he might shake him, but he'll never give up, and he'll overcome it, and by golly he will win!" And that's how the feud gets written.
Cena is smart, calculating, opinionated guy. He hides it well.
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Post by Citizen Snips Has Left on Oct 16, 2014 19:37:59 GMT -5
I blame whoever took Booker T off commentary. Bray never got to make the Fave Five, so the fans don't see him as dat superhero.
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Post by Adam Black on Oct 16, 2014 22:23:47 GMT -5
I remember when John Cena was cutting that awesome promo at the WWE Championship Ascension he went on and on about putting people over and when he talked about puting CM Punk over CM Punk had this "dude, f*** you" face .
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