Sasha Banks and Naomi leave Raw after creative dispute

[Blade]

May 22, 2022 4:07:27 GMT -5 doinkmark said:

What were you in? Just curious.

Now that you mention acting, I wonder if that was part of it for Sasha? She does Hollywood stuff and says to herself "Oh, I could be treated THIS way instead?" And is suddenly less willing to deal with WWE.

Bunch of tv shows and movies filmed in Ottawa in 2004-10 (before I moved to Australia and wasn't in a convenient place to get work doing that), and a few indie things. Only really significant part was in a tv show called "Me, My House & I" (kind of a comedy/home improvement show). I've met Janeane Garofolo! And Colin Mochrie! They were nice.  

It is possible. I always think about the hilarious/sad bit where Bayley had the interview with a reporter and blithely talked about how the WWE expects wrestlers to deal with their own travel arrangements and lodgings, to the horror of said reporter.

[doinkmark]

May 21, 2022 23:53:36 GMT -5 joeiscool said:

However it's weird this revolves around the booking of a match. I feel like if it was about an unsafe work practice or something that was actually demeaning I would feel like they were being treated unfairly. The fact it's because they are being asked to wrestle in a different storyline than the one they wanted is so hard to empathize with them. Like you signed up to be booked by vince mchmon how am i supposed to be mad that vince booked you?

I'd think - I'd hope - that this was the last straw and not the first one. When you're booked as a champion and STILL walk? You have to have been unhappy for a while.

Or they really are just spoiled. I don't know.

[mrtuesday]

If this is a work, than WWE has bit more effort into this than they have put into every other storyline they have right now.

And WwE never puts in that much effort.

[A Platypus Rave is Correct]

so... cam we now 100% officially say that PCB have won Gang Wars? >_> <_<

[Starshine]

May 22, 2022 3:05:58 GMT -5 Blade said:

May 21, 2022 22:18:21 GMT -5 slickrickstyles said:

I understand the common nature to side with the person over the company but no one will convince me that walking out over creative (and not a breach of contract on WWE's part in negligence, sexual harassment etc) is justifiable in a performing arts industry whether these people get paid hourly, salary, or in food stamps. You do not just walk off the damn job because you did not get your way.

"Sasha Banks" is WWE intellectual property and she absolutely has written documents to perform as that character and wholeheartedly agreed to do. Hell if an actor walks away or has a dispute 9 out of 10 times they kill off the character in a tv series and move on.

Fans get so caught up in the emotional aspect of what they believe these wrestlers deserve from a creative standpoint and just how they feel about the workers in general that they fail to realize this is still a job and not just a passion play for the people involved.

If legit reasons other than creative come up then those should absolutely be taken into account but this social media positioning of them as martyrs or the lesser of two evils is frustrating and makes me pretty upset at them as a fan.

I am not even trying to defend WWE intentionally as they will do what WWE does to benefit WWE. The fact that we are surprised by it but not shocked is almost funny in itself. I just simply do not defend abandoning post. Some people have used the blindsided releases of WWE to justify this and it's actually not the same either considering their pay does not just stop most times...The entire 90-day period IS that paid transition period even if it's designed to cool them off professionally.

1) We do not, in fact, know this was just over creative.

2) If it was, f*** WWE anyway.

3) No, seriously, f*** WWE anyway. I was a professional actor for a decade and if I had ever been treated the way WWE treats their "independent contractors" I would have walked out. And I could do that, because I was actually an independent contractor.

Not disagreeing with any of your points, just want to add that actors also aren’t a great comp for wrestlers since they by-and-large tend not to be defined by a singular role for their entire career, and have opportunities for other roles, even if typecast. Killing a character played by an actor isn’t necessarily going to be as damaging to their career as writing something to the detriment of a wrestler on a wrestling show. Who even if they get different offers, is still likely going to play the same role, albeit under a different name.

[Vice honcho room temperature]

May 22, 2022 6:03:22 GMT -5 A Platypus Rave is Correct said:

so... cam we now 100% officially say that PCB have won Gang Wars? >_> <_<

Submission sorority for life

[schma]

May 22, 2022 6:03:22 GMT -5 A Platypus Rave is Correct said:

so... cam we now 100% officially say that PCB have won Gang Wars? >_> <_<

You could even say the other sororities submitted to them?

[mrtuesday]

May 22, 2022 6:03:22 GMT -5 A Platypus Rave is Correct said:

so... cam we now 100% officially say that PCB have won Gang Wars? >_> <_<

Tamina's still around. So Team BAD's not done, yet.

[nisidhe]

May 22, 2022 6:20:54 GMT -5 Starshine said:

Not disagreeing with any of your points, just want to add that actors also aren’t a great comp for wrestlers since they by-and-large tend not to be defined by a singular role for their entire career, and have opportunities for other roles, even if typecast. Killing a character played by an actor isn’t necessarily going to be as damaging to their career as writing something to the detriment of a wrestler on a wrestling show. Who even if they get different offers, is still likely going to play the same role, albeit under a different name.

I'd suggest you're looking at the wrong kinds of actors.

If Susan Lucci were to have walked off from _All My Children_, or indeed if, back in the day Victoria Wyndham were to done so from _Another World_ and either their networks (ABC and NBC respectively) or the sponsoring/production companies were to pull this kind of smear campaign, there'd be damn near riots in the streets by fans. These are not people you discard easily on such short notice. The writing teams would likely walk rather than finagle the deaths of those characters.

We're dealing with kind of the same thing at least with Sasha for image, and Naomi for longevity and reputation as a worker. Sure, we can drag Sasha for having previously done this, but Naomi has to have hit a line for her to do the same, and it may not be just by acting as the Usos' DD.

[asuka007]

Yeah Naomi walking as well is very telling.

There also seems to be this disturbing trend by some out there to take away her agency by saying she was “manipulated” or whatever.

As for Sasha, WWE’s booking of her has been bizarre for a long time and her not being 100% cool with it goes back to 2016 at least I think.

[Deleted]

May 22, 2022 7:46:11 GMT -5 asuka007 said:

Yeah Naomi walking as well is very telling.

There also seems to be this disturbing trend by some out there to take away her agency by saying she was “manipulated” or whatever.

As for Sasha, WWE’s booking of her has been bizarre for a long time and her not being 100% cool with it goes back to 2016 at least I think.

Yeah it is very weird because as popular as she is and as much as they do "promote" her she has oddly felt separated from the group of main roster women including even Bayley.

[xCompackx]

It's never really felt like they knew what to do with Sasha and I completely get not being cool with shitty creative decisions, especially coming from NXT and the run she had there.

[Mecca]

May 22, 2022 11:38:26 GMT -5 xCompackx said:

It's never really felt like they knew what to do with Sasha and I completely get not being cool with shitty creative decisions, especially coming from NXT and the run she had there.

They don't know what to do with a lot of people, they have these very rigid definitions of characters and try to make each person fit into that when they come to the main roster. If you aren't that they don't adapt they just assume that it's obviously your fault cause you aren't good and move on.

In reality becoming a publicly traded company is one of the worst things to ever happen to the company in regards to creative, they just follow their paint by numbers.

[xCompackx]

May 22, 2022 11:41:16 GMT -5 Mecca said:

May 22, 2022 11:38:26 GMT -5 xCompackx said:

It's never really felt like they knew what to do with Sasha and I completely get not being cool with shitty creative decisions, especially coming from NXT and the run she had there.

They don't know what to do with a lot of people, they have these very rigid definitions of characters and try to make each person fit into that when they come to the main roster. If you aren't that they don't adapt they just assume that it's obviously your fault cause you aren't good and move on.

In reality becoming a publicly traded company is one of the worst things to ever happen to the company in regards to creative, they just follow their paint by numbers.

Oh no, I don't disagree at all and it's crazy how even when they get something "right", it's only because either the talent themselves were mostly responsible for it, or they managed to hold off on f***ing it up.

[The Ichi]

May 21, 2022 22:22:49 GMT -5 asuka007 said:

I could not care less.

WWE fires people during a pandemic despite making record profits by the dozens, just because. But people who WANT to leave, like Ali and Roddy, are held hostage just because someone else MIGHT use them better.

So why should I care if someone turns the table on WWE? Especially when WWE seems to be trying to pit talent against each other as well? That’s just a flat out toxic work environment.

Pretty much where I'm at.

I don't care about the legalities of it or whether or not it was professional to walk out on a company built from the ground up on being unprofessional. The fact is they did something more people should do and it's awesome.

[asuka007]

May 22, 2022 11:38:26 GMT -5 xCompackx said:

It's never really felt like they knew what to do with Sasha and I completely get not being cool with shitty creative decisions, especially coming from NXT and the run she had there.

Sasha has always suffered from, not that she is not pushed necessarily, but that she has never been consistently pushed as much as her talent and popularity would suggest.

It always feels like she gets built up, just to lose to someone WWE wants more. Charlotte is the most obvious (Charlotte even mentions it in her book) and that is still going on. But also Alexa for a few years there, Becky, Ronda, etc.

Naomi is even more frustrating because she manages to keep herself ever and they TEASE doing more with her. But they always end up cutting her down and putting her back where she was before in the end.

Naomi talks about liking her story with Sonya because that was the first story that she got of her own in WWE that lasted more than a few weeks. And Naomi has been there a LONG time.

[Mecca]

May 22, 2022 11:56:18 GMT -5 The Ichi said:

May 21, 2022 22:22:49 GMT -5 asuka007 said:

I could not care less.

WWE fires people during a pandemic despite making record profits by the dozens, just because. But people who WANT to leave, like Ali and Roddy, are held hostage just because someone else MIGHT use them better.

So why should I care if someone turns the table on WWE? Especially when WWE seems to be trying to pit talent against each other as well? That’s just a flat out toxic work environment.

Pretty much where I'm at.

I don't care about the legalities of it or whether or not it was professional to walk out on a company built from the ground up on being unprofessional. The fact is they did something more people should do and it's awesome.

That's the shit that baffles me, we are gonna release people constantly...oh you want out? Nevermind f*** you you don't get to leave.

[Mecca]

Wade Keller says he has heard from people in WWE who are backing Sasha Banks and Naomi: "there are others who, yes, think this is a cool thing that they did. And they sort of wished that they had the guts to do something like that and take a stance."

During a recent PWTorch.com audio update, Wade Keller recapped the Sasha Banks and Naomi situation and added that he has heard that there are some people in the business who are expressing support for what they did last Monday.

“Naomi’s contract is coming due,” Keller said. “We don’t have much more details on Sasha and Naomi in terms of any reconciliation or any more details on their departure. I know some people and I’ve run into a lot of them who just instinctually want to blame Vince McMahon for everything. Other people, although fewer outside and inside WWE are not complimentary of Sasha and Naomi’s likelihood of handling this well, and are not surprised that [out] of anybody of prominence on the roster, that they’d be the ones who maybe handled things in a way that wasn’t ideal.

Keller made it clear that when he reports on things, he is not someone who picks a side between the wrestlers and management and his story is not biased towards any side. He added, “But I can say there are people who in that locker room – colleagues of theirs [including] active wrestlers, and otherwise, who are disappointed and not sympathetic to the way Sasha and Naomi handled this. And there are others who, yes, think this is a cool thing that they did. And they sort of wished that they had the guts to do something like that and take a stance. So I mentioned Naomi’s contract is coming due in WWE. And there had been some rumblings that maybe this was related to contract issues and not wanting to look like they were being sacrificed right before to take some leverage away or just spend some of their equity right before their contracts come due. We don’t have details on when her contract expires, just that that could have been a contributing factor in the frustration of Naomi and perhaps Sasha, that, we’re going to take away some of your leverage by having you do pretty high profile jobs in the midst of a tag team title reign that they were excited about.”

“And they felt like that wasn’t being repaid with being protected while they were tag team champions. And like I said, I’ve talked to enough people to get a sense [that] there’s not any sort of unanimity in their opinion, in the locker room of how they handle this. I think there’s some sympathy for certain details of why they walked out but not a lot of sympathy for walking out before a show. But when it gets right down to it, Sasha and Naomi could not have stayed and done that match without making things worse for WWE. If Naomi won the match and earned the title shot and you do that and then Naomi says I don’t want to go through with this, now WWE has more of a mess to clean up than simply announcing the six-pack challenge that WWE needs to rework on short notice…”

During SmackDown, WWE announced that Banks and Naomi have been indefinitely suspended and new Women’s Tag Team Champions will be crowned soon. Since walking out on Monday, Banks has been seen hanging out with Snoop Dogg’s son Calvin.

[Deleted]

So Sasha has been hanging out in Prince's house and lastnight was on Stage with Steve Aoki.

Sasha could not give less of a shit about any of this drama she out here living her life just laughing it up.



It is funny though there is still this narrative being spun in some parts that Sasha is somehow gonna just have a career collapse without WWE...cue Sasha laughing harder.

[Deleted]

May 22, 2022 12:21:45 GMT -5 Mecca said:

Wade Keller says he has heard from people in WWE who are backing Sasha Banks and Naomi: "there are others who, yes, think this is a cool thing that they did. And they sort of wished that they had the guts to do something like that and take a stance."

During a recent PWTorch.com audio update, Wade Keller recapped the Sasha Banks and Naomi situation and added that he has heard that there are some people in the business who are expressing support for what they did last Monday.

“Naomi’s contract is coming due,” Keller said. “We don’t have much more details on Sasha and Naomi in terms of any reconciliation or any more details on their departure. I know some people and I’ve run into a lot of them who just instinctually want to blame Vince McMahon for everything. Other people, although fewer outside and inside WWE are not complimentary of Sasha and Naomi’s likelihood of handling this well, and are not surprised that [out] of anybody of prominence on the roster, that they’d be the ones who maybe handled things in a way that wasn’t ideal.

Keller made it clear that when he reports on things, he is not someone who picks a side between the wrestlers and management and his story is not biased towards any side. He added, “But I can say there are people who in that locker room – colleagues of theirs [including] active wrestlers, and otherwise, who are disappointed and not sympathetic to the way Sasha and Naomi handled this. And there are others who, yes, think this is a cool thing that they did. And they sort of wished that they had the guts to do something like that and take a stance. So I mentioned Naomi’s contract is coming due in WWE. And there had been some rumblings that maybe this was related to contract issues and not wanting to look like they were being sacrificed right before to take some leverage away or just spend some of their equity right before their contracts come due. We don’t have details on when her contract expires, just that that could have been a contributing factor in the frustration of Naomi and perhaps Sasha, that, we’re going to take away some of your leverage by having you do pretty high profile jobs in the midst of a tag team title reign that they were excited about.”

“And they felt like that wasn’t being repaid with being protected while they were tag team champions. And like I said, I’ve talked to enough people to get a sense [that] there’s not any sort of unanimity in their opinion, in the locker room of how they handle this. I think there’s some sympathy for certain details of why they walked out but not a lot of sympathy for walking out before a show. But when it gets right down to it, Sasha and Naomi could not have stayed and done that match without making things worse for WWE. If Naomi won the match and earned the title shot and you do that and then Naomi says I don’t want to go through with this, now WWE has more of a mess to clean up than simply announcing the six-pack challenge that WWE needs to rework on short notice…”

During SmackDown, WWE announced that Banks and Naomi have been indefinitely suspended and new Women’s Tag Team Champions will be crowned soon. Since walking out on Monday, Banks has been seen hanging out with Snoop Dogg’s son Calvin.

Yeah unfortunately both have split themselves down the middle with their contemporaries and a fresh start would be best for everyone involved. Getting there is the torturous process