Abdullah
Hank Scorpio
Thank you, Ishmeal Loves Bayley!
Posts: 6,421
|
Post by Abdullah on Sept 11, 2013 3:57:19 GMT -5
What I'm getting from Meltzer is "If you're gonna be a wrestler, don't be passionate about it. Just show up, get paid, get laid and screw everything else." "...But don't try consider outside projects. Because then we'll fire you for your lack of loyalty and dedication." This very likely has a lot to do with AJ being a diva. Carlito, Shelton and more recently Bateman all lost their jobs for being too indifferent - if the reports are to be believed. I'd love to know whose making fun of her backstage so I could stop supporting them.
|
|
|
Post by Hit Girl on Sept 11, 2013 4:11:22 GMT -5
Since it's Dave Meltzer, this would be a more accurate quote...
|
|
|
Post by Slammy Award-Winning Cannibal on Sept 11, 2013 4:40:13 GMT -5
Yeah let's shit on AJ for striving for a goal to be the legit top diva in WWE as a character, villain and wrestler. Piss on her for having an ego and wanting to be #1. Talk about an insane concept.
|
|
BigBadZ
Grimlock
The Rumors Are All True
Posts: 13,923
|
Post by BigBadZ on Sept 11, 2013 4:57:28 GMT -5
"belt mark" This is one of those things that makes really appreciate wrestling. Y'know - its like - only in wrestling. No one would ever say this about something like the Academy Awards or what have you. It would be incredibly marky if someone say, Mark Wahlberg, were to ever win an Academy Award and tattoo the date on his body.
|
|
|
Post by Hit Girl on Sept 11, 2013 5:10:20 GMT -5
Belts should be important. They should be the driving force behind the most important storylines in the company. If they are meaningless, then the audience has no reason to care either. A wrestler SHOULD be proud of holding a title if it's treated with prestige
|
|
|
Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on Sept 11, 2013 5:26:19 GMT -5
"belt mark" This is one of those things that makes really appreciate wrestling. Y'know - its like - only in wrestling. No one would ever say this about something like the Academy Awards or what have you. It would be incredibly marky if someone say, Mark Wahlberg, were to ever win an Academy Award and tattoo the date on his body. Would that make him Marky Mark, the markiest mark that ever marked?
|
|
|
Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Sept 11, 2013 5:28:48 GMT -5
It would be incredibly marky if someone say, Mark Wahlberg, were to ever win an Academy Award and tattoo the date on his body. Would that make him Marky Mark, the markiest mark that ever marked? Come on, that's just a whole bunch of funky.
|
|
|
Post by HMARK Center on Sept 11, 2013 6:04:27 GMT -5
Guys, if we're being honest here, there hasn't been much in the way of personal "trashing" of AJ over her tattoo OR over her excitement for being champion for the first time. On their own, those things really aren't the point.
Again, while Meltzer and Alvarez could've gone about it better, they're making a legitimate point: that the wrestling industry (both WWE in particular and most promotions in general) is absolutely crazy.
As stated already, in what other industry do people who are passionate about their craft get used, made fun of, underpaid, taken advantage of, on such a large scale on the basis of "kid, what you do is fake!"...while at the same time being held to absurd loyalty standards that involve traveling all over the world, missing one's family for the vast bulk of the year, and having to act like an employee while receiving none of the legal benefits of having that moniker?
It's a dirty, double-standard-ridden industry, and again, especially in a company like WWE it's important that the talent not show management ways that they can be taken advantage of, because for all of it's trappings as a 21st century publicly traded company, WWE is still clownshoes-carny in many, many ways.
|
|
|
Post by The Baltimore Staircase on Sept 11, 2013 6:50:53 GMT -5
As far as a tattoo goes, I really don't get why people go mad. There's the old thing about "the only people who care if you've got a tattoo, are people who don't have tattoos". It's a personal choice by the individual. If they feel strongly enough about something that they wish to express it by having it marked on their body then so what? It's their way of doing it. Your way might be to post a lame facebook status or make a cute little facebook cover. Not everyone has to be the same.
And as far as the "belt mark" thing goes. No doubt some people scoff at it but the fact is that fake or not, holding these belts is a sign of hard work paying off. It's a career goal to be on top in the biggest company the industry has to offer. The belts might not be the same as a football trophy or whatever but to fans of DIS BUSINESS they symbolise more than a fancy gold prop. Not just the world titles, all of them. When as a young kid you've spent every minute idolising the wrestlers from the past, these things matter. Whether you grew up watching Stone Cold rise to the WWF championship, or Kurt Angle winning the European Title and treating it as the greatest thing he'd ever done, these things matter.
AJ Lee, just like a lot of the talent right now, before everything else was a fan and you can't manufacture the passion, determination and loyalty that they have to offer. I think it's a shame that people scoff at AJ's show of pride, when really these are the things that make her great.
|
|
|
Post by willywonka666 on Sept 11, 2013 6:58:52 GMT -5
Well to me, if the belts nowadays weren't like a doorknob (everyone gets a turn) and someone besides CM Punk and Cena held onto one for over a year, then maybe I would get more excited about winning one if I was wrestling.
Good for her, but I see his point.
|
|
|
Post by ________ has left the building on Sept 11, 2013 7:08:59 GMT -5
It wouldn't been no controversy if she got a butterfly tramp stamp or a tribal band.
|
|
|
Post by willywonka666 on Sept 11, 2013 7:11:16 GMT -5
What if Tommy Rich had gotten a tattoo? or any number of transitional champs?
|
|
|
Post by Snaptastic on Sept 11, 2013 7:21:43 GMT -5
Totally agree. AJ of course should be the WWE champion and face of the company. They could have a hologram of her skipping for the sideplates and everything.....
|
|
|
Post by Sparvid on Sept 11, 2013 7:38:35 GMT -5
I just don't think it's a coincidence that JBL was mocking her for her tattoo. Remember whose voice is in that earpiece. I seem to recall hearing a story somewhere that before Wrestlemania XX, Ultimo Dragon had a bunch of Japanese reporters following him around everywhere because he was going to wrestle at MSG, and when Vince saw/heard about it, he was basically "What the hell is that about?" BTW, why bring up Acadamy Awards? Shouldn't it be more like Ralph Macchio celebrating the date when he won the All Valley Under 18 Karate Tournament?
|
|
|
Post by Slammy Award-Winning Cannibal on Sept 11, 2013 8:02:17 GMT -5
Also, I love how getting a tattoo for getting a title makes you a mark for the business.
Meanwhile, wrestlers get tattoos all the time dedicated to their families, beliefs, philisophies, and passions and then fans cream their jeans over how awesome they look.
|
|
|
Post by Hit Girl on Sept 11, 2013 8:03:43 GMT -5
I just don't think it's a coincidence that JBL was mocking her for her tattoo. Remember whose voice is in that earpiece. I seem to recall hearing a story somewhere that before Wrestlemania XX, Ultimo Dragon had a bunch of Japanese reporters following him around everywhere because he was going to wrestle at MSG, and when Vince saw/heard about it, he was basically "What the hell is that about?" BTW, why bring up Acadamy Awards? Shouldn't it be more like Ralph Macchio celebrating the date when he won the All Valley Under 18 Karate Tournament? No, because wrestling has always been portrayed as simulated sport, and never just a work of fiction with clearly defined lines between character and portrayer. It's why wrestling never includes a cast list. There's no difference between AJ being proud of winning her title, and Ric Flair harping on about being a 16 time world champion. No one would ever laugh at him for claiming that (they'd laugh at him for other reasons though), so she shouldn't be mocked either, especially from people who make their living off the very same business.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2013 8:23:51 GMT -5
"belt mark" This is one of those things that makes really appreciate wrestling. Y'know - its like - only in wrestling. No one would ever say this about something like the Academy Awards or what have you. It would be incredibly marky if someone say, Mark Wahlberg, were to ever win an Academy Award and tattoo the date on his body. "Felt the Vibrations 2/10/17"
|
|
|
Post by fortknox on Sept 11, 2013 8:26:27 GMT -5
Not to get this off topic but, people talking about Bret Hart taking less money seem to be forgetting that business as a whole was down.
So it wouldn't make much sense to demand top dollar when the company can't cover it.
|
|
|
Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on Sept 11, 2013 9:23:22 GMT -5
Shawn Michaels must've worked ultra-cheap considering how often he was given the belt to shut his mouth.
|
|
|
Post by carp (SPC, Itoh Respect Army) on Sept 11, 2013 9:34:24 GMT -5
However, it's a cumulative effect, and in an industry where wrestlers NEED to band together to be treated fairly, gestures like tattooing the date of your first title win, again, particularly for a title that's considered unimportant by the company, offers the company a potential weakness to exploit. This is far less a condemnation of AJ, however, than a condemnation of the wrestling industry as a whole. I think Meltzer was kind of looking at this sadly from a "man, these wrestlers just make life harder for themselves" perspective, but again, he said it in a condescending way that hardly seemed appropriate. There is literally nothing AJ Lee or anyone can do to actually make the WWE see its female talent as MORE replaceable or unimportant. I kind of see your point, but the levels of respect that the WWE has for its female wrestlers is already at negative infinity. Practically speaking, she just doesn't have the power to lower it. But here's the other thing, I think this "belt mark" thing is a false villain. Wrestlers don't debase themselves because they're fans. They debase themselves because they buy into the FALSE COMPETITION. They buy into the mindset that the stars are the ones who Worked Their Way Up and Really Deserve It, so they never fully trust one another, and the egregious, cut-throat unfairness of the bosses and bookers is just part of the game. There are no rational reasons to actually become a wrestler. Well... I take that back. If you look like Tor Johnson or Bam Bam Bigelow or someone, you might as well become a wrestler. But for most people, it's objectively an awful job. But the percent of Fan-wrestlers is lower than the percent of people who apply the sports mindset to pro wrestling, and THAT is what keeps them from organizing. ...I do like how just a given here is that the bosses of the WWE are just pure evil who will gleefully exploit anyone they can get away with exploiting.
|
|