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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Sept 7, 2021 16:38:53 GMT -5
and what's worse is the WWE seems completely aware of the problem... they (read Vince) Don't care. How many times have they openly pointed out issues on their show ON the show? No,you got it upside down. Vince is aware we THINK it is the problem. But Vince thinks we are wrong. That is more or less the short of it I believe. He gives out little morsel, like when he absolutely buried Corbin for killing the show, but he doesn't think that's actually the problem. It's getting heat, it can't be the problem in his eyes. Making your company the primary heel is not a smart long term strategy
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bob
Salacious Crumb
The "other" Bob. FOC COURSE!
started the Madness Wars, Proudly the #1 Nana Hater on FAN
Posts: 78,475
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Post by bob on Sept 7, 2021 17:00:44 GMT -5
Mick is right
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FHgrad99
Vegeta
Never mind that s***, here comes Mongo!
Posts: 9,024
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Post by FHgrad99 on Sept 7, 2021 17:07:29 GMT -5
Unfortunately, no matter how right Mick Foley is in his assessment of the WWE, I don't think his words will really matter to Vince and Co. Vince does need to change the creative direction of his company but I think he's too stubborn to do it.
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john84
Fry's dog Seymour
Proud Father of 3 :)
Posts: 23,860
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Post by john84 on Sept 7, 2021 17:37:36 GMT -5
Yeah, the guy's looking great nowadays which is awesome to see. I'm not far off from rewatching the start of his WWE career in 1996 on the Network. I was 4 when he debuted as Mankind and he terrified the SHIT out of me. I was 12 when he started at WWE, bare in mind I didn't have access to ECW back then and didn't really watch WCW till after he left so I was completely new to him and the creepy promos he used to do in WWE were awesome, his feud with Taker is one of my favourite Taker memories and that was BEFORE the Hell in a Cell match. Good times
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Legion
Fry's dog Seymour
Amy Pond's #1 fan
Hail Hydra!
Posts: 22,857
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Post by Legion on Sept 7, 2021 17:41:43 GMT -5
It's Mick Foley, that'll be the most money he's spent on anything in his life. I know, but it takes a lot out of your statement when you cheap out on your outrage and clearly leave the actual worthwhile screens undisturbed. Dude broke his son's spare computer monitor. Talking of his son, he still works there as a writer. Or maybe did, until Vince sees this.
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Pushed to the Moon
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Tony Schiavone in Disguise
Working myself into a shoot
Posts: 15,819
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Post by Pushed to the Moon on Sept 7, 2021 17:56:19 GMT -5
I don't watch AEW regularly and I'm not a WWE hater by any means but I saw All Out and the vibe of it was just totally different. It felt new and fresh and vibrant and exciting. Also I watched the press conferences with Bryan, Punk, Cole and Ruby on youtube after too and they just sound SO happy to be there it's crazy. It might have just been the hysteria cos the crowd was so hot with all the debuts etc but you really get the sense the company is about to really take off.
If I was a young aspiring wrestler then I'd still probably want to go to WWE as it's obviously still THE ultimate wrestling company in the world historically and from a prestige point of view and the training facilities are top notch but if I was one of those established guys in their mid 30 to early 40s like Bryan etc then it's easy to see why you'd go to AEW instead. Obviously WWE isn't in any immediate "trouble" like going out of business tomorrow or anything but just purely from a cool factor, the two companies are trending in opposite directions which could be a problem in the long run.
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thehottag
Don Corleone
We're here for one reason only: fame, fortune, & the World Wrestling Federation Tag Team Champions!
Posts: 1,668
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Post by thehottag on Sept 7, 2021 18:34:03 GMT -5
No,you got it upside down. Vince is aware we THINK it is the problem. But Vince thinks we are wrong. I actually think deep down Vince knows there is a problem, he just has no idea how to fix it, & isn't willing to stand aside to let someone else try.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2021 20:02:27 GMT -5
Vince is not in the business of producing "good" (according to internet fans) pro wrestling. He's in the business of making money, and doing quite well in that department. He is also a 70 year old billionaire; no matter what happens, he is going to die rich. He doesn't need to care. Sure, how the WWE will fare after he's gone is another question, but that's not his problem.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2021 20:04:20 GMT -5
With out Al Snow stealing every wrestling trope in history.
OVW wouldn’t be the bonkers show it is every week.
I seriously can’t recommend it enough.
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Post by Triangle Lancer on Sept 7, 2021 20:08:30 GMT -5
Yeah, the guy's looking great nowadays which is awesome to see. I'm not far off from rewatching the start of his WWE career in 1996 on the Network. I was 4 when he debuted as Mankind and he terrified the SHIT out of me. Lol, my daughter was not even 1 and scared of Mankind also...this was dress shirt era Mick in 1999. Satanic Undertaker? She was fine with, cause that was Mommy's favorite.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2021 20:14:36 GMT -5
People on the internet always talk about the WWE like it's objectively bad, and are on the verge of dying unless they listen to the internet fans. But they are making money. They are thriving. It doesn't appeal to us, but they're not trying to. It's not their goal.
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Post by smokinvokoun86 on Sept 7, 2021 20:20:46 GMT -5
He didn’t say anything that me or other haven’t said before. But I would think him saying it has a lot more weight than when I say it.
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Post by eJm on Sept 7, 2021 20:25:21 GMT -5
People on the internet always talk about the WWE like it's objectively bad, and are on the verge of dying unless they listen to the internet fans. But they are making money. They are thriving. It doesn't appeal to us, but they're not trying to. It's not their goal. I mean…nobody has said that? So I don’t know where you get that from. And I also don’t know what that has to do with addressing the problems they’ve had for decades now. They’ll still make the same amount if they solve them.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2021 20:27:06 GMT -5
People on the internet always talk about the WWE like it's objectively bad, and are on the verge of dying unless they listen to the internet fans. But they are making money. They are thriving. It doesn't appeal to us, but they're not trying to. It's not their goal. I mean…nobody has said that? So I don’t know where you get that from. And I also don’t know what that has to do with addressing the problems they’ve had for decades now. They’ll still make the same amount if they solve them. Maybe they don't think there is a problem. Maybe it isn't a problem. I dunno.
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Post by eJm on Sept 7, 2021 20:30:27 GMT -5
I mean…nobody has said that? So I don’t know where you get that from. And I also don’t know what that has to do with addressing the problems they’ve had for decades now. They’ll still make the same amount if they solve them. Maybe they don't think there is a problem. Maybe it isn't a problem. I dunno. But it comes off like you’re saying we shouldn’t be talking about the problems because they make money regardless which, I mean, doesn’t really apply to most other companies who also make loads of money.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2021 20:33:39 GMT -5
Maybe they don't think there is a problem. Maybe it isn't a problem. I dunno. But it comes off like you’re saying we shouldn’t be talking about the problems because they make money regardless which, I mean, doesn’t really apply to most other companies who also make loads of money. Just the doom and gloom is funny. I remember vividly back in around 2003 when WWE was basically about to go out of business because it sucked so much and didn't book like Ring of Honor.
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Sept 7, 2021 20:34:35 GMT -5
I mean…nobody has said that? So I don’t know where you get that from. And I also don’t know what that has to do with addressing the problems they’ve had for decades now. They’ll still make the same amount if they solve them. Maybe they don't think there is a problem. Maybe it isn't a problem. I dunno. Nah there's definitely a problem. Ratings falls outpace television on average. Merch sales tumble year on year. Live attendance fell quarterly pre-pandemic. The majority of their money right now, more than ever before, is coming from other businesses as they sell themselves more and more to the industry than to a dwindling aaudience. These are objective facts their own financials bear out. This isn't internet fans going "my fave isn't pushed so the show is bad and they need to listen to me".
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Post by eJm on Sept 7, 2021 20:34:50 GMT -5
But it comes off like you’re saying we shouldn’t be talking about the problems because they make money regardless which, I mean, doesn’t really apply to most other companies who also make loads of money. Just the doom and gloom is funny. I remember vividly back in around 2003 when WWE was basically about to go out of business because it sucked so much and didn't book like Ring of Honor. Ok. Doesn’t really have to do with my point, though.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2021 20:34:55 GMT -5
On the real, I feel a lot of what Mick's saying but the reality is a lot of younger talent aren't going to think "damn, WWE or AEW" when their lights are about to go off. They'll go with the money exactly like all that other talent who signed with the company less than a month ago. Yeah, it's different for more experienced indie talent who are known a little bit but the younger younger talent nah, that doesn't apply to them. They'll just see "WWE wants me, imma go" and that'll be it.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2021 20:38:06 GMT -5
Maybe they don't think there is a problem. Maybe it isn't a problem. I dunno. Nah there's definitely a problem. Ratings falls outpace television on average. Merch sales tumble year on year. Live attendance fell quarterly pre-pandemic. The majority of their money right now, more than ever before, is coming from other businesses as they sell themselves more and more to the industry than to a dwindling aaudience. These are objective facts their own financials bear out. This isn't internet fans going "my fave isn't pushed so the show is bad and they need to listen to me". But isn't that their business model now? Basically B2B, the money coming in from other businesses. They're basically just a content creation machine.
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