Legion
Fry's dog Seymour
Amy Pond's #1 fan
Hail Hydra!
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Post by Legion on May 6, 2011 15:12:21 GMT -5
[ Note I said 'imo.' For me, and maybe it is just me, but Christian was only ever put in this position because Edge was hurt. ...except the fans were behind him as soon as he returned for vengeance against Del Rio. They only played the Edge card later. You can not like the guy, but if it's your opinion he was only ever over and an important part of Smackdown because of Edge, then your opinion is wrong. By definition one cannot have a wrong opinion. When Christian returned of course the crowd was behind him, he was returning and WWE made it clear that it was ADR who put Christian out. But being caught in a storyline with ADR doesnt mean 'here, have a title and keep it for a bit' it means that the guy had a storyline ready for him. My point, if you continued to read, was not that Christian couldn't be champion, but simply that with Edge gone, that spot should go to someone with something left to show me, someone new, not someone whose the same character now as they were years ago and aren't showing me anything new or anything to make me care. Orton and Cena are attacked constantly for being stale, please explain to me how Christian, WHC or not, isn't just as, if not more stale than them in terms of his on air persona?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2011 15:20:35 GMT -5
The funny thing is that the people saying stuff about the 'youth movement' in this situation can't really make an argument for a number of reasons:
1. How is Orton winning the title in any way shape or form helping the youth movement? The guy is already an established main eventer with 7 world title reigns.
2. If Christian had kept the world title, he could've begun a feud with Sheamus while Orton could've feuded with Cody Rhodes. It makes perfect sense because Cody and Orton have their Legacy background. Sheamus would also instantly become a major player on Smackdown and shown he could be the number one heel on a brand.
3. And like I've said before in this thread, now with Christian and Orton feuding for the world title, this now leaves Sheamus and Cody Rhodes with NOTHING to do for the next PPV.
4. Christian is a veteran and very good in the ring, he does a better job at putting over younger talent then Orton. During his title run, or even after he lost the world title he could've put over the likes of Sheamus, Cody and Barrett immensely if he wanted to.
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Post by carp (SPC, Itoh Respect Army) on May 6, 2011 15:28:19 GMT -5
...except the fans were behind him as soon as he returned for vengeance against Del Rio. They only played the Edge card later. You can not like the guy, but if it's your opinion he was only ever over and an important part of Smackdown because of Edge, then your opinion is wrong. By definition one cannot have a wrong opinion. Of course you can; an opinion can be based on incorrect or incomplete facts, illogically formed, or biased. That's crazy, thinking an opinion can't be wrong. "I hate trees, because trees caused the holocaust." See? Wrong opinion. In this case, they made Christian a big deal against Del Rio, who was already in line for a shot for the title. If Edge hadn't retired, then they would have turned Christan (or more intriguingly: Edge) and feuded them. It's just wrong to act like Christian was hotshotted for no reason other than Poor Edge Had to Retire! The second part is a LITTLE better, but still: Christian simply hasn't been around that long, thanks to his time off in TNA. Orton and Cena have been top stars in the WWE for YEARS. Christian just came back.
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Post by elitistheel on May 6, 2011 15:28:25 GMT -5
...except the fans were behind him as soon as he returned for vengeance against Del Rio. They only played the Edge card later. You can not like the guy, but if it's your opinion he was only ever over and an important part of Smackdown because of Edge, then your opinion is wrong. By definition one cannot have a wrong opinion. But you can certainly misuse the word "opinion." If your "opinion" is a false claim of an actual event, you are wrong. See, there *was* a reason for Christian to win the title. Someone made the decision, and they had their reasons. If sympathy was not one of them, then your "opinion" was wrong. I think they fast-tracked a title win so that they could turn him heel and win it off of Orton, and that the original plan was for Christian to turn heel on a healthy Edge to win it.
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BigJerichool222
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
THE BIG DOG!
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Post by BigJerichool222 on May 6, 2011 15:28:45 GMT -5
Can't wait for SD to air so I can use my new sig.
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Post by FUNK_US/BRODUS on May 6, 2011 15:30:06 GMT -5
Yeah, thats easily my favourite part of Ortons repertoire, the way theyve created the "where will it come from next" mystique of the RKO. Id love to see that inserted into match storytelling, where guys will think about springboards or top rope moves only to balk on it as they see Orton prepare for it.
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Legion
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Hail Hydra!
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Post by Legion on May 6, 2011 15:30:43 GMT -5
1. How is Orton winning the title in any way shape or form helping the youth movement? The guy is already an established main eventer with 7 world title reigns.
It isn't and i never said it was, my point was that the main event spot vacated by Edge should go to a new up and comer, be it Cody, Sheamus or whoever. I do not believe it should ever have gone to Christian.
2. If Christian had kept the world title, he could've begun a feud with Sheamus while Orton could've feuded with Cody Rhodes. It makes perfect sense because Cody and Orton have their Legacy background. Sheamus would also instantly become a major player on Smackdown and shown he could be the number one heel on a brand.
The way WWE appear to be setting things up, it would appear Mark Henry is going to be the heel challenger, or at least in the upper level. A legacy fued makes no sense, as reminding people of Cody the bitch doesnt help elevate him. Christian could have fueded with any number of people, but the point I made was never that he couldn't do something, but that I don't believe he has anything left to show me. Id prefer to see someone new elevated to fued with Orton over someone being used to help elevate an already established mid carder like Christian.
3. And like I've said before in this thread, now with Christian and Orton feuding for the world title, this now leaves Sheamus and Cody Rhodes with NOTHING to do for the next PPV.
We have no idea Christian and Orton will fued, or that Over the Limit wont feture multiman matches with many people. Until next week, we can't say this.
4. Christian is a veteran and very good in the ring, he does a better job at putting over younger talent then Orton. During his title run, or even after he lost the world title he could've put over the likes of Sheamus, Cody and Barrett immensely if he wanted to.
Yes, Christian is solid in the ring, but his tenure gives him that status minus a world title. Like Kane, a fued with someone like Christian puts someone over, WHC or not.
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Post by James McCloud IS John Godot on May 6, 2011 15:36:56 GMT -5
I'd laugh if it turns out the opening and final segments/matches were for the live crowd only and they ignore the result of the match.
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Post by The Cole Mine on May 6, 2011 15:40:28 GMT -5
I'd laugh if it turns out the opening and final segments/matches were for the live crowd only and they ignore the result of the match. I was thinking along the same lines except once the fans left the arena, they would fill the first few rows with backstage people and reshoot the finish with Henry coming down causing a DQ.
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Post by Wolf Hurricane on May 6, 2011 15:47:55 GMT -5
I'd laugh if it turns out the opening and final segments/matches were for the live crowd only and they ignore the result of the match. I was thinking along the same lines except once the fans left the arena, they would fill the first few rows with backstage people and reshoot the finish with Henry coming down causing a DQ. If they do that, then... FUNK THIS COMPANY!
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Post by A Platypus Rave on May 6, 2011 15:52:52 GMT -5
Can't wait for SD to air so I can use my new sig. OK that is awesome.
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Post by Savage Gambino on May 6, 2011 16:07:06 GMT -5
I'd laugh if it turns out the opening and final segments/matches were for the live crowd only and they ignore the result of the match. I was thinking along the same lines except once the fans left the arena, they would fill the first few rows with backstage people and reshoot the finish with Henry coming down causing a DQ. And what purpose would that serve? Working the smarks in to a online frenzy. Causing mass outrage that spoils Smackdown, only for the dirtsheets to be proven wrong... Oh, that's why.
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Post by Triple H buried SnS on May 6, 2011 16:39:51 GMT -5
I never like short reigns... especially to cap off a rather interesting story that technically started back at the royal rumble. Nor do I like that the top guy on the brand dropping the belt first thing to the 'newcomer'. Makes it really seem like Raw really was the dominate brand.
But it is what it is.
Now Christian's first reign was about as significant as Edge's. Let the parallels begin!
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Post by Savage Gambino on May 6, 2011 16:51:37 GMT -5
Now Christian's first reign was about as significant as Edge's. Let the parallels begin! They're both Canadians who were in a tag-team with Chris Jericho. They also both feuded with Kurt Angle (albeit, in two different companies). Oh, and they both beat Alberto del Rio on PPV.
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mrjl
Fry's dog Seymour
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Post by mrjl on May 6, 2011 17:01:28 GMT -5
Just watched the end...What a great finish, I hope we see more between the two. Also, man was the crowd on FIRE when Orton won. I guess that really goes to show the discrepancy between places like this and most of the WWE Universe. the crowd still chanted for Christian post match. I don't think anyone has claimed that the fans booed the result. It's just the fans cared enough to celebrate him post match, which is the sort of stuff that got Eddie Guerrero over(remember the Eddie chants after Edge beat him in a match on Smackdown?) and that Orton's post match behavior was heelish. Fans cheered Hogan at Mania 9. I think though that in the aftermath, no defenses for months and all, even big time Hulkamaniacs were probably less enthused
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mrjl
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Post by mrjl on May 6, 2011 17:05:28 GMT -5
None of us are crying because "Our guy" lost. We're pissed off because of the way it has been done. Its such an unprofessional thing to do by creative. People are still angry and upset, threatening to quit watching, over the result of a scripted match. Which is a far gone overreaction to something relatively small. So the point still stands. if you don't like the way the scripts are written, then you don't watch a show. Lots of people have quit watching TV shows when a favorite character was derailed
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Yami Daimao
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Post by Yami Daimao on May 6, 2011 17:07:23 GMT -5
Also, people are actually blaming Orton for the booking? That makes no sense. Now I have the sudden urge to play the TCG again.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2011 17:17:56 GMT -5
I don't get why it's not cool for some people to quit watching wrestling because of a stupid plot twist. I mean, it's a TV show like anything else - would it be wrong if, say, I dropped watching Young Justice because it turns out the head of Cadmus is Batman? No, because it's just an indicator of terrible writing.
Besides, I'm more going to stop because of the fact both rosters at the moment are terrible, and the characters of both champions were gathering dust four years ago yet nothing about them has particularly changed since. Moreso with Cena.
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Cronant
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Post by Cronant on May 6, 2011 17:21:50 GMT -5
Its because most of the time "I'm not watching anymore" means "I'm just going to say that every RAW and SD thread".
Just a tad funny.
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Bang Bang Bart
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Post by Bang Bang Bart on May 6, 2011 17:27:04 GMT -5
I don't get why it's not cool for some people to quit watching wrestling because of a stupid plot twist. I mean, it's a TV show like anything else - would it be wrong if, say, I dropped watching Young Justice because it turns out the head of Cadmus is Batman? No, because it's just an indicator of terrible writing. Besides, I'm more going to stop because of the fact both rosters at the moment are terrible, and the characters of both champions were gathering dust four years ago yet nothing about them has particularly changed since. Moreso with Cena. If the people who say that they'll quit watching WWE actually follow through with their ultimatum, I'd understand.
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