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Post by AwamoriRock on Nov 17, 2016 19:54:55 GMT -5
Signature moment lol. What a ridiculous way to measure an MVP.
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,506
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Nov 17, 2016 19:55:08 GMT -5
No. No he didn't. The Angels were a 74 win team. That's garbage
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Unocal 76
King Koopa
Providing The Finest Oil
Posts: 12,687
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Post by Unocal 76 on Nov 17, 2016 19:57:54 GMT -5
Trout winning the AL MVP is a joke.
Seriously, people have such a hard-on for him just because he has a WAR of 50.
A stat that didn't exist 10 years ago and all of a sudden we're anointing Trout because of that?
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Post by AwamoriRock on Nov 17, 2016 20:07:00 GMT -5
Unocal's Halloween costume was a man made of straw. Trout hit .315 with 32 doubles, five triples, 29 home runs, 100 RBIs and 30 stolen bases. He led the Majors in runs (123), walks (116) and on-base percentage (.441)lol No. No he didn't. The Angels were a 74 win team. That's garbage And that's all on Trout?
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,506
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Nov 17, 2016 20:08:44 GMT -5
Unocal's Halloween costume was a man made of straw. Trout hit .315 with 32 doubles, five triples, 29 home runs, 100 RBIs and 30 stolen bases. He led the Majors in runs (123), walks (116) and on-base percentage (.441)lol No. No he didn't. The Angels were a 74 win team. That's garbage And that's all on Trout? No, but it just kills the concept of the award
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Post by AwamoriRock on Nov 17, 2016 20:10:33 GMT -5
Unocal's Halloween costume was a man made of straw. Trout hit .315 with 32 doubles, five triples, 29 home runs, 100 RBIs and 30 stolen bases. He led the Majors in runs (123), walks (116) and on-base percentage (.441)lol And that's all on Trout? No, but it just kills the concept of the award Why does team record matter for an individual reward that is usually given to who had the most outstanding season? Not mocking, just legit curiosity.
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Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Nov 17, 2016 20:15:17 GMT -5
No, but it just kills the concept of the award Why does team record matter for an individual reward that is usually given to who had the most outstanding season? Not mocking, just legit curiosity. Baseball is the sport where an individual has the least impact on the game. So you shouldn't use the team being bad to disqualify somebody deserving.
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,506
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Nov 17, 2016 20:15:52 GMT -5
No, but it just kills the concept of the award Why does team record matter for an individual reward that is usually given to who had the most outstanding season? Not mocking, just legit curiosity. It's not "best player" or "most outstanding", it's most valuable. It's really hard to give an award like that to someone who plays on a mediocre team
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Post by AwamoriRock on Nov 17, 2016 20:18:09 GMT -5
Why does team record matter for an individual reward that is usually given to who had the most outstanding season? Not mocking, just legit curiosity. It's not "best player" or "most outstanding", it's most valuable. It's really hard to give an award like that to someone who plays on a mediocre team So are there degrees of how valuable the player is to the team then? If Trout plays on a better team than the Angels, he helps them make the playoffs. He plays on a team that is nowhere near playoff capability and no matter how much he helps them there is a ceiling. You're penalizing him for playing on a bad team then?
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BRV
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Wants him some Taco Flavored Kisses.
Posts: 16,951
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Post by BRV on Nov 17, 2016 20:38:57 GMT -5
Unocal's Halloween costume was a man made of straw. Trout hit .315 with 32 doubles, five triples, 29 home runs, 100 RBIs and 30 stolen bases. He led the Majors in runs (123), walks (116) and on-base percentage (.441)lol No. No he didn't. The Angels were a 74 win team. That's garbage And that's all on Trout? No, it's not, but if you're going to be deemed the league's most valuable player - and I know there are many differing definitions of what "valuable" truly means - and if your team is in last place basically wire-to-wire, then you'd better have an otherworldly season to deserve the award. Trout had a phenomenal season, but so did Mookie Betts (and so did the true AL MVP, David Ortiz, but that's a discussion for another day). Betts hit .318 to Trout's .315. He had 42 doubles to Trout's 32. He had five triples, equal that of Trout. He had 31 home runs to Trout's 29. He had 113 RBI to Trout's 100. He had 26 stolen bases, four fewer than Trout. He trailed Trout's league lead in runs by one run, 123 to 122. He had a slash line of .318/.363/.534/.897 to Trout's .315/.441/.550/.991. They were also a wash defensively. So with the players being that close in every statistical category, the tie has to go to the guy who did it when it mattered and whose impact vaulted his team into the postseason. The Red Sox and Mookie Betts were playing competitive baseball from April through October. Relevant baseball stopped being played for the Angels and Mike Trout around the beginning of May.
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Post by AwamoriRock on Nov 17, 2016 20:47:08 GMT -5
Unocal's Halloween costume was a man made of straw. Trout hit .315 with 32 doubles, five triples, 29 home runs, 100 RBIs and 30 stolen bases. He led the Majors in runs (123), walks (116) and on-base percentage (.441)lol And that's all on Trout? So with the players being that close in every statistical category, the tie has to go to the guy who did it when it mattered and whose impact vaulted his team into the postseason That just seems to be a very arbitrary decision that has nothing to do with the actual performance of the player, though. Don't get me wrong, I understand that when your team is relevant your performance has more gravity to it, but "when it mattered" isn't an opportunity Trout got this season and I dunno why he should get docked for it.
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Post by RI Richmark on Nov 17, 2016 21:13:47 GMT -5
Trout winning the AL MVP is a joke. Seriously, people have such a hard-on for him just because he has a WAR of 50. A stat that didn't exist 10 years ago and all of a sudden we're anointing Trout because of that? Or maybe they were afraid of getting more angry tweets from Kate Upton.
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Unocal 76
King Koopa
Providing The Finest Oil
Posts: 12,687
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Post by Unocal 76 on Nov 17, 2016 23:56:56 GMT -5
Since when did we anoint Mike Trout the best player in baseball?
Just because he has a great WAR?
Seriously, this stat is so ridiculous- the way we discount offensive stats like HR's, hits, doubles, total bases, extra base hits.
WAR.
What is it good for?
Making us forget all the other offensive stats in baseball that should still mean something.
The wrong guy won as far as I'm concerned.
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Post by AwamoriRock on Nov 18, 2016 0:19:12 GMT -5
Since when did we anoint Mike Trout the best player in baseball? Just because he has a great WAR? Seriously, this stat is so ridiculous- the way we discount offensive stats like HR's, hits, doubles, total bases, extra base hits. WAR. What is it good for? Making us forget all the other offensive stats in baseball that should still mean something. The wrong guy won as far as I'm concerned. Why do you think people only look at WAR when praising Trout? News to me.
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Post by Cyno on Nov 18, 2016 0:25:11 GMT -5
Honestly, MVP is basically "Best Player in Baseball" anymore. Trout had an amazing year even if the rest of his team was the drizzling shits. But then, you could've made a really solid case for Mookie Betts, too.
Verlander did get hosed on the Cy Young, though.
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,506
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Nov 18, 2016 5:45:28 GMT -5
Verlander did get hosed on the Cy Young, though. Eh, yes and no. I think the thing that cost him is that he had a lousy first half, and great 2nd half while Porcello was terrific from wire to wire.
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Post by sfvega on Nov 18, 2016 7:25:48 GMT -5
I think Verlander got hosed, but how bad can you really feel for the guy? Britton deserved it more than Verlander, didn't even make the finalists, and isn't going home to Kate Upton. In totality, Verlander still wins.
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Post by deltarich on Nov 18, 2016 9:05:42 GMT -5
Betts was surrounded by a ton of great hitters in an offense that led MLB in runs scored....playing in a ballpark that's heavily more friendly to hitters than Angel Stadium is, and yet his edge over Trout was merely 2 total HR's and a slight difference in BA. RBI numbers mean nothing to me considering the lineups both played in and the fact that Betts got a ton more total plate appearances than Trout did overall. Trout pretty much matched Betts despite all of this and obviously was significantly better overall at getting on base, which is what you want to do as a hitter since that's how you score runs. Betts made nearly 100 more outs than Trout did, which is obviously not what you want to do as a hitter 30 of Betts 42 doubles came at Fenway....I wonder why. Betts played great defense in RF, but Trout was above average in CF, which is the tougher and more valuable position on the field. Betts had an awesome season but you can't look at his numbers and say he was better than Trout. No individual player brought more total value to a team than Trout did this year. Even if you want to bring up "clutch" situations, Trout was significantly better than Betts in that area too Medium Leverage Situations Trout - .957 OPS, .405 wOBA, 162 wRC+ Betts - .884 OPS, .373 wOBA, 131 wRC+ High Leverage Situations Trout - 1.175 OPS, .475 wOBA, 210 wRC+ Betts - .907 OPS, .370 wOBA, 129 wRC+ I'm actually very surprised the voters got this one right. Great sign going forward IMO. The best players should deservedly be recognized for their performance without having to lose out due to some other player having better team mates around him Since when did we anoint Mike Trout the best player in baseball? Just because he has a great WAR? Seriously, this stat is so ridiculous- the way we discount offensive stats like HR's, hits, doubles, total bases, extra base hits. WAR. What is it good for? Making us forget all the other offensive stats in baseball that should still mean something. The wrong guy won as far as I'm concerned. Since Trout played his first full season(2012) his MLB ranks are 4th in BA 2nd in OBP 3rd in slg 2nd in OPS 5th in Hits 5th in HR 10th in SB 1st in runs scored 7th in RBI 1st in Total Bases 1st in extra base hits all doing this through age 20-24
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Post by HMARK Center on Nov 18, 2016 14:12:10 GMT -5
No. No he didn't. The Angels were a 74 win team. That's garbage He's the most valuable player. The rest of the team is immaterial. There is nobody on Trout's level in MLB. He should have five MVPs at this point.
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,506
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Nov 18, 2016 14:23:02 GMT -5
No. No he didn't. The Angels were a 74 win team. That's garbage He's the most valuable player. The rest of the team is immaterial. There is nobody on Trout's level in MLB. He should have five MVPs at this point. Mookie Betts beat Trout in most statistical categories and the ones he didn't, he was right below him. And again, he did so while being a monster part of the reason the Sox made the playoffs. By that criteria, he's the MVP because we're talking *valuable* not "best"
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