pinja
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Posts: 2,998
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Post by pinja on Dec 16, 2022 4:53:54 GMT -5
There is no malice or judgment in saying: With my casual awareness of Ospreay and Martin I looked at Andretti from a theater like distance and thought that he is the same type with a similar silhouette. It doesn't take away from his match and the moment. It is just an immediate impression in a very visual media. Of course it gets relativized by being able to catch the details, by watching him move, rest, emote.
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Post by Doo Doo is a Ratings Expert on Dec 16, 2022 5:10:17 GMT -5
I've enjoyed AEW all year, but I think this is the best booking decision Khan's made of 2022.
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Post by Celexa Bliss 54 on Dec 16, 2022 10:07:45 GMT -5
Happy for the guy, but they really telegraphed that win from the second they announced Jericho would be "in action". Jericho doesn't have matches for no reason, plus the way they hammered home that Andretti had no business being in the ring with Jericho, then the match ran through a commercial. Even Stevie Wonder could've seen it coming.
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Dec 16, 2022 10:27:21 GMT -5
There is no malice or judgment in saying: With my casual awareness of Ospreay and Martin I looked at Andretti from a theater like distance and thought that he is the same type with a similar silhouette. It doesn't take away from his match and the moment. It is just an immediate impression in a very visual media. Of course it gets relativized by being able to catch the details, by watching him move, rest, emote. There's no malice or judgment in your part, but the reason everyone is reacting that way is because "looks like Ospreay and Martin" as first presented was a value judgment.
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Post by eJm on Dec 16, 2022 10:28:31 GMT -5
Happy for the guy, but they really telegraphed that win from the second they announced Jericho would be "in action". Jericho doesn't have matches for no reason, plus the way they hammered home that Andretti had no business being in the ring with Jericho, then the match ran through a commercial. Even Stevie Wonder could've seen it coming. I disagree. Mostly because whenever they say they’re in action regardless of their level, they’re mostly against someone who did well on Dark or Elevation whose there to die. It’s happened with everyone from Wardlow to Moxley to Britt Baker. And all of those have been to set something up in the future. For the record, I expected was for Jericho to kill someone, he’d challenge Claudio to a title rematch for New Year’s Smash or somewhere like that where the swing is banned and we’d be talking about what could happen after that. Now, though? No idea.
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Post by Celexa Bliss 54 on Dec 16, 2022 10:33:51 GMT -5
Happy for the guy, but they really telegraphed that win from the second they announced Jericho would be "in action". Jericho doesn't have matches for no reason, plus the way they hammered home that Andretti had no business being in the ring with Jericho, then the match ran through a commercial. Even Stevie Wonder could've seen it coming. I disagree. Mostly because whenever they say they’re in action regardless of their level, they’re mostly against someone who did well on Dark or Elevation whose there to die. It’s happened with everyone from Wardlow to Moxley to Britt Baker. And all of those have been to set something up in the future. For the record, I expected was for Jericho to kill someone, he’d challenge Claudio to a title rematch for New Year’s Smash or somewhere like that where the swing is banned and we’d be talking about what could happen after that. Now, though? No idea. Mox going out and bearing a jobber is one thing. Jericho doesn't just wrestle for the sake of it, though. They've made that perfectly clear, Jericho is a star attraction, if he wrestles, it's a big deal and has a purpose. So as soon as I saw that, I was like, "welp, the jobber's going over." For me, the biggest surprise was that it was decisive and not a fluke roll-up.
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Post by eJm on Dec 16, 2022 10:34:56 GMT -5
I disagree. Mostly because whenever they say they’re in action regardless of their level, they’re mostly against someone who did well on Dark or Elevation whose there to die. It’s happened with everyone from Wardlow to Moxley to Britt Baker. And all of those have been to set something up in the future. For the record, I expected was for Jericho to kill someone, he’d challenge Claudio to a title rematch for New Year’s Smash or somewhere like that where the swing is banned and we’d be talking about what could happen after that. Now, though? No idea. Mox going out and bearing a jobber is one thing. Jericho doesn't just wrestle for the sake of it, though. They've made that perfectly clear, Jericho is a star attraction, if he wrestles, it's a big deal and has a purpose. So as soon as I saw that, I was like, "welp, the jobber's going over." For me, the biggest surprise was that it was decisive and not a fluke roll-up. I mean, I’d argue Moxley’s on that level too so we’ll have to agree to disagree.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2022 11:39:35 GMT -5
There is no malice or judgment in saying: With my casual awareness of Ospreay and Martin I looked at Andretti from a theater like distance and thought that he is the same type with a similar silhouette. It doesn't take away from his match and the moment. It is just an immediate impression in a very visual media. Of course it gets relativized by being able to catch the details, by watching him move, rest, emote. Sadly some people on this forum have a hard time accepting that most wrestlers look and act the same these days. It's not exclusive to AEW but they have probably more than most. This is an industry thing. Why it's so offensive to say "That short curly haired guy looks and acts exactly the same as that other short curly haired guy" is beyond me. Compare Action Andretti and Will Osperay and then compare Bam Bam Bigelow to somebody like Earthquake or Vader. Absolutely nobody is confusing the latter two because although they're both FAT, they look and act completely different. I'm not swayed by the audiences reaction by the way. AEW and WWE will always have diehard fans. My concern is about the people who are tuning into wrestling for the first time. Are THEY stopping the channel for these generic looking guys? The answer is no. Because wrestling isn't popular in the mainstream anymore. And that's for a reason.
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Zone Was Wrong
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Currently living off the high that AEW brings every Wednesday and Friday
Posts: 16,155
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Post by Zone Was Wrong on Dec 16, 2022 12:03:55 GMT -5
There is no malice or judgment in saying: With my casual awareness of Ospreay and Martin I looked at Andretti from a theater like distance and thought that he is the same type with a similar silhouette. It doesn't take away from his match and the moment. It is just an immediate impression in a very visual media. Of course it gets relativized by being able to catch the details, by watching him move, rest, emote. Sadly some people on this forum have a hard time accepting that most wrestlers look and act the same these days. It's not exclusive to AEW but they have probably more than most. This is an industry thing. Why it's so offensive to say "That short curly haired guy looks and acts exactly the same as that other short curly haired guy" is beyond me. Compare Action Andretti and Will Osperay and then compare Bam Bam Bigelow to somebody like Earthquake or Vader. Absolutely nobody is confusing the latter two because although they're both FAT, they look and act completely different. I'm not swayed by the audiences reaction by the way. AEW and WWE will always have diehard fans. My concern is about the people who are tuning into wrestling for the first time. Are THEY stopping the channel for these generic looking guys? The answer is no. Because wrestling isn't popular in the mainstream anymore. And that's for a reason. .......Did you have the volume on for that match? I don't think anyone gave shit about how dude looked. They were hooked on him the second he kicked out of the Code Breaker and chanted "You Deserve It" to him afterwards. That segment gained in viewers as well. People just turning in just saw an athletic dude, who was an unknown before that night, pin a former world champion, and someone that is in contention for GOAT for a lot of people. Now they will want to know who the hell that was and what comes next. Plus if they are someone "tuning in for the first time" then they won't have a comparison of people like Dante or Osprey anyways right? So it's not like they're going to think to themselves that he looks like those guys anyways.
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Dec 16, 2022 12:37:53 GMT -5
Of all the places to make this about how this guy can't appeal to casual fans. We had a magical moment with an amazing crowd reaction, a reaction that literally could only exist within the confines of the rules of professional wrestling, a storytelling beat only given value by familiarity with the tropes and the subversion of expectations, and the question is just "But what about the casual fans just tuning in?" Like no. This isn't for them. It doesn't have to be. Even outside of any idea on the merits of if wrestling needs to appeal to this made up guy who channel surfs in 2022, media does not need everything to be meant for first time consumption. That'd be awful. Nobody wrote episodes of The Wire going "But what if someone tunes in for the first time in this scene in season three episode seven" because they were making The f***ing Wire and they knew that it would speak for itself. The Action Andretti story at this juncture literally is not for those thereotical people, and a world where that is a valid complaint is a world where all media is just total dogshit.
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Post by Cyno on Dec 16, 2022 12:39:39 GMT -5
There is no malice or judgment in saying: With my casual awareness of Ospreay and Martin I looked at Andretti from a theater like distance and thought that he is the same type with a similar silhouette. It doesn't take away from his match and the moment. It is just an immediate impression in a very visual media. Of course it gets relativized by being able to catch the details, by watching him move, rest, emote. Sadly some people on this forum have a hard time accepting that most wrestlers look and act the same these days. It's not exclusive to AEW but they have probably more than most. This is an industry thing. Why it's so offensive to say "That short curly haired guy looks and acts exactly the same as that other short curly haired guy" is beyond me. Compare Action Andretti and Will Osperay and then compare Bam Bam Bigelow to somebody like Earthquake or Vader. Absolutely nobody is confusing the latter two because although they're both FAT, they look and act completely different. I'm not swayed by the audiences reaction by the way. AEW and WWE will always have diehard fans. My concern is about the people who are tuning into wrestling for the first time. Are THEY stopping the channel for these generic looking guys? The answer is no. Because wrestling isn't popular in the mainstream anymore. And that's for a reason. The Jericho-Andretti match had a nice bump in viewership and the highest rated quarter hour after the first quarter among the 18-49 demo. The facts don't care about your obsolete feelings.
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Post by Mid-Carder on Dec 16, 2022 12:40:25 GMT -5
Happy for the guy, but they really telegraphed that win from the second they announced Jericho would be "in action". Jericho doesn't have matches for no reason, plus the way they hammered home that Andretti had no business being in the ring with Jericho, then the match ran through a commercial. Even Stevie Wonder could've seen it coming. You're seriously saying you knew Jericho would be losing that match?
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Dec 16, 2022 12:41:22 GMT -5
You think Andretti goes to the bank and the teller goes "Wait you look just like IWGP United States Heavyweight Champion Will Ospreay! I don't watch wrestling and I don't know anyone, but that's why I don't watch it. Wear something other than kickpads, dorkus" and then denies him a savings account?
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XIII
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
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Post by XIII on Dec 16, 2022 12:44:40 GMT -5
I mainly think that all of us, myself included, from time to time get caught up in the over analysis and minutia of wrestling and don’t always just enjoy moments for what they are. 🤷🏻♂️
This is a story as old as time, an unknown coming out of nowhere and defeating a former champion/legend that clearly is underestimating him, it doesn’t matter if he looks like 12 other guys or is completely unique. Those things will matter in the future, because if he doesn’t evolve as a performer/character then he will stagnate, but for one night none of that mattered. What matter was the story told on that night and it was a good one.
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FinalGwen
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Post by FinalGwen on Dec 16, 2022 12:50:50 GMT -5
There is no malice or judgment in saying: With my casual awareness of Ospreay and Martin I looked at Andretti from a theater like distance and thought that he is the same type with a similar silhouette. It doesn't take away from his match and the moment. It is just an immediate impression in a very visual media. Of course it gets relativized by being able to catch the details, by watching him move, rest, emote. Sadly some people on this forum have a hard time accepting that most wrestlers look and act the same these days. It's not exclusive to AEW but they have probably more than most. This is an industry thing. Why it's so offensive to say "That short curly haired guy looks and acts exactly the same as that other short curly haired guy" is beyond me. Compare Action Andretti and Will Osperay and then compare Bam Bam Bigelow to somebody like Earthquake or Vader. Absolutely nobody is confusing the latter two because although they're both FAT, they look and act completely different. I'm not swayed by the audiences reaction by the way. AEW and WWE will always have diehard fans. My concern is about the people who are tuning into wrestling for the first time. Are THEY stopping the channel for these generic looking guys? The answer is no. Because wrestling isn't popular in the mainstream anymore. And that's for a reason. Do you think a casual TV viewer would see the guy in your profile pic and name and think "boy, another middle aged white guy with a beard and leather jacket, very original" and switch over?
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Post by Cyno on Dec 16, 2022 12:57:48 GMT -5
Also "he looks completely indistinct and like a nobody." Like yeah, that was kind of the f***ing point. Even John Cena's debut against Kurt Angle he just looked like a nobody in generic trunks.
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Post by Celexa Bliss 54 on Dec 16, 2022 12:59:05 GMT -5
Happy for the guy, but they really telegraphed that win from the second they announced Jericho would be "in action". Jericho doesn't have matches for no reason, plus the way they hammered home that Andretti had no business being in the ring with Jericho, then the match ran through a commercial. Even Stevie Wonder could've seen it coming. You're seriously saying you knew Jericho would be losing that match? Im just saying, to me, it was obvious. Clearly, I'm the only one lol
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2022 12:59:56 GMT -5
Sadly some people on this forum have a hard time accepting that most wrestlers look and act the same these days. It's not exclusive to AEW but they have probably more than most. This is an industry thing. Why it's so offensive to say "That short curly haired guy looks and acts exactly the same as that other short curly haired guy" is beyond me. Compare Action Andretti and Will Osperay and then compare Bam Bam Bigelow to somebody like Earthquake or Vader. Absolutely nobody is confusing the latter two because although they're both FAT, they look and act completely different. I'm not swayed by the audiences reaction by the way. AEW and WWE will always have diehard fans. My concern is about the people who are tuning into wrestling for the first time. Are THEY stopping the channel for these generic looking guys? The answer is no. Because wrestling isn't popular in the mainstream anymore. And that's for a reason. The Jericho-Andretti match had a nice bump in viewership and the highest rated quarter hour after the first quarter among the 18-49 demo. The facts don't care about your obsolete feelings. A small bump in the already average viewership doesn't mean this approach is working. When talk shows, fitness magazines and movies are calling up, begging for guys like Action Andretti, Ricky Starks, Dante Martin, Will Osperay and The Young Bucks, come back to me. They may mesmerize the smark fans with their very obviously chereographed acrobatics but thats all they will do.
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Post by eJm on Dec 16, 2022 13:00:23 GMT -5
The Jericho-Andretti match had a nice bump in viewership and the highest rated quarter hour after the first quarter among the 18-49 demo. The facts don't care about your obsolete feelings. Yeah, he isn’t going to respond to this but man, the moment the quarters came out and it was basically confirmed his match was top overrules any and all “casual fans” argument because those people might have heard from their friends to watch the show and clearly they did. Oh and Negan, my offer in another thread is open. Prove your findings or stop talking about it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2022 13:04:55 GMT -5
Sadly some people on this forum have a hard time accepting that most wrestlers look and act the same these days. It's not exclusive to AEW but they have probably more than most. This is an industry thing. Why it's so offensive to say "That short curly haired guy looks and acts exactly the same as that other short curly haired guy" is beyond me. Compare Action Andretti and Will Osperay and then compare Bam Bam Bigelow to somebody like Earthquake or Vader. Absolutely nobody is confusing the latter two because although they're both FAT, they look and act completely different. I'm not swayed by the audiences reaction by the way. AEW and WWE will always have diehard fans. My concern is about the people who are tuning into wrestling for the first time. Are THEY stopping the channel for these generic looking guys? The answer is no. Because wrestling isn't popular in the mainstream anymore. And that's for a reason. Do you think a casual TV viewer would see the guy in your profile pic and name and think "boy, another middle aged white guy with a beard and leather jacket, very original" and switch over? If Negan was called "John" and he showed up without the barbed wire bat, wearing a plain white t shirt and jeans and had absolutely no charisma whatsoever? Yes. No way would anyone remember him or take him seriously. Infact, I'd argue Negan wouldn't even still be alive in the show if it wasn't for the presence and charisma of Jeffrey Dean Morgan.
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