WWE Champion Big E isn't working.

[Lizuka #BLM]

And it's not at all his fault, but they seem to steadfastly refuse to actually put him into any kind of position to feel like a main eventer. Between the way they're just having him aimlessly drift from feud to feud with no clear direction in mind, him winning the belt out of nowhere to pop a rating rather than them actually bothering to build to it, and now sacrificing him at the alter of Roman, it feels less like they elevated him to the main event scene and more like he brought the belt to the midcard and it sucks.

[Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]]

He made Roman look strong. That's all that ever matters. So he's truly doing a good job for WWE Management...

[El Cokehead del Knife Fight]

It doesn't help that he's been kinda made to look like a goober. Even tonight Roman spent the whole match talking about how he didn't belong and then went and beat Big E clean to no pop because the fans thought it was building to something big.

[Deleted]

You nailed it...it does not feel like E got elevated but that he brought the WWE title to the midcard.

["Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik]

He's being booked like he's the Intercontinental Champion while Brock is away with the real belt.

[Chiral]

They blew it when they skipped his final climb up the mountain to the top to pop a rating. Even if he's not cashing in on Reigns, have him tell Lashley he's coming for him fairly to beat the shit out of him for what he did to Kofi and Xavier. Instead they just did a comic book superhero reboot where he's the champion now, combined with a Punk 2012 "you're the champion, but we lowered the belt to you instead of raising your profile up to it."

It's f***ing depressing.

[El Cokehead del Knife Fight]

Nov 21, 2021 23:42:26 GMT -5 @sigmax said:

You nailed it...it does not feel like E got elevated but that he brought the WWE title to the midcard.

Just like when the World Heavyweight Title was a thing.

[Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]]

He won the MITB in a fluke way with Bobby Lashley having an injured leg

Doesn't shock me that they don't really treat him on the level of other talent and won't give him that big definitive win. He feels like a placeholder and it's incredibly disappointing.

He's world champion and he'll always be on the record books... but yeah... WWE just don't get it.

[Deleted]

I completely disagree with this. The issue isn't that a "Big E isn't being booked as a world champion." The issue is Reigns and how they book every champion on the roster. Saying he's like a midcarder now is just false because on Raw he's definitely built up as being the lead champion there, he's the lead guy. If we break it down to as to what makes a "WWE Champion"...

Big E is one of the most popular people on the roster, he's great on the mic, great in the ring, he can be in multiple segments and things will go fine. He's got that. Tonight's one of the only times he hasn't had the crowd behind him over his opponents. Don't let one night trick you into thinking that's how everybody thinks because you and others might not like Big E, this is Brooklyn.

Out of all the world champions I've seen these past years, hell maybe decade, Big E's the one I'm seeing get all the mainstream press, even more than Becky had. He's at these real sporting events promoting himself, on known popular shows like The Breakfast Club, he's always being brought up outside of the WWE bubble so from a mainstream perspective, he's making it work. I haven't seen any world champion be in that many outlets this past decade. Hell he was just doing it again this weekend.

In the WWE bubble Big E's only lost 3 matches since becoming WWE Champion. One is this Reigns match, one was a tag match by count out and another was that 3 person tag last week where Riddle lost it for their team. From a defense and "hey this guy's better than everyone else on this brand" perspective he's got that. If we're talking about Big E going from "feud to feud with no direction"...that's every single champion in this company. If we're talking about Reigns being better than Big E...Reigns is presented as being better than everyone and they're clearly sacrificing Big E for Reigns because of this Reigns/Rock match that we're definitely getting now after tonight's show, it's obvious.

Big E is presented as a WWE Champion and he's working. The only thing you can do to make him better is him having a pure arc as champion (which almost nobody has had this past decade) and for him to be better than Reigns. What he isn't presented as is being the best WWE Champion possible because you've got Reigns out there and because this company isn't booking any champion right and that is also including Reigns. Saying Big E isn't working is like saying nobody is working because everybody's in the same boat. If that's the case the thread needs to be "no champion is working" rather than singling out Big E because he's working better than all of them.

I think this is just, again, an issue with Reigns and an issue with how they book champions. It doesn't matter how great Big E can be because he'll always be under Reigns in their eye and with that said it doesn't matter what Reigns does because he's still not being booked as best he can be. 

[Jindrak Mark]

The most annoying part of it is that it would have been SO easy to give him a big win tonight without even having to make Roman look bad or give away his first big clean loss.

Like, have a great 20 minute match, Brock's music hits, Roman looks concerned and is distracted, turns around and gets the Big Ending and is pinned. Then you can show Kofi/Xavier in the production truck laughing. It would be such a New Day thing to do and would make complete sense while also furthering the Roman/Brock thing. Or hell, if you don't want to do the New Day thing then leave it ambiguous as to who played the music and have Roman question if it was Heyman's doing and wondering if he's secretly back in cahoots with Brock.

[Chiral]

Nov 21, 2021 23:47:25 GMT -5 El Cokehead del Knife Fight said:

Nov 21, 2021 23:42:26 GMT -5 @sigmax said:

You nailed it...it does not feel like E got elevated but that he brought the WWE title to the midcard.

Just like when the World Heavyweight Title was a thing.

It might've been just me being young and starting watching in 03, but I feel like there was a time they at least tried to make the world titles both seem big. Then around like 2011 they were like "no, one's absolutely the cool one and one is the lame one, and also both titles suck compared to Cena/HHH/Brock/Undertaker/etc. when they don't have them soooooo" and it's like we're repeating that time period now

[Gus Richlen Was Wrong]

Nov 21, 2021 23:47:35 GMT -5 Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] said:

He won the MITB in a fluke way with Bobby Lashley having an injured leg

Doesn't shock me that they don't really treat him on the level of other talent and won't give him that big definitive win. He feels like a placeholder and it's incredibly disappointing.

He's world champion and he'll always be on the record books... but yeah... WWE just don't get it.

There's an effort put in and you can tell they do care given they had to essentially hobble him for him to lose (though it took a bit longer than it should have to remember to have him sell that), but when Roman's getting more support chants for part of the match despite being the biggest heel in the yard, it's clear that it's not enough.

[Captain Stud Muffin (BLM)]

Big disagree from me

He is over and did not look out of place with Roman tonight. He doesn't have the challengers set up the way Kofi did but he looks and feels the part of champion

[Cranjis McBasketball]

You can't have a guy in a comedy tag team, no matter how successful, cash in like a heel and then turn his character on a dime and expect it's gonna work.

I dunno if the crowd was bored or just knew Roman was winning or just waiting for Rock, but it was pretty quiet for Big E tonight when normally the guy is massively over.

[Captain Stud Muffin (BLM)]

Nov 21, 2021 23:47:53 GMT -5 @kn said:

I completely disagree with this. The issue isn't that a "Big E isn't being booked as a world champion." The issue is Reigns and how they book every champion on the roster. Saying he's like a midcarder now is just false because on Raw he's definitely built up as being the lead champion there, he's the lead guy. If we break it down to as to what makes a "WWE Champion"...

Big E is one of the most popular people on the roster, he's great on the mic, great in the ring, he can be in multiple segments and things will go fine. He's got that. Tonight's one of the only times he hasn't had the crowd behind him over his opponents. Don't let one night trick you into thinking that's how everybody thinks because you and others might not like Big E, this is Brooklyn.

Out of all the world champions I've seen these past years, hell maybe decade, Big E's the one I'm seeing get all the mainstream press, even more than Becky had. He's at these real sporting events promoting himself, on known popular shows like The Breakfast Club, he's always being brought up outside of the WWE bubble so from a mainstream perspective, he's making it work. I haven't seen any world champion be in that many outlets this past decade. Hell he was just doing it again this weekend.

In the WWE bubble Big E's only lost 3 matches since becoming WWE Champion. One is this Reigns match, one was a tag match by count out and another was that 3 person tag last week where Riddle lost it for their team. From a defense and "hey this guy's better than everyone else on this brand" perspective he's got that. If we're talking about Big E going from "feud to feud with no direction"...that's every single champion in this company. If we're talking about Reigns being better than Big E...Reigns is presented as being better than everyone and they're clearly sacrificing Big E for Reigns because of this Reigns/Rock match that we're definitely getting now after tonight's show, it's obvious.

Big E is presented as a WWE Champion and he's working. The only thing you can do to make him better is him having a pure arc as champion (which almost nobody has had this past decade) and for him to be better than Reigns. What he isn't presented as is being the best WWE Champion possible because you've got Reigns out there and because this company isn't booking any champion right and that is also including Reigns. Saying Big E isn't working is like saying nobody is working because everybody's in the same boat. If that's the case the thread needs to be "no champion is working" rather than singling out Big E because he's working better than all of them.

I think this is just, again, an issue with Reigns and an issue with how they book champions. It doesn't matter how great Big E can be because he'll always be under Reigns in their eye and with that said it doesn't matter what Reigns does because he's still not being booked as best he can be. 

He was presented in "Romans league" for someone who has been a multi champion and on the hottest streak of his career and a first time champion who is stepping into the big time circle for the first time 

Roman at points looked confused and basically gave him that same respect he gave Drew last year like this guy isn't the same as the one I faced before. Roman beat him clean after a hard fought match, so be it. Big E lost nothing in this match and this gives him steam as a babyface character. Should he get himself so amped up that he losses focus of the goal and heels have ammo to use on him 

[Lizuka #BLM]

I might be more inclined to think that Big E might actually have gained something from a competitive match if not for the fact that everyone supposedly benefits from working with Roman only to become immediately irrelevant. After 700 other times the past year of people taking Roman to the limit only for it to mean jack and shit I don't see any reason to put any stock in it this time.

[Deleted]

Nov 22, 2021 0:06:14 GMT -5 Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) said:

Nov 21, 2021 23:47:53 GMT -5 @kn said:

I completely disagree with this. The issue isn't that a "Big E isn't being booked as a world champion." The issue is Reigns and how they book every champion on the roster. Saying he's like a midcarder now is just false because on Raw he's definitely built up as being the lead champion there, he's the lead guy. If we break it down to as to what makes a "WWE Champion"...

Big E is one of the most popular people on the roster, he's great on the mic, great in the ring, he can be in multiple segments and things will go fine. He's got that. Tonight's one of the only times he hasn't had the crowd behind him over his opponents. Don't let one night trick you into thinking that's how everybody thinks because you and others might not like Big E, this is Brooklyn.

Out of all the world champions I've seen these past years, hell maybe decade, Big E's the one I'm seeing get all the mainstream press, even more than Becky had. He's at these real sporting events promoting himself, on known popular shows like The Breakfast Club, he's always being brought up outside of the WWE bubble so from a mainstream perspective, he's making it work. I haven't seen any world champion be in that many outlets this past decade. Hell he was just doing it again this weekend.

In the WWE bubble Big E's only lost 3 matches since becoming WWE Champion. One is this Reigns match, one was a tag match by count out and another was that 3 person tag last week where Riddle lost it for their team. From a defense and "hey this guy's better than everyone else on this brand" perspective he's got that. If we're talking about Big E going from "feud to feud with no direction"...that's every single champion in this company. If we're talking about Reigns being better than Big E...Reigns is presented as being better than everyone and they're clearly sacrificing Big E for Reigns because of this Reigns/Rock match that we're definitely getting now after tonight's show, it's obvious.

Big E is presented as a WWE Champion and he's working. The only thing you can do to make him better is him having a pure arc as champion (which almost nobody has had this past decade) and for him to be better than Reigns. What he isn't presented as is being the best WWE Champion possible because you've got Reigns out there and because this company isn't booking any champion right and that is also including Reigns. Saying Big E isn't working is like saying nobody is working because everybody's in the same boat. If that's the case the thread needs to be "no champion is working" rather than singling out Big E because he's working better than all of them.

I think this is just, again, an issue with Reigns and an issue with how they book champions. It doesn't matter how great Big E can be because he'll always be under Reigns in their eye and with that said it doesn't matter what Reigns does because he's still not being booked as best he can be. 

He was presented in "Romans league" for someone who has been a multi champion and on the hottest streak of his career and a first time champion who is stepping into the big time circle for the first time 

Roman at points looked confused and basically gave him that same respect he gave Drew last year like this guy isn't the same as the one I faced before. Roman beat him clean after a hard fought match, so be it. Big E lost nothing in this match and this gives him steam as a babyface character. Should he get himself so amped up that he losses focus of the goal and heels have ammo to use on him 

Yeah he's fine. I imagine if the Rock card wasn't in play things might have gone differently or at least Reigns cheated or something to win. Given we had that segment with Vince talking about Rock, the fact Reigns did the Rock Bottom, like it's pretty clear they had Reigns beat Big E clean as a sheet because they want it justified that Reigns is the strongest and he's going to face Rock.

It's the same thing they did with the whole Cena/Punk thing where the winner faced Rock. Cena beat the strongest guy on the roster (Punk) to show he's next up.

Ain't nothing different.

[EoE: Well There's Your Problem]

Nov 22, 2021 0:10:41 GMT -5 Lizuka #BLM said:

I might be more inclined to think that Big E might actually have gained something from a competitive match if not for the fact that everyone supposedly benefits from working with Roman only to become immediately irrelevant. After 700 other times the past year of people taking Roman to the limit only for it to mean jack and shit I don't see any reason to put any stock in it this time.

If the actual reigning world champion of the other brand drops off the face of the earth the same way as all those challengers did while still the champion, then that's a serious issue.

(How much grace would we give for that before we say that he didn't drop off?)

[polarbearpete]

Hard disagree on that. Big E is awesome and feels like he’s a legitimate main eventer that made a tier jump (similar to Drew last year).

[Deleted]

He was never main event calibre in my opinion.

Lashley should've kept the title till he met Lesnar at WM.