asuka007
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 23,690
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Post by asuka007 on Jul 3, 2022 16:12:53 GMT -5
My biggest issue with the whole thing is there were so many more interesting choices for MITB winner in that match. Sami having the brief case could have been huge fun..A guy who is constantly about to cash it on but chickens out at the last minute. Madcap Moss could have been fun. Hell I would have even preferred Omos. But nope, this guy. I think some fans also worry that WWE is not going to capitalize on how mega over Riddle in particular is right now.
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Gus Richlen: Ruffian
Patti Mayonnaise
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Post by Gus Richlen: Ruffian on Jul 3, 2022 16:26:01 GMT -5
Calling Theory "just a bland white dude" tells me you haven't actually watched him at all Theory absolutely epitomizes "bland white dude." However, he's not bland in the dry, uncharismatic sense of the word. He's bland in the way Minoru Suzuki described it - he's decent at every aspect of wrestling but doesn't stand out at all because of that. Rather than excelling at one or two things he's just okay at everything, and that makes him incredibly boring. He's the type of dude where if you fire up Extreme Warfare Revenge, all of his stats are in the 60's and his gimmick is Cocky. Add in his generic look, his ridiculous overexposure, and yeah, the allegations against him and he's a total channel-changer. And speaking of the allegations, him getting pushed this hard as Vince's favorite while Vince himself is still under a microscope for plenty of misconduct of his own IS a coincidence but still looks rather bad. To me, anyway.
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Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Jul 3, 2022 16:52:42 GMT -5
I haaaaaate this line of thought because it always carries with it the idea that there are people who just broadly want anybody pushed while having no standards for it past their age. It's just an absurd strawman. Even when people just blanket say they want new people pushed it's an absurd reach to read that as being open to literally anyone on the planet so long as they're within a certain age group. Also, like, the crowd does cheer for people who they want pushed. There's a difference between who actually gets pushed and who the crowd cheers to be pushed and that very rarely blends well together for some reason. Heck, Cody Rhodes being the most over babyface and them treating him like the most over babyface is the biggest outlier of the past decade to almost anything WWE's done in terms of getting a new talent over. And they had to get him from another company. Yeah, the WWE have people that the crowd have been DYING to cheer forever and the WWE treated them like trash... some of them bad enough they just left.
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Post by 06vwgti on Jul 3, 2022 18:21:50 GMT -5
Honestly, he isn't clicking with me. Not sure how he would do as a face, it isn't like Drew where he was a far more natural face than a huff and puff heel yet they kept miscasting him as a heel for the longest time.
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Post by "Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik on Jul 4, 2022 12:27:53 GMT -5
Like when he has resting Theory face he looks alright. But when his face does literally anything else, it's a horror show.
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Post by Kay Faban on Jul 4, 2022 14:04:40 GMT -5
I haaaaaate this line of thought because it always carries with it the idea that there are people who just broadly want anybody pushed while having no standards for it past their age. It's just an absurd strawman. Even when people just blanket say they want new people pushed it's an absurd reach to read that as being open to literally anyone on the planet so long as they're within a certain age group. As I've said every time it comes up. It's like if you say you are hungry and someone gives you dog food. Then someone responding with "Well you said you wanted FOOD". That is not what the first person meant and everyone knows it. I think it’s more like someone saying they want food and then complaining no matter what they get fed. They just want to be complaining they are hungry.
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Mozenrath
FANatic
Foppery and Whim
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Posts: 121,998
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Post by Mozenrath on Jul 4, 2022 14:11:36 GMT -5
This is what investing young talent looks like. The thing this forum allegedly wants them to do. I haaaaaate this line of thought because it always carries with it the idea that there are people who just broadly want anybody pushed while having no standards for it past their age. It's just an absurd strawman. Even when people just blanket say they want new people pushed it's an absurd reach to read that as being open to literally anyone on the planet so long as they're within a certain age group. I especially don't agree with it because, well, when he won the US title, it was not anyone's first pick, probably, but people were mostly fine with it. He's the sort of person a midcard title can help build legitimacy for, but that doesn't mean he is ready to challenge for the world title, especially since they already had guys like Brock and Cody fight with him, and Theory being shown to be not remotely in their league at this time. So, why the sudden rush?
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Jul 4, 2022 14:34:30 GMT -5
As I've said every time it comes up. It's like if you say you are hungry and someone gives you dog food. Then someone responding with "Well you said you wanted FOOD". That is not what the first person meant and everyone knows it. I think it’s more like someone saying they want food and then complaining no matter what they get fed. They just want to be complaining they are hungry. I mean, he’s used a clearer example of what he means more than you have to be honest. Like, if you like the guy, more power to you but it’s weird that you’re getting offended at people not liking him.
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Legion
Fry's dog Seymour
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Post by Legion on Jul 4, 2022 14:53:53 GMT -5
I haaaaaate this line of thought because it always carries with it the idea that there are people who just broadly want anybody pushed while having no standards for it past their age. It's just an absurd strawman. Even when people just blanket say they want new people pushed it's an absurd reach to read that as being open to literally anyone on the planet so long as they're within a certain age group. As I've said every time it comes up. It's like if you say you are hungry and someone gives you dog food. Then someone responding with "Well you said you wanted FOOD". That is not what the first person meant and everyone knows it. Someone will be complaining whoever it is. If it had been Seth, Drew or Shamus, we'd have a thread about how WWE has wasted it on someone who can get a title shot with one promo because of their history. If it had been Riddle, we'd have the thread about how problematic he is. If it was Moss, we'd have a similar thread to this one about not being ready. If it was Omos, the forum would still be down from the amount of LOL posts. Sami was the only one it made any real sense to give it to, but at the same time, he isn't really a main event level character/presentation, however much he can do it all. And even that would be a waste of the possibility of it being used to elevate someone. Frankly, the whole concept could do with a rest, but given it wont be, at least having it actually go to someone with the potential to be a top future star is better than wasting it. In that respect, people could be more open to the idea, even if it wasnt the person they wanted in the idea getting the nod.
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Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Jul 4, 2022 15:08:53 GMT -5
As I've said every time it comes up. It's like if you say you are hungry and someone gives you dog food. Then someone responding with "Well you said you wanted FOOD". That is not what the first person meant and everyone knows it. Someone will be complaining whoever it is. If it had been Seth, Drew or Shamus, we'd have a thread about how WWE has wasted it on someone who can get a title shot with one promo because of their history. If it had been Riddle, we'd have the thread about how problematic he is. If it was Moss, we'd have a similar thread to this one about not being ready. If it was Omos, the forum would still be down from the amount of LOL posts. Sami was the only one it made any real sense to give it to, but at the same time, he isn't really a main event level character/presentation, however much he can do it all. And even that would be a waste of the possibility of it being used to elevate someone. Frankly, the whole concept could do with a rest, but given it wont be, at least having it actually go to someone with the potential to be a top future star is better than wasting it. In that respect, people could be more open to the idea, even if it wasnt the person they wanted in the idea getting the nod. That was not in terms of the Money in the Bank. That was in response to when people throw the "you said you wanted them to push someone new" when there is a general push back against who they are pushing. If you've got a roster full of people that the crowd has been begging to get behind and you insist on pushing people the crowd are not behind... you're going to get the response.
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Gus Richlen: Ruffian
Patti Mayonnaise
Metal Maestro: Co-winner of the FAN Idol Throwdown!
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Posts: 39,203
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Post by Gus Richlen: Ruffian on Jul 4, 2022 15:13:21 GMT -5
I think it’s more like someone saying they want food and then complaining no matter what they get fed. They just want to be complaining they are hungry. I mean, he’s used a clearer example of what he means more than you have to be honest. Like, if you like the guy, more power to you but it’s weird that you’re getting offended at people not liking him. It's hard being a Reigns fan.... [/selfdeprecation]
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Jul 4, 2022 15:22:27 GMT -5
Someone will be complaining whoever it is. If it had been Seth, Drew or Shamus, we'd have a thread about how WWE has wasted it on someone who can get a title shot with one promo because of their history. If it had been Riddle, we'd have the thread about how problematic he is. If it was Moss, we'd have a similar thread to this one about not being ready. If it was Omos, the forum would still be down from the amount of LOL posts. Sami was the only one it made any real sense to give it to, but at the same time, he isn't really a main event level character/presentation, however much he can do it all. And even that would be a waste of the possibility of it being used to elevate someone. Frankly, the whole concept could do with a rest, but given it wont be, at least having it actually go to someone with the potential to be a top future star is better than wasting it. In that respect, people could be more open to the idea, even if it wasnt the person they wanted in the idea getting the nod. That was not in terms of the Money in the Bank. That was in response to when people throw the "you said you wanted them to push someone new" when there is a general push back against who they are pushing. If you've got a roster full of people that the crowd has been begging to get behind and you insist on pushing people the crowd are not behind... you're going to get the response. Like, look, if you want to put MITB on a younger talent, go for it. The problem is, if we’re looking at it from a big stage, only-sees-the-big-4 WWE fan, Theory couldn’t beat a commentator (albeit a former Super Bowl winning commentator but still) and at this very PPV, lost to Bobby Lashley in a dominating affair so…why should people take him seriously as a winner? Because he’s new?
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Fade
Patti Mayonnaise
Posts: 38,526
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Post by Fade on Jul 4, 2022 15:26:05 GMT -5
Someone will be complaining whoever it is. If it had been Seth, Drew or Shamus, we'd have a thread about how WWE has wasted it on someone who can get a title shot with one promo because of their history. If it had been Riddle, we'd have the thread about how problematic he is. If it was Moss, we'd have a similar thread to this one about not being ready. If it was Omos, the forum would still be down from the amount of LOL posts. Sami was the only one it made any real sense to give it to, but at the same time, he isn't really a main event level character/presentation, however much he can do it all. And even that would be a waste of the possibility of it being used to elevate someone. Frankly, the whole concept could do with a rest, but given it wont be, at least having it actually go to someone with the potential to be a top future star is better than wasting it. In that respect, people could be more open to the idea, even if it wasnt the person they wanted in the idea getting the nod. That was not in terms of the Money in the Bank. That was in response to when people throw the "you said you wanted them to push someone new" when there is a general push back against who they are pushing. If you've got a roster full of people that the crowd has been begging to get behind and you insist on pushing people the crowd are not behind... you're going to get the response. Yeah but who is there right now on the main roster who’s young, can go and shows potential enough to elevate and push around. Theory. There’s no one else. There’s a few cats in NXT who fit the bill, but they’re there for a reason. Closest I could think of is Moss, Ali and Ford and they’re all in their 30s. And if your response is “they’ve had guys before that the crowd was into and they let them go..” Yes. Absolutely agreed. They’ve squandered so many. But right now?? It makes sense. Doesn’t even promise a percentage of success, this could very well inevitably kill the guy’s push.
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Post by canceled4truth on Jul 4, 2022 15:31:48 GMT -5
The crowd isn't supposed to be behind him right now. He's a heel explicitly pushed as the unearned apple of Vince's eye in kayfabe. He's supposed to be booed out of the building. And yes, I know, "X-Pac/go away heat," but as far as I'm concerned the only difference between that and regular heat is in the mind of the beholder.
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Post by "Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik on Jul 4, 2022 15:36:34 GMT -5
The crowd isn't supposed to be behind him right now. He's a heel explicitly pushed as the unearned apple of Vince's eye in kayfabe. He's supposed to be booed out of the building. And yes, I know, "X-Pac/go away heat," but as far as I'm concerned the only difference between that and regular heat is in the mind of the beholder. I think he tends to generate more apathy than anything. There have been plenty of guys who had the gimmick of being favored by management. Sometimes it generates the right kind of heat but other times it generates more of a "meh" reaction.
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Post by "Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik on Jul 4, 2022 15:38:12 GMT -5
That was not in terms of the Money in the Bank. That was in response to when people throw the "you said you wanted them to push someone new" when there is a general push back against who they are pushing. If you've got a roster full of people that the crowd has been begging to get behind and you insist on pushing people the crowd are not behind... you're going to get the response. Yeah but who is there right now on the main roster who’s young, can go and shows potential enough to elevate and push around. Theory. There’s no one else. There’s a few cats in NXT who fit the bill, but they’re there for a reason. Closest I could think of is Moss, Ali and Ford and they’re all in their 30s. And if your response is “they’ve had guys before that the crowd was into and they let them go..” Yes. Absolutely agreed. They’ve squandered so many. But right now?? It makes sense. Doesn’t even promise a percentage of success, this could very well inevitably kill the guy’s push. I know they're in NXT but I think Melo and Waller are both better suited to this push. Grayson in particular is basically a more charismatic Theory in my eyes, just with a slightly less impressive physique.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Jul 4, 2022 15:38:21 GMT -5
Also, if you’ve watched WWE for longer than 5 minutes, you know not to take seriously an idea of Vince McMahon having a protégé or chosen one because he eventually gets bored of them and heels on them or something.
Even with someone like Cena, you can tell that Vince is really invested in him when he’s feuding with him.
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Fade
Patti Mayonnaise
Posts: 38,526
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Post by Fade on Jul 4, 2022 15:41:06 GMT -5
Yeah but who is there right now on the main roster who’s young, can go and shows potential enough to elevate and push around. Theory. There’s no one else. There’s a few cats in NXT who fit the bill, but they’re there for a reason. Closest I could think of is Moss, Ali and Ford and they’re all in their 30s. And if your response is “they’ve had guys before that the crowd was into and they let them go..” Yes. Absolutely agreed. They’ve squandered so many. But right now?? It makes sense. Doesn’t even promise a percentage of success, this could very well inevitably kill the guy’s push. I know they're in NXT but I think Melo and Waller are both better suited to this push. Grayson in particular is basically a more charismatic Theory in my eyes, just with a slightly less impressive physique. Melo, Waller and Breakker were the ones I alluded to but again: Still in developmental.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Jul 4, 2022 15:43:48 GMT -5
I know they're in NXT but I think Melo and Waller are both better suited to this push. Grayson in particular is basically a more charismatic Theory in my eyes, just with a slightly less impressive physique. Melo, Waller and Breakker were the ones I alluded to but again: Still in developmental. I mean, hasn’t been the first time they’ve rushed people to a push from developmental. And we know this because it’s happening to an extent with Theory.
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Post by daveyt on Jul 4, 2022 15:44:37 GMT -5
Every time
“WWE NEVER PUSHES NEW YOUNG TALENT”
*WWE pushes a new, young talent
“UGH WHY IS WWE PUSHING THIS PERSON.”
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