Mochi Lone Wolf
Fry's dog Seymour
Development through Destruction.
Posts: 24,072
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Post by Mochi Lone Wolf on Feb 28, 2012 9:36:18 GMT -5
I still don't care about this feud. I'm happy WWE have found their niche with the Twilight-inspired thing but it just doesn't appeal to me. I like my feuds to be about who is the best, not about wrist notes and kung Pow bitches. That's why I'm more interested in Taker/Hunter and Punk/Y2J. Still stoked for the match itself but I have no interest in what either man has to say from here to WM.
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Post by Shaun2k5 on Feb 28, 2012 9:39:04 GMT -5
Wasn't what was written on Rocks hand gibberish anyway?
I suspect WWE want Cena to look like an equal.
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Allie Kitsune
Crow T. Robot
Always Feelin' Foxy.
HaHa U FaLL 4 LaVa TriK
Posts: 46,344
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Feb 28, 2012 9:40:28 GMT -5
Well, Korpela's tweet is obviously a work. NOBODY can stand up to Punk on the mic. Punk cuts promos like he's running for office in a tough district. He will dig deep, pull all the skeletons out of your closet, and ruin your life (if you haven't lived a perfect one) in order to win a promo war. And if they don't let him do it on TV, he'll just do it on Twitter. Let's see Cena ever do that. Hell, let's see Rock ever do that. Depends what you class as good mic work. If we're talking about construction of a promo along with content...then yes Punk is the very best. If we're talking about working a crowd into a frenzy, holding them in your hand and getting them to do everything on your own whim...then Rock is the best ever. In the world of entertainment...Rock wins. Punk is a pure wrestler and it makes sense his promos are more about content than entertainment. That's the thing, though. If Cena and Rock were supposed to hate each other as much as WWE wants us to believe, then they need to be willing to let Cena and Rock "Go there".
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Post by Snaptastic on Feb 28, 2012 9:45:39 GMT -5
Depends what you class as good mic work. If we're talking about construction of a promo along with content...then yes Punk is the very best. If we're talking about working a crowd into a frenzy, holding them in your hand and getting them to do everything on your own whim...then Rock is the best ever. In the world of entertainment...Rock wins. Punk is a pure wrestler and it makes sense his promos are more about content than entertainment. That's the thing, though. If Cena and Rock were supposed to hate each other as much as WWE wants us to believe, then they need to be willing to let Cena and Rock "Go there". Agreed 100%. Rock did bring up a lot of good points on RAW before Cena came out, if you look past some of the name calling. I do believe he went out there to be as serious as possible, with referring to himself in the first person as oppose to third. I know he had the Kung Pow Bitch thing lined up as per the notes (which really don't bother me as I'd need notes too), but it didn't really bother me. Had Rock gone out there and been totally serious without having fun, then it wouldn't have felt right and would have felt "phony". This is the thing, people are congratulating Cena for being serious and to the point...but it doesn't wash with me. Cena isn't being who he really is, as it being totally phony whilst Rock is for better or worse sticking to who his character really is and always has been. Some people hate it sure, but the majority of crowds around the globe lap it up and mark out for that kind of thing. The Cena "notes" comment did leave a bad taste in my mouth, but it's one of those things. I'm not sure who Cena is getting creative direction from, but he's gone from being a goof to mr serious "you're a son of a bitch" all too quickly. At least Rock is staying true to himself, and hasn't needed to re-invent his character to get over. Whether we like it or not, Rock is still the most over guy in the company even now.
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Allie Kitsune
Crow T. Robot
Always Feelin' Foxy.
HaHa U FaLL 4 LaVa TriK
Posts: 46,344
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Feb 28, 2012 9:48:43 GMT -5
That's the thing, though. If Cena and Rock were supposed to hate each other as much as WWE wants us to believe, then they need to be willing to let Cena and Rock "Go there". Agreed 100%. Rock did bring up a lot of good points on RAW before Cena came out, if you look past some of the name calling. I do believe he went out there to be as serious as possible, with referring to himself in the first person as oppose to third. I know he had the Kung Pow Bitch thing lined up as per the notes (which really don't bother me as I'd need notes too), but it didn't really bother me. Had Rock gone out there and been totally serious without having fun, then it wouldn't have felt right and would have felt "phony". This is the thing, people are congratulating Cena for being serious and to the point...but it doesn't wash with me. Cena isn't being who he really is, as it being totally phony whilst Rock is for better or worse sticking to who his character really is and always has been. Some people hate it sure, but the majority of crowds around the globe lap it up and mark out for that kind of thing. The Cena "notes" comment did leave a bad taste in my mouth, but it's one of those things. I'm not sure who Cena is getting creative direction from, but he's gone from being a goof to mr serious "you're a son of a bitch" all too quickly. At least Rock is staying true to himself, and hasn't needed to re-invent his character to get over. Whether we like it or not, Rock is still the most over guy in the company even now. The irony is that Cena's been coming out, basically saying "The kid-friendly hero who stands tall is who I am, who I've always been, and I'm proud of it, I'm not a fake." While slipping back into his old Thuganomics voice and speech patterns. So yeah... that needs to be pointed out.
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Post by Snaptastic on Feb 28, 2012 9:51:30 GMT -5
Agreed 100%. Rock did bring up a lot of good points on RAW before Cena came out, if you look past some of the name calling. I do believe he went out there to be as serious as possible, with referring to himself in the first person as oppose to third. I know he had the Kung Pow Bitch thing lined up as per the notes (which really don't bother me as I'd need notes too), but it didn't really bother me. Had Rock gone out there and been totally serious without having fun, then it wouldn't have felt right and would have felt "phony". This is the thing, people are congratulating Cena for being serious and to the point...but it doesn't wash with me. Cena isn't being who he really is, as it being totally phony whilst Rock is for better or worse sticking to who his character really is and always has been. Some people hate it sure, but the majority of crowds around the globe lap it up and mark out for that kind of thing. The Cena "notes" comment did leave a bad taste in my mouth, but it's one of those things. I'm not sure who Cena is getting creative direction from, but he's gone from being a goof to mr serious "you're a son of a bitch" all too quickly. At least Rock is staying true to himself, and hasn't needed to re-invent his character to get over. Whether we like it or not, Rock is still the most over guy in the company even now. The irony is that Cena's been coming out, basically saying "The kid-friendly hero who stands tall is who I am, who I've always been, and I'm proud of it, I'm not a fake." While slipping back into his old Thuganomics voice and speech patterns. So yeah... that needs to be pointed out. Oh sure I see that, and perhaps I did overlook that in my previous post. Unfortunately they've booked themselves into a corner with this one, as Rock's main attack initially was against Cena's current form. If Cena did a complete reversal you've flushed a year of build down the toilet, and for what? But I do agree for the most part, that they should tell them in which direction to go but let them say what they want to get there.
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Post by xCompackx on Feb 28, 2012 10:01:07 GMT -5
Agreed 100%. Rock did bring up a lot of good points on RAW before Cena came out, if you look past some of the name calling. I do believe he went out there to be as serious as possible, with referring to himself in the first person as oppose to third. I know he had the Kung Pow Bitch thing lined up as per the notes (which really don't bother me as I'd need notes too), but it didn't really bother me. Had Rock gone out there and been totally serious without having fun, then it wouldn't have felt right and would have felt "phony". This is the thing, people are congratulating Cena for being serious and to the point...but it doesn't wash with me. Cena isn't being who he really is, as it being totally phony whilst Rock is for better or worse sticking to who his character really is and always has been. Some people hate it sure, but the majority of crowds around the globe lap it up and mark out for that kind of thing. The Cena "notes" comment did leave a bad taste in my mouth, but it's one of those things. I'm not sure who Cena is getting creative direction from, but he's gone from being a goof to mr serious "you're a son of a bitch" all too quickly. At least Rock is staying true to himself, and hasn't needed to re-invent his character to get over. Whether we like it or not, Rock is still the most over guy in the company even now. The irony is that Cena's been coming out, basically saying "The kid-friendly hero who stands tall is who I am, who I've always been, and I'm proud of it, I'm not a fake." While slipping back into his old Thuganomics voice and speech patterns. So yeah... that needs to be pointed out. This, completely. We all knew that Cena was probably going to either go heel or get edgier in this feud, but the way they did it really bothers me. Even when he did the stuff with Eve before his promo last week, he was all smiley and happy.
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Post by hossfan on Feb 28, 2012 10:09:17 GMT -5
Perhaps you're right, I didn't take that into account. Rock did do a convincing job at least in my book of looking pissed. Just gonna add in some other quotes about who thought who won what... Well, Korpela's tweet is obviously a work. NOBODY can stand up to Punk on the mic. Punk cuts promos like he's running for office in a tough district. He will dig deep, pull all the skeletons out of your closet, and ruin your life (if you haven't lived a perfect one) in order to win a promo war. And if they don't let him do it on TV, he'll just do it on Twitter. Let's see Cena ever do that. Hell, let's see Rock ever do that. This idea that Punk is a force of nature on the mic is silly. He was average at best last night. Destroying Chris Brown in a Twitter feud doesn't take much skill.
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Post by Ryback on a Pole! on Feb 28, 2012 10:09:41 GMT -5
Cena easily.
The Rock's promo was okay until he started blow-jobbing twitter, using his lame insults, his 'fruity pebbles' thing and banging on about "blah blah blah trending world wide!" again.
Cena's promo when he came out was excellant. A nice jab too at Rock having notes on his wrist.
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Post by CM Parish on Feb 28, 2012 10:11:30 GMT -5
I think they went about it the wrong way when Cena came out - they should have shown that Cena was really getting to Rock - have Rock shout while Cena was on the way back about how he should come back and talk to him while being flustered, and the show should have gone off the air with Rock looking like he didnt know what to do in the middle of the ring.
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Post by joebob27 on Feb 28, 2012 10:13:47 GMT -5
It's making people like Cena? I mean, I like this Cena more, so I guess it works that way, but did you hear that line go over like a lead balloon? It was like Jinder Mahal, if little girls and kids really, really liked him. ![:D](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/grin.png) To me, this is a booking truth. You cannot make people like someone they hate. It's impossible and I don't think it's ever worked. BUT, you can make people hate someone enough to the point that they BECOME liked. If you get what I'm saying here. They go about this with Cena in the most halfassed awful ways possible. Basically their last X number of years of booking has been, c'mon, please like Cena, he's our #1 guy. Why they've never though, shit just make the guy a heel for 6-12 months, key on the things that made people like him initially, and reboot the whole goddamn thing over again. This way is so destined to fail that they need to stop and pull a 180. Freaking turn him for this feud already. Have him shoot on the crowd that doesn't like him, have him be entertaining. I think some aspects are there, they just need to go all out on it. Do a Diesel tweener thing where if you're with him, he loves you, and if you hate him, he's gonna let you know about it. Then turn him back afterwards, or maybe he'll have gotten over enough with that crowd that you won't have to.
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Allie Kitsune
Crow T. Robot
Always Feelin' Foxy.
HaHa U FaLL 4 LaVa TriK
Posts: 46,344
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Feb 28, 2012 10:17:26 GMT -5
Well, Korpela's tweet is obviously a work. NOBODY can stand up to Punk on the mic. Punk cuts promos like he's running for office in a tough district. He will dig deep, pull all the skeletons out of your closet, and ruin your life (if you haven't lived a perfect one) in order to win a promo war. And if they don't let him do it on TV, he'll just do it on Twitter. Let's see Cena ever do that. Hell, let's see Rock ever do that. This idea that Punk is a force of nature on the mic is silly. He was average at best last night. Destroying Chris Brown in a Twitter feud doesn't take much skill. It's not that I think nobody else is capable of doing what he does, it's that I think nobody else is willing to do it. 1990s Shawn would have done it. Reign of Terror Hunter would have done it. But those days have passed, and nobody else is willing to go that far. If Andy Leavine was to get called up next week, who's the guy willing to go out there and say "Where's your cowboy hat, "Kevin Hackman"? Why don't you get out of my ring and go work the ticket booth? Or can't you even pass the drug test to go do THAT? If the WWE machine hand-picked me to win their stupid little MTV show, I wouldn't shit the bed and throw it away like you!" I know that's not a particularly strong example, but that's why I'm not cutting promos in WWE. ![:P](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/tongue.png)
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Post by Crazy Diamond on Feb 28, 2012 10:31:16 GMT -5
I noticed something weird about Rock's promo last night. He made a comment about how he was booed just like Cena when he was a face. Yet, the only time I've seen that happen was from when he was Rocky Maivia. Rocky was a midcarder while Cena was a main eventer. It reminded me of how wrestlers going up against HHH had to talk about how good he was and all of that crap.
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ASYLUMHAUSEN
Fry's dog Seymour
GIFs | Shitposts | Fun
Posts: 24,609
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Post by ASYLUMHAUSEN on Feb 28, 2012 10:50:36 GMT -5
YES! Rock called Cena "Jack" in last night's promo.
My god I have waited for SOMEBODY to call somebody "Jack" for years (like they used to do in every promo back in the day)
WIN!
(Cena is still winning the verbal war though...can't believe I'd ever say that)
EDIT MULTIPLE "Jack" uses (Just finished the promo on WWE.com - fell asleep early last night) I AM IN HEAVEN!
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ASYLUMHAUSEN
Fry's dog Seymour
GIFs | Shitposts | Fun
Posts: 24,609
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Post by ASYLUMHAUSEN on Feb 28, 2012 10:55:59 GMT -5
Seriously though...WWE is doing a good job of slow burning this feud right now. I am genuinely stoked to see this match and we're still a month+ out.
Again, NEVER thought I'd say that.
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Post by Snaptastic on Feb 28, 2012 12:35:29 GMT -5
I will say it's a shame they're going down this route, by having Rock shill anything and everything they have going. I know it's Vince's idea to get Rock behind this stuff, as it is part of their master plan to become more relevant which they have failed to do for the most part. They had a chance with Punk last year, but again they dropped the ball with that and they couldn't recover. Punk's mic work became sloppy towards the end of the year, and his title reign this far has been far from memorable in many ways. Whilst I don't agree with their obvious creative direction designed to bring Cena up to Rock's level, I don't see what else they could do. Cena has never been considered at that level en mass, whereas even Rock's biggest detractors admitted he is one of the very best there's been.
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Post by pepsitwist on Feb 28, 2012 12:47:08 GMT -5
The irony is that Cena's been coming out, basically saying "The kid-friendly hero who stands tall is who I am, who I've always been, and I'm proud of it, I'm not a fake." While slipping back into his old Thuganomics voice and speech patterns. So yeah... that needs to be pointed out. This, completely. We all knew that Cena was probably going to either go heel or get edgier in this feud, but the way they did it really bothers me. Even when he did the stuff with Eve before his promo last week, he was all smiley and happy. They tried to get him to embrace to the hate with Kane and if anything heightened the pandering nature of his character to shill merchandise to the legions of children who believe in his 'rise above hate'. Every week it was the same promo and the feud literally went nowhere than to simply give Cena something to do (put over Ryder and turn Eve). I'm glad Cena is freshening up his character. But it's the breath mint effect - it's temporary. If Cena wants to edgy and not make poopy jokes he brings out the Boston accent and it always feels forced and disingenuous. Cena won that verbal battle but they'll be plenty more since he's the top guy right now going against the biggest name since Hogan. It gives the feud more dimensions because lets face it to have a year long drawn out feud was never going to work. When Rock is always so busy.
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trollrogue
Hank Scorpio
Nashville City of Music!!
Posts: 5,609
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Post by trollrogue on Feb 28, 2012 13:12:22 GMT -5
I noticed something weird about Rock's promo last night. He made a comment about how he was booed just like Cena when he was a face. Yet, the only time I've seen that happen was from when he was Rocky Maivia. Rocky was a midcarder while Cena was a main eventer. It reminded me of how wrestlers going up against HHH had to talk about how good he was and all of that crap. Rocky's been booed as a face whenever he feuded with Hogan. He was booed as the Corporate People's Champ (still acted like he did while a face, but was booed for being aligned with Vince). He was booed as Hollywood Rock (same deal-- he did his usual Rocky catchphrases but acted extremely arrogant and cocky to midcard faces like Hurricane Helms). If they wanted to make this a Cocky Heel Rocky vs. Goofy Face Cena feud, that would've been boring. What they're doing now is capitalizing off the popularity of 'pipe-bombs' recently in the WWE to get Rock and Cena to light this feud on fire. The next time Cena's in a hostile environment, he WILL be getting Kung Pao Bitch chants, so even if Rock 'lost' the promo battle last night with the power of his Millions he's wayyy ahead in the promo war...
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BRV
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Wants him some Taco Flavored Kisses.
Posts: 17,102
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Post by BRV on Feb 28, 2012 13:34:10 GMT -5
Sean Grande, who does radio play-by-play for the Boston Celtics, and has occasionally co-hosted the Raw Live Chats, wrote one of the better jokes regarding last night's promo on his Twitter account.
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Mochi Lone Wolf
Fry's dog Seymour
Development through Destruction.
Posts: 24,072
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Post by Mochi Lone Wolf on Feb 28, 2012 13:40:31 GMT -5
Ya know, I don't see how anyone can talk about Cena pandering when he really doesn't do it much at all (outside of charity and PR). He accepts that he can't please all the fans so he respects their right to not like him. He rides with the other half of the audience because they know the score, they like what he is doing and they support him. You cannot possibly complain about Cena "pandering" when compared to the current incarnation of The Rock. The patriotic pandering, the religious pandering, the twitter whoring worse than Michael Cole, the I love everyone in the audience thank you so much you made me I'm getting goose bumps OMG I used to live here and I met famous people from here and know historic parts of this city while flashing his pearly whites. Cena doesn't pander much anymore. But, you can't say that he's never done it outside of charity. I clearly remember a period where every John Cena promo started with "We're live in [Insert City Here]. The home of this team, and that team, and this landmark, and that beer! And this place is hot tonight!".
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