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Post by Crow Dust on Sept 3, 2018 16:48:07 GMT -5
Here are some: 1. All In was essentially made so Cody Rhodes could prove to Dave Meltzer that he could be a big draw... and the show was as big as it was because of the other wrestlers involved in it, not Cody himself. 2. All In was good but it doesn't have a match that one must drop whatever they're doing and go watch. It was pretty good but it's not one of the great shows of the year. 3. AJ Styles and Shinsuke Nakamura were victims of their own hype at WrestleMania. They had good matches over the WWE title and, while there were parts when they felt underwhelming, chances are that they feel that way because we know they can do better. Just because their matches in WWE weren't as good as their stuff in New Japan doesn't mean that they weren't good. 4. People put too much weight on Meltzer's star system. Dave Meltzer knows what he likes but taking his word as gospel and treating Omega and Okada as the best damn pro wrestlers ever because a middle aged man felt tingly when he saw them wrestle is a bit over the top. Then again, wrestling should be about giving the fans a good show and tell a story, not please one critic and wait for him to give you an imaginary reward for your efforts. 5. Shibata should've won the G1 Climax instead of Omega, having his crowning moment at Wrestle Kingdom and finally being forgiven for his past. 6. I don't see the big deal about Pentagon Jr. Just because you scream that you're fearless and call people faggots in Spanish doesn't make you a badass and most of his offense can be done by anyone else in the indies with similar results. What he has is presence and that goes out of the window when everyone else is a badass out there. Shibata’s handling was the single biggest mistake NJPW has made in the last 5 years he was the best in ring talent they had and his level of physical charisma was untouchable he was a far greater talent than they knew what do with and they dropped the ball constantley with his booking
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Sept 3, 2018 16:48:09 GMT -5
Edge & Christian told jokes but when they got in the ring they were all business
Kurt Angle was a nerdy olympic hero but when he got in the ring you better be on your A game with him
There is a place for comedy in wrestling and you can make money in the cases of Disco and Al Snow who both had long careers while not being top draws
They made money but they never drew money. Nobody bought a ticket to watch them perform, nobody tune in to raw or nitro because of them. You can tell jokes and do funny skits, but when the bell rings you need to be a badass in order to draw money. That’s why Al and Disco never drew a dime. They don't have to be THE draw when you have people who can draw already
There only thing was to stay over and make money
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Sept 3, 2018 16:51:29 GMT -5
They made money but they never drew money. Nobody bought a ticket to watch them perform, nobody tune in to raw or nitro because of them. You can tell jokes and do funny skits, but when the bell rings you need to be a badass in order to draw money. That’s why Al and Disco never drew a dime. They don't have to be THE draw when you have people who can draw already
There only thing was to stay over and make money
Yes that’s what I’m saying, they made money because they were part of the show, but they never drew money. That’s why Cornette says Funny don’t draw money. Comedy only wrestlers can only reach the midcard if lucky, but they don’t draw shit. It’s like the clown in the circus, he’s just there but you don’t pay to watch him, you pay to watch the lion tamer for example.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Sept 3, 2018 16:53:35 GMT -5
They don't have to be THE draw when you have people who can draw already
There only thing was to stay over and make money
Yes that’s what I’m saying, they made money because they were part of the show, but they never drew money. That’s why Cornette says Funny don’t draw money. Comedy only wrestlers can only reach the midcard if lucky, but they don’t draw shit. It’s like the clown in the circus, he’s just there but you don’t pay to watch him, you pay to watch the lion tamer for example. Right there's a difference between having your main draw be a comedy character and having guys that are funny contribute to the roster
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Post by ben:friendship frog on Sept 3, 2018 16:53:42 GMT -5
Bruno was an awful wrestler and champion. If you disagree I’ll fight ya...on Smackdown Here Comes The Pain, nobody can beat me when I’m Scott Steiner. Oh by the way, Here Comes The Pain is the best wrestling video game of all time, better than No Mercy, No Mercy is overrated. Imo Here Comes The Pain is overrated, Shut Your Mouth is my favourite wrestling game of that era.
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Sept 3, 2018 16:55:34 GMT -5
Yes that’s what I’m saying, they made money because they were part of the show, but they never drew money. That’s why Cornette says Funny don’t draw money. Comedy only wrestlers can only reach the midcard if lucky, but they don’t draw shit. It’s like the clown in the circus, he’s just there but you don’t pay to watch him, you pay to watch the lion tamer for example. Right there's a difference between having your main draw be a comedy character and having guys that are funny contribute to the roster Yeah. If you would’ve put Disco and Al on top of wcw and wwe, both companies would’ve gone out of business.
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Nikki Heyman
Fry's dog Seymour
EXTREEEEEME Pony Manager
✬ Believe In The Fight ✬
Posts: 24,018
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Post by Nikki Heyman on Sept 3, 2018 17:04:19 GMT -5
Roman Reigns is not a bad wrestler or character, but he really has to be careful since he wears his heart on his sleeve.
All In was a stunt show, let's see if they can maintain that with more shows and a TV deal.
Nia Jax is the prettiest woman on the roster.
Carmella can wrestle, she just needs a little carrying.
I already miss Dean's hobo haircut
If there's no room in wrestling for comedy, then the Rock should never have gotten as far as he did with his promos. Or Jericho for that matter.
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Post by 1 Free Moon-Down with Burger on Sept 3, 2018 17:16:38 GMT -5
Here are some: 1. All In was essentially made so Cody Rhodes could prove to Dave Meltzer that he could be a big draw... and the show was as big as it was because of the other wrestlers involved in it, not Cody himself. 2. All In was good but it doesn't have a match that one must drop whatever they're doing and go watch. It was pretty good but it's not one of the great shows of the year. 3. AJ Styles and Shinsuke Nakamura were victims of their own hype at WrestleMania. They had good matches over the WWE title and, while there were parts when they felt underwhelming, chances are that they feel that way because we know they can do better. Just because their matches in WWE weren't as good as their stuff in New Japan doesn't mean that they weren't good. 4. People put too much weight on Meltzer's star system. Dave Meltzer knows what he likes but taking his word as gospel and treating Omega and Okada as the best damn pro wrestlers ever because a middle aged man felt tingly when he saw them wrestle is a bit over the top. Then again, wrestling should be about giving the fans a good show and tell a story, not please one critic and wait for him to give you an imaginary reward for your efforts. 5. Shibata should've won the G1 Climax instead of Omega, having his crowning moment at Wrestle Kingdom and finally being forgiven for his past. 6. I don't see the big deal about Pentagon Jr. Just because you scream that you're fearless and call people faggots in Spanish doesn't make you a badass and most of his offense can be done by anyone else in the indies with similar results. What he has is presence and that goes out of the window when everyone else is a badass out there. Shibata’s handling was the single biggest mistake NJPW has made in the last 5 years he was the best in ring talent they had and his level of physical charisma was untouchable he was a far greater talent than they knew what do with and they dropped the ball constantley with his booking That’s why I always roll my eyes at people saying New Japan is sooooo smart for not having Naito win the title at Wrestle Kingdom. At any moment a guy can be injured and gone for good. If he’s red hot and moving paper, f***ing put him over.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Sept 3, 2018 17:31:24 GMT -5
Shibata’s handling was the single biggest mistake NJPW has made in the last 5 years he was the best in ring talent they had and his level of physical charisma was untouchable he was a far greater talent than they knew what do with and they dropped the ball constantley with his booking That’s why I always roll my eyes at people saying New Japan is sooooo smart for not having Naito win the title at Wrestle Kingdom. At any moment a guy can be injured and gone for good. If he’s red hot and moving paper, f***ing put him over. Well the problem with Shibata at the end of the day was sadly he himself caused his career to be shortened with his in ring style but yes I agree I was hyped when it seemed like he was finally getting his chance to move up and prove he can be IWGP champ material and sadly that was the end all be all
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Post by Jumpin' Jesse Walsh on Sept 3, 2018 17:45:39 GMT -5
I really don't give a shit whether a wrestler is a draw.
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tenshi
Patti Mayonnaise
Probably more memorable than a Charlotte title reign
Posts: 34,826
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Post by tenshi on Sept 3, 2018 17:53:37 GMT -5
That’s why I always roll my eyes at people saying New Japan is sooooo smart for not having Naito win the title at Wrestle Kingdom. At any moment a guy can be injured and gone for good. If he’s red hot and moving paper, f***ing put him over. Well the problem with Shibata at the end of the day was sadly he himself caused his career to be shortened with his in ring style but yes I agree I was hyped when it seemed like he was finally getting his chance to move up and prove he can be IWGP champ material and sadly that was the end all be all This takes me to another hot take: There are many different wrestlers in New Japan and they have their certain hook that sets them apart. With that said, maybe it'll be nice for NJPW to have main events that go for too long and rely on long periods of time when they just exchange big moves and rest after them. Shibata/Ishii weren't main event matches but they lasted a bit over 10 minutes, they were action-packed, they got good reviews and it got the crowd involved. Not every main event has to go over 30 or 40 minutes if you can tell a more concise story in less time.
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Post by Rudy Gobert Fingers on Sept 3, 2018 18:03:36 GMT -5
AJ Styles is one of the most boring wrestlers to watch in the whole world rn.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Sept 3, 2018 18:06:36 GMT -5
Well the problem with Shibata at the end of the day was sadly he himself caused his career to be shortened with his in ring style but yes I agree I was hyped when it seemed like he was finally getting his chance to move up and prove he can be IWGP champ material and sadly that was the end all be all This takes me to another hot take: There are many different wrestlers in New Japan and they have their certain hook that sets them apart. With that said, maybe it'll be nice for NJPW to have main events that go for too long and rely on long periods of time when they just exchange big moves and rest after them. Shibata/Ishii weren't main event matches but they lasted a bit over 10 minutes, they were action-packed, they got good reviews and it got the crowd involved. Not every main event has to go over 30 or 40 minutes if you can tell a more concise story in less time. Yea, that's the Omega and Okada special
They have a tendency of making the matches way too long when they don't need to be when 20 mins of action packed pace can work just as well
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Facetious
King Koopa
ADAM COLE BAYBAY
Posts: 12,418
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Post by Facetious on Sept 3, 2018 18:23:29 GMT -5
Bruno was an awful wrestler and champion. If you disagree I’ll fight ya...on Smackdown Here Comes The Pain, nobody can beat me when I’m Scott Steiner. Oh by the way, Here Comes The Pain is the best wrestling video game of all time, better than No Mercy, No Mercy is overrated. Imo Here Comes The Pain is overrated, Shut Your Mouth is my favourite wrestling game of that era. Everyone is sleeping on Day of Reckoning 1 and 2 for the Gamecube imo. The fact that the collision detector is still miles ahead of the one used in 2018 is pretty pathetic.
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WWEedy
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,320
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Post by WWEedy on Sept 3, 2018 18:28:05 GMT -5
Disco Inferno and Buff Bagwell were underutilized talent and WCW could have done a lot more for them. Bagwell could have got over as a ME level babyface and they had a perfect chance to do it. The guy had his legs cut out from under himcso many times and it's odd because he was so so marketable. The same can be said but to a lesser extent for Disco and although I believe his place on the card was fine I just think he could have been used more and featured in more prominent angles. I'm not saying make him a winner but let him lose in title matches.
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Post by zero744 on Sept 3, 2018 18:43:09 GMT -5
Imo Here Comes The Pain is overrated, Shut Your Mouth is my favourite wrestling game of that era. Everyone is sleeping on Day of Reckoning 1 and 2 for the Gamecube imo. The fact that the collision detector is still miles ahead of the one used in 2018 is pretty pathetic. Day of Reckoning is my favorite wrestling game
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Post by Natural Born Farmer on Sept 3, 2018 18:56:09 GMT -5
Here are some: 1. All In was essentially made so Cody Rhodes could prove to Dave Meltzer that he could be a big draw... and the show was as big as it was because of the other wrestlers involved in it, not Cody himself. 2. All In was good but it doesn't have a match that one must drop whatever they're doing and go watch. It was pretty good but it's not one of the great shows of the year. 3. AJ Styles and Shinsuke Nakamura were victims of their own hype at WrestleMania. They had good matches over the WWE title and, while there were parts when they felt underwhelming, chances are that they feel that way because we know they can do better. Just because their matches in WWE weren't as good as their stuff in New Japan doesn't mean that they weren't good. 4. People put too much weight on Meltzer's star system. Dave Meltzer knows what he likes but taking his word as gospel and treating Omega and Okada as the best damn pro wrestlers ever because a middle aged man felt tingly when he saw them wrestle is a bit over the top. Then again, wrestling should be about giving the fans a good show and tell a story, not please one critic and wait for him to give you an imaginary reward for your efforts. 5. Shibata should've won the G1 Climax instead of Omega, having his crowning moment at Wrestle Kingdom and finally being forgiven for his past. 6. I don't see the big deal about Pentagon Jr. Just because you scream that you're fearless and call people faggots in Spanish doesn't make you a badass and most of his offense can be done by anyone else in the indies with similar results. What he has is presence and that goes out of the window when everyone else is a badass out there. Shibata’s handling was the single biggest mistake NJPW has made in the last 5 years he was the best in ring talent they had and his level of physical charisma was untouchable he was a far greater talent than they knew what do with and they dropped the ball constantley with his booking I mean... yeah that match with Okada was six shades of awesome but he almost literally killed himself to do it. You cannot put the title on someone like that because they will try to earn it, and you do not want to be the promoter telling morning shows “it’s fake!” when your top guy croaks.
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thirteen3
Dennis Stamp
posted with a broken freakin neck keyboard
Posts: 3,946
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Post by thirteen3 on Sept 3, 2018 19:09:21 GMT -5
I do not care for WALTER. I don't think he's that good a wrestler.
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fw91
Patti Mayonnaise
FAN Idol All-Star: FAN Idol Season X and *Gavel* 2x Judges' Throwdown winner
Tribe has spoken for 2024 Mets
Posts: 39,654
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Post by fw91 on Sept 3, 2018 19:17:01 GMT -5
Michael Cole isn't terrible at all, and generally speaking, wrestling fans put way too much stock on who's on commentary. Very minimal influence on the overall product imo.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Sept 3, 2018 19:24:47 GMT -5
Fans will rather boo the guy they hate more than loudly cheer for the guy they want to see or I should say they rather shit on the guy they dislike more than talk up the person they do like
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