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Post by warriorthug4edge on Sept 14, 2015 23:27:10 GMT -5
The only way to fix this is for Charlotte to demolish Nikki Sunday. To show that the new girls are legitimately better, that things are going to be different. 99.9% shot Paige costs Charlotte. but..people were saying that was the only way to salvage it yesterday They were right sans the Paige thing. And now would be the way to do it, with Paige pissed her partner didn't stop Nikki. Although I would laugh if Nikki popping Charlotte got seen by the ref and Nikki got DQ'd to lose the belt.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2015 23:49:29 GMT -5
The second they #DivasRevolution they ruined it.
Calling it a revolution is stupid too, because it creates the idea that they're just scrapping everything and starting anew, which they aren't doing nor should they. More talent, longer matches, reasons to care, that's all I wanted at least. You don't need to get rid of everything to do that.
Introducing all the call ups as teams was dumb too. A tournament would have been better - you can lengthen Nikki's reign while giving the challengers some direction and building to someone taking the championship from her instead of months of aimless single and tag matches with varying degrees of interference and post match attacks.
And aligning everyone in teams while telling the story of Nikki having a record setting reign through dubious methods makes them all look like idiots. Why should Paige and Becky be cheering on Charlotte when they were also going for the championship, Paige especially?
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Post by Urfarkendarf on Sept 14, 2015 23:56:41 GMT -5
I don't see how anyone can say that its done more harm than good. Its clearly upped the visibility of the girls at the very least. They're getting two matches on Raw typically every week now, and there's an emphasis on the title in a way that hasn't been seen for a lot of Nikki's reign.
There are negatives to it in some respects. I think the over-emphasis on calling it a "Revolution" has watered it down and made it less than what it could potentially be. I think the whole 3 team baloney is total overkill as well, but these are generally small nitpick type of gripes. I cannot see how it can even be considered to have done more harm at all.
One thing has to be realized, the division was largely garbage before the "big 3" arrived, and while Paige is talented, she was just another spoke on the wheel until Sasha etc. got brought up. Once the Bellas are put into their place hopefully we will see an emphasis on what some of these girls are capable of, but the fact of the matter is that right now since this "Revolution" they are getting more exposure and more time on the show. Yes, creative could be better, yes even the work could be better, but that can be said about the men at times too (especially creative).
There is no way it can be considered a bad thing or harmful right now. They've got to get the belt off of Nikki, who in fairness has improved light years compared to what she used to be (and shes not awful ass Brie) and get out of this 3 team nonsense and put a greater emphasis on the more talented in-ring competitors, but at the very least its on the right track. Its going to take time for it to go full circle.
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Post by thelonewolf527 on Sept 15, 2015 2:54:32 GMT -5
I always believe that when you have to tell people that its a "thing", then its not really a thing. If you have to tell us that its a divas revolution, then its really not. The buzzwords are fine but there are no actions that show that its happening. And I'll be honest, I cried when Charlotte Sasha and Becky were called up, but I quickly realized that like everything else, WWE were jumping on the strong female athlete trend, as a way to pander and to make money. Nothing more, nothing less. I mean in all fairness, a lot of the "women power" movement you're seeing in the sports world nowadays is a farce created by media outlets to push certain figures as god-like characters for ratings. Serena Williams is a perfect example of that. Only NOW is she all of a sudden a tennis god in spite of the fact that she's been the #1 female tennis player for like 17 years. They compared her loss to Mike Tyson losing to Buster Douglas, even though she loses all the time. It's a hot topic issue so the media wants to exploit it. WWE trying to "create" their own female power movement really isn't much different. The big difference though is that they had to try and make 3 divas look great in a barren wasteland, while subsequently making sure the other divas don't look like complete shit so they can still be viable players in the division, as well as not piss off the Total Divas fanbase. Many people wouldn't have been happy with anything that wasn't "Charlotte, Becky, and Sasha squash all of the divas, then they all get fired, and then the matches are just the 3 of them for the rest of time." That obviously wasn't going to happen, and it wouldn't even lead to anything new since we've seen that already for like a year and a half in NXT.
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Bo Rida
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Post by Bo Rida on Sept 15, 2015 6:25:42 GMT -5
It's not a "revolution" when all you change is the length of the matches and add a few new faces. The ass-backwards booking is still in effect, therefore any attempt at a "revolution" was doomed to fail from the beginning. Yeah the measure of success was wrong from the start, the success of the women's division in NXT didn't start with long matches instead they built towards that. Hell to this day most of their TV matches are around five minutes unless the big names are facing each other. Emma failing to lift herself into the ring on her debut did more to get her over than anything in the divas revolution so far. From there the characterisation only got better, Sasha becoming The Boss, Becky learning to be herself, Bayley gaining the steel needed to become champion. Much of that characterisation came in the ring even in those short matches. Perhaps more importantly they were the ones that drove the changes, not an external force like Stephanie. They all evolved and made us care, they earned their spot and only then were rewarded with longer matches on the specials and now a Takeover main-event. Yet they can't do that on Raw. Strong stories? Character arcs? Building things up over time? Alliances that make sense? Nah that's too much effort, they'd rather just reduce some of their best wrestlers to a f***ing hashtag. And then dilute the meaning of the hashtag. A video here of a young(er) Becky and Paige in Shimmer did more to justify their team than anything I've seen on Raw. Yet because of the "revolution" they can't go back to building slowly. Tell people they'll change everything and stop them from delivering on that promise and there's bound to be a backlash. I think they'll all talented enough to turn things around but they shouldn't be in that position in the first place.
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Post by ________ has left the building on Sept 15, 2015 6:39:13 GMT -5
Cold introducing the newbies. Telling fans what you like before sucked and the newbies will make things better. Putting them into stables. Changing character alignments on a weekly basis. Lack of distinct characters. Stephanie McMahon being the center point of the storyline.
Those are the things that done more harm than a hashtag.
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auph10imitated
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Post by auph10imitated on Sept 15, 2015 6:44:36 GMT -5
I dont think its done harm, because when you look at the times the matches have been given since it began they are running up to the 10 minute mark, remember during the post Trish/Lita era, hell even in the Trish/Lita era, on RAW the women would have 3 minutes. So they are given a fair shake to put matches on.
The problem they have is they are still focusing on The Bella Twins, but it would appear everyone seems to ahve thier back - much like Trish Stratus and Laycool before them, they have political pull. (Trish was a favourite, Michelle was with Undertaker) so the focus is always on them. But The Bellas have now been with the company for 8 years, thats a long time for a diva, thats more than Trish and Lita had runs. Its time to pass the torch and I hope they are slowly doing this with the Charlotte angle.
I personally didnt want Nikki to beat AJ and thats why I thought they pushed the match to RAW to end it before she could - but when you think logically AJ quit, shes married to Punk, WWE dont owe her anything right now. Nikki needs to play the heel everyone wants to get see beat like AJ did before her, so the angle on RAW made sense, it gace Charlotte sympathy, she had Ric with her, it was made to be a big deal. Eventually when she does beat her, it will be a big deal and thats when they need to phase The Bellas out of ring action, and just use them on Total Divas since thier relationships tend to give them automatic storylines for that show.
Thats when they can start building the other girls, quietly end the faction wars and then begin to build the characters of Becky Lynch and Sasha Banks.Charlotte is ready made, we know this. But they now have to focus on who the other girls are. Paige is established too.
When Charlotte beats Nikki, she then has some ready made feuds, you have a Paige heel turn and you have the returning Natalya (who had an awesome match on NXT) and you can involve the blood lines of The Hart vs Flair deal. Then in the meantime you need to start building up who Becky and Sasha are.
The dead weight like Alicia and Tamina really have run thier course. Naomi was a pretty good valet for The Uso's and should actually go back with them once they are back in action. Her going through the table at the hands of The Dudleyz is a throw back to what they originally started and also sets up an Usos/Dudleyz angle down the road.
I saw Becky and Sheamus as a pairing, but apart from both being Irish red heads im not sure the characters match, plus I see her as a good babyface.
This whole division once Nikki loses needs to be Charlotte, Natalya, Paige, Becky Lynch, Sasha Banks and Naomi. Each one fighting for themselves, no alignments.
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rippo
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Post by rippo on Sept 15, 2015 7:21:57 GMT -5
In order for there to be a "Revolution", WWE would need to get rid of The Bellas, Alicia and everyone else who can't wrestle.
That won't happen. So just be glad you can see good feuds and matches in NXT. At least until they get called up to job to the Bellas...
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auph10imitated
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Post by auph10imitated on Sept 15, 2015 7:47:59 GMT -5
I think one good thing about NXT exposure is unlike the days when they introduced people like The Bella Twins, Alicia, Rosa, Layla and all the Diva Search model crew, it took them forever to get over, if at all get over. No one gave a shit about them. These girls are lucky to have the NXT exposure and are automatically well know to a good portion of the crowd and have gotten over pretty good, the fact Sasha gets Sasha chants and even Beckly who id say is the least known of the three got a huge pop on her debut and has stayed decenetly enough consistent in crowd reaction.
Yet The Bella twins have taken 8 years to get any kind of crowd response and thats only kind of come as of late, Layla struggled for years until they created Laycool and even then the crowd were indifferent, not sure if people like Fox, Rosa, Tamina so on and so forth have ever had any crowd interest in them or been over in the slightest.
They just need to start focusing on seperate characters now, luckily they all have different unique looks reminds me back in the Golden Era when you had Jazz, Trish, Lita, Victoria, Ivory, Gail etc.. all bringing a different look and style.
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Post by EvenBaldobombHasAJob on Sept 15, 2015 9:13:06 GMT -5
any time anything starts with #, you know it's just a buzzword that doesn't mean anything.
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kidkamikaze10
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Post by kidkamikaze10 on Sept 15, 2015 9:24:29 GMT -5
any time anything starts with #, you know it's just a buzzword that doesn't mean anything. This is lazy rhetoric. There are plenty more things hampering the angle than what they call it or how they want people to signal boost it on social media. Like how it's been booked throughout or who they've focused the angle on. The more I hear this, the more it seems like execution was not the initial problem for many people but instead the fact that they even tried in the first place.
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Tom S
Samurai Cop
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Post by Tom S on Sept 15, 2015 9:24:36 GMT -5
I'm sure the Tsar will be quaking in his boots
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Post by warriorthug4edge on Sept 15, 2015 9:28:58 GMT -5
In order for there to be a "Revolution", WWE would need to get rid of The Bellas, Alicia and everyone else who can't wrestle. That won't happen. So just be glad you can see good feuds and matches in NXT. At least until they get called up to job to the Bellas... Alicia is fine. Nikki's actually not too bad, although I wouldn't say she's "good" by any stretch. Naomi has shown flashes. Brie and Tamina, though, need to go into managerial roles or something. They're not very good by any measure.
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Post by Finish Uncle Muffin’s Story on Sept 15, 2015 9:35:08 GMT -5
All this stuff makes me wonder if Undertaker debuted today if we'd get one win at Wrestlemania and then #TheStreak from there on out. They feel like their audiences don't have the attention span that they once did so they tend to blaze through stories - this is true - but sometimes slow burn storytelling doesn't hurt. I know they wanted to get the women from NXT up to the main roster as quickly as they could, but I still think a better way to do it would have been bringing up one or two at a time and just having them compete and work their way up the ranks.
Heck, I'd even make the argument that they should make Superstars the "Divas" show.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Sept 15, 2015 9:44:47 GMT -5
Telling fans what you like before sucked and the newbies will make things better. This was especially stupid. True or not you don't call your product shitty. Just book the Divas like the NXT Division and don't draw attention to it... people will realize that it's gotten better on it's own without you having to crow about how it used to be terrible. Also the entire team thing was BS from the start. Paige getting Charlotte/Becky to counteract Brie works fine and makes sense... the heel Stephanie McMahon coming out and assigning Paige, Charlotte and Becky as a team because shutup doesn't even look good on paper... not to mention there's only the one title so if they try to do anything with the teams it pretty much has to be non-title.
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chrom
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Post by chrom on Sept 15, 2015 10:05:38 GMT -5
There's not going to be a change in women's wrestling, nor will there be a change in the tag division, or in the IC or US titles either.
Instead its going to keep on being the same old song and dance routine we've been getting. WWE has made sure of that and reminded everyone that nothing will change.
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Rave
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Post by Rave on Sept 15, 2015 11:08:43 GMT -5
the heel Stephanie McMahon coming out and assigning Paige, Charlotte and Becky as a team because shutup doesn't even look good on paper... The heel Stephanie McMahon who'd previously supported Nikki's title reign, at that. Made absolutely no sense.
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Post by Hit Girl on Sept 15, 2015 11:23:19 GMT -5
Yesterday told you everything you needed to know about how irrational WWE's booking of women is.
Stephanie, the supposed evil heel authority figure, is also on the same show presented as a benevolent loving mother who cares deeply about sick children. Between self-aggrandising footage of her charitable work (which by her own admission is done for cynical reasons) she's also supporting the cowardly heel WWE champion, and crushing the dreams of the Divas title challenger who Stephanie herself brought onto the main roster.
Nikki Bella, consistently booked as a bitch, is praised unchallenged as the leader of the Divas revolution, despite clearly being the beneficiary of the aforementioned evil authority figure, and is also given flattering vignettes depicting her as a brave and strong role model.
Even if Charlotte wins the title, it makes no difference now. The heel has gained her accomplishment and broken the record. All you needed to do was take a look at Charlotte's face yesterday. She looked crushed. Given WWE's past history, it's very likely she's going to lose at NOC anyway, which makes the whole thing even more pointless.
It's not working. It's never going to work. Even without Vince, the problem remains.
That problem is Stephanie.
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Post by sportatorium on Sept 15, 2015 11:30:02 GMT -5
The idea that people would look at the Bella's & Alicia as anything revolutionary is hard to swallow. The idea that a belt is kept on one of the worst in ring talents in the division makes it worse. At least the pieces are in place for a solid division. Charlotte needs a solid chase for the title now. If they have Nikki drop the title now, it really looks like they were doing nothing more than giving Punk & AJ the finger.
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Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Sept 15, 2015 11:31:07 GMT -5
It did everything that the WWE wanted it to, it got Stephanie some positive publicity for a few weeks and got some people to forget the attack by AJ over how laughable her claims to be a feminist are. It was never going to be a much needed overhaul of the women's division or a long term thing as the WWE don't care about women's wrestling or putting on the best show they can, it was a McMahon ego stroke, pure and simple.
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