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Post by Joe Neglia on Nov 25, 2019 23:54:54 GMT -5
Also Joe Neglia how the hell did you get involved? I burst through the wall and yelled Oh Yeah. No, seriously, I'm just trying to help encourage Joey to get coherent and organized, and to take whatever else he has to some of the journalists who can actually help him with this. I'm not really involved in it, per se.
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Post by ogreknee on Nov 26, 2019 0:28:27 GMT -5
I do not think shit will change with roh
I am happy njpw is savvy enough to separate from roh in the states and grow their own us developmental
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Post by HMARK Center on Nov 26, 2019 12:35:03 GMT -5
Before all this broke I dropped a few bucks for a couple ROH shows: The Experience and Unauthorized, which both ran recently.
Made me want to reiterate what a lot of us have been saying so far: the wrestlers and on-air talent are clearly not the problem with this promotion. I only watched The Experience so far, but it gave a solid Dragon Lee vs. Jeff Cobb match, a really good Gresham vs. Haskins 2 out of 3 falls match, a great Last Man Standing match with Flip against Williams, and a couple tag match main events that made pretty much everybody in them look good.
Again, the fact that they have that talent and that they're capable of doing so well when left to their own devices just makes all of this an even bigger bummer; they all deserve better than the management they're saddled with.
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Post by XaviersSS2015hair on Nov 26, 2019 16:12:11 GMT -5
Enzo and Cass were on Talk is Jericho last week and it's actually a really good episode. They both sound down to earth and realistic about everything they've done the last couple years. Pertaining to this thread they also give a full account of everything that happened with the ROH / MSG show and the aftermath of it. It seems they are very close to Bubba Ray or "Uncle Bubba" as Enzo refers to him. They said three people from Sinclair and ROH knew what was going to happen at MSG that night. They didn't really say anything negative about ROH only that ROH "ghosted them" after the event and they didn't hear back from them ever again. I guess ten thousand people in MSG chanting "get the f*** out" wasn't the type of heat ROH were looking for.
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Post by ogreknee on Nov 26, 2019 17:42:14 GMT -5
Enzo and Cass were on Talk is Jericho last week and it's actually a really good episode. They both sound down to earth and realistic about everything they've done the last couple years. Pertaining to this thread they also give a full account of everything that happened with the ROH / MSG show and the aftermath of it. It seems they are very close to Bubba Ray or "Uncle Bubba" as Enzo refers to him. They said three people from Sinclair and ROH knew what was going to happen at MSG that night. They didn't really say anything negative about ROH only that ROH "ghosted them" after the event and they didn't hear back from them ever again. I guess ten thousand people in MSG chanting "get the f*** out" wasn't the type of heat ROH were looking for. The thing is i know enzo would have made it work. I see enzo and cass ending up in aew
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Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Nov 26, 2019 18:20:18 GMT -5
Two guys with a reputation for being toxic to be around, one of whom made a 'rap' video attacking the fans whose AEW are reliant on? I doubt it. The ROH debacle already showed how they'd be received by an audience who like good matches, something neither man can provide.
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Post by Joe Neglia on Nov 26, 2019 21:38:42 GMT -5
Okay, I'm asking anyone who understands the make-up of ROH more than I do - can anyone put together a bullet points list of everything that has come out of all this, point by point? Klein would be the major one so far, so far as I can tell, but I'd like to get a better understanding of how many different things are currently present in this. Thanks in advance.
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Post by Mozenrath on Nov 27, 2019 2:41:57 GMT -5
Two guys with a reputation for being toxic to be around, one of whom made a 'rap' video attacking the fans whose AEW are reliant on? I doubt it. The ROH debacle already showed how they'd be received by an audience who like good matches, something neither man can provide. Basically, yeah. I mean, at least Joey Janela doesn't seem to have hard feelings, so that probably wouldn't be a hurdle, but it doesn't seem like a fit for them at all. Impact feels more realistic for Enzo and Cass. I'd say WWE for a maybe, but Triple H openly accusing Enzo of floating the rumor they'd come back, and dashing it publicly and quickly, plus how Enzo got fired to begin with, yeah, that's super not happening. MLW also seems like a maybe, given how they seem to have a knack for rehabbing problem wrestlers.
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Post by Mozenrath on Nov 27, 2019 2:47:56 GMT -5
Okay, I'm asking anyone who understands the make-up of ROH more than I do - can anyone put together a bullet points list of everything that has come out of all this, point by point? Klein would be the major one so far, so far as I can tell, but I'd like to get a better understanding of how many different things are currently present in this. Thanks in advance. Off the top of my head, there's also the bigger problem of the women being paid really poorly, and the men also not getting paid that well (they apparently had to fight to get Jeff Cobb, one of their biggest names currently, 40k, which is about on par with some of their office workers). They jerked Alex Shelley around, who had to give medical care to some of the wrestlers himself. Additionally, some of the wrestlers had to pop Flip Gordon's elbow back into place because, again, no one on-hand to take care of it. When Jay Lethal, their former world champion and someone who has been fiercely loyal to them, broke his arm, Greg (the main guy Joey's pissed at) just left the show without bothering to call a driver for the guy who could no longer drive himself from the arena, and other people had to step in.
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Post by XaviersSS2015hair on Nov 27, 2019 3:40:01 GMT -5
Okay, I'm asking anyone who understands the make-up of ROH more than I do - can anyone put together a bullet points list of everything that has come out of all this, point by point? Klein would be the major one so far, so far as I can tell, but I'd like to get a better understanding of how many different things are currently present in this. Thanks in advance. Off the top of my head, there's also the bigger problem of the women being paid really poorly, and the men also not getting paid that well (they apparently had to fight to get Jeff Cobb, one of their biggest names currently, 40k, which is about on par with some of their office workers). They jerked Alex Shelley around, who had to give medical care to some of the wrestlers himself. Additionally, some of the wrestlers had to pop Flip Gordon's elbow back into place because, again, no one on-hand to take care of it. When Jay Lethal, their former world champion and someone who has been fiercely loyal to them, broke his arm, Greg (the main guy Joey's pissed at) just left the show without bothering to call a driver for the guy who could no longer drive himself from the arena, and other people had to step in. Kobb is only making 40K a year? On Talk is Jericho earlier this year Cobb said under his ROH contract he can only work PWG. Which means Kobb has to be living off those NJPW dates to make ends meet. Haven't heard that story about Gary and Jay Lethal. I really want to be surprised and disappointed by that story but after the last couple weeks how could I be?
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Post by Mozenrath on Nov 27, 2019 3:51:12 GMT -5
Off the top of my head, there's also the bigger problem of the women being paid really poorly, and the men also not getting paid that well (they apparently had to fight to get Jeff Cobb, one of their biggest names currently, 40k, which is about on par with some of their office workers). They jerked Alex Shelley around, who had to give medical care to some of the wrestlers himself. Additionally, some of the wrestlers had to pop Flip Gordon's elbow back into place because, again, no one on-hand to take care of it. When Jay Lethal, their former world champion and someone who has been fiercely loyal to them, broke his arm, Greg (the main guy Joey's pissed at) just left the show without bothering to call a driver for the guy who could no longer drive himself from the arena, and other people had to step in. Kobb is only making 40K a year? On Talk is Jericho earlier this year Cobb said under his ROH contract he can only work PWG. Which means Kobb has to be living off those NJPW dates to make ends meet. Haven't heard that story about Gary and Jay Lethal. I really want to be surprised and disappointed by that story but after the last couple weeks how could I be? Yeah, that's seemingly the case, which goes to further explain why Jeff Cobb is intent on working as much NJPW as he can, the money's way better. That, and probably also to capitalize on the void left by Elgin for a bruiser gaijin, anyway. Is his name Gary? Whatever, the office guy, I admittedly suck with names sometimes. But yeah, it's unprofessional to leave any of your guys high and dry, but it's especially said when it's one of your top stars. Really just paints the picture of them just not giving the faintest phantom of a shit about the business you're supposed to be running. It'd be like if I was a concert promoter, and Metallica told me the stage lights were all busted, and I just drove home and ignored it.
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Post by HMARK Center on Nov 27, 2019 11:29:01 GMT -5
I thought it said at least 50k for Cobb, but I might've read that wrong; either way it sounds way too low, guy would be making a full time living beyond that if he wanted to so something seems weird there. I read that Rush is getting something like $180k (ensures his US exclusivity), so I can't imagine Cobb's doing significantly worse, but it could be the case that he's simultaneously doing better than that AND still being underpaid relative to what he's worth and what Sinclair could afford to pay.
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Post by XaviersSS2015hair on Nov 27, 2019 12:53:13 GMT -5
Kobb is only making 40K a year? On Talk is Jericho earlier this year Cobb said under his ROH contract he can only work PWG. Which means Kobb has to be living off those NJPW dates to make ends meet. Haven't heard that story about Gary and Jay Lethal. I really want to be surprised and disappointed by that story but after the last couple weeks how could I be? Yeah, that's seemingly the case, which goes to further explain why Jeff Cobb is intent on working as much NJPW as he can, the money's way better. That, and probably also to capitalize on the void left by Elgin for a bruiser gaijin, anyway. Is his name Gary? Whatever, the office guy, I admittedly suck with names sometimes. But yeah, it's unprofessional to leave any of your guys high and dry, but it's especially said when it's one of your top stars. Really just paints the picture of them just not giving the faintest phantom of a shit about the business you're supposed to be running. It'd be like if I was a concert promoter, and Metallica told me the stage lights were all busted, and I just drove home and ignored it. No you're right it's Greg. That was my mistake. As the Rock would say, it doesn't matter what his name is! That would be absolutely right in this case. He's a piece of garbage regardless.
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Post by Chainsaw on Nov 27, 2019 14:47:59 GMT -5
One of Joey's biggest points on their scumbaggery is that he accuses them of having no concussion protocol in place, and the general shoddiness of their treatment of the wrestlers' health. He certainly has the evidence for it, and the fact that Kelly Klein was suffering from post concussion disorders that, she argues, prevented her from making a clear decision to not travel to South Africa to wrestle, backs that up. It seems like nobody in the office put their foot down for her own safety.
A lot of what Joey is illustrating is that it's up to the wrestlers to take care of their own business in ROH because Greg and Joe are absentee landlords, actively just there to collect the money and meddle in the worse ways possible.
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Post by Mister Pigwell on Dec 2, 2019 19:34:31 GMT -5
So is this done?
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Post by chrom on Dec 3, 2019 13:06:17 GMT -5
Here's some more news regarding the women's and ROH ineptitude.
Before signing and starting with AEW, Britt Baker had half a dozen dates left on her contract with ROH that she was willing to do. However reports say that Joe Koff told ROH management that they didn't owe her anything and refused to let her work them. She arrived at a show to do one and she was told that they had nothing for her and her remaining dates had been cut.
Real professional company
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2019 23:47:10 GMT -5
Bumping this but Joey posted a list on Twitter of people who ROH is planning on getting rid of in the near future. Im on moblie so I cant post his tweet on here.
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Dec 9, 2019 1:24:11 GMT -5
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Post by Mozenrath on Dec 9, 2019 1:40:54 GMT -5
Bumping this but Joey posted a list on Twitter of people who ROH is planning on getting rid of in the near future. Im on moblie so I cant post his tweet on here. For anyone who can't see, there are two redacted names, but the remaining are: Brodie King (Conditional), which presumably means he's either a maybe, or they may keep him if he agrees to less money or some other stipulation. Colt Cabana Rhett Shane Taylor TK O'Ryan Boys (Not sure who that refers to) Tracy Williams Of these, Colt I guess is probably going to be fine, especially if NJPW have liked his work in the World Tag series, but I wonder if TK O'Ryan feels like a twit, given wasn't he one of the guys defending ROH and trying to call BS on Joey? Shane, we knew about, but it's still shitty. Anyone know what "Boys" would be referring to? Also, wonder who the two blacked out names would have been.
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Post by Convoy on Dec 9, 2019 1:58:58 GMT -5
The Boys refer to the Tate Twins aka Dalton Castle's former Boys, who just had a WWE tryout.
I'm assuming Brody is conditional to Marty/PCO resigning.
Not sure why Joey would redact certain names, but maybe he asked everyone before he posted the image, and two people said to leave them out.
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