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Post by Toilet Paper Roll on Apr 16, 2018 18:42:24 GMT -5
I think most people on the Simpson's are pretty Shitty at heir occupations. I mean Moe is one of the worst human beings, comic book guy is a asshole and a slob. Mr. Burns is evil incarnate. And look no further than the main character of the show and see his horrible attitude towards work.
Apu is like the rest of them, comically stereotyped into his role.
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Post by Savage Gambino on Apr 16, 2018 18:42:27 GMT -5
It's in no way segregation. While I think VO actors can play other races, segregation doesn't enter into it. As a general rule, while it would be nice for someone of color to get the job playing the voice of someone of color, it's not that big a deal in most instances. As a black guy, I couldn't care less about Dr. Hibbert or Carl being played by a white guy because they sound so generic, for lack of a better word. Now, if he chose to play them with a blaccent that bordered on minstrelsy, yeah, at best it'd be cringeworthy and at worst outright offensive. Which brings us to Apu: in theory, him just being voiced by a white guy is more of a debate about hiring practices and representation in voice acting than anything. But when that white guy bases that voice on a literal brownface performance, it becomes a much simpler discussion about insensitivity, borderline minstrelsy, and arguably racism.
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Post by hossfan on Apr 16, 2018 18:50:56 GMT -5
I think most people on the Simpson's are pretty Shitty at heir occupations. I mean Moe is one of the worst human beings, comic book guy is a asshole and a slob. Mr. Burns is evil incarnate. And look no further than the main character of the show and see his horrible attitude towards work. Apu is like the rest of them, comically stereotyped into his role. You mean the habitual child abuser?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2018 19:16:17 GMT -5
I think most people on the Simpson's are pretty Shitty at heir occupations. I mean Moe is one of the worst human beings, comic book guy is a asshole and a slob. Mr. Burns is evil incarnate. And look no further than the main character of the show and see his horrible attitude towards work. Apu is like the rest of them, comically stereotyped into his role. I guess the difference is that none of the others really struck a nerve the way Apu seems to have. I think there's merit to the frustration that East Indians have had little positive cultural icons in North America, everyone else is a stereotype as well but none quite as marginalized. I don't know what the answer is for the Simpsons writers, as I never really even considered that there was a problem with Apu until the documentary came out. The thing is that Simpsons probably could have carried on just fine with Apu as he is now, the doc came out, everyone spoke their piece, but the fact that they poked at the offended parties like that and then entered apology mode so quickly communicates to me that it's pretty much time to do something to appease them. Like if the Apu character is a character worth fighting for to the Simpsons staff, then they should stick up for it, they barely put up a fight at all, as if they didn't even expect there'd be a backlash, so they kind of deserve their pittance I think. They could've left well enough alone and offended parties would probably just grit their teeth that the Apu character exists and put him out of sight and out of mind. They truly brought it on themselves. I'm not a big believer in censoring comedy, I think any subject matter can be breached through comedy if done right, but if the comedian can't stand by the joke then it's a bad joke and they probably shouldn't be telling it.
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Post by wildojinx on Apr 16, 2018 21:02:34 GMT -5
Maybe the solution is to retire Apu in the show (Springfield has a grocery store and that Sam's Club knockoff, have the characters do their shopping there now) and if they still want to use the character just have him show up in the comic book (Hutz and McClure are still in the comics long after Hartman's death IIRC), which negates the whole voice acting thing.
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Post by Skeletor on Apr 16, 2018 21:27:13 GMT -5
Most voice work is done by various people of different races. Is it wrong for Phil Lamarr (black man) to voice Samaria Jack (Asian man)? What about all of the Asian actors voicing white people in China? Who cares?
Bill Mahar says it perfectly here:
I might like this Bill guy
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Post by Jokaine on Apr 16, 2018 21:33:43 GMT -5
Wake me up when The PC Thugs get kicked out of power and we can go back to watching stuff without them coming in and demanding we feel guilty for doing so. Shall we change Injun Joe to Victorian Joseph while we're at it? Or how's about we have Popeye no longer be a sailor because he smokes a corncob pipe? And how could we possibly live with ourselves if we allow The Flintstones to continue on with domesticating and using Dinosaurs as labor animals? I have to admit that I sometimes grow tired of reading about people who get offended over forms of entertainment that were probably not created with any malicious intent. I find it almost disrespectful to the Black folks who basically birthed what would become popular music in this country when I read some of today's accusations of cultural appropriation. Everytime I read a phrase like "PC thug," however, or see some clown compare animated dinosaurs to humans, I am immediately reminded that I would rather be around a bunch of people who are overly-sensitive to everybody than a bunch of people that think no longer being able to call people f----ts in public is somehow a violation of their First Amendment rights.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2018 21:56:26 GMT -5
Wake me up when The PC Thugs get kicked out of power and we can go back to watching stuff without them coming in and demanding we feel guilty for doing so. Shall we change Injun Joe to Victorian Joseph while we're at it? Or how's about we have Popeye no longer be a sailor because he smokes a corncob pipe? And how could we possibly live with ourselves if we allow The Flintstones to continue on with domesticating and using Dinosaurs as labor animals? I have to admit that I sometimes grow tired of reading about people who get offended over forms of entertainment that were probably not created with any malicious intent. I find it almost disrespectful to the Black folks who basically birthed what would become popular music in this country when I read some of today's accusations of cultural appropriation. Everytime I read a phrase like "PC thug," however, or see some clown compare animated dinosaurs to humans, I am immediately reminded that I would rather be around a bunch of people who are overly-sensitive to everybody than a bunch of people that think no longer being able to call people f----ts in public is somehow a violation of their First Amendment rights. "PC thug" is a very prominent Simpsons reference.
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Post by brown bricks on Apr 16, 2018 22:50:55 GMT -5
Most voice work is done by various people of different races. Is it wrong for Phil Lamarr (black man) to voice Samaria Jack (Asian man)? What about all of the Asian actors voicing white people in China? Who cares?
Bill Mahar says it perfectly here:
I might like this Bill guy Political nature of his show aside, this dude dropped the n-word on his show. I don't know if he's the greatest choice to comment on this.
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Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Apr 17, 2018 0:23:05 GMT -5
I might like this Bill guy Political nature of his show aside, this dude dropped the n-word on his show. I don't know if he's the greatest choice to comment on this. he's also makes a ton of openly racist comments at times.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Apr 17, 2018 1:23:02 GMT -5
Most voice work is done by various people of different races. Is it wrong for Phil Lamarr (black man) to voice Samaria Jack (Asian man)? What about all of the Asian actors voicing white people in China? Who cares?
Bill Mahar says it perfectly here:
I might like this Bill guy He can be a funny guy but yeah I wouldn't buy too much into him
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Apr 17, 2018 1:23:35 GMT -5
Political nature of his show aside, this dude dropped the n-word on his show. I don't know if he's the greatest choice to comment on this. he's also makes a ton of openly racist comments at times. Racist, sexist you name it
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Post by BayleyTiffyCodyCenaJudyHopps on Apr 17, 2018 1:38:19 GMT -5
It doesn’t matter to me where P.C. Thug originated. If thinking that something should be done with Apu makes me one, so be it.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2018 1:51:26 GMT -5
The amount of people here willing to comment on the show while not getting the PC Thug reference is crazy. Great reference, btw. It never stops hurting. As a Mexican, there were only two Mexican males (I think Pepe was hispanic) on the show in its prime, both voiced by white people one by a white woman. And Bumblebee Man was an even more egregious stereotype. And really, you couldn't pay me to give two shits about that. As someone who has actually been denied service for being brown, you would have a hard time convincing me that Hank Azaria voicing a brown guy (be it Indian or Mexican) is worth complaining about. Isn't that the whole point of progress? That many of the things that were acceptable (or more acceptable) then, aren't now? It's hard to compare this to blackface and some really awful caricatures of race throughout the history of TV or movies. Apu was presented as maybe the more thoughtful and wise of any character of the glory years of the show. And Azaria voiced Lou (the black police officer) and Bumblebee guy, and probably about 1/3rd of the characters on any given episode because he's a talented voice actor and already getting paid by the show. So yeah, it's very lazy and somewhat insensitive, especially in hindsight. But it seems like something incredibly minor to have such a huge issue with. I mean, if your biggest complaint about being an Indian person in the US is who Apu on the Simpsons is voiced by, isn't THAT progress? I agree with this. It's like with food. 100 years ago, starving or being malnourished was a big problem. Now in North America, there's so much food, that the problem is the opposite. How ridiculous is it that society is so prosperous that having too much food is a problem? Now when it comes to societal issues, we've come so far. That we actually have time to complain about a character on a show that no one even really watches or cares about anymore.
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Malcolm
Grimlock
Wanted something done about the color of his ring.
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Post by Malcolm on Apr 17, 2018 2:09:18 GMT -5
I knew PC Thug was a Simpsons reference. It's just that it comes off as smug and self-righteous instead of clever in this context.
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Post by I'm Team Bayley and Indi on Apr 17, 2018 3:33:32 GMT -5
I have nothing to add but I was catching up on reading this thread and I'm watching What About Dick? an Eric Idle stage play done like a radio play featuring Billy Connolly, Jane Leeves etc. and Eddie Izzard is doing an Indian accent, talk about crazy timing
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Post by Alice Syndrome on Apr 17, 2018 7:24:32 GMT -5
Most voice work is done by various people of different races. Is it wrong for Phil Lamarr (black man) to voice Samaria Jack (Asian man)? What about all of the Asian actors voicing white people in China? Who cares?
Bill Mahar says it perfectly here:
Rich white guy weighs in on racism, more at 11.
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Post by BayleyTiffyCodyCenaJudyHopps on Apr 17, 2018 8:19:55 GMT -5
The amount of people here willing to comment on the show while not getting the PC Thug reference is crazy. Great reference, btw. It never stops hurting. As a Mexican, there were only two Mexican males (I think Pepe was hispanic) on the show in its prime, both voiced by white people one by a white woman. And Bumblebee Man was an even more egregious stereotype. And really, you couldn't pay me to give two shits about that. As someone who has actually been denied service for being brown, you would have a hard time convincing me that Hank Azaria voicing a brown guy (be it Indian or Mexican) is worth complaining about. Isn't that the whole point of progress? That many of the things that were acceptable (or more acceptable) then, aren't now? It's hard to compare this to blackface and some really awful caricatures of race throughout the history of TV or movies. Apu was presented as maybe the more thoughtful and wise of any character of the glory years of the show. And Azaria voiced Lou (the black police officer) and Bumblebee guy, and probably about 1/3rd of the characters on any given episode because he's a talented voice actor and already getting paid by the show. So yeah, it's very lazy and somewhat insensitive, especially in hindsight. But it seems like something incredibly minor to have such a huge issue with. I mean, if your biggest complaint about being an Indian person in the US is who Apu on the Simpsons is voiced by, isn't THAT progress? I agree with this. It's like with food. 100 years ago, starving or being malnourished was a big problem. Now in North America, there's so much food, that the problem is the opposite. How ridiculous is it that society is so prosperous that having too much food is a problem? Now when it comes to societal issues, we've come so far. That we actually have time to complain about a character on a show that no one even really watches or cares about anymore. There's still a lot more work to be done. And there are clearly enough people who still care about the Simpsons to realize how harmful Apu, and maybe a few other characters on the Simpsons, are.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Apr 17, 2018 8:57:52 GMT -5
Maher I like on some things, not others. His views on medicine, at least in the past, have been woefully stupid.
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Post by Confused Mark Wahlberg on Apr 17, 2018 9:09:34 GMT -5
Sometimes it is okay to say, 'I never thought of it that way' instead of being defensive.
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