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Post by Hit Girl on Jun 27, 2020 0:30:41 GMT -5
Hopefully they'll find two actual space aliens to voice Kang and Kodos.
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Cranjis McBasketball
Crow T. Robot
Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
Posts: 42,002
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Jun 27, 2020 0:43:38 GMT -5
They are f***ing drawings. They are not white, black, yellow, Indian, Scottish, male or female....they are drawings! That whiny guy who made the documentary....if Apu was voiced by an Indian actor...you’re still getting called Apu. Quit picking on the easy shit and concentrate on the actual racism. Don't know if it's our place to tell the Indian guy how-to feel about the white guy doing an Indian voice. Reality still applies. His main argument was he was Indian, he was in a Kwik-E-Mart and got called Apu. The VO changes none of that. Eventually people’s feelings and the real world have to merge.
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lucas_lee
Hank Scorpio
Heel turn is finished, now stripping away my personality
Posts: 6,774
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Post by lucas_lee on Jun 27, 2020 0:54:57 GMT -5
This is a tough call for me. As a hobbyist VA and now currently a casting director. The whole point of VA is picking the right person for the voice and not discriminate due to sex and color. But on the other hand POC VAs are under represented and I think it's a little odd that folks are now putting out casting calls for people of color instead of doing it before the protests. It makes me question the genuineness of gestures like these
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hassanchop
Grimlock
Who are you to doubt Belldandy?
Posts: 14,814
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Post by hassanchop on Jun 27, 2020 1:09:31 GMT -5
So what are they gonna do about anime dubs? Have them dubbed in Singapore, Philippines or Malaysia?
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Post by "Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik on Jun 27, 2020 1:19:19 GMT -5
If this means more voice actors of color get work, than I'm all for it.
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Post by Vice honcho room temperature on Jun 27, 2020 3:19:41 GMT -5
Yep just voices. Like Amos n' Andy and that wasn't a blackface minstrel radio show that reenforced the idea in millions of people's heads that Africian Americans are dumb. Nope just voices.
So why this is necessary? Because I as a white guy who hypothetically would do a voice of a marginalized race in the US could fall into a stereotype even if I don't mean it when trying to make a silly voice. But if we get more voices of color thus more ideas in the creative process we can move away from coming up with another Apu which becomes the major stereotype of a vast swath of the country.
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Post by Viking Hall on Jun 27, 2020 5:27:40 GMT -5
Yep just voices. Like Amos n' Andy and that wasn't a blackface minstrel radio show that reenforced the idea in millions of people's heads that Africian Americans are dumb. Nope just voices. I'm not aware of that show but I assume the main issue was the overall content. In that it would still be objectionable now if black guys had voiced it.
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Fundertaker
El Dandy
Hideo Kojima should direct every ending ever!
Posts: 8,981
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Post by Fundertaker on Jun 27, 2020 5:52:44 GMT -5
So what are they gonna do about anime dubs? Have them dubbed in Singapore, Philippines or Malaysia? Well most of them are representing Japanese characters, so you better get some Japanese people voicing them. You know, maybe this whole "dubbing" business should go out the window... (yes, this is sarcasm)
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Jun 27, 2020 5:55:18 GMT -5
Yes the real problem here is the white people that are playing other white people And yet no complaints about Phil Lamarr playing a Japanese guy or Christopher Judge playing a Greek.
Hi, here is me complaining about it. Those things shouldn't happen either. Samurai Jack is finished though. This isn't about redubbing, this is about moving forward.
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Jun 27, 2020 6:14:46 GMT -5
Sorry, but some posts had to be moved. The ban on outright political talk still applies here. Carry on.
As for my take, I personally understand why they're going this route. Like others noted, it's also speaking to the issue of the lack of opportunity for marginalized talent in Hollywood overall. That's why it's not seen as taboo for Phil Lamarr to voice Samurai Jack as it is Mike Henry to play Cleveland Brown. It's sadly still more difficult for black actors to acquire those roles in general, much more than it would on average for someone like Henry to get the chance to play his part.
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Post by eJm on Jun 27, 2020 6:20:26 GMT -5
Sorry, but some posts had to be moved. The ban on outright political talk still applies here. Carry on.As for my take, I personally understand why they're going this route. Like others noted, it's also speaking to the issue of the lack of opportunity for marginalized talent in Hollywood overall. That's why it's not seen as taboo for Phil Lamarr to voice Samurai Jack as it is Mike Henry to play Cleveland Brown. It's sadly still more difficult for black actors to acquire those roles in general, much more than it would on average for someone like Henry to get the chance to play his part. Pretty much. And a lot of the people who get those roles are, as mentioned, the same 4-5 people that get those roles consistently. And yeah, wider scope of things, it’s not that big a deal but it’s only empty if a) nothing really happens on a wider level in terms of casting, production and even stories in entertainment or b) they just go “Hey Kevin Michael Richardson, can you do a Cleveland impression?” and we’re just back to where we started.
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Post by wildojinx on Jun 27, 2020 7:51:03 GMT -5
Let's hope the new VAs at least sound like the original character. It would be jarring to hear Dr. Hibbert with an incredibly deep voice, or Lou with a higher pitched voice. Maybe we can also get some more ethnicity with the children characters as well (save for Janey and Hibbert's kids, most of the kids in Springfield are all white kids).
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Post by HMARK Center on Jun 27, 2020 8:29:50 GMT -5
Sorry, but some posts had to be moved. The ban on outright political talk still applies here. Carry on.As for my take, I personally understand why they're going this route. Like others noted, it's also speaking to the issue of the lack of opportunity for marginalized talent in Hollywood overall. That's why it's not seen as taboo for Phil Lamarr to voice Samurai Jack as it is Mike Henry to play Cleveland Brown. It's sadly still more difficult for black actors to acquire those roles in general, much more than it would on average for someone like Henry to get the chance to play his part. That's the key: there is no major issue with white on screen actors or voice actors being underrepresented in the industry. There is an issue with non-white on screen actors and voice actors being underrepresented in the industry. Ergo, one issue stands to be addressed in some ways, while the opposite does not. Feels like a lot of bad faith arguments here to say something like "I guess a Canadian can't play an American anymore" when that's A - conflating nationality with ethnicity or race, which makes no sense, B - it's being used as a way to sidestep and avoid the issue of non-white actors having a more difficult time getting casted or breaking through into the industry, on average, and C - there's a world of difference between the potential harm that could be caused by stereotyping certain groups of people from the dominant/more powerful part of a population versus those in the margins - while most voice actors try to avoid stereotyping unless it's directly part of the job, it's not always easy to avoid even with good intentions (e.g. Azaria's Apu speaks with an accent all his own, but many have taken it as a generic Indian accent, which...it is not). I don't think anyone was going out of their way not to cast non-white actors, but that's how systemic stuff works: you don't do something harmful out of hatred, you do it because "that's just the way things are." Certain types of voices are "just the way things are"; "sorry you didn't get the part, your voice just comes across a bit too ethnic" or something like that is a real thing, because it doesn't fit what's considered the "normal" vocal range that a casting director might be looking for. I can agree that this isn't being done out of some benevolent, big-hearted gesture on the part of Fox or the team at The Simpsons, but I don't expect pure-hearted benevolence from major corporations or for-profit ventures in the first place. More than that, though, people need to start facing reality: the cast of The Simpsons aren't getting younger. If the show is truly going to be around in some form forever (and given its longevity, you just know that if it's canceled that there'll be attempts to revive it or reboot it in some way going forward), it's best to get used to the idea that you won't hear the old voices for that duration. Mel Blanc couldn't be Bugs Bunny or Daffy Duck forever, Clarence Nash had to train Tony Anselmo to take over as Donald Duck, this is what happens with legacy characters, and The Simpsons has been around and projects to be around long enough that "legacy" is the term that'll have to be applied.
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Post by Ganon83 on Jun 27, 2020 9:03:22 GMT -5
It’s zombie Simpsons, guys.
This changes nothing for me because I don’t watch past season 10, besides the movie.
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Post by Rocky Raccoon on Jun 27, 2020 9:45:39 GMT -5
I'm a very successful, but not well-known black cartoon voice actor. I have an extremely nuanced opinion when it comes to The Simpsons' casting and I've shared it here before, but I'll just say this for now:
Black voice actors getting the opportunity to audition for ONLY token black roles and nothing else, is a very, VERY common occurrence. Don't try to tell me looks don't matter if you've never worked a day in my industry. You're wrong. It SHOULDN'T matter. But it does.
It took me 7 YEARS of begging, pleading, stealing audition documents I wasn't supposed to have, and threatening my agent before I got anywhere near the level of opportunities my white colleagues got. My white colleagues who sometimes still got cast on the paltry number of black roles available anyway. I felt like quitting several times because there seemingly was no place for me. "Best actor for the part" is subjective, but you have no chance if you don't even get to try.
When I finally got the chance, I became one of the most dominant actors in my territory almost overnight.
In weathering the storm of garbage and overcoming this, I am one of the lucky ones. The exception, not the rule. For every "WHAT ABOUT PHIL LAMARR AND CREE SUMMER!!!!" I know 20 black actors going through exactly what I went through.
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Post by thechase on Jun 27, 2020 9:53:22 GMT -5
It’s zombie Simpsons, guys. This changes nothing for me because I don’t watch past season 10, besides the movie. To this day, I'm still working on what would make a good 'final' season of the programme, with a proper finale and everything. It's taken me across two forums so far.
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Post by James Fabiano on Jun 27, 2020 10:00:56 GMT -5
So what are they gonna do about anime dubs? Have them dubbed in Singapore, Philippines or Malaysia? Well most of them are representing Japanese characters, so you better get some Japanese people voicing them. You know, maybe this whole "dubbing" business should go out the window... (yes, this is sarcasm) Or at least go straight to HFIL ;-)
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Post by James Fabiano on Jun 27, 2020 10:06:08 GMT -5
The problem is that The Simpsons is still going. I mean, why are we even mad? When was the last time we sat and watched The Simpsons? What is the last episode you remember or quote. It's done. It's past it's point of relevance. Maybe 10 years ago, it does something, but now; getting mad over a ghost? I dunno, it's just one of those things where people get outraged over something even though people have long stopped caring. The irony is, I can assure you a good portion of the people complaining stopped watching the show regularly years, if not decades, ago and would not be interested at all in seeing an episode from recent history, but will bitch for the sake of bitching. If anything, this is just something to ensure that the cow keeps getting milked long after it's udder withered since that's all The Simpsons is good for nowadays. One such thing I notice is people feel like these changes invalidate the past; as long as the past exists and there's archival footage of it, what trouble is there to tinker with the formula? That was one reason why people had so many issues with George Lucas's constant meddling with the original Star Wars trilogy; it was constantly being adjusted even while it was in theaters. As far as we know, no original archived version of the films exist for public consumption, so anytime we get those films, we get stuff with more tacked-on content that is unnecessary. This also presents the issue I see with people having gripes with them removing Elmer Fudd's access to guns; older cartoons still exist, and even projects from recent years had used them. If one project decided "Nah, we'll do things differently due to how society is", that does not mean everything that existed beforehand should be wiped out or you must feel bad about it. It just represents the progression of society and how you choose to view it is on you. And yet, it's things like what Lucas did that makes people worry, and that he could get away with it and effectively "officially" erase the original versions of the OT so far. Yes it's the exception not the rule, but we've had flirting with it nonetheless... - The (brief) moratorium on the original version of E.T. - Certain Disney works being altered, and that's the "official" version. Has any version of Melody Time since the 90s brought back Pecos Bill's smoking habit (I remember them deleting his cigarette but keeping the animation!!) - The time Cartoon Network was showing chopped up versions of classic shorts (this was before the DVD collections and their warnings) - Other various examples of banned episodes.
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Jun 27, 2020 10:08:41 GMT -5
Don't know if it's our place to tell the Indian guy how-to feel about the white guy doing an Indian voice. Reality still applies. His main argument was he was Indian, he was in a Kwik-E-Mart and got called Apu. The VO changes none of that. Eventually people’s feelings and the real world have to merge. That’s a valid point, that I don’t know has really been addressed. Had Apu had an Indian voice actor from Day 1 would that have changed one thing about how the Apu character was written over the years? I mean, I get that minority representation in voice acting is piss poor but I’m not sure this is going to improve that much. If anything this may hand tie producers going forward, as they may start hiring more minority voice actors but pigeonhole them to strictly roles of their race. I’d much rather see animation producers announce people of all race can apply for all roles, if a black dude is the best voice for a white New Yorker then so be it. If a Hispanic guys totally nails the voice of a black character, then give’r. It’s an idealistic take, I understand that, but I just feel this current solution isn’t gonna open the opportunities as much as people hope.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 27, 2020 10:20:29 GMT -5
This is a tough call for me. As a hobbyist VA and now currently a casting director. The whole point of VA is picking the right person for the voice and not discriminate due to sex and color. But on the other hand POC VAs are under represented and I think it's a little odd that folks are now putting out casting calls for people of color instead of doing it before the protests. It makes me question the genuineness of gestures like these From my perspective, it comes off mostly as an empty gesture at best and tone-deaf at worst. If you want to utilize voice actors that are people of color, as previously said, studios can simply recycle the same three or four VAs or go to another field of entertainment to grab their voices, which only further reinforces that glass ceiling. And if you really don't want to put any effort into it, you can simply just not write minorities in your story, which makes your show less inclusive.
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