Push R Truth
Patti Mayonnaise
Unique and Special Snowflake, and a pants-less heathen.
Perpetually Constipated
Posts: 39,372
|
Post by Push R Truth on Jul 24, 2018 6:32:09 GMT -5
Like what story with batman and superman could possibly take 5 damm hours? it has a 3 hour epilogue of Snyder farting on a snare drum
|
|
|
Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Jul 24, 2018 6:37:53 GMT -5
It's hilarious to me that WB stuck with him as long as they did. I don't know whose ass he was kissing, but it was working. Sometimes when you make a mistake, you don't want to admit it, so you keep trying to force it so you'll be right. They didn't want to admit they screwed up, and that Marvel did it the right way. They also figured they did huge business and got big critical praise for Nolan's Batman Trilogy, so dark and gritty would work for everybody, and anybody could make it work.
|
|
BlackoutCreature
Grimlock
The Ultimate Popcorntunist!
Posts: 14,800
Member is Online
|
Post by BlackoutCreature on Jul 24, 2018 8:07:36 GMT -5
Like what story with batman and superman could possibly take 5 damm hours? Obviously he had to show the intricacies of Bruce Wayne's sex addiction. Because that's what everybody wants from a Batman movie, several hours of Batman picking up easy girls at bars.
|
|
|
Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on Jul 24, 2018 8:21:42 GMT -5
It's hilarious to me that WB stuck with him as long as they did. I don't know whose ass he was kissing, but it was working. Sometimes when you make a mistake, you don't want to admit it, so you keep trying to force it so you'll be right. They didn't want to admit they screwed up, and that Marvel did it the right way. They also figured they did huge business and got big critical praise for Nolan's Batman Trilogy, so dark and gritty would work for everybody, and anybody could make it work.They still haven't learned this doesn't work! Look at Mean Titans.
|
|
|
Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Jul 24, 2018 13:25:41 GMT -5
It's hilarious to me that WB stuck with him as long as they did. I don't know whose ass he was kissing, but it was working. Greg Silverman really liked Snyder and thought he was doing a great job. (Silverman and Snyder worked on 300 together) Post Batman V. Superman the executives were pleading with Silverman to take JL away from Snyder... he wouldn't budge. Silverman was ousted from the company in late 2016, Snyder was taken off the movie months later.
|
|
riseofsetian1981
King Koopa
"I met him fifteen years ago. I was told there was nothing left."
Posts: 10,323
|
Post by riseofsetian1981 on Jul 24, 2018 13:46:39 GMT -5
I honestly believe Snyder had good intentions and was attempting to do something different with Superman and Batman. He thought his direction would be embraced because it was different. That's why I can't truly be mad at him, call him a hack, or hate him because I applaud his efforts for genuinely believing he could create something unique and different with the DC characters. If anything I think the blame falls solely on DC/WB for rushing their universe instead of building it organically.
A sequel to Man of Steel could've fleshed out the Superman character and thus exploring him becoming the Beacon of Hope, once the Avengers broke records and Marvel gained massive momentum, WB went into panic mode and thought that by rushing Batman vs. Superman, Suicide Squad, and Justice League that they would be able to catch up.
|
|
|
Post by darbus alan on Jul 24, 2018 15:26:43 GMT -5
The moral of the story is never ask Zack Snyder to cook you a hamburger. Instead you'll end up with four courses of different barbecued steaks, burnt to a crisp on the outside, raw on the inside, with a host of sides that don't compliment the meal at all. Imagining snyder making his own version of Steamed Hams Chalmers and Skinner's mom would've done it in the middle of Aurora Borealis.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2018 15:38:50 GMT -5
Imagining snyder making his own version of Steamed Hams Chalmers and Skinner's mom would've done it in the middle of Aurora Borealis. AT THIS TIME OF DAY! AT THIS TIME OF YEAR! IN THIS PART OF THE COUNTRY! ENTIRELY ONTOP OF MY KITCHEN TABLE!
|
|
bob
Backup Wench
The "other" Bob. FOC COURSE!
started the Madness Wars, Proudly the #1 Nana Hater on FAN
Posts: 80,591
|
Post by bob on Jul 24, 2018 21:34:18 GMT -5
|
|
EyeofTyr
Hank Scorpio
Strange and Mystical
Posts: 5,744
|
Post by EyeofTyr on Jul 24, 2018 22:54:49 GMT -5
Like what story with batman and superman could possibly take 5 damm hours? I can't believe I'm actually going to say this but... *deep breath* In defense of Snyder, likely a story that... - Sets up an aged, battle hardened Batman. - Sets up a conflict between Superman and this veteran Batman. - Furthers the stories of the characters from Man of Steel & let's you know where they are now. - Sets up Lex Luthor as a character and the person egging the two on. - Sets Wonder Woman as a character and explains some of her backstory & motivations. - Lays the groundwork for the other members of the Justice League. - Lays the groundwork for The Joker & Robin's death. - The government elements of the plot regarding Superman. - Has Superman and Batman fight a few times. - Has Wonder Woman get involved in the plot in a substantial way. - Has Superman and Batman resolve their differences enough to fight the real bad guy. - Has Lex Luthor make Doomsday. - Sets up Darkseid and his crew even further, implying Luthor's being played by them or trying to get in with them to get more alien technology. - Has the Trinity fight Doomsday. - Superman dies. - Show Batman redeemed and Luthor teasing Darkseid further. All without sacrificing anybody's story or time, giving everything time to breathe and not feel like any pieces were left on the cutting room floor or rushed. That is likely the story involving Superman and Batman that would take 5 hours. Now am I saying it would be a good movie or the right call? No way. The movie as is and the movie as it could've been are a mess because DC and Snyder both played their parts in jamming way too much into it, or trying to anyways. It's like a billion people have said before me and will probably say after me, this movie should've essentially been the World's Finest TV movie the 90's Animated Series made. Batman and Superman meet, there's some friction but they end up having to work together to beat a bad guy. No Dark Knight Returns homages. No Darkseid, no Doomsday, no Wonder Woman, no Justice League, no battle hardened Batman that's portrayed as being significantly older than Superman.
|
|
|
Post by mcmahonfan85 on Jul 24, 2018 23:20:16 GMT -5
I honestly believe Snyder had good intentions and was attempting to do something different with Superman and Batman. He thought his direction would be embraced because it was different. That's why I can't truly be mad at him, call him a hack, or hate him because I applaud his efforts for genuinely believing he could create something unique and different with the DC characters. If anything I think the blame falls solely on DC/WB for rushing their universe instead of building it organically. A sequel to Man of Steel could've fleshed out the Superman character and thus exploring him becoming the Beacon of Hope, once the Avengers broke records and Marvel gained massive momentum, WB went into panic mode and thought that by rushing Batman vs. Superman, Suicide Squad, and Justice League that they would be able to catch up. if there had been several iterations of Batman and Superman together in a live action film, fine, try something different. but this was the very first one with both of them together, something fans have spent their whole lives waiting for, so only a monumental dumbass would chose this point to go "...you know what, i'm just gonna complete change the characters, cause that's what people want". Hack Snyder has no one to blame but himself
|
|
EyeofTyr
Hank Scorpio
Strange and Mystical
Posts: 5,744
|
Post by EyeofTyr on Jul 25, 2018 1:57:00 GMT -5
I honestly believe Snyder had good intentions and was attempting to do something different with Superman and Batman. He thought his direction would be embraced because it was different. That's why I can't truly be mad at him, call him a hack, or hate him because I applaud his efforts for genuinely believing he could create something unique and different with the DC characters. If anything I think the blame falls solely on DC/WB for rushing their universe instead of building it organically. A sequel to Man of Steel could've fleshed out the Superman character and thus exploring him becoming the Beacon of Hope, once the Avengers broke records and Marvel gained massive momentum, WB went into panic mode and thought that by rushing Batman vs. Superman, Suicide Squad, and Justice League that they would be able to catch up. if there had been several iterations of Batman and Superman together in a live action film, fine, try something different. but this was the very first one with both of them together, something fans have spent their whole lives waiting for, so only a monumental dumbass would chose this point to go "...you know what, i'm just gonna complete change the characters, cause that's what people want". Hack Snyder has no one to blame but himself I don't think it's so simple. Not that Snyder is innocent. But Goyer wrote the script and Warner Bro.s had a clear vision that demanded certain elements be forced into the script and movie. Had Snyder been left alone to do as he liked I feel we would've gotten an even closer film to the Dark Knight Returns. Which...isn't great either to be honest. But it possibly could've been better than what was instead Frankensteined between the heads of Warner, Goyer and Snyder and their interests in this piece.
|
|
|
Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on Jul 25, 2018 11:19:58 GMT -5
I f***ing hate The Dark Knight Returns now.
DO SOMETHING DIFFERENT!
|
|
Juice
El Dandy
Wrong? Oh he can tell ya about being wrong.
I'm the one who raised you from perdition.
Posts: 8,172
|
Post by Juice on Jul 25, 2018 11:44:24 GMT -5
if there had been several iterations of Batman and Superman together in a live action film, fine, try something different. but this was the very first one with both of them together, something fans have spent their whole lives waiting for, so only a monumental dumbass would chose this point to go "...you know what, i'm just gonna complete change the characters, cause that's what people want". Hack Snyder has no one to blame but himself I don't think it's so simple. Not that Snyder is innocent. But Goyer wrote the script and Warner Bro.s had a clear vision that demanded certain elements be forced into the script and movie. Had Snyder been left alone to do as he liked I feel we would've gotten an even closer film to the Dark Knight Returns. Which...isn't great either to be honest. But it possibly could've been better than what was instead Frankensteined between the heads of Warner, Goyer and Snyder and their interests in this piece. This so overlooked by people who want to make Snyder some evil villain. Fact is the dude isn't a hack at all. Uwe Ball is a hack. Snyder is a modern name who changed contemporary cinema. All of his films up to this point were well recieved. 300 and Watchmen (changed ending aside) were very well recieved. All of the nerd anger coming now was non exisent when his love letter to them, Suckerpunch was released. Wb are to blame here. As evident by EVERY director brought in to work on the solo films. By suicide Squad reshoots, by justice league re shoots, hiring Whedon and still putting out a lame movie. It wasn't bad. It wasn't. It,just wasn't good. It was there, it was generic. There was no life to it. Ben Affleck one of the best contemporary directors left Batman, the role he is playing. Wonder why that is? Because WB had a vision he didn't want associated with. There is such a bigger picture here and all anyone wants to do is act like Snyder is a hack asshole. Not true, at all. Bvs wasnt half as bad as everyone acts, Man of Steel was very good. Top 2 or 3 Superman movies ever made frankly. And Supermans arch was forced to occur over those three films. Not by Snyder, by WB. David Goyer gets a lot of hate too. Mostly justified but he isn't responsible either. When given good direction he delivers well too. (Blade trilogy) Wb is vimce McMahon here. Snyder is HHH, goyer is steph, whedon is coachman
|
|
|
Post by darbus alan on Jul 25, 2018 12:42:19 GMT -5
Man of Steel is probably the third or fourth best Superman movie by default. Which says a lot more about how terrible the Superman movies have been than how good MoS was (which wasn't very).
And no one's arguing that WB's handling of the DCEU hasn't been atrocious outside of Wonder Woman, and Goyer isn't the best screenwriter, either. But Zack Snyder still sucks at anything involving directing exposition. Probably why his most highly-regarded movie was 300, which played to his strengths of fun action scenes. And 300 was one giant action scene. Unsurprisingly, the worst parts of 300 had to do with anything involving exposition that distracted away from half-naked men killing the crap out of each other.
While Watchmen's film was probably as good as a Watchmen film was going to get (still think a miniseries on a premium channel like HBO or Starz would've been an ideal fit), I didn't like a lot of Snyder's changes to certain scenes to make them more gory or graphic. Nor did I like him making Veidt's implied homosexuality more obvious for a cheap laugh. The only change he made that I actually thought was somewhat for the better was turning Dr. Manhattan into the villain to unite the US and the USSR instead of a giant squid, which would've looked corny as hell on the big screen.
And yes, BvS is a piece of shit.
|
|
|
Post by HMARK Center on Jul 25, 2018 12:45:14 GMT -5
I certainly wouldn't go so far as to say BvS doesn't qualify as a bad movie, but I do agree that it stands as perhaps the ultimate example of a collaborative failure in modern blockbuster filmmaking. Films just don't get made like they used to: the auteur is not prized the way he/she might have been as recently as the 1990s. In this age of franchises and "tent poles", movie making has become a factory process of many different parts and inputs, with edicts from corporate, endless advertisers, and tons of other considerations. There's no one, single voice driving how these things are made anymore, and the quest to find standalone "villains" to heap blame on is pointless and childish, usually.
This does not mean, however, that anyone involved in the process is absolved of blame for how poor the film was; if anything, there's simply more blame to spread around, this isn't a zero-sum game. Snyder deserves more than his share of the blame for what happened, here. So does Goyer. So does WB as an entity; said it before, but their modern track record with almost all of their franchises is not good at all. WB likely said "catch us up with Marvel in one movie!" Snyder probably said "I have this gigantic, unwieldy vision, but I'm sure I can fit all that other stuff in, too!" The end result was a big LOLNOPE on such practices.
|
|
Mozenrath
FANatic
Foppery and Whim
Speedy Speed Boy
Posts: 121,967
|
Post by Mozenrath on Jul 25, 2018 12:53:50 GMT -5
It's hilarious to me that WB stuck with him as long as they did. I don't know whose ass he was kissing, but it was working. Sometimes when you make a mistake, you don't want to admit it, so you keep trying to force it so you'll be right. They didn't want to admit they screwed up, and that Marvel did it the right way. They also figured they did huge business and got big critical praise for Nolan's Batman Trilogy, so dark and gritty would work for everybody, and anybody could make it work. A lot of it is that it's just difficult to change horses mid-stream. They hired Snyder, probably contracted him to multiple pictures, and are also faced with the problem in these situations of the films having some die-hards. Changing everything doesn't guarantee you'll win over people who didn't like the films before, and you might lose the Snyder die-hards in the process, even if I don't get the appeal other than that the guy took music video experience and shoots stuff that generally trailers well. Compare to any given episode of Kitchen Nightmares. Shit's going bad, but they fight Ramsay tooth and nail on every step because failure sucks, but they feel too invested to change that out for an uncertain future. When a studio is in that position, they only let go of their floundering directors with tremendous hesitation.
|
|
|
Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on Jul 25, 2018 15:12:43 GMT -5
I don't think it's so simple. Not that Snyder is innocent. But Goyer wrote the script and Warner Bro.s had a clear vision that demanded certain elements be forced into the script and movie. Had Snyder been left alone to do as he liked I feel we would've gotten an even closer film to the Dark Knight Returns. Which...isn't great either to be honest. But it possibly could've been better than what was instead Frankensteined between the heads of Warner, Goyer and Snyder and their interests in this piece. This so overlooked by people who want to make Snyder some evil villain. Fact is the dude isn't a hack at all. Uwe Ball is a hack. Snyder is a modern name who changed contemporary cinema. All of his films up to this point were well recieved. 300 and Watchmen (changed ending aside) were very well recieved. All of the nerd anger coming now was non exisent when his love letter to them, Suckerpunch was released. Wb are to blame here. As evident by EVERY director brought in to work on the solo films. By suicide Squad reshoots, by justice league re shoots, hiring Whedon and still putting out a lame movie. It wasn't bad. It wasn't. It,just wasn't good. It was there, it was generic. There was no life to it. Ben Affleck one of the best contemporary directors left Batman, the role he is playing. Wonder why that is? Because WB had a vision he didn't want associated with. There is such a bigger picture here and all anyone wants to do is act like Snyder is a hack asshole. Not true, at all. Bvs wasnt half as bad as everyone acts, Man of Steel was very good. Top 2 or 3 Superman movies ever made frankly. And Supermans arch was forced to occur over those three films. Not by Snyder, by WB. David Goyer gets a lot of hate too. Mostly justified but he isn't responsible either. When given good direction he delivers well too. (Blade trilogy) Wb is vimce McMahon here. Snyder is HHH, goyer is steph, whedon is coachman People hated Suckerpunch.
|
|
|
Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Jul 25, 2018 15:16:19 GMT -5
This so overlooked by people who want to make Snyder some evil villain. Fact is the dude isn't a hack at all. Uwe Ball is a hack. Snyder is a modern name who changed contemporary cinema. All of his films up to this point were well recieved. 300 and Watchmen (changed ending aside) were very well recieved. All of the nerd anger coming now was non exisent when his love letter to them, Suckerpunch was released. Wb are to blame here. As evident by EVERY director brought in to work on the solo films. By suicide Squad reshoots, by justice league re shoots, hiring Whedon and still putting out a lame movie. It wasn't bad. It wasn't. It,just wasn't good. It was there, it was generic. There was no life to it. Ben Affleck one of the best contemporary directors left Batman, the role he is playing. Wonder why that is? Because WB had a vision he didn't want associated with. There is such a bigger picture here and all anyone wants to do is act like Snyder is a hack asshole. Not true, at all. Bvs wasnt half as bad as everyone acts, Man of Steel was very good. Top 2 or 3 Superman movies ever made frankly. And Supermans arch was forced to occur over those three films. Not by Snyder, by WB. David Goyer gets a lot of hate too. Mostly justified but he isn't responsible either. When given good direction he delivers well too. (Blade trilogy) Wb is vimce McMahon here. Snyder is HHH, goyer is steph, whedon is coachman People hated Suckerpunch. Yeah, Suckerpunch was not well liked by anybody.
|
|
|
Post by 2coldMack is even more baffled on Jul 25, 2018 15:21:20 GMT -5
People hated Suckerpunch. Yeah, Suckerpunch was not well liked by anybody. Also, I don't even remember Watchman being that particularly well-liked, though I'll admit that was probably more on the "Love it or hate it" spectrum than Suckerpunch and anything that came after.
|
|