|
Post by froggyfrog on Jul 6, 2012 1:39:37 GMT -5
I feel bad for Rhett
|
|
The Line
Patti Mayonnaise
Real Name: Bumkiss. Stanley Bumkiss.
Peanut Butter & JAAAAAMMMM!
Posts: 36,698
|
Post by The Line on Jul 6, 2012 1:45:41 GMT -5
And just so people know, a verbal contract is[/b] legally binding. I don't know where people are coming up with the fact that they aren't but they are, you just have to be able to prove that it exists and was mutually agreed upon(witnesses are important)
|
|
|
Post by Spankymac is sick of the swiss on Jul 6, 2012 1:47:42 GMT -5
And just so people know, a verbal contract is[/b] legally binding. I don't know where people are coming up with the fact that they aren't but they are, you just have to be able to prove that it exists and was mutually agreed upon(witnesses are important)[/quote] Indeed, I think the legality of it varies from state to state, but verbal contracts with witnesses DO hold up in court. Frankly, I can see King's side of things, but he handled it poorly. He did ROH dirty. I mean, get paid, feed your family, do what you have to do, but at least be straight up about it.
|
|
The Line
Patti Mayonnaise
Real Name: Bumkiss. Stanley Bumkiss.
Peanut Butter & JAAAAAMMMM!
Posts: 36,698
|
Post by The Line on Jul 6, 2012 1:49:54 GMT -5
All sides are to blame. Both King and ROH and TNA Rhett got screwed. It's not ROH's fault. ROH had a (legal) verbal contract with King, which he broke.
|
|
The Line
Patti Mayonnaise
Real Name: Bumkiss. Stanley Bumkiss.
Peanut Butter & JAAAAAMMMM!
Posts: 36,698
|
Post by The Line on Jul 6, 2012 1:53:15 GMT -5
And just so people know, a verbal contract is[/b] legally binding. I don't know where people are coming up with the fact that they aren't but they are, you just have to be able to prove that it exists and was mutually agreed upon(witnesses are important)[/quote] Indeed, I think the legality of it varies from state to state, but verbal contracts with witnesses DO hold up in court. Frankly, I can see King's side of things, but he handled it poorly. He did ROH dirty. I mean, get paid, feed your family, do what you have to do, but at least be straight up about it. [/quote] Just looked it up, and Verbal/Oral contracts are legally binding in of Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, the jurisdiction that I would assume this would fall under(with ROH being HQ'd in Philly/Bristol)
|
|
|
Post by Error on Jul 6, 2012 1:56:22 GMT -5
Indeed, I think the legality of it varies from state to state, but verbal contracts with witnesses DO hold up in court. Frankly, I can see King's side of things, but he handled it poorly. He did ROH dirty. I mean, get paid, feed your family, do what you have to do, but at least be straight up about it. Just looked it up, and Verbal/Oral contracts are legally binding in the state of Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, the jurisdiction that I would assume this would fall under(with ROH being HQ'd in Philly/Bristol) Nah, they are based out of Maryland now and they recognize them in some cases but not all.
|
|
The Line
Patti Mayonnaise
Real Name: Bumkiss. Stanley Bumkiss.
Peanut Butter & JAAAAAMMMM!
Posts: 36,698
|
Post by The Line on Jul 6, 2012 2:02:52 GMT -5
Just looked it up, and Verbal/Oral contracts are legally binding in the state of Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, the jurisdiction that I would assume this would fall under(with ROH being HQ'd in Philly/Bristol) Nah, they are based out of Maryland now and they recognize them in some cases but not all. Strange. All their website info still lists Philly & Bristol. And while it's true that in Maryland, it's "some cases and not all", saying that makes it sound like judges pick and choose when to make them legally binding, which is not the case at all. There is a set legal precedent that determines if a verbal contract is legally binding in the state of Maryland. I assume ROH handing over the belt to King counts as "something of value", while his services can apply in the other way, as well.
|
|
|
Post by Ecks Ecks Ringout Ecks Ecks on Jul 6, 2012 2:03:07 GMT -5
Silly as it probably seems, crap like this really kills my interest in watching a guy wrestle. Had he switched companies minus the shenanigans, I would have considered this a great acquisition for TNA and looked forward to seeing his matches. I know he's the same performer with the same talent, but now ... I don't know, I had the same reaction to Mike Awesome and the ECW/WCW debacle. Suddenly I just don't care.
Seizing opportunities is part of the business, but you don't do it by spitting in the face of the people who gave you the opportunity to shine.
|
|
|
Post by Error on Jul 6, 2012 2:11:27 GMT -5
Nah, they are based out of Maryland now and they recognize them in some cases but not all. Strange. All their website info still lists Philly & Bristol. And while it's true that in Maryland, it's "some cases and not all", saying that makes it sound like judges pick and choose when to make them legally binding, which is not the case at all. There is a set legal precedent that determines if a verbal contract is legally binding in the state of Maryland. Yeah, I just wasn't going to dig to deep into the specifics. But yeah, when Cary sold to Sinclair they formed an LLC in Maryland where Sinclair is located and they handle all the business side. The store and school are still located in Penn. for now. It's how Gabe tried to weasel his way out of his "do not disparage" clause, claiming that he had a deal with ROH Wrestling Co., owned by Cary which ceased to exist when he sold to Sinclair and they launched Ring of Honor Wrestling Entertainment LLC in Maryland.
|
|
The Line
Patti Mayonnaise
Real Name: Bumkiss. Stanley Bumkiss.
Peanut Butter & JAAAAAMMMM!
Posts: 36,698
|
Post by The Line on Jul 6, 2012 2:15:48 GMT -5
Strange. All their website info still lists Philly & Bristol. And while it's true that in Maryland, it's "some cases and not all", saying that makes it sound like judges pick and choose when to make them legally binding, which is not the case at all. There is a set legal precedent that determines if a verbal contract is legally binding in the state of Maryland. Yeah, I just wasn't going to dig to deep into the specifics. But yeah, when Cary sold to Sinclair they formed an LLC in Maryland where Sinclair is located and they handle all the business side. The store and school are still located in Penn. for now. It's how Gabe tried to weasel his way out of his "do not disparage" clause, claiming that he had a deal with ROH Wrestling Co., owned by Cary which ceased to exist when he sold to Sinclair and they launched Ring of Honor Wrestling Entertainment LLC in Maryland. Either way, Penn. or Maryland, 1 & 2 look to be true. 3 looks to be hardest to argue, but like I said, ROH giving King the ROH Tag title, plus the money they were paying him to do the shows he worked verbally probably could count in the eyes of the right judge, if ROH were to take this to court. With that said, I doubt ROH has any real reason to take this to court. I was only bringing up the point to refute how many people were talking like verbal contracts mean absolutely nothing, when in many/most jurisdictions, they do.
|
|
MrBRulzOK
Wade Wilson
Mr No-Pants Heathen
Something Witty Here.
Posts: 26,719
|
Post by MrBRulzOK on Jul 6, 2012 2:21:25 GMT -5
Speaking as a fan of King, yeah, this really wasn't the brightest decision on his part. To take that verbal agreement and treat it as if it meant nothing just so he could make an appearance on TNA television is pretty low of him. But at the same time I can see why he may have done it. With the recent uncertainty as to whether ROH can really grow from where it is now maybe it's not the best idea for him to stick around.
Still, why couldn't he have waited a few months for his extension to expire before he did this? It's not like ROH wasn't gonna be using him seeing as they just put the tag belts on him and Rhett. Was he having so many financial issues that he simply couldn't wait to accept a deal with TNA?
In fact that makes it worse. He basically told them that the tag belts meant absolutely nothing to him. Not to mention it hurts Rhett who is kind of left in the middle of it all. I suppose they could have him pick a replacement tag partner, maybe a guy like TJ Perkins or Matt Taven or even Jay Lethal, but that certainly wouldn't make things better.
Not to mention TNA may get cold feet on using him anyway if this ends up developing into yet another lawsuit between two wrestling companies. So he may have ended up pretty much doing all this for absolutely nothing in the end.
|
|
|
Post by Big DSR Energy on Jul 6, 2012 2:23:12 GMT -5
Silly as it probably seems, crap like this really kills my interest in watching a guy wrestle. Had he switched companies minus the shenanigans, I would have considered this a great acquisition for TNA and looked forward to seeing his matches. I know he's the same performer with the same talent, but now ... I don't know, I had the same reaction to Mike Awesome and the ECW/WCW debacle. Suddenly I just don't care. Seizing opportunities is part of the business, but you don't do it by spitting in the face of the people who gave you the opportunity to shine. I feel the same way. I totally marked out for Kenny King when I saw him in Pittsburgh this past weekend. Now, I don't care for him at all.
|
|
Chuck Conry
Dennis Stamp
zombies DON'T Run
Posts: 3,822
|
Post by Chuck Conry on Jul 6, 2012 2:27:11 GMT -5
I've seen this happen in Extreme Warfare Revenge. Damn company not being able to get people to sign..By the end of the Summer Brutal Bob could be TV Champion!
|
|
Rave
El Dandy
Perpetually Bored
Posts: 8,356
|
Post by Rave on Jul 6, 2012 3:24:02 GMT -5
Only guy who came out of this well and truly screwed is Rhett Titus, especially if ROH decides to punish him for it.
Honestly though? There's a great opportunity to be had for him if they don't. He's talented, he can talk, he's homegrown, he's over with the crowd, and he's already a face. I say shoot the moon with him. Build him up as the guy to represent ROH against Steen. The underdog fighting for the company that gave him his start against the man holding it hostage. It would make a pleasant change from the never-ending parade of title shots given to the clones.
|
|
|
Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Jul 6, 2012 3:27:09 GMT -5
Only guy who came out of this well and truly screwed is Rhett Titus, especially if ROH decides to punish him for it. Honestly though? There's a great opportunity to be had for him if they don't. He's talented, he can talk, he's homegrown, he's over with the crowd, and he's already a face. I say shoot the moon with him. Build him up as the guy to represent ROH against Steen. The underdog fighting for the company that gave him his start against the man holding it hostage. It would make a pleasant change from the never-ending parade of title shots given to the clones. I can't see ROH punishing Titus for this. Unless he actively encouraged King to disregard his agreement with ROH and work TNA, he really had nothing to do with this.
|
|
Steveweiser
Dalek
Mickie Mickie You're So Fine... Hey Mickie!
THE GRAPS
Posts: 50,249
|
Post by Steveweiser on Jul 6, 2012 5:07:05 GMT -5
Austin Aries had retweeted ROH's statement, and made a comment about how it reminds him of the shady way they dealt with him, but he's since deleted it.
|
|
Dave at the Movies
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
VINTAGE D-DAY DAVE! Always cranking dat thing.
Posts: 18,228
|
Post by Dave at the Movies on Jul 6, 2012 6:35:25 GMT -5
I would really like to hear King's side about this whole situation.
ROH put themselves in this situation. It was extremely stupid on there part. They should let there guys negotiate deals with bigger companies while they are still under contract. Ever since ROH got bought out by Sinclair things have appeared very sketchy in that company. For example the Young Bucks signed on because ROH originally offered them more money than TNA. Now ROH is pulling this "oh we can't fly you out here crap". Unless the Young Bucks have a huge gaurentee with ROH(which is highly unlikely) they are getting screwed over big time by ROH.
ROH is not a steady company like it use to be. The only reason they are still doing okay is because their core fans are buying the DVDs and iPPV(which they have screwed up on the streaming more than once). Now that they are pissing off their core fans and can't get through their thick little corporate head that they should not depend on DVD sales in the year 2012 they could be in deep crap really soon.
There is so much more ROH could be doing business wise to make money and it's like they aren't even trying. Come up with some new merchandise ideas. Try to sneak some signs into WWE events. Sure that sounds a bit desperate but if ROH doesn't get desperate real soon it will be too late.
BTW for those that don't know Sinclair almost went bankrupt back in 2009. It is not a very stable company. It's only going to get worse for them if the price of advertising keeps dropping.
|
|
|
Post by Stab Sword on Jul 6, 2012 7:35:49 GMT -5
ROH is butt hurt that a wrestler broke a verbal agreement and went to a rival company when he didn't have a contract? Welcome to Professional Wrestling.
This just hasn't been ROH's year. First the iPPV debacle, then the website crash, then cancelling shows due to poor attendance, Sinclair not putting any money into the company, their TV show being showed at 1 in the morning in small markets and now one of their champs has gone to TNA.
|
|
|
Post by ________ has left the building on Jul 6, 2012 8:11:28 GMT -5
This reeks of WCW.
|
|
|
Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Jul 6, 2012 8:59:40 GMT -5
It's strange to see TNA on the other side of such shenannigans given how many times they've lost out after using talent not signed to a contract. It's one of those situations where no-one is in the right, King probably feared that if he said no to TNA now, another opportunity to make an immediate impact (no pun intended) wouldn't happen any time soon, and that RoH management may stop using him anyway, like they have Colt and the Young Bucks, unless he signs a new deal that many not be as good as his last given how RoH are tightening their belt lately. RoH and TNA shouldn't have put him in this position to begin with, but as many have said, the real victim in all of this is his tag partner.
I do agree with people who compare the situation to WCW, but not in the way they probably mean. It's like WCW versus WCW in a way, with RoH playing the role of Jim Herd era WCW, being run by people with experience in TV but no experience running a wrestling company, cutting corners and trying to save money on talent, damaging the company in the process by driving away people who could make them money. TNA, on the other hand, are Bischoff era WCW, swooping in to sign talent from wounded competitors whenever it suits their needs.
|
|