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Post by eJm on Jul 14, 2021 8:04:19 GMT -5
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Jul 14, 2021 15:39:32 GMT -5
If you weren't watching at the time it is really hard to describe the atmosphere of this show and its build.
So many mistakes in the booking, but it is a much more watchable time than you may remember.
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Post by eJm on Jul 14, 2021 15:42:16 GMT -5
If you weren't watching at the time it is really hard to describe the atmosphere of this show and its build. So many mistakes in the booking, but it is a much more watchable time than you may remember. It’s weird because looking back, it felt like a much bigger deal than it actually was because I was still in my naive mark phase (who knew it was fake because I was in a school with kids who wouldn’t let me have kayfabe, damnit). It was when Shawn Stasiak was bumping into walls that was my “take the red pill” moment and made me go “Wait, this storyline is shit!”
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Jul 14, 2021 15:45:11 GMT -5
If you weren't watching at the time it is really hard to describe the atmosphere of this show and its build. So many mistakes in the booking, but it is a much more watchable time than you may remember. It’s weird because looking back, it felt like a much bigger deal than it actually was because I was still in my naive mark phase (who knew it was fake because I was in a school with kids who wouldn’t let me have kayfabe, damnit). It was when Shawn Stasiak was bumping into walls that was my “take the red pill” moment and made me go “Wait, this storyline is shit!” You are right... but I still think that shit is funny
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Post by eJm on Jul 14, 2021 15:48:07 GMT -5
It’s weird because looking back, it felt like a much bigger deal than it actually was because I was still in my naive mark phase (who knew it was fake because I was in a school with kids who wouldn’t let me have kayfabe, damnit). It was when Shawn Stasiak was bumping into walls that was my “take the red pill” moment and made me go “Wait, this storyline is shit!” You are right... but I still think that shit is funny The weird thing is, any other time I likely would have. It was just that particular version of the segment that was the awakening and I have no idea why.
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Cranjis McBasketball
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Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Jul 14, 2021 18:03:15 GMT -5
I kind of disagree with his decision to bust up the theme of the InVasion with other PPVs, but I get why he did.
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Post by Celexa Bliss 54 on Jul 14, 2021 18:11:40 GMT -5
I kind of disagree with his decision to bust up the theme of the InVasion with other PPVs, but I get why he did. Well, I think the other thing is, he wants to cover each show in the month it happened, but he still needs to do one or two other PPVs each month. Plus this way he (as well as the viewers) don't get burnt out on 2001 WWE.
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Post by eJm on Jul 14, 2021 18:12:34 GMT -5
I kind of disagree with his decision to bust up the theme of the InVasion with other PPVs, but I get why he did. I think the thing would be that there’s a lot to the build of each PPV compared to something like the last days of WCW that spending your time going through and doing the research continuously (especially for a period like summer/fall 2001) will just drain the enthusiasm to do it.
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Cranjis McBasketball
Crow T. Robot
Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
Posts: 41,949
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Jul 14, 2021 18:27:18 GMT -5
I kind of disagree with his decision to bust up the theme of the InVasion with other PPVs, but I get why he did. I think the thing would be that there’s a lot to the build of each PPV compared to something like the last days of WCW that spending your time going through and doing the research continuously (especially for a period like summer/fall 2001) will just drain the enthusiasm to do it. I guess there’s that, and an easy thing for me to say is to cover any notable Raw and Smackdown in between.
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Post by Jumpin' Jesse Walsh on Jul 14, 2021 19:42:57 GMT -5
Perfect timing. Just watched this show recently.
For such a deeply flawed angle, there were so many little moments of greatness. That Freddie Blassie segment? I mean, wow.
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fw91
Patti Mayonnaise
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Post by fw91 on Jul 14, 2021 20:21:37 GMT -5
I know a lot of stars were in the main event, but that card is kind of shitty.
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Post by sarkerpolseng on Jul 14, 2021 22:52:26 GMT -5
I know a lot of stars were in the main event, but that card is kind of shitty. Besides RVD v. Hardy, I though this show sucked.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2021 4:36:23 GMT -5
First wrestling show I ever attended actually.
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Post by Cry Me a Wiggle on Jul 15, 2021 5:31:05 GMT -5
I know we're in the full-on InVasion nostalgia mode right now, but I'm the rare bird WCW fan who was excited about the WWF's incarnation of the company and couldn't quite fathom the whiplash I had from June to July, seeing all of my hopes for the brand completely disintegrate over the course of a week.
It gets lost down the memory hole, but WWF crowds WERE cheering for the WCW elements up until the first week in July. Had that first match not taken place in Tacoma, had it not been Buff, had McMahon actually let the storyline play out, had Heyman not been angling to sabotage it to get the WWF to use the ECW brand and bail him out... well, quite a lot of what-ifs. But beyond my own bitterness (because let's be honest: the WWF's version of WCW would have succumbed to the same idiocy that's sabotaged everything WWE-related for the past 20 years), it's still sobering to think that THIS was the dream WWF vs. WCW pay-per-view that we all fantasized about during the 1990s. Such a nothing show that was completely carried on the dreams of what we wanted it to be. Yes, it did an impressive buyrate, but the returns were quickly diminishing after this.
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Post by eJm on Jul 15, 2021 5:41:33 GMT -5
I know we're in the full-on InVasion nostalgia mode right now, but I'm the rare bird WCW fan who was excited about the WWF's incarnation of the company and couldn't quite fathom the whiplash I had from June to July, seeing all of my hopes for the brand completely disintegrate over the course of a week. It gets lost down the memory hole, but WWF crowds WERE cheering for the WCW elements up until the first week in July. Had that first match not taken place in Tacoma, had it not been Buff, had McMahon actually let the storyline play out, had Heyman not been angling to sabotage it to get the WWF to use the ECW brand and bail him out... well, quite a lot of what-ifs. But beyond my own bitterness (because let's be honest: the WWF's version of WCW would have succumbed to the same idiocy that's sabotaged everything WWE-related for the past 20 years), it's still sobering to think that THIS was the dream WWF vs. WCW pay-per-view that we all fantasized about during the 1990s. Such a nothing show that was completely carried on the dreams of what we wanted it to be. Yes, it did an impressive buyrate, but the returns were quickly diminishing after this. It's actually really cool to hear from a WCW fan who decided to take a chance and see how it went because it doesn't feel like we get that perspective much. It's more weird considering how WCW was doing in the final days with genuinely trying to build talent up (Palumbo/O'Haire, Stasiak, Jindrak etc) and just how they were kind of just thrown into the whole thing without much of a rhyme or reason, which felt weirder because they were the ones to book Palumbo/O'Haire as prominent for the last Nitro show so you would have thought it'd have lead to more? And as Zane points out as well, those first few weeks were this weird thing where the crowds were invested by doing the basic things and then the company were trying to balance "These are the big threats of the summer" with "These are pieces of shit and they don't stand up against our own talent" and it's like...of course stuff wasn't going to work. It'd be like if right after the debut of the Nexus on Raw, they got taken out by the main eventers on Smackdown. You just eroded any believability that these guys were any sort of threat.
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Jul 15, 2021 8:41:49 GMT -5
I know we're in the full-on InVasion nostalgia mode right now, but I'm the rare bird WCW fan who was excited about the WWF's incarnation of the company and couldn't quite fathom the whiplash I had from June to July, seeing all of my hopes for the brand completely disintegrate over the course of a week. It gets lost down the memory hole, but WWF crowds WERE cheering for the WCW elements up until the first week in July. Had that first match not taken place in Tacoma, had it not been Buff, had McMahon actually let the storyline play out, had Heyman not been angling to sabotage it to get the WWF to use the ECW brand and bail him out... well, quite a lot of what-ifs. But beyond my own bitterness (because let's be honest: the WWF's version of WCW would have succumbed to the same idiocy that's sabotaged everything WWE-related for the past 20 years), it's still sobering to think that THIS was the dream WWF vs. WCW pay-per-view that we all fantasized about during the 1990s. Such a nothing show that was completely carried on the dreams of what we wanted it to be. Yes, it did an impressive buyrate, but the returns were quickly diminishing after this. It's actually really cool to hear from a WCW fan who decided to take a chance and see how it went because it doesn't feel like we get that perspective much. It's more weird considering how WCW was doing in the final days with genuinely trying to build talent up (Palumbo/O'Haire, Stasiak, Jindrak etc) and just how they were kind of just thrown into the whole thing without much of a rhyme or reason, which felt weirder because they were the ones to book Palumbo/O'Haire as prominent for the last Nitro show so you would have thought it'd have lead to more? And as Zane points out as well, those first few weeks were this weird thing where the crowds were invested by doing the basic things and then the company were trying to balance "These are the big threats of the summer" with "These are pieces of shit and they don't stand up against our own talent" and it's like...of course stuff wasn't going to work. It'd be like if right after the debut of the Nexus on Raw, they got taken out by the main eventers on Smackdown. You just eroded any believability that these guys were any sort of threat. Actually given how the WCW guys got booked, it is more like the Nexus getting taken out by the midcard and below on Smackdown. I was watching WWF every week at this point and there were wrestlers I had never seen wrestle a match on TV who showed up to beat down Alliance guys, like the big stars they were...
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Sephiroth
Wade Wilson
Surviving
Posts: 28,961
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Post by Sephiroth on Jul 15, 2021 8:52:07 GMT -5
I know we're in the full-on InVasion nostalgia mode right now, but I'm the rare bird WCW fan who was excited about the WWF's incarnation of the company and couldn't quite fathom the whiplash I had from June to July, seeing all of my hopes for the brand completely disintegrate over the course of a week. It gets lost down the memory hole, but WWF crowds WERE cheering for the WCW elements up until the first week in July. Had that first match not taken place in Tacoma, had it not been Buff, had McMahon actually let the storyline play out, had Heyman not been angling to sabotage it to get the WWF to use the ECW brand and bail him out... well, quite a lot of what-ifs. But beyond my own bitterness (because let's be honest: the WWF's version of WCW would have succumbed to the same idiocy that's sabotaged everything WWE-related for the past 20 years), it's still sobering to think that THIS was the dream WWF vs. WCW pay-per-view that we all fantasized about during the 1990s. Such a nothing show that was completely carried on the dreams of what we wanted it to be. Yes, it did an impressive buyrate, but the returns were quickly diminishing after this. It's actually really cool to hear from a WCW fan who decided to take a chance and see how it went because it doesn't feel like we get that perspective much. It's more weird considering how WCW was doing in the final days with genuinely trying to build talent up (Palumbo/O'Haire, Stasiak, Jindrak etc) and just how they were kind of just thrown into the whole thing without much of a rhyme or reason, which felt weirder because they were the ones to book Palumbo/O'Haire as prominent for the last Nitro show so you would have thought it'd have lead to more? And as Zane points out as well, those first few weeks were this weird thing where the crowds were invested by doing the basic things and then the company were trying to balance "These are the big threats of the summer" with "These are pieces of shit and they don't stand up against our own talent" and it's like...of course stuff wasn't going to work. It'd be like if right after the debut of the Nexus on Raw, they got taken out by the main eventers on Smackdown. You just eroded any believability that these guys were any sort of threat. I remember feeling really bad for Shane Helms in that period before he created The Hurricane. In those final weeks if WCW they were pushing him hard, probably as part of Bischoff’s plan to revamp the cruiserwreights; put the bekt on him, have him an elaborate entrance with the nitro girls, put him on a win streak, etc. And then in his WWE debut he has no throne music and his entrance consists of just wearing a glittery robe-and he loses the belt to Kidman to boot. He deserves all credit for salvaging his career after they let down.
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Ben Wyatt
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I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Jul 15, 2021 8:53:20 GMT -5
What's...amazing? Frustrating? Annoying? about it is that there was SO much gold within it, and even as they were screwing it up, you can see potential salvaging points in hindsight that they just didn't go with
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Post by eJm on Jul 15, 2021 8:55:12 GMT -5
It's actually really cool to hear from a WCW fan who decided to take a chance and see how it went because it doesn't feel like we get that perspective much. It's more weird considering how WCW was doing in the final days with genuinely trying to build talent up (Palumbo/O'Haire, Stasiak, Jindrak etc) and just how they were kind of just thrown into the whole thing without much of a rhyme or reason, which felt weirder because they were the ones to book Palumbo/O'Haire as prominent for the last Nitro show so you would have thought it'd have lead to more? And as Zane points out as well, those first few weeks were this weird thing where the crowds were invested by doing the basic things and then the company were trying to balance "These are the big threats of the summer" with "These are pieces of shit and they don't stand up against our own talent" and it's like...of course stuff wasn't going to work. It'd be like if right after the debut of the Nexus on Raw, they got taken out by the main eventers on Smackdown. You just eroded any believability that these guys were any sort of threat. Actually given how the WCW guys got booked, it is more like the Nexus getting taken out by the midcard and below on Smackdown. I was watching WWF every week at this point and there were wrestlers I had never seen wrestle a match on TV who showed up to beat down Alliance guys, like the big stars they were... Oh yeah, when the entire lower midcard and the APA wrecked O'Haire/Palumbo just after they ran in to cost them the match. Because, you know, why have moments like that settle and breathe? What are we, a wrestling company on TV?
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Jul 15, 2021 9:41:51 GMT -5
What's...amazing? Frustrating? Annoying? about it is that there was SO much gold within it, and even as they were screwing it up, you can see potential salvaging points in hindsight that they just didn't go with Mike Awesome (ignoring his own shortcomings) was woefully misused. But his first 60 seconds in the company? Attacking Rhyno out of nowhere and winning the hardcore title? Might be one of my top 10 biggest mark out moments ever
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