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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Apr 22, 2018 14:09:07 GMT -5
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Nr1Humanoid
Hank Scorpio
Is the #3 humanoid at best.
Posts: 5,478
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Post by Nr1Humanoid on Apr 23, 2018 9:01:55 GMT -5
Didn't T2 have the Sarah Connor/Kyle Reese dream sequence removed because it took away from her strong woman character?
Taking comfort in the arms of a man does not make a strong woman weak.
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Post by TWERKIN' MAGGLE on Apr 23, 2018 10:43:40 GMT -5
James Cameron is an asshole who needs to apologize and go away.
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H-Virus
Hank Scorpio
A Real Contagious Experience
Posts: 5,962
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Post by H-Virus on Apr 23, 2018 11:49:13 GMT -5
Didn't T2 have the Sarah Connor/Kyle Reese dream sequence removed because it took away from her strong woman character? Taking comfort in the arms of a man does not make a strong woman weak. Too many people, Cameron included apparently, take the ‘independent’ part of ‘strong, independent woman’ too the extreme of “Doesn’t need a man for anything. Ever!”
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Post by Perpetual Nirvana on Apr 23, 2018 11:50:37 GMT -5
Didn't T2 have the Sarah Connor/Kyle Reese dream sequence removed because it took away from her strong woman character? Taking comfort in the arms of a man does not make a strong woman weak. The only sequence I remember was when Sarah wakes in the hospital, Kyle is there. She embraces him (I think, I can't remember), then Reese tells her their son is in danger. He walks off, she follows and she ends up in the park where we get that iconic imagery of Sarah reduced to a skeleton by a nuclear blast. But I'm pretty sure that was in the theatrical cut (I've seen the special edition so often it and the original version run together in my mind). That scene did change a bit. In the original script, Sarah runs into a T-800 when following Reese who leads her outside. Her reaction to seeing Arnie later is a callback to that but it works fine without it. If there was another sequence it was never filmed because that little scene was the only thing Micheal Biehn did since I seem to remember Cameron saying they only had him for the day because he was busy with something else. As far as I'm aware, the only scenes that were filmed and never used in the special edition were the T-1000 "searching" John's room and finding hidden letters from Sarah (which is how it knows to go to the mental hospital, a point both cuts never resolve) and the awful alternate ending with Linda Hamilton in terrible old people makeup.
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Dr. T is an alien
Patti Mayonnaise
Knows when to hold them, knows when to fold them
I've been found out!
Posts: 31,354
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Post by Dr. T is an alien on Apr 23, 2018 14:06:50 GMT -5
Wonder Woman never objectified its protagonist, at least not from what I remembered. I think James Cameron is looking for something just to make an argument and pat himself on the back. Also it's pretty damn sexist to say that badass women and good-looking women are mutually exclusive. I don’t know. I’ve only seen clips of the films but the close up on her ass probably wasn’t by accident, especiallly since Barry got tongue-tied immediately after it:
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Shai
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 6,507
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Post by Shai on Apr 23, 2018 14:18:34 GMT -5
Wonder Woman never objectified its protagonist, at least not from what I remembered. I think James Cameron is looking for something just to make an argument and pat himself on the back. Also it's pretty damn sexist to say that badass women and good-looking women are mutually exclusive. I don’t know. I’ve only seen clips of the films but the close up on her ass probably wasn’t by accident, especiallly since Barry got tongue-tied immediately after it: One of my biggest grips with JL is that they really didn't stick with what Patty Jenkins had done with the charater. Like...it was a mess.
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Post by Cyno on Apr 23, 2018 15:20:03 GMT -5
Wonder Woman never objectified its protagonist, at least not from what I remembered. I think James Cameron is looking for something just to make an argument and pat himself on the back. Also it's pretty damn sexist to say that badass women and good-looking women are mutually exclusive. I don’t know. I’ve only seen clips of the films but the close up on her ass probably wasn’t by accident, especiallly since Barry got tongue-tied immediately after it: But that's Justice League. I was talking specifically about WW's solo movie. Cameron's comments were also made before JL's release.
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Post by EvenBaldobombHasAJob on Apr 23, 2018 15:20:36 GMT -5
Wonder Woman never objectified its protagonist, at least not from what I remembered. I think James Cameron is looking for something just to make an argument and pat himself on the back. Also it's pretty damn sexist to say that badass women and good-looking women are mutually exclusive. I don’t know. I’ve only seen clips of the films but the close up on her ass probably wasn’t by accident, especiallly since Barry got tongue-tied immediately after it: Yet another reason to hate that movie. Snyder is a creep (or maybe Wheddon. But probably Snyder).
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Post by Hit Girl on Apr 23, 2018 15:25:43 GMT -5
They should just give Patty Jenkins control over the whole DCU. She clearly gets it.
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Post by Perpetual Nirvana on Apr 23, 2018 15:48:19 GMT -5
Wonder Woman never objectified its protagonist, at least not from what I remembered. I think James Cameron is looking for something just to make an argument and pat himself on the back. Also it's pretty damn sexist to say that badass women and good-looking women are mutually exclusive. I don’t know. I’ve only seen clips of the films but the close up on her ass probably wasn’t by accident, especiallly since Barry got tongue-tied immediately after it: They should have made The Flash Wally if they were gonna do that. The fanboying and "dweebness" fits him more than Barry.
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Dr. T is an alien
Patti Mayonnaise
Knows when to hold them, knows when to fold them
I've been found out!
Posts: 31,354
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Post by Dr. T is an alien on Apr 23, 2018 17:17:54 GMT -5
I don’t know. I’ve only seen clips of the films but the close up on her ass probably wasn’t by accident, especiallly since Barry got tongue-tied immediately after it: They should have made The Flash Wally if they were gonna do that. The fanboying and "dweebness" fits him more than Barry. Yes, but isn't the fact that Barry is Flash the thing that led Wally to recreating the accident to get his powers in the first place?
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Post by HMARK Center on Apr 23, 2018 20:18:58 GMT -5
To summarise this debate in meme form Eh, that's kind of apples and oranges. Young men don't receive nearly the volume of body shaming that young women (and older women!) do; it definitely exists for both sexes, but society places a much higher premium on a woman's physical beauty than it does on a man's. Additionally, He-Man is not supposed to be a pinnacle of male attractiveness: he's a symbol of a male power fantasy, not of male beauty, and that comes with a very distinct set of baggage. He-Man, Hulk Hogan and Arnold in the 80s, most comic book superheroes: they weren't marketed/designed to appeal to the sexual sensibilities of women, they were marketed/drawn to appeal to the power fantasies of straight men. Barbie is a very different story from that.
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Post by Savage Gambino on Apr 23, 2018 20:57:33 GMT -5
I don’t know. I’ve only seen clips of the films but the close up on her ass probably wasn’t by accident, especiallly since Barry got tongue-tied immediately after it: Yet another reason to hate that movie. Snyder is a creep (or maybe Wheddon. But probably Snyder).
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Mochi Lone Wolf
Fry's dog Seymour
Development through Destruction.
Posts: 24,037
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Post by Mochi Lone Wolf on Apr 23, 2018 21:32:10 GMT -5
Yet another reason to hate that movie. Snyder is a creep (or maybe Wheddon. But probably Snyder). I don't know, and mostly don't care, who between Synder and Whedon did what for most of Justice League. That said, I'll eat my whole wardrobe if Joss Whedon didn't write that scene. The absolute self-righteous hypocrite. Awkward, out of place, forced sexual tension that later leads to a gag where the male falls on the female's breasts. Sound familiar? Yeah, that's Bruce and Natasha in Age of Ultron.
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Post by Toilet Paper Roll on Apr 23, 2018 22:29:47 GMT -5
To summarise this debate in meme form Eh, that's kind of apples and oranges. Young men don't receive nearly the volume of body shaming that young women (and older women!) do; it definitely exists for both sexes, but society places a much higher premium on a woman's physical beauty than it does on a man's. Additionally, He-Man is not supposed to be a pinnacle of male attractiveness: he's a symbol of a male power fantasy, not of male beauty, and that comes with a very distinct set of baggage. He-Man, Hulk Hogan and Arnold in the 80s, most comic book superheroes: they weren't marketed/designed to appeal to the sexual sensibilities of women, they were marketed/drawn to appeal to the power fantasies of straight men. Barbie is a very different story from that. Society has also placed a MASSIVE amount of expectations on males to be strong, cocksure and "manly". As much as women get heaped with pressure to fit some pre ordained vision of what a female should look like and represent men get pressured into actions that are supposed to define what "manhood" is.
Sure if He Man solved just as many problems with rational discussion and dialogue as he did beating the everliving shit out of people maybe it'd be a fair, but theres not a man who has grown up having their masculinity called into question anytime they do something that's out of the bounds of what men are expected to be.
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Post by HMARK Center on Apr 23, 2018 22:41:26 GMT -5
Eh, that's kind of apples and oranges. Young men don't receive nearly the volume of body shaming that young women (and older women!) do; it definitely exists for both sexes, but society places a much higher premium on a woman's physical beauty than it does on a man's. Additionally, He-Man is not supposed to be a pinnacle of male attractiveness: he's a symbol of a male power fantasy, not of male beauty, and that comes with a very distinct set of baggage. He-Man, Hulk Hogan and Arnold in the 80s, most comic book superheroes: they weren't marketed/designed to appeal to the sexual sensibilities of women, they were marketed/drawn to appeal to the power fantasies of straight men. Barbie is a very different story from that. Society has also placed a MASSIVE amount of expectations on males to be strong, cocksure and "manly". As much as women get heaped with pressure to fit some pre ordained vision of what a female should look like and represent men get pressured into actions that are supposed to define what "manhood" is.
Sure if He Man solved just as many problems with rational discussion and dialogue as he did beating the everliving shit out of people maybe it'd be a fair, but theres not a man who has grown up having their masculinity called into question anytime they do something that's out of the bounds of what men are expected to be.
It still prevents it from being an apples to apples comparison, though, given the entirely different motivations behind the designs and marketing of each. Not that toxic masculinity isn't a massive issue, of course, but it's a problem that stems from the same mentality and institutional forces that place so much undue body image pressure on women (i.e. women's bodies being utilized primarily as something to appeal to the male gaze). He-Man can save the day using his wits against Skeletor and nobody would say that makes him weak; on the other hand, Barbie can never afford to have an eyelash out of place.
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Post by Savage Gambino on Sept 13, 2019 16:55:17 GMT -5
And this guy wanted to direct a Battle Angel Alita live action movie. The irony that Mr. Wonder-Woman-is-an-objectified-icon's pet project was not only embraced as an (unintended) anti-feminist alternative to Captain Marvel, but was overwhelmingly embraced by the "mai waifu" crowd.
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adamclark52
El Dandy
I'm one with the Force; the Force is with me
Posts: 8,139
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Post by adamclark52 on Sept 13, 2019 18:16:49 GMT -5
... ... ... FOUR AVATAR SEQUELS!?
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Post by Alexander The So-so on Sept 13, 2019 18:30:27 GMT -5
I loved both Terminator and the Wonder Woman movie, and I have no idea what Cameron is babbling about here.
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