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Post by CeilingFan on Sept 9, 2023 11:03:23 GMT -5
A person who is not a Wrestling fan looks at Roman Reigns and Jack Perry. Who will look more like a World Champion to that non-fan?
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Post by "American Cream" Dusty Loads on Sept 9, 2023 11:09:40 GMT -5
A person who is not a Wrestling fan looks at Roman Reigns and Jack Perry. Who will look more like a World Champion to that non-fan? I don’t mean to sound rude, but who cares what a non fan thinks?
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Post by Doo Doo Dickhead on Sept 9, 2023 11:19:01 GMT -5
A person who is not a Wrestling fan looks at Roman Reigns and Jack Perry. Who will look more like a World Champion to that non-fan? I don’t mean to sound rude, but who cares what a non fan thinks? I'm one of FAN's biggest CeilingFan fans, but I'll never understand this argument.
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pinja
Unicron
Posts: 3,023
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Post by pinja on Sept 9, 2023 11:30:27 GMT -5
Was the "will never be world champion" always an argument or did it only become an argument after WWE's midcard died a sad death? Bischoff's stupidity doesn't interest me, but this line of thinking does. If a wrestler is destined to become a world champion but doesn't fulfill the promise, is there merit to say they are expendable opposed to putting them into the midcard? Is there more merit today then let's say during the attitude era? I think there's more merrit now because the roster and pool of wrestlers outside aew is bigger. At some point it's best to not renew a contract to make room for someone with more potential. Depends what's been invested in them, what do they add to shows now, what's their ceiling, how old are they and who else fills a similar role. For example if in a few years it's becomes clear that Hook is never likely to progress to the top he's unique enough to still have a role in the midcard. However if Action Andretti has stalled then he's more expendable because there's likely to be a dozen similar younger wrestlers to choose from. It is also the other side of the coin of the thought, that calling for a wrestler to be fired is an inherently vile thing. Because when Miro (extreme example, I know) allegedly turned down every idea and decided to not work instead, I gathered: Fire the guy and give the money to young outside talents willing to prove themselves. Wrestlers usually aren't just fired, but replaced.
Perry has a lot of upside and I understand why his ceiling was made out to be world champion. But I don't feel like he'll get there by staying in AEW for ten years. And when someone isn't good enough for the main event, where is the cutoff to say they are good enough for the midcard? Because there are a ton of wrestlers who could perform on a main event level, who I still don't deem main event material. Vice versa if you can't perform on a main event level, are you even midcard material?
A bit rambling and I was trying to abstract it from Perry.
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chazraps
Wade Wilson
Better have my money when I come-a collect!
Posts: 28,016
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Post by chazraps on Sept 9, 2023 11:37:33 GMT -5
A person who is not a Wrestling fan looks at Roman Reigns and Jack Perry. Who will look more like a World Champion to that non-fan? They're both outstandingly handsome athletes in absolutely incredible shape. You basically just asked "a person who is not a Boxing fan looks at 1988 Mike Tyson and 2007 Floyd Mayweather. Who will look more like a World Champion to that non-fan?"
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chazraps
Wade Wilson
Better have my money when I come-a collect!
Posts: 28,016
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Post by chazraps on Sept 9, 2023 11:44:15 GMT -5
Jack Perry is just such a wild choice to make the "who looks most like a champion to a non-fan" argument, which is a shitty flawed argument to begin with. But, trying to make that with JACK PERRY?
He has the body, the traditionally handsome features, the hair, the toning, and (since we've seen him wrestle barefoot) the height.
He's the exact visual aesthetic you'd want from a marketable mid-20s wrestler.
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Kalmia
King Koopa
Happy to be here
Posts: 11,854
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Post by Kalmia on Sept 9, 2023 11:44:22 GMT -5
A person who is not a Wrestling fan looks at Roman Reigns and Jack Perry. Who will look more like a World Champion to that non-fan? You can't have a roster full of world champions though. You need mid-carders, lower-carders, tag team wrestlers, veterans etc to have a proper roster. Should we fire FTR Bald because next to Roman Reigns, he'd just look like a normal guy? Next to Roman Reigns, Bret Hart would just look like a normal guy with greasy hair.
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Post by Doo Doo Dickhead on Sept 9, 2023 11:51:12 GMT -5
Next to me, Roman Reigns looks like James Ellsworth.
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Chiral
Salacious Crumb
Posts: 74,014
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Post by Chiral on Sept 9, 2023 11:57:27 GMT -5
A person who is not a Wrestling fan looks at Roman Reigns and Jack Perry. Who will look more like a World Champion to that non-fan? Quit baitin' sug
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Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Sept 9, 2023 11:59:17 GMT -5
Hulk and friends running wild at the top was Bischoff's fault though. Austin was well regarded in WCW off the blondes and dangerous alliance, he had more upside and it's business being pushed than Brutus Beefcake. No doubt about that, Austin was one for the furure and with a higher ceiling than Beefcake etc, but I find it very, very difficult to see how he becomes Stone Cold over and big if he stays in WCW, which seems to be the implied meaning of the "He fired Steve Austin!" argument. Do you see it? I'm genuinely curious. How many of the pieces of the Stone Cold Steve Austin character existed prior to the WWF? The look, Austin had been balding since 1990 so the shaven head and beard were inevitable as Hogan, Quake, Kevin Sullivan et al were already there rocking the skullet, The character was cobbled together from his prior work, the fact he was a a huge ass former football player from Texas and what Shane Douglas was doing in ECW, none of which had anything to do with the WWF creative process giving him something tailor made for him. His wife came up with the Stone Cold name if I remember correctly so even that could have come about elsewhere. Austin wasn't like Kane, something created by the company and put on a guy who wasn't over and wouldn't have been over without it, he was a product of Austin's life and the wrestling landscape at that time. It's impossible to say Austin would have become a redneck antihero in WCW, but it was entirely possible he could have, if Bischoff wasn't giving Hogan the moon on a stick at everyone else's expense.
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Post by Tiger Millionaire on Sept 9, 2023 12:03:23 GMT -5
A person who is not a Wrestling fan looks at Roman Reigns and Jack Perry. Who will look more like a World Champion to that non-fan? A baseball fan looks at Mickey Mantle and Terry Pendleton. Which one of them should be allowed to play baseball?
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tenshi
Patti Mayonnaise
Probably more memorable than a Charlotte title reign
Posts: 34,104
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Post by tenshi on Sept 9, 2023 13:00:13 GMT -5
A person who is not a Wrestling fan looks at Roman Reigns and Jack Perry. Who will look more like a World Champion to that non-fan? A baseball fan looks at Mickey Mantle and Terry Pendleton. Which one of them should be allowed to play baseball? Or Aaron Judge and Bartolo Colón, if you want another example. I mean, Bobby Lashley took a picture with Shohei Ohtani for a media appearance with the Angels and Ohtani towered over Lashley... even though Ohtani isn't portrayed as physically imposing.
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asuka007
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 21,134
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Post by asuka007 on Sept 9, 2023 13:34:00 GMT -5
A person who is not a Wrestling fan looks at Roman Reigns and Jack Perry. Who will look more like a World Champion to that non-fan? They're both outstandingly handsome athletes in absolutely incredible shape. You basically just asked "a person who is not a Boxing fan looks at 1988 Mike Tyson and 2007 Floyd Mayweather. Who will look more like a World Champion to that non-fan?" One of the highest grossing MMA fighters for years was a smaller, tattooed Irish guy.
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Post by Doo Doo Dickhead on Sept 9, 2023 13:43:09 GMT -5
They're both outstandingly handsome athletes in absolutely incredible shape. You basically just asked "a person who is not a Boxing fan looks at 1988 Mike Tyson and 2007 Floyd Mayweather. Who will look more like a World Champion to that non-fan?" One of the highest grossing MMA fighters for years was a smaller, tattooed Irish guy. I'm this board's biggest draw and I'm barely 5'7".
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Post by tagteammatchplaya on Sept 9, 2023 13:49:20 GMT -5
A person who is not a wrestling fan looks at Madcap Moss and every other wrestler, obviously Madcap Moss looks more like a world champion to that non fan, Wrestling Fans and Non Wrestling Fans can all agree Madcap Moss is the GOAT
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Post by Zombie Mod on Sept 9, 2023 13:54:15 GMT -5
A person who is not a Wrestling fan looks at Roman Reigns and Jack Perry. Who will look more like a World Champion to that non-fan? hulk hogan, ultimate warrior, big daddy, giant haystacks, the rock. a non fan would only know those names (country depending.) as wrestlers and any that have stood out in the news for random reasons.
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Post by Cyno on Sept 9, 2023 14:07:04 GMT -5
I mean we've had plenty of guys be world champion that do not look like what you'd expect to be world champions to a non-fan. Bryan Danielson, Rey Mysterio, Christian, Mick Foley, CM Punk, Eddie Guerrero, etc.
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Post by Zombie Mod on Sept 9, 2023 14:15:06 GMT -5
A person who is not a Wrestling fan looks at Roman Reigns and Jack Perry. Who will look more like a World Champion to that non-fan? Quit baitin' sug Dixie?
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Post by Dr. Bolty, Disaster Enby on Sept 9, 2023 14:43:02 GMT -5
Jack Perry is just such a wild choice to make the "who looks most like a champion to a non-fan" argument, which is a shitty flawed argument to begin with. But, trying to make that with JACK PERRY? He has the body, the traditionally handsome features, the hair, the toning, and (since we've seen him wrestle barefoot) the height. He's the exact visual aesthetic you'd want from a marketable mid-20s wrestler. Yeah, like...this is why I always feel like the "how do you think the casuals will accept this small guy?!" arguments always sound like the most insular wrestling-brained perspectives to me. Jack is hot y'all, and it's really conspicuous to me when that is completely disregarded. Even if he doesn't do it for you, wrestling has always had space for attractive men. Attractiveness isn't everything any more than promo skills, workrate, or size is, but like. It's not nothing.
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Chiral
Salacious Crumb
Posts: 74,014
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Post by Chiral on Sept 9, 2023 14:56:12 GMT -5
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