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Post by Bang Bang Bart on Feb 19, 2023 22:07:39 GMT -5
The solution to WWE having two over marketable baby faces isn’t to turn one of them heel When I was a kid in 2004, Eddie Guerrero and John Cena were both the most popular and marketable faces in the company. Now Cena was a 26 year old kid at the time, but Eddie was more white hot and it was HIS year and Cena was still given the US title and we all know what happened the year after. Sami winning the tag titles will be his Cena Mania XX moment, and then next year he can win the wwe championship. Heck, I’d let Sami win the Rumble next year to complete the analogy.
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Post by 1 Free Moon-Down with Burger on Feb 19, 2023 22:13:32 GMT -5
When I was a kid in 2004, Eddie Guerrero and John Cena were both the most popular and marketable faces in the company. Now Cena was a 26 year old kid at the time, but Eddie was more white hot and it was HIS year and Cena was still given the US title and we all know what happened the year after. Sami winning the tag titles will be his Cena Mania XX moment, and then next year he can win the wwe championship. Heck, I’d let Sami win the Rumble next year to complete the analogy. That or MITB for sure.
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mc74
Samurai Cop
Posts: 2,410
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Post by mc74 on Feb 19, 2023 23:51:46 GMT -5
Being in Montreal, part of me was afraid of seeing a screwjob type of finish, but thankfully that suspicion was put to rest. That was one damn fine match between the two. The way it was executed, it was très magnifique!
Once again, I suggest to everyone not to sleep on the tag team title match at Wrestlemania. The division may have been shoddy for years, but we've got something truly special here.
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Mozenrath
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Speedy Speed Boy
Posts: 121,219
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Post by Mozenrath on Feb 19, 2023 23:58:09 GMT -5
Heck, I’d let Sami win the Rumble next year to complete the analogy. That or MITB for sure. Hell, have him break out the handcuffs spot again, just do it on someone trying to interfere in the match so it's a face move.
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Post by Bang Bang Bart on Feb 20, 2023 0:25:49 GMT -5
Being in Montreal, part of me was afraid of seeing a screwjob type of finish, but thankfully that suspicion was put to rest. That was one damn fine match between the two. The way it was executed, it was très magnifique! Once again, I suggest to everyone not to sleep on the tag team title match at Wrestlemania. The division may have been shoddy for years, but we've got something truly special here. WWE has a chance to elevate the tag division much in the same way the Intercontinental Title has been raised in credibility with Gunther's run. KO and Sami being the forefront of this can only be a good thing.
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J. Hova
Don Corleone
Emotionally exhausted and morally bankrupt
Posts: 2,013
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Post by J. Hova on Feb 20, 2023 0:34:27 GMT -5
I really liked the match but it just felt like the finish was flat. I don't know what I'd do differently, maybe the guillotine and Sami passing out rather than tapping.
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Post by eJm on Feb 20, 2023 2:45:40 GMT -5
I will say, thinking about it more, sticking to a direction because you set it honestly feels like going away from what the beauty of pro wrestling is.
Most TV shows, most movies, most entertainment cannot pivot and change as quickly to things going on around them as pro wrestling can. You don’t need to stick to a story because it’s there, if something factors into it that changes, you can make it work and make money from that change. That’s what makes it such an art form and a changing scope. It’s why Mick Foley won the title from The Rock or how Daniel Bryan got the main event and many other examples.
The rules of storytelling are much more flexible here. And that’s why having Sami win and then losing it before ‘Mania or losing it at ‘Mania in a three way or whatever wouldn’t matter as much if you tell the story well. As it is…I don’t know, sort of feels like that philosophy of the modern Vince booking never really left HHH regardless of Vince was back on the board or not.
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Post by carp (SPC, Itoh Respect Army) on Feb 20, 2023 2:53:25 GMT -5
Being in Montreal, part of me was afraid of seeing a screwjob type of finish, but thankfully that suspicion was put to rest. That was one damn fine match between the two. The way it was executed, it was très magnifique! Once again, I suggest to everyone not to sleep on the tag team title match at Wrestlemania. The division may have been shoddy for years, but we've got something truly special here. WWE has a chance to elevate the tag division much in the same way the Intercontinental Title has been raised in credibility with Gunther's run. KO and Sami being the forefront of this can only be a good thing. I have a very hard time imagining this would especially work. It's kind of the worst sort of situation for making the tag division feel important on its own, since he's jumping into it immediately after failing on the singles main event scene.
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Post by eJm on Feb 20, 2023 3:12:06 GMT -5
Being in Montreal, part of me was afraid of seeing a screwjob type of finish, but thankfully that suspicion was put to rest. That was one damn fine match between the two. The way it was executed, it was très magnifique! Once again, I suggest to everyone not to sleep on the tag team title match at Wrestlemania. The division may have been shoddy for years, but we've got something truly special here. WWE has a chance to elevate the tag division much in the same way the Intercontinental Title has been raised in credibility with Gunther's run. KO and Sami being the forefront of this can only be a good thing. I’d say the problem is; what then? Because the tag scene around them would be The Usos, the New Day and a bunch of goobers for the most part. Especially since there’s potential the Street Profits are breaking up soon. With WWE’s history with tag teams, you can’t have this payoff and then expect people to care about Zayn/Owens vs. The Good Brothers. That’s just not going to happen.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2023 3:26:12 GMT -5
If it makes anyone feel better, statistically speaking it's much more likely Cody loses to Roman at Wrestlemania the same way Sami, Drew, and the rest did!!!!!!!! At this point I’d love to see it just for the reaction
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Post by stoptheclocks on Feb 20, 2023 3:36:02 GMT -5
Main event faces in WWE generally have a pretty short shelf life before everyone starts hating them, so there's certainly no need to prematurely turn one who is currently universally over.
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Mozenrath
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Post by Mozenrath on Feb 20, 2023 3:53:48 GMT -5
WWE has a chance to elevate the tag division much in the same way the Intercontinental Title has been raised in credibility with Gunther's run. KO and Sami being the forefront of this can only be a good thing. I’d say the problem is; what then? Because the tag scene around them would be The Usos, the New Day and a bunch of goobers for the most part. Especially since there’s potential the Street Profits are breaking up soon. With WWE’s history with tag teams, you can’t have this payoff and then expect people to care about Zayn/Owens vs. The Good Brothers. That’s just not going to happen. I think they'd have enough good will to carry the division for a few months, at least, but the issue is going to be if WWE invests that time wisely. I do think they could handle guys like the Imperium, etc, too, people who generally the Usos aren't dealing with because they're heels, anyway. That, too, is at least something, that the alignment will be different, and it's considerably easier to do face vs face with tag teams than it is with heel vs heel.
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Post by eJm on Feb 20, 2023 4:29:13 GMT -5
I’d say the problem is; what then? Because the tag scene around them would be The Usos, the New Day and a bunch of goobers for the most part. Especially since there’s potential the Street Profits are breaking up soon. With WWE’s history with tag teams, you can’t have this payoff and then expect people to care about Zayn/Owens vs. The Good Brothers. That’s just not going to happen. I think they'd have enough good will to carry the division for a few months, at least, but the issue is going to be if WWE invests that time wisely. I do think they could handle guys like the Imperium, etc, too, people who generally the Usos aren't dealing with because they're heels, anyway. That, too, is at least something, that the alignment will be different, and it's considerably easier to do face vs face with tag teams than it is with heel vs heel. That is true and fair. It’s just I’ve been around long enough as a fan since 2001 to see every tag team resurgence come along and die rapidly and quickly when people in charge just lose interest and have the top star beat them in a handicap match or the two single stars dominate everyone in a battle Royale and only lose because one turned on the other, things like that.
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Feb 20, 2023 6:26:57 GMT -5
I think they'd have enough good will to carry the division for a few months, at least, but the issue is going to be if WWE invests that time wisely. I do think they could handle guys like the Imperium, etc, too, people who generally the Usos aren't dealing with because they're heels, anyway. That, too, is at least something, that the alignment will be different, and it's considerably easier to do face vs face with tag teams than it is with heel vs heel. That is true and fair. It’s just I’ve been around long enough as a fan since 2001 to see every tag team resurgence come along and die rapidly and quickly when people in charge just lose interest and have the top star beat them in a handicap match or the two single stars dominate everyone in a battle Royale and only lose because one turned on the other, things like that. And it's hard to really see, "Yeah, but Triple H is in charge now!" as much of a consolation because for most of its existence NXT's tag division's been a ghost town and presently nothing even slightly resembling an attempt to make people care about the Women's Tag division is happening.
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Post by eJm on Feb 20, 2023 6:42:07 GMT -5
That is true and fair. It’s just I’ve been around long enough as a fan since 2001 to see every tag team resurgence come along and die rapidly and quickly when people in charge just lose interest and have the top star beat them in a handicap match or the two single stars dominate everyone in a battle Royale and only lose because one turned on the other, things like that. And it's hard to really see, "Yeah, but Triple H is in charge now!" as much of a consolation because for most of its existence NXT's tag division's been a ghost town and presently nothing even slightly resembling an attempt to make people care about the Women's Tag division is happening. It’s such a weird thing because even with the tag division where it was, it still felt like there was effort at times to get talent like ReDragon and War Machine and even forming The Revival was one of NXT’s achievements as a brand because that was the entire point of developmental, getting people who might work as a team working as a team. So that not really happening yet and instead focusing on getting people who weren’t exactly being chased by the other companies for the most part after release (Emma being a lone exception) doesn’t exactly make it something to be optimistic about. The interview where Shawn Michaels, in charge of matters relating to booking NXT, said that he and HHH don’t talk as much about booking matters was mind blowing to me because from what I have seen, it feels like they’re both literally repeating the same mistakes that cost HHH his talent relations gig and almost had the PC stripped down for parts.
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Post by government mule on Feb 20, 2023 7:31:58 GMT -5
Cody to win at WM is where the business money is. You won't get a more suitable moment to capitalise on his momentum than now and it would be crazy to throw that good money away.
Sami-Mania can run to next year if booked correctly (hah). The Roman 3 year reign(s) will be finished hopefully, he can put Jey, Sami and KO over during the year and you have plenty of booking time to decide whether to split the titles or keep them united, then maybe push Sami at the RR to win and give him that extra special moment at WM40, which in my mind is warranted after what he has done this last year.
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asuka007
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 21,204
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Post by asuka007 on Feb 20, 2023 8:24:29 GMT -5
WWE has a chance to elevate the tag division much in the same way the Intercontinental Title has been raised in credibility with Gunther's run. KO and Sami being the forefront of this can only be a good thing. I have a very hard time imagining this would especially work. It's kind of the worst sort of situation for making the tag division feel important on its own, since he's jumping into it immediately after failing on the singles main event scene. WWE has spent 20+ years telling fans that the tag belts don’t matter. Even if Triple H is trying to elevate them, it will take time to change fan’s minds after so long. And I agree that having Sami go after the world title FIRST probably doesn’t help either.
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Post by stoptheclocks on Feb 20, 2023 8:34:01 GMT -5
Cody to win at WM is where the business money is. You won't get a more suitable moment to capitalise on his momentum than now and it would be crazy to throw that good money away. Sami-Mania can run to next year if booked correctly (hah). The Roman 3 year reign(s) will be finished hopefully, he can put Jey, Sami and KO over during the year and you have plenty of booking time to decide whether to split the titles or keep them united, then maybe push Sami at the RR to win and give him that extra special moment at WM40, which in my mind is warranted after what he has done this last year. Yours isn't the first to mention the idea that Roman needs to lose to not one of, but all of Cody, Sami, Jey and KO in the near future. Is there not diminishing returns to doing that, and shouldn't you be looking to keep your biggest draw looking at least somewhat strong? Got to be some middle ground in between not being pinned for four years and then losing every match.
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Post by sarkerpolseng on Feb 20, 2023 9:08:25 GMT -5
Sami and KO vs Pretty Deadly plzzzzzz
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Post by Finish Uncle Muffin’s Story on Feb 20, 2023 9:09:00 GMT -5
I will say, thinking about it more, sticking to a direction because you set it honestly feels like going away from what the beauty of pro wrestling is. Most TV shows, most movies, most entertainment cannot pivot and change as quickly to things going on around them as pro wrestling can. You don’t need to stick to a story because it’s there, if something factors into it that changes, you can make it work and make money from that change. That’s what makes it such an art form and a changing scope. It’s why Mick Foley won the title from The Rock or how Daniel Bryan got the main event and many other examples. The rules of storytelling are much more flexible here. And that’s why having Sami win and then losing it before ‘Mania or losing it at ‘Mania in a three way or whatever wouldn’t matter as much if you tell the story well. As it is…I don’t know, sort of feels like that philosophy of the modern Vince booking never really left HHH regardless of Vince was back on the board or not. Look, we can debate till we're blue in the face about Sami/Cody, but the one thing that I think is pretty true is that without Triple H being around, this conversation never even happens. So I have to kind of argue that "Vince booking" is in fact gone, at least as it relates to this story. Sami would have been beat down and working midcard stuff if Vince was still around. Sami's kind of said as much himself. And I have to disagree that it wouldn't matter where Roman loses. If you're trying to develop a leading character, there's a clear time and place to do that based on how this company has operated for four decades. And having the supporting character beat the big bad before your new leading character beats the big bad seems pretty weird. It's like if Robin beat the Joker by himself and then Batman beats the Joker after, too. Mick Foley won the title from The Rock at a time when the titles were getting moved all the time. Daniel Bryan got the main event at Mania because the fans lost their shit that they'd give him wins over guys like Cena and Orton and then just cast him aside for Batista. Situations aren't the same.
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