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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Apr 19, 2020 11:53:30 GMT -5
I think a lot of discourse around superheroes lately (and some storylines too, looking at you, Nick Spencer) tries too hard to be serious and meaningful. I like thought provoking cape stories as well, but in between all these scholarly articles and debates around better character representation (which I am all for expanding) and what this MCU movie symbolizes, IMO some take for granted these characters are first and foremost supposed to be fun. I feel the same way when I see threads/reviews for things like Clone Wars and DuckTales that are straining to apply adult sensibilities to children's cartoons. AV Club reviews DuckTales the same way they review Devs and I'm like "You're...you're not the target audience. They're not offering up deep takes on socioeconomics in a duck cartoon for kids." Things can be simple AND well-made and entertaining. It always seems like a justification for someone to like "kid's stuff" with these highbrow takes. I have to respectfully disagree about Clone Wars. After about the first season or so, they very clearly knew that had a strong adult audience and were definitely keeping that in mind in the writing as the series progressed. And this final season? I’d say it’s 100% written for the adult audience, 10 year olds weren’t pining for the return of a show that was cancelled in 2013 Rebels honestly would’ve been a better example, it carried some of the adult themes of Clone Wars but it was pretty clearly designed with a younger target audience. |
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Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Apr 19, 2020 13:54:12 GMT -5
I've said before there's a reason why when they nuked the Ultiverse that Miles was the only real survivor... Except Spider-Men 2 set something up plus the Maker is running around in the regular universe and so is Jimmy I never read Spider-men... but I forgot about Maker... I knew there were a few other minor hang overs but Miles was the main one they kept. |
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Talent Name
Ozymandius
Got fined anyway.
Possibly a Moose
James Franco is the white Donald Glover
Posts: 63,993 
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Post by Talent Name on Apr 19, 2020 15:23:00 GMT -5
Except Spider-Men 2 set something up plus the Maker is running around in the regular universe and so is Jimmy I never read Spider-men... but I forgot about Maker... I knew there were a few other minor hang overs but Miles was the main one they kept. Spider-Men 2 spoiler {Spoiler}Other Miles is from the Ultimate Universe and that it was recreated at the end of the event and he returned there Also Maker has possession of the Ultimate Venom as well |
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ERON
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 6,827
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Post by ERON on Apr 19, 2020 19:51:59 GMT -5
I'll never not be angry at Marvel for making Wolverine's birth name James Howlett. I cringe whenever I see a character profile that says Real Name: James Howlett instead of Real Name: Logan. His name should have been either Logan Something or Something Logan, period. Howlett doesn't even work as a pun since wolverines don't howl. His name's supposed to be a pun? Yeah, I remember reading that in an interview with either Jenkins or Quesada. When they were throwing potential names around, someone suggested Howlett as a joke, like "Howlett the moon," and it stuck. |
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El Pollo Guerrera
Grimlock
His name has chicken in it, and he is good at makin' .gifs, so that's cool.
Status: Runner
Posts: 14,944
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Post by El Pollo Guerrera on Apr 19, 2020 20:46:38 GMT -5
A lot of artists regarded as 'great' are great when it's a splash page or a cover but not great storytellers. It started with the Image founders and it's followers. I miss the 70's and 80's style of comic art.
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Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Apr 19, 2020 20:51:29 GMT -5
I hate the "Batman can beat anyone" mentality.
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Post by Sir Woodrow on Apr 19, 2020 21:33:44 GMT -5
I hate the "Batman can beat anyone" mentality. Superman doesn't even need to use his strength, he could kick Batman's ass with some well placed words "Hey Brucey boy, I'm faster than a speeding bullet, you know, like the one that killed your Mom!" |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2020 1:33:01 GMT -5
Norman Osborn has spent probably the last 40 years being a completely shit character and at this point I really think people should just stop using him entirely.
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Post by Joe Neglia on Apr 20, 2020 1:45:24 GMT -5
Earth X had pretty Ross covers, pure crap otherwise.
Scott Lobdell and Fabian Nicieza's "quiet" issues of the 90s X-books (the issues that were mostly characters talking, no action) were among the best books in the entire franchise.
Dark Knight Returns is absolute trash in every regard.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2020 2:32:46 GMT -5
Dark Knight Returns is absolute trash in every regard. There are aspects of it I like, mostly individual scenes, but it does get a lot of praise that I don't really understand. Its narrative is basically just a hodgepodge of, "I wanna do this scene, and this one!" loosely stapled together without much real cohesion to any of it, the talking heads stuff is useless, the art is terrible, and there are all kinds of stupid Frank Miller-isms just in there for no reason, like the swastika woman. I don't hate it but I can certainly see why someone would and I don't think there's nearly as gigantic a gap between it and some of Miller's more hated stuff like Holy Terror and All-Star Batman and Robin as you would think. |
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Post by thechase on Apr 20, 2020 4:46:09 GMT -5
Norman Osborn has spent probably the last 40 years being a completely shit character and at this point I really think people should just stop using him entirely. ESPECIALLY when they just give up and make him Lex Luthor |
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Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on Apr 20, 2020 6:25:40 GMT -5
Norman Osborn has spent probably the last 40 years being a completely shit character and at this point I really think people should just stop using him entirely. ESPECIALLY when they just give up and make him Lex Luthor And you didn't even need to do that when Rod Kingsley/Hobgoblin is still around and would make far more sense as that type of character. Norman is just far too overtly nuts and creepy to pull it off. It being common public knowledge that he's a serial killer makes it even harder to buy. IMO Dark Reign was one of Marvel's biggest creative mis-steps and it rested entirely on them picking the absolute worst character possible to head it up. |
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dav
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 6,073
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Post by dav on Apr 20, 2020 9:27:55 GMT -5
His name's supposed to be a pun? Yeah, I remember reading that in an interview with either Jenkins or Quesada. When they were throwing potential names around, someone suggested Howlett as a joke, like "Howlett the moon," and it stuck. It doesn't even begin to make a lick of sense. |
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Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on Apr 20, 2020 9:56:33 GMT -5
Yeah, I remember reading that in an interview with either Jenkins or Quesada. When they were throwing potential names around, someone suggested Howlett as a joke, like "Howlett the moon," and it stuck. It doesn't even begin to make a lick of sense. I refuse to acknowledge his real name is James Anything. Why they didn't just give Logan a last name if they wanted to give him a full name is a real "what we're they thinking?" Moment. See also: trying to retcon that Wolverine led a team called ge X-Men before Professor X created them. Daken is literally the ONLY good thing that came out of Wolverine remembering his whole past, and even he took a change in writers to become a compelling character beyond "weird Mohawk bisexual rapist" |
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Phosphor Glow
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Is a real girl!
Posts: 19,883 
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Post by Phosphor Glow on Apr 20, 2020 11:01:55 GMT -5
I hate the "Batman can beat anyone" mentality. I love Batman, but I think he might have the actual worst fanbase in comics. He's unbeatable to his diehards even in the face of cosmic threats, and that started to leak into the writing for awhile, and just ugghhhh. Loathe that mindset. |
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Post by Joe Neglia on Apr 20, 2020 12:17:45 GMT -5
I hate the "Batman can beat anyone" mentality. I love Batman, but I think he might have the actual worst fanbase in comics. He's unbeatable to his diehards even in the face of cosmic threats, and that started to leak into the writing for awhile, and just ugghhhh. Loathe that mindset. And some of y'all were questioning a couple pages back why I made my opinion on Morrison being allowed to write the in-canon stuff. |
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Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on Apr 20, 2020 12:29:57 GMT -5
I love Batman, but I think he might have the actual worst fanbase in comics. He's unbeatable to his diehards even in the face of cosmic threats, and that started to leak into the writing for awhile, and just ugghhhh. Loathe that mindset. And some of y'all were questioning a couple pages back why I made my opinion on Morrison being allowed to write the in-canon stuff. Oh his run on Batman was largely terrible. I think in theory recanonizing his 60s and 70s adventures could have worked but in practice the attempt was just too weird. And Damien as originally conceived was a flat out terrible character who was only salvaged when Peter Tomasi started writing him. And I say this all as probably the most unabashed Grant Morrison fanboy on the boards. |
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Post by Joe Neglia on Apr 20, 2020 12:37:53 GMT -5
And some of y'all were questioning a couple pages back why I made my opinion on Morrison being allowed to write the in-canon stuff. Oh his run on Batman was largely terrible. I think in theory recanonizing his 60s and 70s adventures could have worked but in practice the attempt was just too weird. And Damien as originally conceived was a flat out terrible character who was only salvaged when Peter Tomasi started writing him. And I say this all as probably the most unabashed Grant Morrison fanboy on the boards. Wasn't even alluding to his Batman run, but his JLA run. That's where the "Batman can beat EVERYONE" shit got firmly implanted into the regular continuity books. |
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Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on Apr 20, 2020 13:05:13 GMT -5
Oh his run on Batman was largely terrible. I think in theory recanonizing his 60s and 70s adventures could have worked but in practice the attempt was just too weird. And Damien as originally conceived was a flat out terrible character who was only salvaged when Peter Tomasi started writing him. And I say this all as probably the most unabashed Grant Morrison fanboy on the boards. Wasn't even alluding to his Batman run, but his JLA run. That's where the "Batman can beat EVERYONE" shit got firmly implanted into the regular continuity books. I dunno I'm pretty sure that was a thing before that. He was just a little more blatant about it. I think the problem with Batman in the Justice League has always been that he's a normal man (albeit an obscenely rich one) standing among gods, but he's also the most popular superhero at DC so needs to be there. So writers (not just Morrison) always end up having to justify his presence in some way or another and they can get a bit overboard about it. Personally I think once Frank Miller had Batman beat Superman in a fight (even if he cheated like mad which made sense in context) the gloves were off already in the "Make Batman beat someone who should by all accounts reduce him to a smear" Sweepstakes. |
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Post by Joe Neglia on Apr 20, 2020 13:12:14 GMT -5
Wasn't even alluding to his Batman run, but his JLA run. That's where the "Batman can beat EVERYONE" shit got firmly implanted into the regular continuity books. I dunno I'm pretty sure that was a thing before that. He was just a little more blatant about it. I think the problem with Batman in the Justice League has always been that he's a normal man (albeit an obscenely rich one) standing among gods, but he's also the most popular superhero at DC so needs to be there. So writers (not just Morrison) always end up having to justify his presence in some way or another and they can get a bit overboard about it. Personally I think once Frank Miller had Batman beat Superman in a fight (even if he cheated like mad which made sense in context) the gloves were off already in the "Make Batman beat someone who should by all accounts reduce him to a smear" Sweepstakes. "firmly implanted" does not equal "the first one to hint at it" And it absolutely was the place where it was firmly implanted, during the Prometheus storyline. |
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