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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2015 8:58:51 GMT -5
I don't care if Triple H is sincere or just seeing an opportunity to make money, to model the Divas division after the NXT womens division would be awesome.
The thing of it to me is though, that the NXT women (and NXT in general for that matter) is such a contrast to WWE television that if you plug the NXT womens booking into WWE it would seem so out of place. A competition based division where it's made clear that everyone eligible to fight for it is actively aspiring to be champ and having occasional midcard 5 star matches would be such a dramatic shift of tone for the WWE show as a whole that I just can't picture them doing it without changing their whole way of thinking. If Vince always has the final say, how can the NXT womens booking truly transition to WWE shows unfiltered? You bring Lynch, Baylee, Charlotte and Sasha over and Vince gets one of his shitty ideas through even once and the tires are flattened on the whole thing.
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Post by Vice honcho room temperature on May 22, 2015 9:03:34 GMT -5
Sounds like Vince is like FIFA president Sepp Blatter and his attitude to women football (soccer) players. Which is they should all be hot and be wearing skimpy outfits. So that's why Wrestlemania 33 is going to be in Qatar
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on May 22, 2015 9:03:48 GMT -5
One has to look no further than Nikki Bella's enterance to see what is wrong with the division: her music of "you can look but you can't touch," wearing too much make up and a low cut top and doing that stripper move where she turns around while carrying the DIVAS title. Times have changed. Women should be viewed as athletes. Have them stop acting like mean, jealous divas. They need to stop dissing each other by calling people fat, ugly, smelly. It should be called the Women's title too. I agree with the second half of this (mostly) but the first part of it I disagree with. Wearing too much makeup? That's because she is on television, you have to be made up heavier for the cameras. She wears a low cut top. So? She should be able to wear what she wants. And there is nothing wrong with a character that is kind of a bombshell. It's a character, no better or worse than any other. I don't think the Nikki Bella character is far from the actual personality of Nicole Garcia-Colace, and that always tends to be better character wise. Without the superficial catty nonsense. I actually really like the...the Twitter Nikki and I've thought that could be a better character tbh. I think that first part might be there are just SO many wrestlers like that and always have been. Nikki doing it is fine, but how many "Oh look at me, I'm conceited because I'm so hot and all the guys here want me" characters have there been over the last 20 years? Nikki herself I think does it well, but it's like the evil authority figure angle, it's been done beyond death, reincarnation and death again.
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TWERKIN' MAGGLE
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Post by TWERKIN' MAGGLE on May 22, 2015 9:08:06 GMT -5
Who gives a damn about women on TV? Hike those shorts up your ass and spin, goddammit.
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Post by thelonewolf527 on May 22, 2015 9:14:09 GMT -5
Team Vince: Kelly Kelly - Then, Now, and Forever! Kelly Kelly's popularity has always been severely understated. She's the reason Mason Ryan beat Sin Cara in the "Who would you rather see wrestle Evan Bourne" poll
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Post by lesleymoon on May 22, 2015 9:17:09 GMT -5
Here I agree with you. It has been done to death at this point which is why i wish they'd move away from the catty, superficial part of the character (and it seems like they are making steps to move away from this trope with NXT and tweaks to the current main roster divas) and more toward the slightly tomboy and 'fearless' side.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2015 9:23:17 GMT -5
I just don't understand Vince, I really don't. They think NXT only appeals to hardcore smarks, and while that audience does follow it, you see a lot of families in the crowd there too. So if people are going apeshit for that product, and seem mostly indifferent to the main show, wouldn't it make sense, even from a purely business standpoint, to at least experiment with making the main show like that?
I mean my God, how awesome would Raw be if it were booked more like NXT but with better production and bigger stars? It would be mind-blowingly glorious.
Also, more on-topic, my wife who is a former wrestling fan thinks it's awesome whenever she sees an NXT show on. She always asks why the women's wrestling isn't like that on Raw.
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Abdullah
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Post by Abdullah on May 22, 2015 9:30:22 GMT -5
That second bit, to me, is more that he thinks women will make money in NXT to a very specific crowd but not nessesarily on a larger scale. If that's true, then he's really not that difference than Vince. Just more strategic. Again, he's been asked why the main roster fails with women and his answers aren't exactly convincing. I don't care why he does anything. I just question how much of NXT will ever translate to RAW and Smackdown. That'd still be giving them an opportunity, maybe he'd stop with them as it is in NXT, the semi main event but that's an insane leap over what there is now, and if they kept making money, why wouldn't he go all the way? As for his answers, what's he going to say about Vince in public? He's not going to lay into him, hes going to at most, make veiled shots like he did on the Austin podcast, Vince is still his father in law and boss, it's a fight you're never going to win, so he's going to wait in the wings till his moment comes. That's absolutely true about Vince. And I think it's where you and I diverge. Here is what he said that essentially gave me pause. In the conference call for R-ival, in February, when asked about divas on the main roster, he said it 'takes time' which is what he usually says. When a few of the reports pushed back, pointing out that it didn't take time for UFC to push Rousey, he seemed to get flustered and changed the subject. Maybe 'time' is code for 'when Vince loses influence' which is what most assume. I worry that it means he already has his biases about women's wrestling working on a larger scale. For the record, I don't think it takes time exactly. There already is, and there have been a number of hugely over female performers since Trish and Lita but WWE has consistently refused to use that overness to help the division.
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Post by Tiger Millionaire on May 22, 2015 10:00:38 GMT -5
I think the biggest trouble with the division now is they try to tie it with a "reality show" that involves the women of the company.
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on May 22, 2015 10:03:21 GMT -5
That'd still be giving them an opportunity, maybe he'd stop with them as it is in NXT, the semi main event but that's an insane leap over what there is now, and if they kept making money, why wouldn't he go all the way? As for his answers, what's he going to say about Vince in public? He's not going to lay into him, hes going to at most, make veiled shots like he did on the Austin podcast, Vince is still his father in law and boss, it's a fight you're never going to win, so he's going to wait in the wings till his moment comes. That's absolutely true about Vince. And I think it's where you and I diverge. Here is what he said that essentially gave me pause. In the conference call for R-ival, in February, when asked about divas on the main roster, he said it 'takes time' which is what he usually says. When a few of the reports pushed back, pointing out that it didn't take time for UFC to push Rousey, he seemed to get flustered and changed the subject. Maybe 'time' is code for 'when Vince loses influence' which is what most assume. I worry that it means he already has his biases about women's wrestling working on a larger scale. For the record, I don't think it takes time exactly. There already is, and there have been a number of hugely over female performers since Trish and Lita but WWE has consistently refused to use that overness to help the division. Ah, I gotcha, yeah I'm on the more optimistic side. The stuttering I see as him having his usual script and just not being ready to have it challenged. I agree on it taking not much time, I'd say about a month, a big opening and a solid feud and long match at the PPV, if they pick the right person who can handle it, that's all you need to get started. Personally I'd go with Charlotte of Sasha Banks since they seem the best figurehead personalities from the NXT group. As awesome as Bayley is, I'd hold back on her because she works best with her interactions with others, you need the others there first, then redo her initial storyline, sweet girl amazed to be there then develops into a better, stronger wrestler.
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on May 22, 2015 10:39:12 GMT -5
I think the biggest trouble with the division now is they try to tie it with a "reality show" that involves the women of the company. i have to mention,Total Divas should burn
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Jiren
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Post by Jiren on May 22, 2015 10:57:26 GMT -5
I don't mind them having total divas but keep it separate from Raw/SD.
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thecrusherwi
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Post by thecrusherwi on May 22, 2015 11:18:40 GMT -5
I just don't understand Vince, I really don't. They think NXT only appeals to hardcore smarks, and while that audience does follow it, you see a lot of families in the crowd there too. So if people are going apeshit for that product, and seem mostly indifferent to the main show, wouldn't it make sense, even from a purely business standpoint, to at least experiment with making the main show like that? I mean my God, how awesome would Raw be if it were booked more like NXT but with better production and bigger stars? It would be mind-blowingly glorious. Also, more on-topic, my wife who is a former wrestling fan thinks it's awesome whenever she sees an NXT show on. She always asks why the women's wrestling isn't like that on Raw. When watching Takeover, I noticed that there were a bunch of women in the crowd. And not like moms or disinterested girlfriends who were there on someone else's behalf, but women decked out in NXT gear having the time of their life. This is a new era where more women watch sports than ever before. Give them a serious product that treats women with respect, and they'll start to watch in larger numbers.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on May 22, 2015 11:25:51 GMT -5
For the it takes time remark remember that since the 50's Women's wrestling in America was generally treated like a sideshow act. So there does need to be some time to recondition the audience that this is legitimate competition... but that's not going to even start until Vince either steps down or sees the dollar signs from NXT. Bring in girl fans, too. Hell, a big part of AJ's success was that she resonated with young female fans, and there's been no shortage of pics of girls dressing like her to meet her, completely decked out in her merch hell there was a little girl at the last round of tapings that aired in the front row dressed up exactly like Bailey right down to the hair band and entrance tassels. I can only imagine just how much money they could make off of her if they put her in a main roster slot in an actual division treated with respect.
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kidkamikaze10
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Post by kidkamikaze10 on May 22, 2015 11:31:12 GMT -5
At this point, Vince is fighting against making money.
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Jiren
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Post by Jiren on May 22, 2015 11:40:20 GMT -5
At this point, Vince is fighting against making money. Vince lives in Bizarro world (No not Canada) Money = BAD
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Post by Mid-Carder on May 22, 2015 11:42:24 GMT -5
I'd quite happily have all the (good) women on NXT. They're all better off and more respected there.
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Post by Hit Girl on May 22, 2015 13:31:36 GMT -5
Total Divas complicates matters, because it's not in sync with regular WWE programming, and WWE manufacture shitty Kardashian style "drama" for the Divas, which makes them look like bitches. But WWE have never really taken women's wrestling seriously, and that's not going to change until Vince dies.
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Post by The Tim Duncan Experience on May 22, 2015 17:02:26 GMT -5
Here I agree with you. It has been done to death at this point which is why i wish they'd move away from the catty, superficial part of the character (and it seems like they are making steps to move away from this trope with NXT and tweaks to the current main roster divas) and more toward the slightly tomboy and 'fearless' side. But Nikki is fearless Lol its on her mechandise
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Post by Chuckie Finster on May 22, 2015 17:18:11 GMT -5
Sounds like Vince is like FIFA president Sepp Blatter and his attitude to women football (soccer) players. Which is they should all be hot and be wearing skimpy outfits. Funny enough, there's a FIFA election in the next couple weeks and Blatter's biggest opponent in Prince Ali of Jordan, who has been pushing women's soccer forward a lot.
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