So, knowing little about the series and only just hearing some of the divisive opinions about the ending, was this an actual relationship that made sense or did the creators just pull a Dumbledore?
So, knowing little about the series and only just hearing some of the divisive opinions about the ending, was this an actual relationship that made sense or did the creators just pull a Dumbledore?
If it happened in the first two seasons, it wouldn't. They first met as rivals fighting over the same guy. Seasons 3 began to expand their friendship, and the story interim revealed that Korra had become far closer to Asami than to the others, being the only person she kept contact with between seasons.
It made sense, but it was still subtly done, which is probably the most impressive thing about it. Usually creators either pull a Dumbledore, like you put it, or they make it over the top. Plot elements support them being together without making it blatant. When I look back in hindsight, a some things that didn't make sense before do now.
Last Edit: Dec 21, 2014 9:03:49 GMT -5 by Red Impact
I will say that I do think it made sense with Dumbledore, as the Grindelwald connection reads a LOT more like lovers with things going south than just friends, given how intense the connection and break was, but that's just me.
HMARK Center
Administrator THE 21st CENTURY BEGINS OCTOBER 1, 1982.
Post by HMARK Center on Dec 21, 2014 12:55:19 GMT -5
Reading a few other reviews of the finale, I did enjoy a couple of other analyses that took things in different ways.
For example, as said before, I get that due to the lack of episodes each season compared with the first series that certain things didn't feel as "earned" or came off as rushed; yet with the Korra/Asami ending, it's interesting to juxtapose that with Aang and Katara's kiss to end the first series, which felt like the "it's about time!" culmination, whereas this felt more like the potential beginning of something. They're not a couple yet, have not discussed their feelings yet, but the ending shows that there is a clear, undeniable feeling there, and maybe this trip they're taking will give them the chance to do something about that. That said, it's hard to avoid comparing it with the original show's ending because so much about its direction and the way it was presented felt similar, and I bet that threw a few folks off a bit.
I also liked the review that said we basically got to follow Korra from being the equivalent of a wide-eyed high school freshman at the start of Book One to seeing her end Book Four as a recent college grad who's ready to take that long backpack-hiking trip through Europe with a "special friend"; I definitely laughed at the mental image.
That all said, I'm really, REALLY interested to see if the guys get to revisit this universe the way they've revisited Aang's. While the original series basically left "Where is Zuko's mother?" as the one major hanging thread, this series really left a ton potential room to explore: will Su ever find it in her to forgive (but not forget) what Kuvira did to her, her family, and her nation? Speaking of Su, will we ever learn who her father is? What direction does Bolin and Opal's relationship go in, and what will Bolin do with his life now that the war is over? Has Mako really found himself following his near-sacrifice? And are Korra and Asami really destined to stick together, or are there other possibilities? Is Korra going to experience anything that might partially reconnect her with her old lives, or are they truly severed now? We didn't see nearly as much of the new Air Nomads as Book Four went on (Jinora, Kai, even Bumi), how will they evolve? Hell, even after the timeskip that took him from being an infant to toddler-don, we saw nothing of Tenzin and Pema's youngest son, Rohan.
The new Avatar: The Last Airbender comics are published by Dark Horse and Nickelodeon itself, and I'm afraid Nick isn't likely to OK a Korra series where it'll probably be made very clear that Korra and Asami are in some kind of relationship, however it may evolve. Then again, I also have to figure that Mike and Bryan may want to get away from Nick after all the drama the network put them through, but might have to wrestle with who owns the rights to what properties. I really, really hope they get the chance to come back to Korra's world the way they've returned to Aang's; it's too rich a place not to learn more about.
"We have seen many reflections of China, but the true face of China can be found in our people. We have now come full circle. Sadly, that means this is where we must part, but I hope you will return some day. A wave of the hand now, and I am gone. Lowering my head, I dream that I am home. Until we meet again, zàijiàn."
Reading a few other reviews of the finale, I did enjoy a couple of other analyses that took things in different ways.
For example, as said before, I get that due to the lack of episodes each season compared with the first series that certain things didn't feel as "earned" or came off as rushed; yet with the Korra/Asami ending, it's interesting to juxtapose that with Aang and Katara's kiss to end the first series, which felt like the "it's about time!" culmination, whereas this felt more like the potential beginning of something. They're not a couple yet, have not discussed their feelings yet, but the ending shows that there is a clear, undeniable feeling there, and maybe this trip they're taking will give them the chance to do something about that. That said, it's hard to avoid comparing it with the original show's ending because so much about its direction and the way it was presented felt similar, and I bet that threw a few folks off a bit.
I also liked the review that said we basically got to follow Korra from being the equivalent of a wide-eyed high school freshman at the start of Book One to seeing her end Book Four as a recent college grad who's ready to take that long backpack-hiking trip through Europe with a "special friend"; I definitely laughed at the mental image.
That all said, I'm really, REALLY interested to see if the guys get to revisit this universe the way they've revisited Aang's. While the original series basically left "Where is Zuko's mother?" as the one major hanging thread, this series really left a ton potential room to explore: will Su ever find it in her to forgive (but not forget) what Kuvira did to her, her family, and her nation? Speaking of Su, will we ever learn who her father is? What direction does Bolin and Opal's relationship go in, and what will Bolin do with his life now that the war is over? Has Mako really found himself following his near-sacrifice? And are Korra and Asami really destined to stick together, or are there other possibilities? Is Korra going to experience anything that might partially reconnect her with her old lives, or are they truly severed now? We didn't see nearly as much of the new Air Nomads as Book Four went on (Jinora, Kai, even Bumi), how will they evolve? Hell, even after the timeskip that took him from being an infant to toddler-don, we saw nothing of Tenzin and Pema's youngest son, Rohan.
The new Avatar: The Last Airbender comics are published by Dark Horse and Nickelodeon itself, and I'm afraid Nick isn't likely to OK a Korra series where it'll probably be made very clear that Korra and Asami are in some kind of relationship, however it may evolve. Then again, I also have to figure that Mike and Bryan may want to get away from Nick after all the drama the network put them through, but might have to wrestle with who owns the rights to what properties. I really, really hope they get the chance to come back to Korra's world the way they've returned to Aang's; it's too rich a place not to learn more about.
Have they said there will be any Korra comics taking place after the series ?
Post by Gerard Gerard on Dec 21, 2014 21:42:09 GMT -5
There's been no word on any continuation of the Korra stuff, comics or otherwise. The ending was of such an ambiguous strand that it's hard to see them going back to it.
Shippers are a scary bunch. People were convinced that Korra and Mako getting back together was going to be inevitable.
Ironically those same groups of people were the ones convinced that Zuko and Katara would be a couple.
Shippers do scare me, but "crack shippers" are at least fun because they embrace insanity.
Bring on the MaKorrAsami shippers who argue "they're all adults, so it's none of our business" when writing their demented fan fics.
"We have seen many reflections of China, but the true face of China can be found in our people. We have now come full circle. Sadly, that means this is where we must part, but I hope you will return some day. A wave of the hand now, and I am gone. Lowering my head, I dream that I am home. Until we meet again, zàijiàn."
Now that Korra and Asami’s final moment is out in the world, it seems like an appropriate time to express how I feel about it. I didn’t want to say anything right away so the audience could experience the finale for themselves.
The main themes of the Avatar universe have always revolved around equality, justice, acceptance, tolerance, and balancing differing worldviews. In subtle and maybe not so subtle ways, Avatar and Legend of Korra have dealt with difficult subjects such as genocide, child abuse, deaths of loved ones, and post traumatic stress. I took it as a complement when Joanna Robinson of Vanity Fair called the show subversive. There were times even I was surprised we were able to delve into the really tough stuff on a children’s TV network. While the episodes were never designed to “make a statement”, Bryan and I always strove to treat the more difficult subject matter with the respect and gravity it deserved.
And over the years we’ve heard from numerous fans, in person and online, how Avatar and Korra have influenced their lives for the better or helped them overcome a life struggle or setback. I am always humbled when people share their personal stories with us and I am grateful that my love for telling stories has been able to help people in some small way. So while Avatar and Korra were always meant to be entertaining and engaging tales, this universe and its characters also speak to the deeper humanity in all of us, regardless of age, gender, race, religion, culture, nationality, or sexual orientation.
Our intention with the last scene was to make it as clear as possible that yes, Korra and Asami have romantic feelings for each other. The moment where they enter the spirit portal symbolizes their evolution from being friends to being a couple. Many news outlets, bloggers, and fans picked up on this and didn’t find it ambiguous. For the most part, it seems like the point of the scene was understood and additional commentary wasn’t really needed from Bryan or me. But in case people were still questioning what happened in the last scene, I wanted to make a clear verbal statement to complement the show’s visual one. I get that not everyone will be happy with the way that the show ended. Rarely does a series finale of any show satisfy that show’s fans, so I’ve been pleasantly surprised with the positive articles and posts I’ve seen about Korra’s finale.
I’ve already read some heartwarming and incredible posts about how this moment means so much for the LGBT community. Once again, the incredible outpouring of support for the show humbles me. As Tenzin says, “Life is one big bumpy ride.” And if, by Korra and Asami being a couple, we are able to help smooth out that ride even a tiny bit for some people, I’m proud to do my part, however small it might be. Thanks for reading.
HMARK Center
Administrator THE 21st CENTURY BEGINS OCTOBER 1, 1982.
Now that Korra and Asami’s final moment is out in the world, it seems like an appropriate time to express how I feel about it. I didn’t want to say anything right away so the audience could experience the finale for themselves.
The main themes of the Avatar universe have always revolved around equality, justice, acceptance, tolerance, and balancing differing worldviews. In subtle and maybe not so subtle ways, Avatar and Legend of Korra have dealt with difficult subjects such as genocide, child abuse, deaths of loved ones, and post traumatic stress. I took it as a complement when Joanna Robinson of Vanity Fair called the show subversive. There were times even I was surprised we were able to delve into the really tough stuff on a children’s TV network. While the episodes were never designed to “make a statement”, Bryan and I always strove to treat the more difficult subject matter with the respect and gravity it deserved.
And over the years we’ve heard from numerous fans, in person and online, how Avatar and Korra have influenced their lives for the better or helped them overcome a life struggle or setback. I am always humbled when people share their personal stories with us and I am grateful that my love for telling stories has been able to help people in some small way. So while Avatar and Korra were always meant to be entertaining and engaging tales, this universe and its characters also speak to the deeper humanity in all of us, regardless of age, gender, race, religion, culture, nationality, or sexual orientation.
Our intention with the last scene was to make it as clear as possible that yes, Korra and Asami have romantic feelings for each other. The moment where they enter the spirit portal symbolizes their evolution from being friends to being a couple. Many news outlets, bloggers, and fans picked up on this and didn’t find it ambiguous. For the most part, it seems like the point of the scene was understood and additional commentary wasn’t really needed from Bryan or me. But in case people were still questioning what happened in the last scene, I wanted to make a clear verbal statement to complement the show’s visual one. I get that not everyone will be happy with the way that the show ended. Rarely does a series finale of any show satisfy that show’s fans, so I’ve been pleasantly surprised with the positive articles and posts I’ve seen about Korra’s finale.
I’ve already read some heartwarming and incredible posts about how this moment means so much for the LGBT community. Once again, the incredible outpouring of support for the show humbles me. As Tenzin says, “Life is one big bumpy ride.” And if, by Korra and Asami being a couple, we are able to help smooth out that ride even a tiny bit for some people, I’m proud to do my part, however small it might be. Thanks for reading.
Last Edit: Dec 22, 2014 22:20:50 GMT -5 by HMARK Center
"We have seen many reflections of China, but the true face of China can be found in our people. We have now come full circle. Sadly, that means this is where we must part, but I hope you will return some day. A wave of the hand now, and I am gone. Lowering my head, I dream that I am home. Until we meet again, zàijiàn."
Post by Red Impact on Dec 22, 2014 22:39:35 GMT -5
I like the line about catering to the fans, it really is true. There's no unified fan opinion, and no matter how they ended it, they were going to upset someone.
And for all the bad that Nick has done regarding the show, kudos to them for setting the limit relatively high for what they'll allow to be shown. No kiss, but it was as unambiguous as possible without it, and Nick went along with it.
Last Edit: Dec 22, 2014 22:40:41 GMT -5 by Red Impact
HMARK Center
Administrator THE 21st CENTURY BEGINS OCTOBER 1, 1982.
I like the line about catering to the fans, it really is true. There's no unified fan opinion, and no matter how they ended it, they were going to upset someone.
And for all the bad that Nick has done regarding the show, kudos to them for setting the limit relatively high for what they'll allow to be shown. No kiss, but it was as unambiguous as possible without it, and Nick went along with it.
And some of the fans are pretty nuts, really. Some of them are just shippers who can't deal with it if their "OTPs" aren't chosen, while others are of the mind that there wasn't nearly enough development to justify the final scene. I guess they'd remind some people of "smarky fans" (the stereotypical kind we all joke about) with wrestling, where nothing is good enough or developed enough...though at least wrestling deserves that criticism a lot of the time.
The worst are the ones who keep trying to say they don't read romance in the final scene; I mean, really now. I get that we, as viewers, are largely trained and socialized to not expect non-heteronormative pairings, but it didn't take much close watching of the past two books to see this pairing as a final possibility.
Plus, it isn't like the show ends with the two girls swearing undying love for one another; that's more what Aang and Katara's kiss at the end of the first series felt like, a culmination of something that people knew was probably there from episode one. It instead ends on more of a "this is a new beginning" or "this is a new chapter in their lives" feeling, not on a "this is it, the complete ending!". Given that fact, was it necessary to "develop" it more than they did over Books 3 and 4? Had Korra gonna through what she did in those books with a guy in Asami's place, I don't think anybody would have thought it strange to see them wind up together.
"We have seen many reflections of China, but the true face of China can be found in our people. We have now come full circle. Sadly, that means this is where we must part, but I hope you will return some day. A wave of the hand now, and I am gone. Lowering my head, I dream that I am home. Until we meet again, zàijiàn."
I like the line about catering to the fans, it really is true. There's no unified fan opinion, and no matter how they ended it, they were going to upset someone.
And for all the bad that Nick has done regarding the show, kudos to them for setting the limit relatively high for what they'll allow to be shown. No kiss, but it was as unambiguous as possible without it, and Nick went along with it.
And some of the fans are pretty nuts, really. Some of them are just shippers who can't deal with it if their "OTPs" aren't chosen, while others are of the mind that there wasn't nearly enough development to justify the final scene. I guess they'd remind some people of "smarky fans" (the stereotypical kind we all joke about) with wrestling, where nothing is good enough or developed enough...though at least wrestling deserves that criticism a lot of the time.
The worst are the ones who keep trying to say they don't read romance in the final scene; I mean, really now. I get that we, as viewers, are largely trained and socialized to not expect non-heteronormative pairings, but it didn't take much close watching of the past two books to see this pairing as a final possibility.
Plus, it isn't like the show ends with the two girls swearing undying love for one another; that's more what Aang and Katara's kiss at the end of the first series felt like, a culmination of something that people knew was probably there from episode one. It instead ends on more of a "this is a new beginning" or "this is a new chapter in their lives" feeling, not on a "this is it, the complete ending!". Given that fact, was it necessary to "develop" it more than they did over Books 3 and 4? Had Korra gonna through what she did in those books with a guy in Asami's place, I don't think anybody would have thought it strange to see them wind up together.
I can sort of see people who don't read the romance, at least by the shows standards. I mean, yes, you have to willingly try to argue that they're not doing it with the finale, but when you take into account that Aang/Katara was hammered in for 3 seasons before they finally ended up together, Korra and Asami's subtly building relationship could pretty understandably be missed.
Last Edit: Dec 22, 2014 23:38:11 GMT -5 by Red Impact
Post by Hakumental on Dec 22, 2014 23:24:09 GMT -5
If it seems out of the blue to you, I think a second viewing of the last two seasons would show that perhaps you were looking at it only through a hetero lens.
Right...let's tug the reins on this otter-penguin a second.
I (somewhat) like Korra, and I like Asami, but Legend of Korra's romances have all been middling at best (I thought Varrick and Zhu Li were about it, really) and godawful at worst, and this one is no different merely because the two are the same gender. I thought Korra had almost zilch chemistry with Asami over the course of the show, and no amount of being told that "Asami was there for her!" or "Asami was pen pals with her!" could have convinced me that she and Korra were developing feelings for each other.
"Through a hetero lens." Classy guy, suggesting that if you didn't anticipate a lukewarm "budding romance" in a kid's show, it's because you weren't open-minded enough.
I'd like to be enthusiastic about this, really, but the cynical side of me looks at how troubled this show has been all through its run, all the press it's now suddenly receiving, and suspects colder motivations at work here.
HMARK Center
Administrator THE 21st CENTURY BEGINS OCTOBER 1, 1982.
If it seems out of the blue to you, I think a second viewing of the last two seasons would show that perhaps you were looking at it only through a hetero lens.
Right...let's tug the reins on this otter-penguin a second.
I (somewhat) like Korra, and I like Asami, but Legend of Korra's romances have all been middling at best (I thought Varrick and Zhu Li were about it, really) and godawful at worst, and this one is no different merely because the two are the same gender. I thought Korra had almost zilch chemistry with Asami over the course of the show, and no amount of being told that "Asami was there for her!" or "Asami was pen pals with her!" could have convinced me that she and Korra were developing feelings for each other.
"Through a hetero lens." Classy guy, suggesting that if you didn't anticipate a lukewarm "budding romance" in a kid's show, it's because you weren't open-minded enough.
I'd like to be enthusiastic about this, really, but the cynical side of me looks at how troubled this show has been all through its run, all the press it's now suddenly receiving, and suspects colder motivations at work here.
With regards to this one: I think this is much more like what I said before, that Korra and Asami had plenty of moments that, if given to Korra and a male character, would've easily been construed as "ship teases", or whatever cliche we want to use. Not enough to warrant an Aang/Katara type ending, perhaps, but plenty to warrant a "there's something there, isn't there?", which was basically what the ending said. I hardly see something "colder" here, given the clear amount of thought and work that went into these things.
I'll wholeheartedly agree that you can tell where the series suffered under things like budget constraints and Nick-chain yanking, and further development for a lot of the side characters was definitely a clear part of it. Lots of people still didn't feel enough of a character connection with Asami, and I think that's pretty fair, despite some of what they did in the latter books to attempt to rectify that. I just don't see much to a critique that says this pairing "came out of nowhere" (something I've read in a few places) or what have you, as the teases have certainly been there, and would've been picked up on pretty quickly had it been a male/female pairing.
I'm a bit more interested in the guys admitting that they were formerly of the mind that Korra should end the series single, which was where I thought they were headed originally given that her own spiritual/personal character arc is the focus of the show.
"We have seen many reflections of China, but the true face of China can be found in our people. We have now come full circle. Sadly, that means this is where we must part, but I hope you will return some day. A wave of the hand now, and I am gone. Lowering my head, I dream that I am home. Until we meet again, zàijiàn."
Whomp whomp, with a hetero lens, make a rap video wif a couple of friends
Ahem, with that out of the way, I really do think they have a lot to be proud of with The Legend of Korra, the creators, the writers, actors, all of them, but I'd be lying if I didn't say that it all turned out in a way that I am not entirely sure I am happy with, and that's unrelated to whose hand she held, etc. In fact, kudos to them given how much bi-erasure still exists for at least trying something, since Korra and her friends have a lot of life ahead of them and it could go any which way.
That being said, I went in with a ton of investment in the setting due to the original series, and season one didn't let me down one bit, outside of maybe wishing we could have had some more of that bending sport before shit ramped up like it did, but that's the story of this show, isn't it? A lack of time to work with, compared to the original. Later seasons shot things in different directions than I had expected but I do want to thank them for the ride, however bumpy it may have been at times.
As I never watched this (the setting actively disinterests me) my opinion doesn't carry much weight at all, but I can't help but roll my eyes at yet another physically and mentally capable female character turning out to be not hetero. I don't think it's bad in and of itself, but I do find it tiring that this is a caveat so often applied to "capable" female characters.
