ronin705
Dennis Stamp
All Might
Posts: 4,277
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Post by ronin705 on Jul 11, 2017 13:50:13 GMT -5
Add me to the list of people who loved it. Was a huge Spiderman fan as a kid (mostly from the cartoon) and while I love Sam Raimi, Toby Maguire just never did it for me as Spidey. The Spidey I grew up with was witty, sarcastic, and hilarious. Toby Maguire is not (though I will admit he is quite funny in Spoils of Babylon). Tom Holland nailed it. I hope he gets three or four films to really grow into the role, because an adult man Tom Holland would be awesome (he's 20 now, so think 26-27). This kid just has it and is going to go far, not just in the Marvel universe but Hollywood in general. But as good as Holland was, Keaton stole the show. Not a huge surprise since he's obviously one of the greatest actors on the planet. But it felt so refreshing to have a Marvel villain that actually had some depth. Maybe I'm in the minority but I've always felt the villains have been a weak spot for Marvel. I totally bought Vulture's motivation hook, line, and sinker. And of course it helps that he wasn't just inherently evil (or evil at all, it could be argued). Just a blue collar guy trying to do right by his family. I know it's a longshot and someone already mentioned it earlier, but Vincent D'Onofrio as Kingpin would be an awesome addition to these films. He was always one of my favorite Spidey villains from the cartoon and I think they're missing a huge opportunity by not having him cross over into the films. I'd actually rather see Kingpin make it into the cinematic universe over Daredevil (though I believe Daredevil is rumored for Avengers?). Back back to Homecoming. Overall was not a perfect movie (if I had to go back and analyze, I'd say the structure probably misses the mark in some places). But character and dialogue really hit the mark. Sometimes that's all you need. I will also say the set pieces (particularly the Washington Monument and the ferry) didn't necessarily blow my mind, and it will probably be impossible to ever top the Spidey/Doc Ock train sequence from Spiderman 2. But ultimately this was a great movie experience for me. 7.5/10 I loved Keaton's ascendance into villainy as well. He was still wrestling with it but by the time he manslaughtered Montana, he was full fledge "my way or the highway" villain. I'd like to bring up a point about Flash that Jeremy Jahns made about because I think it's a good one and something I like about this incarnation: "Flash Thompson was always the jock bully. That was the high school cliche I always knew. Jock Bullies. Nerds. The jocks pick on the nerds. Now I've been out of high school for a while so maybe it's changed but I like the fact that Flash Thompson, the bully, is actually apart of Peter Parker's social group. You can't run from someone like that. He's a dick who's apart of your social circle." Basically, he's Reggie to Peter's Archie
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clifford
King Koopa
Shingo Takagi stan
Posts: 10,683
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Post by clifford on Jul 11, 2017 14:39:32 GMT -5
This f***ing forum. The hot debate about this movie is Flash's ethnicity...
Jesus Christ. I remember the thread when it was announced that the MCU Spiderman was going to be Peter Parker again and not Miles Morales... and the absolute outrage it caused.
I will never understand how race/gender needs to play any role in a comic book movie.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2017 16:44:43 GMT -5
Loved it. Probably my 2nd or 3rd favorite Spiderman film. Spiderman 2 is the best and this or the first one is my favorite. I also love how fresh this Spiderman felt compared to the other films. I couldn't get into The Amazing Spiderman films because they felt like poor adaptations of Raimi films except with a slicker ultimate look fresh coat of paint and "Darker & Grittier". Like did we really need to see Peter Parker's origin story again and why did you cast an actor who looks even older than Tobey Maguire to be in highschool again without doing much about it? This did a wonderful job of Universe building that actually felt more separate and independent from the rest of the MCU. Hell I actually loved how much this film strayed away from The Raimi and The Amazing Series that when it did one overused trope {Spoiler}{Spoiler}The villain being connected to Peter Parker's personal life. It was an actual extremely clever and welcoming twist. If you told me the villain was going to be somehow part of Peter's life in pre production I would of rolled my eyes and say "again?"
But the way they build upon it was just so clever and the car scene was probably the most tense scene in the MCU yet.
Hell the twist even added another layer in Vulture's character that you're not sure in the sequel if he's going to protect Peter or he wants to kill him all for himself.
Just a great movie and Keaton's Vulture is one of the all time great Comic Book Movie Villains and holy shit you felt so bad for Liz at the end. Just poor poor poor girl. Can't think of a character who got more of a Raw Deal in the MCU than her.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2017 17:03:34 GMT -5
This f***ing forum. The hot debate about this movie is Flash's ethnicity... Jesus Christ. I remember the thread when it was announced that the MCU Spiderman was going to be Peter Parker again and not Miles Morales... and the absolute outrage it caused. I will never understand how race/gender needs to play any role in a comic book movie. Yeah, race and gender shouldn't matter. Will Smith should have played Aunt May.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2017 17:09:37 GMT -5
It's not just here, but...I'm seeing a lot of people just try to state that Flash should have been less nerdy and people are taking that as "he should have been white."
I don't see how the first statement equals the second.
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Jul 11, 2017 17:15:13 GMT -5
This f***ing forum. The hot debate about this movie is Flash's ethnicity... Jesus Christ. I remember the thread when it was announced that the MCU Spiderman was going to be Peter Parker again and not Miles Morales... and the absolute outrage it caused. I will never understand how race/gender needs to play any role in a comic book movie. I think that so long as Hollywood continues to lag behind in fairly casting women, actors of color and other marginalized groups, people are going to continue to speak out about it, and it's going to play a role in film for quite some time.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2017 17:21:39 GMT -5
This f***ing forum. The hot debate about this movie is Flash's ethnicity... Jesus Christ. I remember the thread when it was announced that the MCU Spiderman was going to be Peter Parker again and not Miles Morales... and the absolute outrage it caused. I will never understand how race/gender needs to play any role in a comic book movie. Yeah, Peter Parker should have been a black transgendered girl that speaks Mandarin as a primary language since who gives a shit about respecting source material anyway. Peter Parkers characteristics is a poor intelligent awkward nerdy kid who looks like the least likely person to be a superhero. Which is why Tom Holland is perfect. There's really nothing in his characteristics or origins that is about ethnicity. I would of rather had Donald Glover casted as Peter Parker in The Amazing Series because he fits the physical characteristics more of being short, not GQ model pretty, and proved he can play a hilarious dork as Troy in Community while Donald Glover comes across as a very intelligent multi talented individual. It's not like Steve Rogers who has to be the Blonde Haired Blue Eyed Hero since his look was used as propaganda against The Nazis or Bruce Wayne coming from one of America's Wealthiest and Historic Dynasty Families or Logan being over 200 years old who fought in all of America's Wars but always being a hidden shadowy figure. Plus I keep saying in 100 years from now, the characteristic origins of characters may change due to time sensitivity including skin colours where its believable. Kind of like how The Punisher went from Nam veteran to Gulf War to Iraq War veteran. Stan Lee considered making Tony Stark Mexican but went against it because he thought the readers wouldn't find a Second Generation Mexican Billionaire to believable. Now if you introduce a second generation billionaire character, he could be of any ethnicity and it's believable.
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Fade
Patti Mayonnaise
Posts: 38,294
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Post by Fade on Jul 11, 2017 17:25:26 GMT -5
It's not just here, but...I'm seeing a lot of people just try to state that Flash should have been less nerdy and people are taking that as "he should have been white." I don't see how the first statement equals the second. I don't see anyone saying that. The actor himself, comes off as a nerdy kinda guy. Short in stature, so a mirror of Peter essentially. Flash has always represented the opposite. If Tony Revolori was tall, athletic, and a natural charismatic cocky guy, I would totally understand why they'd cast him. But he's not, so they went on a totally different direction. All the more power to them, and lots seem to love it, but I think it's stupid and might as well have made him a new, different character. Also, the argument that "well he's in his social circle, unlike the old Flash"...That's not entirely accurate. Homecoming takes a lot of its cues from Ultimate Spider-Man. Where Flash looks the same, but is far more entwined in Peters social circle. In fact, the same clique. It's very possible for cool/uncool kids to have similar friends. This isn't new. Bendis even wrote Ultimate Flash as a guy with a lot of depth, playing out "his role" while showing signs of reluctance and even admiring Peter and Spider-Man at times. I have no idea what depth Homecomings Flash showed other than being really annoying.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Jul 11, 2017 18:27:44 GMT -5
Donald Glover's just too old right now to play the kind of Spider-man they're running with in story. Ditto for him playing Miles who's even younger.
Now if he was playing adult Peter? Sure.
Flash was pretty much always in Peter's social circle even in the Sixties books. Cuz Peter didn't really have any friends till college outside of briefly dating Betty Brant.
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Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on Jul 11, 2017 19:04:32 GMT -5
I had a thought about something. (Scary, I know) {Spoiler}{Spoiler}Tony sold Stark Tower. What are the odds the buyer was Oscorp? I half expected that to be one of the credits scenes. I was pretty disappointed, actually. though the Captain America troll job at the end made up for it.
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the2ndevil
Grimlock
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Where Is Your Santa, Now?
Posts: 13,629
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Post by the2ndevil on Jul 11, 2017 19:09:50 GMT -5
I had a thought about something. (Scary, I know) {Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler}Tony sold Stark Tower. What are the odds the buyer was Oscorp? I half expected that to be one of the credits scenes. I was pretty disappointed, actually. though the Captain America troll job at the end made up for it. {Spoiler}When they showed Toomes in jail, I thought he was going to run into Fisk.
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Post by Stu on Jul 11, 2017 19:20:38 GMT -5
No hate for Zero from Grand Budapest Hotel. I will say he does stand out compared to the other characters who are not the usual Peter Parker supporting cast, it's Ned instead of Harry and Liz instead of Gwen or Mary Jane. {Spoiler}{Spoiler}Then MJ is Michelle. What's that about? I don't know. No hate for Zero from Grand Budapest Hotel. I will say he does stand out compared to the other characters who are not the usual Peter Parker supporting cast, it's Ned instead of Harry and Liz instead of Gwen or Mary Jane. {Spoiler}{Spoiler}Then MJ is Michelle. What's that about? I don't know. {Spoiler}{Spoiler}
The Michelle/MJ thing is just masterful trolling by them. Michelle isn't Mary Jane. We have yet to meet Mary Jane. Hell, neither Mary Jane or Gwen Stacy were introduced until after Peter was out of high school in the comics I believe. Same with Harry. Guys, be careful with the spoilers.
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Post by The Legendary Ring Troll {BLM} on Jul 11, 2017 22:58:36 GMT -5
This f***ing forum. The hot debate about this movie is Flash's ethnicity... Jesus Christ. I remember the thread when it was announced that the MCU Spiderman was going to be Peter Parker again and not Miles Morales... and the absolute outrage it caused. I will never understand how race/gender needs to play any role in a comic book movie. I don't know if I missed something, but I literally haven't seen one complaint about Flash's race. Just that he's a short nerd instead of a big jock.
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The Unconquered Sun
King Koopa
He has no pants! What a heathen!
Lord of Storms and Kittens!
Posts: 11,548
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Post by The Unconquered Sun on Jul 12, 2017 19:00:11 GMT -5
Finally got to see it, loved it, well worth the wait. and give it up for Keaton, what an amazing run for this phase of his career. One minor gripe though {Spoiler}{Spoiler} Stark in Civil War, "Pepper and I are on a break. " Stark in Homecoming "Hey Pepper, tell everybody we're getting married."
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riseofsetian1981
King Koopa
"I met him fifteen years ago. I was told there was nothing left."
Posts: 10,323
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Post by riseofsetian1981 on Jul 13, 2017 3:38:05 GMT -5
Finally got to see it, loved it, well worth the wait. and give it up for Keaton, what an amazing run for this phase of his career. One minor gripe though {Spoiler}{Spoiler}{Spoiler} Stark in Civil War, "Pepper and I are on a break. " Stark in Homecoming "Hey Pepper, tell everybody we're getting married." {Spoiler}Quite possible that Stark and Pepper worked things out during Civil War. Probably after his falling out with Cap he figured he'd get her back into his life.
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Dub H
Crow T. Robot
Captain Pixel: the Game Master
I ❤ Aniki
Posts: 47,879
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Post by Dub H on Jul 13, 2017 8:04:24 GMT -5
This is my favourite spider movie, mainly because i can't stand Toby's acting which consists of making the same face the whole movie.
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Post by Zaq "That Guy" Buzzkill on Jul 13, 2017 11:51:13 GMT -5
OK so i saw it yesterday and after reading the whole debate about Flash I was going to make a post talking about my own confusion until it hit me: He's jealous of Peter.
Not for being more popular or more handsome or anything but I get the sense he doesn't like Peter because he's the smartest guy on their team, Flash was bumped from the main group as soon as Peter came back, everyone on the team seems to like him and he was welcome back with open arms by the teacher despite leaving. Flash is probably upset that Peter is better than him at something and that's why he bullies him.
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Post by The 1Watcher Experience on Jul 14, 2017 17:25:43 GMT -5
I really enjoyed it. Michael Keaton as the Vulture stole the show. Loved the performance and the depth to his character. Tom Holland was a great Spiderman. He's supposed to be a teenager and you can easily believe it this time. Tony Stark showing up gave this Spiderman the rub and added a nice crossover appeal with the Avengers franchise. Those Captain America videos were great. Haha.
I understand people feeling like some of the casting was a bit jarring. Marisa Tomei is too young to play the traditional Aunt May role. Flash is represented differently altogether. They still worked very well within the movie. Once you get past the fact that the characters have been updated it's not a big deal. I know it's happened a lot in superhero movies over the years. It even goes back to Billy Dee Williams playing Harvey Dent in the 1989 Batman movie. The movies will never give us the traditional comic book versions we know and love. Even if the original version is what established the franchise and made it so loved it still doesn't matter to Hollywood. Directors and studios will always have their own visions and motivations. If they think if they tweak something and it will make them a few extra bucks for whatever reason, you'd better believe they're going to do it.
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Post by wildojinx on Jul 14, 2017 18:06:34 GMT -5
I liked it a lot. It did seem somewhat more aimed at teenagers, but Marvel is known for playing with genres in the MCU (Cap 2 and 3 had elements of political thrillers, Guardians was a space opera, Doctor Strange was more of a fantasy film, etc), so having that genre didnt bother me too much. One question though, after the opening, we see a "8 years later" card. Assuming that the opening took place in 2012, does that mean this film actually takes place in 2019-2020?
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Post by wildojinx on Jul 14, 2017 18:08:09 GMT -5
Also, what trailers did you get? I got the newest Kingsman movie, Jumanji, Geoforce (is this supposed to be a sequel to something? Sure seemed like it), Pitch Perfect 3, Wonder, and Daddy's Home 2 (actually looked pretty funny).
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