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Post by Loki on Oct 27, 2007 4:19:25 GMT -5
Can't we just let all the rants about Jericho's burial die after Y2J himself said it was his idea involving Steph and he enjoyed being carried away kicking and screaming? Ok, the angle with Steph and Trips didn't work as he thought it would have, but FFS it wasn't HHH's power trip or something... To be fair, if he is in fact coming back to the E(which seems a lock at this point) he's gonna tow the company line. He'll never get anywhere if he says "My undisputed title run was botched from hell". As far as kicking and screaming, I can see Jericho being cool with that, he liked playing a whiney heel. But during his long hiatus, I don't remember ever reading of Jericho's shooting on WWE or something. And we know too well that if a wrestler has something to take off his chest, it'll be the first thing he'll do once he's out of his contract... If not even a rumour has surfaced about Y2J bitching about his buried reign as Undisputed Champion, it may be because Jericho isn't bothered by that as much as some of us are? I don't think it has much to do with Jericho asskissing the WWE... If he felt misused and wanted to come back to wrestling, TNA'd have offered him a gold mine and for sure a bigger push (for a couple of months anyway). IMO it's just another case of us being more Catholic than the Pope...
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The F'N Captain
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Post by The F'N Captain on Oct 27, 2007 4:21:52 GMT -5
To be fair, if he is in fact coming back to the E(which seems a lock at this point) he's gonna tow the company line. He'll never get anywhere if he says "My undisputed title run was botched from hell". As far as kicking and screaming, I can see Jericho being cool with that, he liked playing a whiney heel. But during his long hiatus, I don't remember ever reading of Jericho's shooting on WWE or something. And we know too well that if a wrestler has something to take off his chest, it'll be the first thing he'll do once he's out of his contract... If not even a rumour has surfaced about Y2J bitching about his buried reign as Undisputed Champion, it may be because Jericho isn't bothered by that as much as some of us are? I don't think it has much to do with Jericho asskissing the WWE... If he felt misused and wanted to come back to wrestling, TNA'd have offered him a gold mine and for sure a bigger push (for a couple of months anyway). IMO it's just another case of us being more Catholic than the Pope... Then again maybe Jericho really DIDN'T care. After all despite how we feel, he WAS the champ and surely making a decent paycheck that comes with it.
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Post by Loki on Oct 27, 2007 4:31:30 GMT -5
My point exactly
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randomranter
Dennis Stamp
When you grow up....... YOU'RE GONNA BE WROOOOOONG!!!!
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Post by randomranter on Oct 27, 2007 4:49:51 GMT -5
I think we'd learn that "loss =/= burial" * Noble has been consistently on TV lately, so even though he's been losing, it's still better than doing nothing. I agree here. EDIT: Actually, I don't. Yes, he's on TV, but he just came out of the losing end of a comedy feud with a midget -- one which some have said damaged the credibility of the entire CW division (Not that that's noble's fault -- He played his role to perfection.). Noble took the crap that Creative fed to him and played it to the best of his ability -- better than 95% of the roster would. And now he's jobbing as a result. Not really a direct burial per se, but his career isn't exactly reaching new heights, either. And his feud with Hornswoggle is going to be forever looked at as a low point of his career. He debuted on SD by winning the US title. He debuted on Raw by winning the IC title. Ric Flair put him over. Now he's jobbing. Yes, it's largely his own fault, but the fact of the matter is, he's still been buried. I could see this being a possibility, given the types of characters that Jericho likes to play. But then again, as someone said above, this could be simply Jericho towing the company line. Yes, I agree that these teams weren't getting over anyway, but when those three teams are THE ENTIRE TAG TEAM DIVISION, you don't make matters worse by feeding them to your main eventers, jobber style. Especially not in 5-on-2 matches. Feeding them to DX eliminated what little chance these teams had of getting over. And at least spirit squad was getting *some* reaction before DX. But how many wrestlers are taken off television in such a humiliating way? Most who are taken off television are jobbed out and/or quietly removed. They're not made the butt of bad DX joke #692543 and humiliated on their way out. (Bischoff and Jericho aside, as those were done for character/storyline purposes.) Being removed in such a humiliating way makes it significantly more difficult to get them over when they return. See Kenny Dykstra. You say that like it's a good thing. Yes, he got eliminated quickly. Normally, I wouldn't consider that a burial, as people have to be eliminated quickly or the matches would last for hours. It was the comments by HBK and HHH of "Who's that guy?" "Was he in the match?" and the like that put the incident into burial territory. There was no need for that. So what "acceptable" reason can you come up with for shipping Spirit Squad off in a wooden OVW box, when simply removing them from television would have accomplished the same thing? Why did HHH and HBK have to make such unnecessary and humiliating remarks about Mike Knox? I *almost* agree here. But when you look at the angle, it does kinda classify. Others have explained it better than I could. The match itself may not have been a burial, but the way Booker was made to look in regards to the angle as a whole does. The fact that his popularity declined sharply after the match indicated that his career did take a hit as a result of the angle.
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Post by Thread Pirate Roberts on Oct 27, 2007 4:50:00 GMT -5
Can't believe no one has said the most obvious one.
Hassan!
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randomranter
Dennis Stamp
When you grow up....... YOU'RE GONNA BE WROOOOOONG!!!!
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Post by randomranter on Oct 27, 2007 5:02:07 GMT -5
Can't believe no one has said the most obvious one. Hassan! I thought about that one myself, but that wasn't really a burial, but a "forced removal from television." WWE made a very bad judgment call in showing the Hassan/Taker angle on the same day of the london bombings, believing that they could justify it later as the angle progressed. Bad move. Very bad move. After the backlash that the networks received, no network wanted anything to do with the Hassan character. Vince was forced by the networks to end the angle and remove him. Another reason not to add Hassan -- His match vs. the Undertaker wasn't a total squash. It was your standard back-and-forth match. Once the match was over, Hassan was removed in a manner consistent with both the storyline and Undertaker's character. From there, he was simply not heard from again. I don't classify it as a burial. They simply rushed the storyline to what would have been its logical conclusion, and removed him from television. In fact, when you compare his removal from television to the removal of many other wrestlers (Spirit Squad being the most notable example), he was actually given a pretty good sendoff.
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Post by ada2 on Oct 27, 2007 5:39:25 GMT -5
all i have to say is shelton
the guy never wins anymore and loses to everyone, what happened to the 2004-2005 shelton he was used in such a great way
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Oct 27, 2007 6:26:13 GMT -5
Can't we just let all the rants about Jericho's burial die after Y2J himself said it was his idea involving Steph and he enjoyed being carried away kicking and screaming? Ok, the angle with Steph and Trips didn't work as he thought it would have, but FFS it wasn't HHH's power trip or something... But.....but........HHH is EVIL!!!!! And I think some the people who are claiming it's Jericho "towing the line" are really reaching. I've got one: Honky Tonk Man post Summerslam 88. He never recovered from the Warrior steamrolling him
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Post by Red 'n' Black Reggie on Oct 27, 2007 6:33:32 GMT -5
val venis. he used to be IC champion. and raw co-GM or assistant or something. now look at him.
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Hiroshi Hase
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The Good Ol' Days
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Post by Hiroshi Hase on Oct 27, 2007 6:44:34 GMT -5
Can't we just let all the rants about Jericho's burial die after Y2J himself said it was his idea involving Steph and he enjoyed being carried away kicking and screaming? Ok, the angle with Steph and Trips didn't work as he thought it would have, but FFS it wasn't HHH's power trip or something... But.....but........HHH is EVIL!!!!! And I think some the people who are claiming it's Jericho "towing the line" are really reaching. I've got one: Honky Tonk Man post Summerslam 88. He never recovered from the Warrior steamrolling him I don't think he minded that much, as I think he liked losing the title that way or so I remember hearing in an interview somewhere.
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,496
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Oct 27, 2007 6:49:09 GMT -5
But.....but........HHH is EVIL!!!!! And I think some the people who are claiming it's Jericho "towing the line" are really reaching. I've got one: Honky Tonk Man post Summerslam 88. He never recovered from the Warrior steamrolling him I don't think he minded that much, as I think he liked losing the title that way or so I remember hearing in an interview somewhere. I didnt know that. I retract my statement. I do have a better one: Goldberg, post Starrcade 98. Nash beating him was the beginning of the end
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Post by RedSmile on Oct 27, 2007 8:50:39 GMT -5
Most of these posts indicate a complete misunderstanding of what a burial is......
Mark Henry's Sexual Chocolate gimmick was a burial, they gave him the gimmick hoping the guy would quit.
Val Venis' slide from prominent midcard to popular jobber, is not a damn burial, it's a shifting of roles so Val can put others over.
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Hiroshi Hase
Patti Mayonnaise
The Good Ol' Days
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Post by Hiroshi Hase on Oct 27, 2007 8:52:37 GMT -5
Most of these posts indicate a complete misunderstanding of what a burial is...... Mark Henry's Sexual Chocolate gimmick was a burial, they gave him the gimmick hoping the guy would quit. Was this ever confirmed or just assumed?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2007 8:54:52 GMT -5
Most of these posts indicate a complete misunderstanding of what a burial is...... Mark Henry's Sexual Chocolate gimmick was a burial, they gave him the gimmick hoping the guy would quit. Was this ever confirmed or just assumed? Does it need to be? The stuff they did with Henry was awful.
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Hiroshi Hase
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The Good Ol' Days
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Post by Hiroshi Hase on Oct 27, 2007 8:59:04 GMT -5
Was this ever confirmed or just assumed? Does it need to be? The stuff they did with Henry was awful. Well yes, it helps the discussion at least to me. It may have been awful to most, but if it's just someone's assumption and not a fact, then I can question it if I wish.
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Post by carter 15 on Oct 27, 2007 9:00:55 GMT -5
Bob Holly vs. Orlando Jordan, it went like... 8 seconds... on a PPV
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2007 9:02:47 GMT -5
Does it need to be? The stuff they did with Henry was awful. Well yes, it helps the discussion at least to me. It may have been awful to most, but if it's just someone's assumption and not a fact, then I can question it if I wish. True enough, although I can't help but feel that it was nothing but trying to get Henry to quit. Didn't they sign him to a ten-year contract in 1996, and he never got over in that time?
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Post by RedSmile on Oct 27, 2007 9:12:38 GMT -5
One other burial, that I believe it legit, involves HHH actually being buried by Warrior at WM. Trips was made to look awful in that match.
I would like to also nominate Bob Backlund getting squashed in 6 seconds by Nash for the WWF title.
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Hiroshi Hase
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The Good Ol' Days
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Post by Hiroshi Hase on Oct 27, 2007 9:16:32 GMT -5
One other burial, that I believe it legit, involves HHH actually being buried by Warrior at WM. Trips was made to look awful in that match. I would like to also nominate Bob Backlund getting squashed in 6 seconds by Nash for the WWF title. I don't see either instance as a burial, as they were to put over the guys in question as monsters. I remember listening to an Nash interview where Backlund was telling him backstage at MSG to go out there and make the people love you and he wasn't upset with the finish at all. Not every match has to be 30 minutes or more.
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randomranter
Dennis Stamp
When you grow up....... YOU'RE GONNA BE WROOOOOONG!!!!
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Post by randomranter on Oct 27, 2007 9:41:03 GMT -5
One other burial, that I believe it legit, involves HHH actually being buried by Warrior at WM. Trips was made to look awful in that match. I would like to also nominate Bob Backlund getting squashed in 6 seconds by Nash for the WWF title. I don't see either instance as a burial, as they were to put over the guys in question as monsters. I remember listening to an Nash interview where Backlund was telling him backstage at MSG to go out there and make the people love you and he wasn't upset with the finish at all. Not every match has to be 30 minutes or more. While the Nash / Backlund thing may not be a burial, the HHH/warrior thing definitely was, as HHH was being punished for the Curtain Call incident.
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