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Post by Hit Girl on Sept 2, 2013 4:15:22 GMT -5
What you need to look for isn't Daniel Bryan being "buried", but rather his role being hijacked. If you notice his presence in the storyline slowly being de-emphasised and marginalised in favour of an already established star like Cena, or even HHH himself following a face turn etc.....being pushed as the main opponent to Orton and the Corporation, then you know HHH has struck again
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Sept 2, 2013 7:04:36 GMT -5
Wrestling fans like us on these forums have long memories and I suspect this is mostly down to people remembering the Corporation stuff from the 90s and feeling like it's a rehash. I can understand that it can feel like a repetition. I do get those feelings. At the same time I feel like we're getting over four new stars using a couple of established ones.
What this will all come down to is how the storyline concludes because if the heels get away with it, it was all for nothing.
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riseofsetian1981
King Koopa
"I met him fifteen years ago. I was told there was nothing left."
Posts: 10,323
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Post by riseofsetian1981 on Sept 2, 2013 7:10:43 GMT -5
I think what people need to understand is that this isn't just a case of "the internet never being happy" or "IWC always complain". We can agree on several things actually. First, look at how many times the WWE has dropped the ball on angles with potential? Let's be honest here. Remember how many times we said "let's wait and see" during Nexus feud with Cena? Summer of Punk? the Walkout, Awesome Truth, etc?
There's absolutely nothing wrong with being optimistic. However, it's wrong to be in denial and feel as if it could be great, especially when history has shown otherwise when it comes to potential.
Fans just don't want it to become another status quo type of scenario.
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riseofsetian1981
King Koopa
"I met him fifteen years ago. I was told there was nothing left."
Posts: 10,323
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Post by riseofsetian1981 on Sept 2, 2013 7:12:05 GMT -5
Wrestling fans like us on these forums have long memories and I suspect this is mostly down to people remembering the Corporation stuff from the 90s and feeling like it's a rehash. I can understand that it can feel like a repetition. I do get those feelings. At the same time I feel like we're getting over four new stars using a couple of established ones. What this will all come down to is how the storyline concludes because if the heels get away with it, it was all for nothing. For me, as a fan, I feel like this is how the Summer of Punk should've played out.
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Arrow
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 5,122
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Post by Arrow on Sept 2, 2013 7:18:36 GMT -5
I think what people need to understand is that this isn't just a case of "the internet never being happy" or "IWC always complain". We can agree on several things actually. First, look at how many times the WWE has dropped the ball on angles with potential? Let's be honest here. Remember how many times we said "let's wait and see" during Nexus feud with Cena? Summer of Punk? the Walkout, Awesome Truth, etc? I understand all of that. I also understand that since you can't change what may or may not happen in the future of the story, then you only have two choices: either "wait and see" or stop watching. And if you're going to do the former, then why not try and enjoy it?
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Post by Citizen Snips on Sept 2, 2013 8:00:20 GMT -5
My quesion is how should it be booked: Bryan dominating everyone? Then, people would complain about how he wins all the time just like they do Cena. Most of the "How I'd Book It" ideas I've seen have been a variation on A. Daniel Bryan destroys everyone by himself. B. Daniel Bryan teams up with my other favorite wrestler (CM Punk and/or Dolph Ziggler) and they destroy everyone together. C. Cena returns as a heel in some variation of either Hogan's or Bret's heel turn. Then Daniel Bryan destroys him. I understand why people are concerned about the storyline going forward, but most of the alternatives being suggested are just as horrible/unoriginal.
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Post by PTBartman on Sept 2, 2013 8:07:26 GMT -5
- Don't rely on Cena saving the day. His return would be the perfect chance to turn him. Tease that he's going to join the rebels, then have him turn on them. At that point, if the SHIELD are still over, they could be turned face, and join the rebels either as SHIELD or with each guy being repackaged (which is going to happen at some point anyway). I feel like it would show more faith in Bryan on WWE's part if they push him as a face while Cena is present and still a face. A face Cena can step aside and let Bryan have the spotlight. A heel Cena would just hijack the story and make it about how "John Cena has turned his back on the WWE Universe" which would undermine Bryan just as much as him "saving the day" would. If Cena gets involved, then branch him off into a feud with Ambrose or teaming up with two other faces against the Shield. I've been thinking about this for a week or so, could Cena turn heel without turning heel? Could he become the unwitting tool of the Corporation without actually turning. He still has at least one rematch in his pocket. So let 's say Orton crashes and loses the belt at the rumble. Cena comes back, the Corp. jumps horses in mid stream and throw their (unwanted) support behind Cena as the returning "prodigal son" Cena's motivation is still "doing it for The Belt and bringing it back where it belongs cause that's what The Cenation/WWE Universe wants." You still have Orton trying to win back his place as favored son. And Bryan trying to get back/retain what he rightfully owned. Plus eight weeks of sign pointing on the road to WMXXX.
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Post by bigalbass86 AKA Smokin Vokoun on Sept 2, 2013 8:49:42 GMT -5
I think what people need to understand is that this isn't just a case of "the internet never being happy" or "IWC always complain". We can agree on several things actually. First, look at how many times the WWE has dropped the ball on angles with potential? Let's be honest here. Remember how many times we said "let's wait and see" during Nexus feud with Cena? Summer of Punk? the Walkout, Awesome Truth, etc? I understand all of that. I also understand that since you can't change what may or may not happen in the future of the story, then you only have two choices: either "wait and see" or stop watching. And if you're going to do the former, then why not try and enjoy it? If you're not enjoying something that, at this point, is very good, then what's the point? If it turns out to be bad, complain, I'll be there as well. As of now, I'm liking how it's going and Daniel Bryan is looking like a star, if he's not a star already.
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Post by Next Level was WRONG on Sept 2, 2013 8:54:15 GMT -5
I love the storyline, its just after Bryan has to be taken away from the title picture the only other people who can fill his shoes are Punk, Ziggler and Big Show and quite frankly I'd rather watch my house burn to the ground than any of those three.
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Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on Sept 2, 2013 10:02:01 GMT -5
I like the story so far, but for the love of god they need to stop ending every show the same way. there's a reason people got tired of the NWO. this angle's only been going 3 weeks and I'm already tired of every show ending with the Shield gangbeating Daniel Bryan.
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Chip
Hank Scorpio
Slam Jam Death.
Posts: 5,185
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Post by Chip on Sept 2, 2013 10:51:25 GMT -5
It feels like a lot of people disliking the storyline dislike it because of the people involved rather then the actual storyline. If it was Maddox instead of Hunter, would it be better then? Potentially Barrett instead of Orton too?
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kidglov3s
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Wants her Shot
Who is Tiger Maskooo?
Posts: 15,870
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Post by kidglov3s on Sept 2, 2013 11:18:24 GMT -5
I like the story so far, but for the love of god they need to stop ending every show the same way. there's a reason people got tired of the NWO. this angle's only been going 3 weeks and I'm already tired of every show ending with the Shield gangbeating Daniel Bryan. If the NWO angle did one thing it made Randy Savage look really strong in 1996 when he totally got beat down all the time. Remember how awesome Ahmed and The Nation was? One sided feuds totally rule. And I don't get why it's not ok to just simply not dig something. I have to go to work. I have to learn what I need to know in nursing school. I have to obey traffic laws while driving. I don't have to like everything in wrestling.
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Bo Rida
Fry's dog Seymour
Pulled one over on everyone. Got away with it, this time.
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Post by Bo Rida on Sept 2, 2013 11:21:41 GMT -5
This corporate storyline has rejuvenated the career of Randy Orton, made Triple H interesting again, and put Bryan in the spotlight. New faces could get over, better heels could be made, great matches could be had, there are a ton of possibilities. I don't see why others would dislike it. You don't like Triple H? What about when he was ending the show as a babyface dominating Lesnar a few months back? Or Randy Orton? Imagine if he just didn't Orton's my issue, you mention "great matches could be had" but he's already regressing to chinlock and stomp based offence, if he carries on down that path I have no desire to watch his matches. Plus he's still boring on the mic. A lot of people didn't like Orton's recent face run but I did, he had plenty of good matches and was mostly mute without too much focus being put on him, to me that's the ideal role for him. If that's combined with weekly 20 minute HHH promos that could easily be cut to 5 minutes it's not a good combination, it takes up a large chunk of Raw I'd rather see spent on other things. That's not unique to HHH though, I felt the same earlier in the year when Punk and Heyman droned on every show and they're two of the all-time great speakers. All that said it could still be a great angle, it's just as others have said WWE have lost the benefit of the doubt when it comes to long-term storytelling.
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Post by rybackrulez on Sept 2, 2013 12:04:52 GMT -5
I like how much of a cocky asshole orton has become. I like the shield keeping on destroying everybody. I like that HHH has surrounded himself with the only champions who matter. I like that Hunter isn't cartoony. He is playing a boss character who really throws his weight around and abuses his power. Instead of being over the top boastful. He is matter of fact. That is the coolest part. Also Vince being a fan of the shield's ruthless aggression months ago make sense now.
Then you have bryan. An underdog in everyway. He has the fans on his side. Unlike Cena or austin he doesn't just handle the situtation by himself because he doesn't have the muscle or the size to pull it off. The shield are still the shield they will cut you off right when you think you got them.
He is a lot like Mankind while Orton is rock. Except Bryan has no DX. He doesn't have a group of renegades who thumb their nose at authority.
Really want Bryan to bring in The outlaws, who then proceed to beat him down, and side with hhh. Every segment they bring hhh a coffee or sandwhich or bottle of vos water.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2013 12:10:50 GMT -5
It feels like a lot of people disliking the storyline dislike it because of the people involved rather then the actual storyline. If it was Maddox instead of Hunter, would it be better then? Potentially Barrett instead of Orton too? I'm fine with Orton being involved because I really, really like Orton. For the story they want to tell they need the players they have pretty much. You need someone who's been a longtime part of the WWE "establishment". I'm super bored of Triple H but if they were to say, sub in Big Johnny for Hunter I'd be in.
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Post by xCompackx on Sept 2, 2013 12:34:08 GMT -5
I think what people need to understand is that this isn't just a case of "the internet never being happy" or "IWC always complain". We can agree on several things actually. First, look at how many times the WWE has dropped the ball on angles with potential? Let's be honest here. Remember how many times we said "let's wait and see" during Nexus feud with Cena? Summer of Punk? the Walkout, Awesome Truth, etc? There's absolutely nothing wrong with being optimistic. However, it's wrong to be in denial and feel as if it could be great, especially when history has shown otherwise when it comes to potential. Fans just don't want it to become another status quo type of scenario. In all fairness, I don't think WWE planned to have those angles end up the way they did.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Sept 2, 2013 12:37:37 GMT -5
See for me though it's not even that it's a rehash of Austin/Mcmahon.. it's that they've never stopped doing that storyline. If it had just been done in say 98, and this was revisiting that, fine, but at least on an annual basis, we've gotten evil heel authority figure iterations. It's just a variation of a theme they've been doing constantly for a decade and a half.
It's less a rehash, and more of the exact same.
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Post by Hit Girl on Sept 2, 2013 14:52:45 GMT -5
My quesion is how should it be booked: Bryan dominating everyone? Then, people would complain about how he wins all the time just like they do Cena. Most of the "How I'd Book It" ideas I've seen have been a variation on A. Daniel Bryan destroys everyone by himself. B. Daniel Bryan teams up with my other favorite wrestler (CM Punk and/or Dolph Ziggler) and they destroy everyone together. C. Cena returns as a heel in some variation of either Hogan's or Bret's heel turn. Then Daniel Bryan destroys him. I understand why people are concerned about the storyline going forward, but most of the alternatives being suggested are just as horrible/unoriginal. It's because one way or another, Daniel Bryan has to destroy his enemy. If he doesn't, and it's either status quo, or even worse, Daniel Bryan and the Corporation coming to some sort of accord, like Punk did with HHH, then the storyline will be blown.
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Post by CATCH_US IS the Conversation on Sept 2, 2013 15:07:32 GMT -5
My quesion is how should it be booked: Bryan dominating everyone? Then, people would complain about how he wins all the time just like they do Cena. Most of the "How I'd Book It" ideas I've seen have been a variation on A. Daniel Bryan destroys everyone by himself. B. Daniel Bryan teams up with my other favorite wrestler (CM Punk and/or Dolph Ziggler) and they destroy everyone together. C. Cena returns as a heel in some variation of either Hogan's or Bret's heel turn. Then Daniel Bryan destroys him. I understand why people are concerned about the storyline going forward, but most of the alternatives being suggested are just as horrible/unoriginal. For me, I just want Bryan to have one or more allies that can help him without making him look too weak. Punk is too big of a name that he'd just hijack the angle. Someone like Big Show or a face turned Ryback pretty much HAS to wreck everyone because as big guys, that's what their characters do, which ultimately makes Bryan look like he needs his hand held. Imo ideally it would be Bryan + an assortment of lower card and mid card supporters. Someone like Miz or Cody Rhodes, or even some low level guys like Zack Ryder or Alex Riley can try to make the save for Bryan, get a small flurry in to pop the crowd only to eventually get overwhelmed by the numbers, but giving Bryan the opening to turn the tide. They can get a rub without taking the focus off of building Bryan up. If Cena goes corporate, the focus of the story shifts to Cena, which has always been the #1 negative of his character.
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Post by cool guy on Sept 2, 2013 15:43:21 GMT -5
It's inevitable that other faces are going to get a shot at the title, because Orton is going to hold it a while and we can't have Daniel Bryan lose more than one or two title matches in a row. So Punk and maybe even Ziggler (but hopefully not Big Show. Show vs Orton? Ugh) will probably be involved in the title scene over the coming months, and I think that's pretty understandable. Plus, I have a reasonable amount of faith that DB will get the win in the end, since he certainly seems to have the higher-ups behind him more than the other options.
I see people suggesting a Cena heel turn, and while I still think that's a money idea, I don't think it needs to be added to this for a while. If Cena's going to turn, he should do it AFTER Bryan has definitively won this storyline. Once Triple H and Orton go down, Cena can step up as the next big heel after Wrestlemania, since by that point Bryan would be firmly established as the protagonist and Cena going heel wouldn't take as much spotlight away as it would if he did it during the middle of this angle.
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