Becky Lynch is OP

[Deleted]

Mar 26, 2019 0:34:57 GMT -5 Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) said:

When the "OP" goes on for a few weeks like with Kofi right now, you say that's dope because you don't expect it to last long but when it starts spanning months and close to a year then you double take and say something is wrong with this picture

I can see where the OP is coming from but as I said in the 1st page, I don't think she is OP yet but if nothing changes by Summerslam she will be

In the same vain, if Kofi was winning Gauntlet matches every week for the next 8 months to a year that fool would be OP and called out on it

Calling someone OP does not mean they are outright bad, people need to get that out their head. It's just saying well, this person is so above their competition, it's becoming a little bit of a joke and when they eventually go back down to the mean, people are going to be mad because the dominance isn't there anymore

Cedric Alexander was OP as f*** but his was lowkey cause of 205 Live

I never wanted Braun to be a jobber, I just wanted him to stop beating the hell out of people 6 on 1 and winning the tag titles with a kid. A little more middle ground and they had that for a while until Vince got bored. Either Braun is flipping over card and telling jokes or getting beat up 3 on 1

Yeah if Kofi's going to have a Monkey D. Luffy type of stretch with this gauntlet match stuff then he's definitely getting called out on it, absolutely. Yeah Kofi is an underdog but what people need to see is that right now the's the strongest booked male superstar on the roster, legit. He beat all those guys in 1 night, almost beat Bryan, that's wild. It's been such a short amount of time and he's got momentum so it's not serious enough to draw attention to but if he's this way by say WM next year? We gotta talk about it. Good thing you brought up Cedric because Ali should have whooped his ass at WM last year. Dude was like CM Punk's 434 day long reign, just lowkey until people realized what was going on.

Becky's in a crucial area right now. I think they'll be smart with her booking but who knows given how else they've booked her. Remember when people said she'd be fine these past 6 months with everything booking related to her? Nah, didn't work out that way.

And yeah, when we say someone is OP nah, that doesn't mean "we don't like them." I like Kazuya and Devil Jin but they were OP for most Tekken titles. I like Goku, Naruto, I love OP characters. At the same time I love others as well so am I supposed to be like "well sorry other guy but this guy's the one" or am I supposed to be like "we can make the both of you coexist and look great" because I don't know about you but I know what I'd say.

Strowman, he's f***ing up now but the reason he's f***ing up isn't the OP stuff. People keep saying "but yall said he was OP", nah stop trying to use that as a crutch and get to the reality of it: Braun's f***ing up now not due to his strength but due to the fact he was stuck in between Lesnar and The Shield. Everybody who's on Raw gets stuck in that spot. Doesn't matter who you are, if you're in the main event of Raw those guys stopped you. They stopped AJ Styles, they stopped John Cena even, it happens.

Why do yall think Joe only started to slightly thrive when he went to SDL? He got away from those guys and then when it was time to get away from Styles he got his.

Mar 25, 2019 23:52:56 GMT -5 @cmprinny said:

As said, There is little to no middle ground in Wwe.

(Another one piece metaphor. Reading 89 books in 3 weeks will do that)

Most boss fights. Luffy kiiinda handles his own, but gets stomped. Has to go back. Think up a new plan to approach enemy (or reveal a new form ) and then wins. You can predict it, doesnt mean its bad. It shows this foe took hero to limit, hero had to train or meditate and then wins the day.

Wwe doesnt do this anymore. Like many here, I HATED styles last year. Besides his lame promo material, it was complete buns to see him beat the same person 3x in a row. His enemies looked like choke artists and he didnt gain anything from decisively winning every feud. A story with a flawless hero is tedious;see also, the common misconception of Superman.

Yeah that's what I think. Becky's going to end up facing a lot of these heels who will somehow be able to do damage to her so to some they'll be like "but Becky was called OP" or "but Becky could take on Ronda and Charl-" without understanding nah, future Raw Women's Champion Becky Lynch is different from how Becky was prior.

From a kayfabe standpoint, Becky's been facing these women on SDL for the past 3 years, she's been facing Charlotte since the NXT days so these newer Raw women somehow doing damage to her makes sense, she's not familiar with them. She might get beaten down on some Raws but then study what happened, think of what she needs to do and then win at the ppv because that's how she is. The whole reason she's been beating Charlotte this entire time isn't because she's stronger than Charlotte, it's not because she's bigger, it's not because she's more athletic, it's not because she's got great wrestling genes.

Becky's been beating Charlotte because Becky's smarter, she knows Charlotte and she's a great technician, that's her strength. Once she realizes who these other girls are she'll get the jump on them too but she'll have to learn about them first which is why she'll be beaten down some.

[Starshine]

These OP threads seem to be a non-starter cause I not sure that half of us really understand what the other side it trying to say.

So sometimes being OP is good. Other times it's bad. But if you're regularly balanced it's fine, I guess. But you can be lowkey OP, which I'm guessing isn't Kaval. But that's okay, I think? I'm not sure. Quality of OP depends how long it lasts, but I don't know if that's when good OP becomes bad OP, or if long OP is always bad OP, or it can get better or-Oh no I've gone cross eyed.



Honestly, I not sure what we're talking about anymore. Isn't it just easier to actually describe the issue specifically instead of constantly using such a vague and seemingly meaningless term?

[Deleted]

Mar 26, 2019 0:45:24 GMT -5 @kn said:

Becky's in a crucial area right now. I think they'll be smart with her booking but who knows given how else they've booked her. Remember when people said she'd be fine these past 6 months with everything booking related to her? Nah, didn't work out that way.

The feud's not great but I would still categorize Becky's position as "fine."

Strowman, he's f***ing up now but the reason he's f***ing up isn't the OP stuff. People keep saying "but yall said he was OP", nah stop trying to use that as a crutch and get to the reality of it: Braun's f***ing up now not due to his strength but due to the fact he was stuck in between Lesnar and The Shield. Everybody who's on Raw gets stuck in that spot. Doesn't matter who you are, if you're in the main event of Raw those guys stopped you. They stopped AJ Styles, they stopped John Cena even, it happens.

Why do yall think Joe only started to slightly thrive when he went to SDL? He got away from those guys and then when it was time to get away from Styles he got his.

I think Joe has a much stronger baseline as a talent than Strowman and that's why fans keep giving him second chances. I can't see Joe ever looking like a lost puppy the way Strowman has in his encounters with Lesnar. Joe had a flat shitty match with Brock where Brock handed him his ass, then the next night Joe squares up with Lesnar again and everyone still wanted it. If Braun isn't cartoonishly overpowered he just doesn't have much about him. Joe cuts amazing promos, has good to great matches, he has a success rate smaller than Braun's and at this point every word he says should be perceived as horseshit but he's too believable in his performance to be ignored.

It's not all Braun's fault but he's definitely lacking in tools that others have that leave them open to making a comeback in slumps like he's in.

[Deleted]

Mar 26, 2019 0:59:42 GMT -5 @nichotine said:

The feud's not great but I would still categorize Becky's position as "fine."

I think Joe has a much stronger baseline as a talent than Strowman and that's why fans keep giving him second chances. I can't see Joe ever looking like a lost puppy the way Strowman has in his encounters with Lesnar. Joe had a flat shitty match with Brock where Brock handed him his ass, then the next night Joe squares up with Lesnar again and everyone still wanted it. If Braun isn't cartoonishly overpowered he just doesn't have much about him. Joe cuts amazing promos, has good to great matches, he has a success rate smaller than Braun's and at this point every word he says should be perceived as horseshit but he's too believable in his performance to be ignored.

It's not all Braun's fault but he's definitely lacking in tools that others have that leave them open to making a comeback in slumps like he's in.

Becky's not in a horrible position but when I mean "fine" I'm saying having no issues. This thing's been a rough ride that will hopefully be wiped away by a dope match. If the match is dope then people will forget about the horrible build exactly like they forgot about Bryan's wild build pre-WM30. I remember how it was each week here whenever they screwed over Bryan. It was wild.

Joe's way better than Strowman I agree and yeah, Strowman just lacked certain tools and to this day he lacks those tools. Nothing against him because he hasn't been in the business as long as Joe, it's just something he'll gain over time. Maybe they thought he had those tools, maybe they realized that he couldn't perform the way they needed him to without those tools but either way once he was hit with The Shield and Lesnar, once we got him in the mix with Drew and Lashley, it was a wrap.

I think Strowman's a future world champion but it'll be in a similar way that Wyatt was. He'll randomly get it during a time where we thought he wasn't getting it and it'll last a short amount of time.

[theironyuppie]

Mar 25, 2019 23:07:37 GMT -5 @dax said:

Mar 25, 2019 23:04:09 GMT -5 @kn said:

Charlotte/Becky's going to go down in WWE's history books as the female Rock/Austin. Each time they lock up it works, we just need them to cool off a bit after this feud but in general this feud's done 2 things: it's gotten Charlotte over as a heel and has improved her heel character as a whole and it's gotten Becky as the lead female babyface.

Ronda's the only person who entered this feud looking worse than she did prior. Becky and Charlotte are above what they were prior to Becky's heel turn. After this WM main event they'll be legends.

I've really enjoyed the Becky/Charlotte feud as it's been happening, but I think in time it's going to go down as a really important feud for WWE. They not only elevated the title with their performances, but showed that two women can be the flat out best performers in the whole company. And that was with them trying to make Becky the heel and Charlotte the face for the first couple months.

This reminds me that in one or two of her recent interviews, Charlotte (who generally does her media work out of character) has talked about the moment they learned they were going to feud, and says they just turned to each other and said "We're going to have the feud of the year, we're going to have the match of the year", and then they did.

[Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]]

Mar 26, 2019 0:27:15 GMT -5 Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) said:

Mar 26, 2019 0:22:13 GMT -5 Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] said:

I just don't see why we have to over-analyze everything. If it's working and telling a good story, like Charlotte being a bitch who deserves and we want to see get her ass kicked in the storyline, like Ronda, then I don't really get why we have to go to the well of OP. 

We'd have a thread like this every week with Rock and Austin at their peak, we'd have one every five minutes with Hogan at his peak. This is just my take on it but when it comes to wrestling sometimes we gotta step back a bit and enjoy the ride before going into these arguments imo. Especially with how fickle WWE Booking can particularly be... Braun friggen died a death very soon after his OP Thread happened. I don't think the same will happen to Becky, but I also feel like it's a severe overreaction when Becky I feel has been treated fairly, and has been beaten down by Charlotte and Ronda without retaliation in this feud before too. 

Again this is just how I see things, I know ya'll see it different, I just wanted to ramble about it.

I wouldn't call it over analyzing at all, i'm giving her the same treatment that people like Cena and Reigns get

Imo it's a fair discussion to have

The over analyzing part wasn't really directed at you per se ust an in general statement of how it COULD be taken, so fair enough. I know you're usually fair and balanced in your critique.  

[Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]]

Mar 26, 2019 0:45:24 GMT -5 @kn said:

Mar 26, 2019 0:34:57 GMT -5 Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) said:

When the "OP" goes on for a few weeks like with Kofi right now, you say that's dope because you don't expect it to last long but when it starts spanning months and close to a year then you double take and say something is wrong with this picture

I can see where the OP is coming from but as I said in the 1st page, I don't think she is OP yet but if nothing changes by Summerslam she will be

In the same vain, if Kofi was winning Gauntlet matches every week for the next 8 months to a year that fool would be OP and called out on it

Calling someone OP does not mean they are outright bad, people need to get that out their head. It's just saying well, this person is so above their competition, it's becoming a little bit of a joke and when they eventually go back down to the mean, people are going to be mad because the dominance isn't there anymore

Cedric Alexander was OP as f*** but his was lowkey cause of 205 Live

I never wanted Braun to be a jobber, I just wanted him to stop beating the hell out of people 6 on 1 and winning the tag titles with a kid. A little more middle ground and they had that for a while until Vince got bored. Either Braun is flipping over card and telling jokes or getting beat up 3 on 1

Yeah if Kofi's going to have a Monkey D. Luffy type of stretch with this gauntlet match stuff then he's definitely getting called out on it, absolutely. Yeah Kofi is an underdog but what people need to see is that right now the's the strongest booked male superstar on the roster, legit. He beat all those guys in 1 night, almost beat Bryan, that's wild. It's been such a short amount of time and he's got momentum so it's not serious enough to draw attention to but if he's this way by say WM next year? We gotta talk about it. Good thing you brought up Cedric because Ali should have whooped his ass at WM last year. Dude was like CM Punk's 434 day long reign, just lowkey until people realized what was going on.

Becky's in a crucial area right now. I think they'll be smart with her booking but who knows given how else they've booked her. Remember when people said she'd be fine these past 6 months with everything booking related to her? Nah, didn't work out that way.

And yeah, when we say someone is OP nah, that doesn't mean "we don't like them." I like Kazuya and Devil Jin but they were OP for most Tekken titles. I like Goku, Naruto, I love OP characters. At the same time I love others as well so am I supposed to be like "well sorry other guy but this guy's the one" or am I supposed to be like "we can make the both of you coexist and look great" because I don't know about you but I know what I'd say.

Strowman, he's f***ing up now but the reason he's f***ing up isn't the OP stuff. People keep saying "but yall said he was OP", nah stop trying to use that as a crutch and get to the reality of it: Braun's f***ing up now not due to his strength but due to the fact he was stuck in between Lesnar and The Shield. Everybody who's on Raw gets stuck in that spot. Doesn't matter who you are, if you're in the main event of Raw those guys stopped you. They stopped AJ Styles, they stopped John Cena even, it happens.

Why do yall think Joe only started to slightly thrive when he went to SDL? He got away from those guys and then when it was time to get away from Styles he got his.

Mar 25, 2019 23:52:56 GMT -5 @cmprinny said:

As said, There is little to no middle ground in Wwe.

(Another one piece metaphor. Reading 89 books in 3 weeks will do that)

Most boss fights. Luffy kiiinda handles his own, but gets stomped. Has to go back. Think up a new plan to approach enemy (or reveal a new form ) and then wins. You can predict it, doesnt mean its bad. It shows this foe took hero to limit, hero had to train or meditate and then wins the day.

Wwe doesnt do this anymore. Like many here, I HATED styles last year. Besides his lame promo material, it was complete buns to see him beat the same person 3x in a row. His enemies looked like choke artists and he didnt gain anything from decisively winning every feud. A story with a flawless hero is tedious;see also, the common misconception of Superman.

Yeah that's what I think. Becky's going to end up facing a lot of these heels who will somehow be able to do damage to her so to some they'll be like "but Becky was called OP" or "but Becky could take on Ronda and Charl-" without understanding nah, future Raw Women's Champion Becky Lynch is different from how Becky was prior.

From a kayfabe standpoint, Becky's been facing these women on SDL for the past 3 years, she's been facing Charlotte since the NXT days so these newer Raw women somehow doing damage to her makes sense, she's not familiar with them. She might get beaten down on some Raws but then study what happened, think of what she needs to do and then win at the ppv because that's how she is. The whole reason she's been beating Charlotte this entire time isn't because she's stronger than Charlotte, it's not because she's bigger, it's not because she's more athletic, it's not because she's got great wrestling genes.

Becky's been beating Charlotte because Becky's smarter, she knows Charlotte and she's a great technician, that's her strength. Once she realizes who these other girls are she'll get the jump on them too but she'll have to learn about them first which is why she'll be beaten down some.

In the end I'd be ok with that, if they write it correctly which is just been WWE's big weakness lately the writing and the booking. But I don't want to see world beaters of course, not Kofi, not Becky. But I don't think Becky is OP at all just yet. I think she has a ways to go... I hope she doesn't get there at all tbh, as that would suck.

[Prince Petty]

She needs to balance strength with vulnerability, I would certainly argue that. But it's been a problem for nearly every wrestler the WWE has tried to build since The Rock. He really knew how to show vulnerability in the ring, even after his promos showcased his utterly dominant persona.

With Becky it's a little different, because most of the other women are so far below her that it just feels mean if she attacks them in promos or on social media, so she needs to be more of a 'plucky underdog' in the ring at times. She knows how to do it, but we're talking about the company that kept having Alexa Bliss wrestle as a dominant, Triple H-style heel, rather than as a chickenshit, cheating heel, so we shouldn't expect too much.

[RedSmile]

Becky Lynch is not "OP". She's not flipping over semis, nor is she single handedly beating the tag team champions.

Becky has to look dominant to be a threat to Ronda. That's pro-wrestling 101. The whole build has just been this overbooked, overly complicated mess, when it never had to be.

[abjordans]

You hear criticism about 50/50 booking and whatnot, but when WWE really gets behind someone that is on fire, there are complaints about being OP (a phrase I never heard in my life until the Braun thread).

Where is the line? How can WWE strongly book someone if they can’t, you know, make them win a lot?

For the record, Becky is NOT OPand this thread is kinda silly in my opinion:

[ThankGodForSidJustice]

I would say she's definitely protected but I wouldn't say she's OP in the slightest. Having protection booking and being OP are two completely things. Becky has been booked strong since June in the sense that she's had very few pinfall/submission jobs with Charlotte at Summerslam and Asuka at the Rumble being the only two.

However she hasn't really gotten Super Woman booking either. Just look at tonight, yeah she won in short order but with a roll up against the kayfabe weakest member of a heel group. A OP face would've destroyed someone like Liv Morgan and went over with their finish. She also tapped out clean to Asuka at the Rumble. What super face has that ever happened to? Also on a Smackdown going into the Rumble it took her 10 minutes to beat tag team jabrone Peyton Royce. Askua then proceeded to destroy Peyton's partner, Billie Kay, in about a minute with no resistance what so ever. Becky is booked to be more then competent but comparing her to Cena/Reigns is ridiculous. Both of those guys have been protected way more and also unlike Becky were golden child's who were always taken care of and never had to endure years of being booked weak and being underutilized like Becky did. That was the main reason for the backlash against both of them as fans saw them as guys who didn't "pay dues" like most people and had it "easy".

[Slingshot Suplay]

Personally, I'm disinterested in Becky because they have done a terrible job of storytelling with her since her failed heel run. Combine that with the overreaction of people on the internet who overhype everything she does like it's the greatest thing ever, I just can't get behind her.

I never bought into the character since the heel turn because it just comes off as forced. She's not intimidating like Stone Cold, she's intimidating like Charlie Sheen in Ferris Bueller's day off. She's come off more as a brat than an anti hero in this story and with the WWE's way of being subtle, she's become the Captain Marvel of the WWE universe.

[Pushed to the Moon]

If I'm to believe that OP means "Over powered"(?) and she wins too much then good. I'm sick to f***ing death of heels beating people up and face looking like losers. People like winners. People like Becky. Long may it continue. I loved it when Seth went on that little winning streak last year and it really helped him gain some steam with the fans every week. Getting beat up to get sympathy sometimes is obviously necessary too but there comes a point where you actually have to win.

[Deleted]

Mar 26, 2019 5:33:08 GMT -5 abjordans said:

You hear criticism about 50/50 booking and whatnot, but when WWE really gets behind someone that is on fire, there are complaints about being OP (a phrase I never heard in my life until the Braun thread).

Where is the line? How can WWE strongly book someone if they can’t, you know, make them win a lot?

For the record, Becky is NOT OPand this thread is kinda silly in my opinion:

Being OP does not mean "this person wins too much." You can win every match you're in and not be OP.

As for the phrase, it's been around for decades. In gaming at least I've been hearing that for a very long long time.

[Deleted]

I feel people are far too focused on the power levels of various wrestlers just generally. Some users on this forum especially have some weird issue with someone being booked extremely strong. It's really odd. It's a far cry from years ago when this forum was mainly people complaining about 50/50 booking. It can work if written well which Lynch, for the most part, has been.

Okada was OP during his title reigns and it led to the greatest title reign I've ever seen.

Austin was OP at the height of his run. Hogan, Goldberg, etc. It comes down to the character and the writing but it can work and work extremely well. This is the way you made a star years ago and this is the way you can still make them now.

[Deleted]

Mar 26, 2019 1:50:36 GMT -5 Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] said:

In the end I'd be ok with that, if they write it correctly which is just been WWE's big weakness lately the writing and the booking. But I don't want to see world beaters of course, not Kofi, not Becky. But I don't think Becky is OP at all just yet. I think she has a ways to go... I hope she doesn't get there at all tbh, as that would suck.

These next 4 months for her are going to be important because it doesn't take much for this company to destroy someone's booking. Se could be HBK in terms of making her opponents look god tier or she could be Cena in a "wow, guy faced Cena and well they were trash."

The major difference is who people like. People give passes for those they like because they like them. It's like the Strowman thread where people gave passes for everything Strowman did because they were fans of his even though Strowman's booking made guys like Owens look horrible.

[Deleted]

Mar 26, 2019 10:10:14 GMT -5 @awataurne said:

I feel people are far too focused on the power levels of various wrestlers just generally. Some users on this forum especially have some weird issue with someone being booked extremely strong. It's really odd. It's a far cry from years ago when this forum was mainly people complaining about 50/50 booking. It can work if written well which Lynch, for the most part, has been.

Okada was OP during his title reigns and it led to the greatest title reign I've ever seen.

Austin was OP at the height of his run. Hogan, Goldberg, etc. It comes down to the character and the writing but it can work and work extremely well. This is the way you made a star years ago and this is the way you can still make them now.

There's a disconnect here. The "wrestler is OP" comments are more than "this guy is booked too strong", it all goes back to how it makes the other opponents look. If the opponents looked great while someone was booked crazy strong, the first wrestler wouldn't be called OP. A guy winning all the time doesn't mean someone is OP.

For example, Strowman. Hypothetically let's say that there's a Strowman/Rush feud where Strowman's doing all of the big bully stuff he was doing. Ripping things down, destroying cars, flipping ambulances, that stuff. Say he's doing all of that to get Lio and the entire time Lio's running through the arena, cutting promos saying he's afraid, he's doing all of that, say it goes on for a month or so. Strowman eventually catches him and Lio let's out a big scream before Strowman punches him once and then Lio's stretchered out. In this case, Strowman's strength doesn't do anything negative to Lio. Strowman's this big monster but Lio gets over this way given he's showing his athleticism, promo and character skills, this helps him. This is how you work these type of stars. Both guys look great, it's successful. It's a feud done to benefit both guys not just one. Now say you did the Strowman/Lio feud where Lio didn't do any of that, it was just Strowman beating him down repeatedly with no offense from Lio, no promos, no escaping, nothing from him, ends with a whimper. That doesn't help anyone besides Strowman out. This is a feud built solely for Strowman only, Lio's just there. Now imagine that happening with everyone Strowman faced, guys where they looked bad when they entered a Strowman feud and only Strowman benefited from it. At that point you wouldn't want said wrestler to interact with Strowman because he makes the others look like crap given he's booked as too OP. He's got the big bully stuff he's doing but nobody benefits from his feud except him and they look worse afterwards. That's Strowman being "too OP" because his wins, strength, booking as a whole completely overpowers the other wrestlers for no point other than himself. You mentioned other wrestlers but I can point to you at least something they looked great in those times when these big names (Okada, Austin and such) did their thing.

When we say "someone is too OP" we're looking at every wrestler as a whole. We want every wrestler regardless of the feud to look great to some degree whether it's strength, promos, just something where every wrestler gets something off. They don't have to win every match but they have to at least bring something to the table. When they bring nothing to the table, what point should they be in that spot other than a jobber?

Okada's reign is someone who's booked mega-strong done right. He made his opponents look great. He's not receiving any of these comments. Austin, Austin made Vince look great, Rock made other look great, Hogan was from a different era and I don't remember much of his stuff, Goldberg's "this guy is OP guys" thing was part of his entire character so that's different entirely.

At the end of the day the "wrestler is OP" comments come down to one central thing: how does the opponent look?

[Mister Pigwell]

These OP discussions are reaching self parody I feel...

[Dub H]

Mar 26, 2019 11:17:11 GMT -5 Mister Pigwell said:

These OP discussions are reaching self parody I feel...

You just say that because mods are OP.

You guys can ban people,delete threads and we cant do anything similar Mods should be nerfed.

[The Heartbreak TWERK]

Mar 26, 2019 11:35:28 GMT -5 Dub H said:

Mar 26, 2019 11:17:11 GMT -5 Mister Pigwell said:

These OP discussions are reaching self parody I feel...

You just say that because mods are OP.

You guys can ban people,delete threads and we cant do anything similar Mods should be nerfed.

Wait until they all fall asleep, friend.

We will post facts about Fandango and they will not be able to stop us.