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Post by Jindrak Mark on Jan 30, 2023 12:17:50 GMT -5
Now that they are actually getting decently strong booking , it is a case of boooo Becky should not be slumming it with these losers even though this is exactly what someone of her star power and longevity should be doing as it only helps the division IMO because again she is teflon It's not helping Damage CTRL though. Listen to the crowd. They're getting the same tepid reactions they were 3 months ago. If they were getting more over I could understand it but they're not, all this is doing is bringing down Becky. I think they need to get Bayley out of Damage CTRL because her as a heel faction leader just doesn't work. I'm less sure it's going to happen imminently though because if it was I think they'd have teased dissension during the Rumble match but there was nothing. They worked together better than ever so it doesn't seem like a split is coming. A few weeks ago I was thinking IYO and Dakota would kick Bayley out and it'd be Damage CTRL v Bayley and Becky at Wrestlemania but now I'm thinking maybe they stay together and Becky brings in two partners to take them down at Mania. No idea who they would be though. If Naomi's returning she could be one.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2023 12:38:28 GMT -5
Now that they are actually getting decently strong booking , it is a case of boooo Becky should not be slumming it with these losers even though this is exactly what someone of her star power and longevity should be doing as it only helps the division IMO because again she is teflon It's not helping Damage CTRL though. Listen to the crowd. They're getting the same tepid reactions they were 3 months ago. If they were getting more over I could understand it but they're not, all this is doing is bringing down Becky. I think they need to get Bayley out of Damage CTRL because her as a heel faction leader just doesn't work. I'm less sure it's going to happen imminently though because if it was I think they'd have teased dissension during the Rumble match but there was nothing. They worked together better than ever so it doesn't seem like a split is coming. A few weeks ago I was thinking IYO and Dakota would kick Bayley out and it'd be Damage CTRL v Bayley and Becky at Wrestlemania but now I'm thinking maybe they stay together and Becky brings in two partners to take them down at Mania. No idea who they would be though. If Naomi's returning she could be one. I am not saying they are super over as a group infact I have always thought once they break up all of them will be better off because we have seen that as individuals they are all better than they are collectively now why that is idk. But at the rumble and I mean seeing it from fan recordings all three get a half way decent reaction so it aint like they are not over...maybe not to Becky Lynch levels of over but they are over. And the seeds of a split have already planted , go back and listen to Bayleys last few promos with Becky where she keeps throwing IYO and Dakota under the bus , taking sole credit for their victories and about how she does not need them , has never needed them etc. it is not an overt in your face obvious break up angle but it is there.
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asuka007
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 23,661
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Post by asuka007 on Jan 30, 2023 13:10:04 GMT -5
I think the Becky vs. Damage CTRL stuff has also just gotten repetitive at this point. There’s only so many times you can see her stupidly try and go at them 1 on 3 and get beaten up before it gets old.
And Damage CTRL is just a cold act. Even beating on Becky isn’t really getting them much heat.
I think that Bianca feud REALLY did massive damage (no pun intended) to them as an act.
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on Jan 30, 2023 16:41:42 GMT -5
It's not helping Damage CTRL though. Listen to the crowd. They're getting the same tepid reactions they were 3 months ago. If they were getting more over I could understand it but they're not, all this is doing is bringing down Becky. I think they need to get Bayley out of Damage CTRL because her as a heel faction leader just doesn't work. I'm less sure it's going to happen imminently though because if it was I think they'd have teased dissension during the Rumble match but there was nothing. They worked together better than ever so it doesn't seem like a split is coming. A few weeks ago I was thinking IYO and Dakota would kick Bayley out and it'd be Damage CTRL v Bayley and Becky at Wrestlemania but now I'm thinking maybe they stay together and Becky brings in two partners to take them down at Mania. No idea who they would be though. If Naomi's returning she could be one. I am not saying they are super over as a group infact I have always thought once they break up all of them will be better off because we have seen that as individuals they are all better than they are collectively now why that is idk. But at the rumble and I mean seeing it from fan recordings all three get a half way decent reaction so it aint like they are not over...maybe not to Becky Lynch levels of over but they are over. And the seeds of a split have already planted , go back and listen to Bayleys last few promos with Becky where she keeps throwing IYO and Dakota under the bus , taking sole credit for their victories and about how she does not need them , has never needed them etc. it is not an overt in your face obvious break up angle but it is there. Damage CTRL as a stable just doesn't have a good dynamic. Bayley doesn't work well as a group leader. Then you have Iyo and Dakota who are both smaller then Bayley so they don't really work as the henchwomen of the group. I know it's a mute point now since they aren't a stable anymore but something like Toxic Attraction in NXT while inferior in the ring had a layout that was much more effective as far as being a trio goes. Nobody is going to say Mandy Rose was a better wrestler then Bayley but I would say she came off like a bigger star then Bayley and fit the role as a heel stable leader more then Bayley. Then with Gigi and Jacy while I don't think either would be classified as big in that they are more kind of mid sized women's wrestlers they at least have some size and were both taller then Mandy so them as the henchwoman worked and fit. I think your kind of overthinking it with them potentially splitting. I thought after Survivor Series it was something that was in the cards maybe too with the slight promo hints and in that I don't know how they would all fit on Wrestlemania with them still together. However lately they have been working very well together and have just been beating Becky's ass every week. Doesn't come off like a stable that's being set up for any split any time soon. Also with how much of a jerk Bayley has been lately it would be hard to turn her face at this point. I could maybe see somebody like Iyo maybe turning face later but probably not like late this year at the earliest.
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on Jan 30, 2023 16:59:39 GMT -5
I only watched the Rumbles and the post match stuff in the main event. I thought it was funny how much the men's Rumble was catered to the IWC. Gunther getting a Jesus push. Gargano getting a long run. Miz, Kross, Corbin, and Omos all getting trash showings. Thought Dominik was great with his cowardly heel schtick. I thought him lasting as long as he did was surprising but also fits with his character in that he's such a cockroach it makes sense that he would survive. Didn't like Logan Paul eliminating Seth but that spot with Ricochet was amazing I have to give him that. Cody coming in at #30 was a little much. I get wanting to ease him back in and not put too much on him coming back from an injury but why couldn't he come out at like #28 or something like that. Also it was kind of ass backwards booking having it come down to him against Gunther who was #1 in that it made the heel come off like the underdog and the hero face won because he had the easiest path. I thought the Women's Rumble was good too. Really liked the finish when it got down to Rhea, Liv, and Asuka. Liv getting such a strong showing was a pleasant surprise as she hasn't been featured much on TV lately. Rhea winning was the right choice. Didn't understand why her and Liv had to go coast to coast though. Especially after Gunther and Sheamus both had super long runs after starting the men's Rumble. When people keep constantly doing well from those positions it takes away from the luck of the draw aspect. It doesn't make getting those numbers that daunting of a challenge when so many people who get those numbers either win or come close to winning. I thought with Becky and Bayley getting eliminated half way through they should've had Becky come in early and had Liv and Rhea both come in more in the middle. Speaking of Becky I thought how they used her was the biggest miss in the match and also continued the strange deemphasizing of her in general since she's come back with her continuously getting bitched out seemingly every week by Damage CTRL who are a pretty cool act themselves right now after getting trucked by Bianca. They had her take a nap spot outside the ring immediately after Damage CTRL beat her up. I don't know why they thought this was necessary with how little actual work in the ring they had planned for her. Then after like ten minutes finally gets back in the ring and dumps the two lackies before Bayley gets the better of her again and dumps her after about a minute. It's like you cool Damage CTRL off immediately but then decide for some reason to sacrifice Becky and diminish her star power by constantly coming off like a chump at their expense. Like it's almost starting to remind of Ryback against the Shield at this point only difference being the Shield were white hot as act and hadn't been jobbed out to some other face before hand. Unless Becky is on the way out or something it just seems like very strange booking. Becky was only in the ring for about three minutes of her 11-minute stint, interestingly. I personally liked the structure with Rhea/Liv coming in early as it helped create that element of doubt wondering when Beth Phoenix was going to show up to finish the job, as well as the pattern of Rhea taking big bumps for most of the women she encountered, but there was a notable lull between the first two entrances and Roxanne at #8 where it probably would have helped having another star in there.
Bayley was #6 so that provided some star power in that section. Even it though it was a bit of a lull in that there wasn't many eliminations I actually enjoyed the early stages in that I thought it put Rhea over further in a way with stuff like Liv, Dana, and Emma all ganging up on her and swarming her. Thought it put Rhea even more over as a threat in that it was presented like "this is the girl we have to go after and get out". Reminded me of when everyone would go after Andre in some of the early Rumbles.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2023 17:01:08 GMT -5
I am not saying they are super over as a group infact I have always thought once they break up all of them will be better off because we have seen that as individuals they are all better than they are collectively now why that is idk. But at the rumble and I mean seeing it from fan recordings all three get a half way decent reaction so it aint like they are not over...maybe not to Becky Lynch levels of over but they are over. And the seeds of a split have already planted , go back and listen to Bayleys last few promos with Becky where she keeps throwing IYO and Dakota under the bus , taking sole credit for their victories and about how she does not need them , has never needed them etc. it is not an overt in your face obvious break up angle but it is there. Damage CTRL as a stable just doesn't have a good dynamic. Bayley doesn't work well as a group leader. Then you have Iyo and Dakota who are both smaller then Bayley so they don't really work as the henchwomen of the group. I know it's a mute point now since they aren't a stable anymore but something like Toxic Attraction in NXT while inferior in the ring had a layout that was much more effective as far as being a trio goes. Nobody is going to say Mandy Rose was a better wrestler then Bayley but I would say she came off like a bigger star then Bayley and fit the role as a heel stable leader more then Bayley. Then with Gigi and Jacy while I don't think either would be classified as big in that they are more kind of mid sized women's wrestlers they at least have some size and were both taller then Mandy so them as the henchwoman worked and fit. I think your kind of overthinking it with them potentially splitting. I thought after Survivor Series it was something that was in the cards maybe too with the slight promo hints and in that I don't know how they would all fit on Wrestlemania with them still together. However lately they have been working very well together and have just been beating Becky's ass every week. Doesn't come off like a stable that's being set up for any split any time soon. Also with how much of a jerk Bayley has been lately it would be hard to turn her face at this point. I could maybe see somebody like Iyo maybe turning face later but probably not like late this year at the earliest. All fair valid points. Idk if they are gonna be breaking up soon but they have had Bayley say things I am sure will be used at some point when they do split I mean her taking sole credit for their victories and saying she does not and has never needed them along with Becky goading her by telling Bayley her lackies are better than her and they have titles while she does not seems pretty clear what the intention has been...which as to say again idk if the break up will be soon but they put things out there to give valid reasons for them to eventually. And I agree the dynmaic of Dmg Cntrl has not come together as it should mainly IMO because Bayley is not fit for the leader role which is why I said the trio always feels better when Bayley takes the backseat and Dakota and IYO are the focus but this is clear a Bayley feud and so she has to take front and centre and it has put them back to their original issue of Bayley not being suited as a leader. I do not believe in the whole size being an issue because look at something like original Kai en Tai/Club Kamakaze three rather small by comparion to the rest of the roster guys who still came off as incredibly dangerous because how well they worked in tandem. Bayley is in the position she is in because she is Bayley not because she can do something Dakota and IYO cannot do...IYO and Dakota are both way better qualified to be taking the lead and really when it comes to groups something that would seem trivial can throw off everything because it diminishes the one/'s more suited to take the bigger lead and if they are not willing to change that then IMO they need to split and push them individually.
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Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on Jan 30, 2023 17:15:00 GMT -5
I think what isn’t helping the group, as much as I want it to succeed and work out for Sky and Kai, is that Bayley’s character is very bland at this point. “LOOK AT ME, I’M THE HEEL, I STICK MY THUMBS DOWN AND BOO YOU” has about as much depth as a paper plate. And because she’s the de facto leader as the tenured veteran, Kai and Sky dial down their more explosive personalities to be more like her.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2023 17:17:22 GMT -5
I think what isn’t helping the group, as much as I want it to succeed and work out for Sky and Kai, is that Bayley’s character is very bland at this point. “LOOK AT ME, I’M THE HEEL, I STICK MY THUMBS DOWN AND BOO YOU” has about as much depth as a paper plate. And because she’s the de facto leader as the tenured veteran, Kai and Sky dial down their more explosive personalities to be more like her. ^That I rambled to get to the same point but again ^That.
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on Jan 30, 2023 17:31:02 GMT -5
Damage CTRL as a stable just doesn't have a good dynamic. Bayley doesn't work well as a group leader. Then you have Iyo and Dakota who are both smaller then Bayley so they don't really work as the henchwomen of the group. I know it's a mute point now since they aren't a stable anymore but something like Toxic Attraction in NXT while inferior in the ring had a layout that was much more effective as far as being a trio goes. Nobody is going to say Mandy Rose was a better wrestler then Bayley but I would say she came off like a bigger star then Bayley and fit the role as a heel stable leader more then Bayley. Then with Gigi and Jacy while I don't think either would be classified as big in that they are more kind of mid sized women's wrestlers they at least have some size and were both taller then Mandy so them as the henchwoman worked and fit. I think your kind of overthinking it with them potentially splitting. I thought after Survivor Series it was something that was in the cards maybe too with the slight promo hints and in that I don't know how they would all fit on Wrestlemania with them still together. However lately they have been working very well together and have just been beating Becky's ass every week. Doesn't come off like a stable that's being set up for any split any time soon. Also with how much of a jerk Bayley has been lately it would be hard to turn her face at this point. I could maybe see somebody like Iyo maybe turning face later but probably not like late this year at the earliest. All fair valid points. Idk if they are gonna be breaking up soon but they have had Bayley say things I am sure will be used at some point when they do split I mean her taking sole credit for their victories and saying she does not and has never needed them along with Becky goading her by telling Bayley her lackies are better than her and they have titles while she does not seems pretty clear what the intention has been...which as to say again idk if the break up will be soon but they put things out there to give valid reasons for them to eventually. And I agree the dynmaic of Dmg Cntrl has not come together as it should mainly IMO because Bayley is not fit for the leader role which is why I said the trio always feels better when Bayley takes the backseat and Dakota and IYO are the focus but this is clear a Bayley feud and so she has to take front and centre and it has put them back to their original issue of Bayley not being suited as a leader. I do not believe in the whole size being an issue because look at something like original Kai en Tai/Club Kamakaze three rather small by comparion to the rest of the roster guys who still came off as incredibly dangerous because how well they worked in tandem. Bayley is in the position she is in because she is Bayley not because she can do something Dakota and IYO cannot do...IYO and Dakota are both way better qualified to be taking the lead and really when it comes to groups something that would seem trivial can throw off everything because it diminishes the one/'s more suited to take the bigger lead and if they are not willing to change that then IMO they need to split and push them individually. I agree that Bayley is leader mainly because of who she is. At the same time I don't think Dakota and Iyo would work in the role either. Being a leader of a upper card heel stable means a lot of talking which would be problem for Iyo. I think Dakota is effective as sort of the jackal of the group who is also kind of unhinged but I don't think she really fits being leader of a faction either. It would have to be either they replace Bayley with someone else or they just become a regular tag team.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2023 17:44:50 GMT -5
All fair valid points. Idk if they are gonna be breaking up soon but they have had Bayley say things I am sure will be used at some point when they do split I mean her taking sole credit for their victories and saying she does not and has never needed them along with Becky goading her by telling Bayley her lackies are better than her and they have titles while she does not seems pretty clear what the intention has been...which as to say again idk if the break up will be soon but they put things out there to give valid reasons for them to eventually. And I agree the dynmaic of Dmg Cntrl has not come together as it should mainly IMO because Bayley is not fit for the leader role which is why I said the trio always feels better when Bayley takes the backseat and Dakota and IYO are the focus but this is clear a Bayley feud and so she has to take front and centre and it has put them back to their original issue of Bayley not being suited as a leader. I do not believe in the whole size being an issue because look at something like original Kai en Tai/Club Kamakaze three rather small by comparion to the rest of the roster guys who still came off as incredibly dangerous because how well they worked in tandem. Bayley is in the position she is in because she is Bayley not because she can do something Dakota and IYO cannot do...IYO and Dakota are both way better qualified to be taking the lead and really when it comes to groups something that would seem trivial can throw off everything because it diminishes the one/'s more suited to take the bigger lead and if they are not willing to change that then IMO they need to split and push them individually. I agree that Bayley is leader mainly because of who she is. At the same time I don't think Dakota and Iyo would work in the role either. Being a leader of a upper card heel stable means a lot of talking which would be problem for Iyo. I think Dakota is effective as sort of the jackal of the group who is also kind of unhinged but I don't think she really fits being leader of a faction either. It would have to be either they replace Bayley with someone else or they just become a regular tag team. Under either IYO or Dakota the group would have to change and I think it would work under either. Under IYO it would have to change and draw heavy inspiration from one of the units in STARDOM which would work because then it becomes a group that is about action and not so much about promos...I would think under an IYO lead group you would look to them becoming something like Oedo Tai or her original incarnation of Queens Quest and replace Bayley with atleast 2 more under utilized women...I mean Piper is right there former member of Queens Quest under IYO. Idk what it would look like under Dakota if they tried to have her lead a heel faction but a babyface one instead could maybe work under her. If they want to keep some semblence of this together then they need to boot Bayley give leadership to IYO and or Dakota...the overall dynamic of the group has to change ...they did it with Judgment Day and look at them now.
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asuka007
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 23,661
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Post by asuka007 on Jan 30, 2023 18:59:14 GMT -5
I think what isn’t helping the group, as much as I want it to succeed and work out for Sky and Kai, is that Bayley’s character is very bland at this point. “LOOK AT ME, I’M THE HEEL, I STICK MY THUMBS DOWN AND BOO YOU” has about as much depth as a paper plate. And because she’s the de facto leader as the tenured veteran, Kai and Sky dial down their more explosive personalities to be more like her. I feel like Bayley could use a face turn soon. I think we’ve gotten about as much out of her as a heel as we can at this point.
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Post by Gerard Gerard on Jan 30, 2023 21:13:31 GMT -5
I think what isn’t helping the group, as much as I want it to succeed and work out for Sky and Kai, is that Bayley’s character is very bland at this point. “LOOK AT ME, I’M THE HEEL, I STICK MY THUMBS DOWN AND BOO YOU” has about as much depth as a paper plate. And because she’s the de facto leader as the tenured veteran, Kai and Sky dial down their more explosive personalities to be more like her. I feel like Bayley could use a face turn soon. I think we’ve gotten about as much out of her as a heel as we can at this point. I hope she's conflicted for a while and starts seeing wacky, waving, arm-flailing inflatable tube-men everywhere guiding her back toward the light.
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Legion
Fry's dog Seymour
Amy Pond's #1 fan
Hail Hydra!
Posts: 23,410
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Post by Legion on Jan 31, 2023 13:16:37 GMT -5
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Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on Jan 31, 2023 13:23:13 GMT -5
This feels like maybe it needs it's own thread, but ima put it here first, so Reddit users noticed the following about the Bianca/Alexa match: https://www.reddit.com/r/funny/comments/10pz77h/wwe_is_running_out_of_ideas/ It may already be in the thread, but 278 pages is too much to check through. It might’ve been pointed out when it happened on RAW, but if it weren’t for the comedic holding the head spot, it’d just look like a regular part of a wrestling match.
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Legion
Fry's dog Seymour
Amy Pond's #1 fan
Hail Hydra!
Posts: 23,410
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Post by Legion on Jan 31, 2023 13:29:41 GMT -5
This feels like maybe it needs it's own thread, but ima put it here first, so Reddit users noticed the following about the Bianca/Alexa match: https://www.reddit.com/r/funny/comments/10pz77h/wwe_is_running_out_of_ideas/ It may already be in the thread, but 278 pages is too much to check through. It might’ve been pointed out when it happened on RAW, but if it weren’t for the comedic holding the head spot, it’d just look like a regular part of a wrestling match. It's the snyc up that does it. They should have saved that for the Rumble match. At least actual comedy can hide poor chemistry.
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Post by hbkid718 on Feb 4, 2023 18:04:51 GMT -5
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on Feb 5, 2023 4:42:32 GMT -5
Man I wish you either posted this earlier or I waited a bit longer before I started as this would've saved me a lot of time when updating and calculating the stats for my Rumble Participant Countdown. That Total Time section especially would've been helpful and much easier then having to use a time calculator.
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Post by hbkid718 on Feb 5, 2023 14:17:52 GMT -5
Man I wish you either posted this earlier or I waited a bit longer before I started as this would've saved me a lot of time when updating and calculating the stats for my Rumble Participant Countdown. That Total Time section especially would've been helpful and much easier then having to use a time calculator. Sorry. I used a time calculator too to add previous times to this year's times.
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on Feb 5, 2023 15:11:33 GMT -5
Man I wish you either posted this earlier or I waited a bit longer before I started as this would've saved me a lot of time when updating and calculating the stats for my Rumble Participant Countdown. That Total Time section especially would've been helpful and much easier then having to use a time calculator. Sorry. I used a time calculator too to add previous times to this year's times. It wasn't that big of an issue in that I had a lot of the guys total stats who have been in it in recent years. It's more an issue with guys like Booker T who haven't been in one in years so then I have to use the time calculator and put in all of his ring times from every year he was in it.
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Woo
Hank Scorpio
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Post by Woo on Feb 6, 2023 1:57:05 GMT -5
That was a great PPV. I did skip the Bray and Alexa matches, but the Rumbles were very enjoyable and the end was steller.
I was impressed by some of the NXT girls. Zoey Stark and Roxanne Perez looked fantastic too.
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