EvilMasterBetty, Esq.
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Bird...Birdie...birdie......Tiger...Tiger Tiger.....
R2C2 Reporting for duty
Posts: 17,355
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Post by EvilMasterBetty, Esq. on Jan 3, 2007 3:08:29 GMT -5
So you're saying that, in the context of a No DQ match, if i hired the entire ROH lockerroom, I could not beat Cena?
Again, I'm not saying one on one or even 5-1. I'm talking 20-30 legit wrestlers against 1. Cena stands no chance and shouldn't no matter what you say. The problem is that people only hear what and not think how. The how is more important than the what in wrestling. You can have a no one beat a someone if it's booked right.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Jan 3, 2007 3:08:57 GMT -5
Can we stop with the whole " end of story" and the various analogues therein at the end of our opinions? It doesn't lend any more weight or relevance or make anyone think 'wow he sure told me guess there's nothing more to be said' ( and I say he, cuz I've never seen any of the XX chromosome crowd do that silly thing) It just looks pompous.
And I disagree with the article's guy opinion.
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Post by Spankymac is sick of the swiss on Jan 3, 2007 3:19:19 GMT -5
So you're saying that, in the context of a No DQ match, if i hired the entire ROH lockerroom, I could not beat Cena? Again, I'm not saying one on one or even 5-1. I'm talking 20-30 legit wrestlers against 1. Cena stands no chance and shouldn't no matter what you say. The problem is that people only hear what and not think how. The how is more important than the what in wrestling. You can have a no one beat a someone if it's booked right. No, you can't. A nobody should never beat your top guys, especially the CHAMP, no matter how it's booked. If Federline had feuded with a midcarder, I wouldn't be as pissed, because he's not one of the top guys. I'd still be annoyed at his prescence, but he wouldn't be beating a top guy 123 in the middle of the ring.
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EvilMasterBetty, Esq.
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Bird...Birdie...birdie......Tiger...Tiger Tiger.....
R2C2 Reporting for duty
Posts: 17,355
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Post by EvilMasterBetty, Esq. on Jan 3, 2007 3:21:13 GMT -5
ok, i'm done here. It's worthless. You aren't even considering what I'm talking about.
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Post by Spankymac is sick of the swiss on Jan 3, 2007 3:23:06 GMT -5
ok, i'm done here. It's worthless. You aren't even considering what I'm talking about. Then by all means explain how having some idiotic nobody beat the CHAMP, and the cornerstone of the company, even with interference, is a good idea.
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EvilMasterBetty, Esq.
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Bird...Birdie...birdie......Tiger...Tiger Tiger.....
R2C2 Reporting for duty
Posts: 17,355
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Post by EvilMasterBetty, Esq. on Jan 3, 2007 3:31:01 GMT -5
Ok, here's how last night should have gone down.
Cena's in the ring already. K-Fed get's introduced.. Goes on spiel about it being a no DQ. Cena's like "Ok whatever I'm still going to kick your ass" K-Fed then says he brought his posse to watch, but out comes like 10-12 heels from the back. They storm the ring. Cena puts up some fight but is overwhelmed and is pinned.
Then McMahon's music hits (since he can freely move from face to heel it seems) and says he's fed up with K-Fed making a mockery of his champion. He then says that the match will happen again as the main event. Still No-DQ, but adds that if anyone interferes they'll be FIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRED.
Later on in the main event, Cena beats the piss out of KFed and wins.
Not only do you get the initial bump, you get people to keep watching (Hopefully) to wait for K-Fed to get his ass kicked. You get a bump at the end of the night. Not only that, you take the fans on a ride and give K-Fed insane heat and let the marks pop HUGE when Cena finally gets him 1-1.
Now if that doesn't make sense, then I'm really done.
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Azraith
AC Slater
There Are No Heroes Left in Man
Posts: 101
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Post by Azraith on Jan 3, 2007 3:34:13 GMT -5
If you're looking for credibility in professional wrestling, why the hell are you watching the WWE? Watch TNA. Watch Dragon Gate. Watch NOAH. Watch ROH. There are literally dozens of alternatives for people that are tenacious enough to look for them. It's just that the WWE is there. It's always there. It's the wrestling version of crack. You can hate it, it can disgust you...but eventually you need your fix and you'll go crawling back to it. Then you'll sit back and whine about it later.
If you don't like what's going on, don't watch. Don't buy every damn PPV they crank out. Stop throwing money at McMahon and maybe he'll get the point.
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Post by Spankymac is sick of the swiss on Jan 3, 2007 3:34:39 GMT -5
No, I'll admit, that actually makes sense, and would have been worlds better than what they actually did. But it still doesn't answer my question. How was having some idiot beat the champ a good idea in any way shape or form the way they did it, because that seems to be where you're coming from.
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EvilMasterBetty, Esq.
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Bird...Birdie...birdie......Tiger...Tiger Tiger.....
R2C2 Reporting for duty
Posts: 17,355
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Post by EvilMasterBetty, Esq. on Jan 3, 2007 3:37:52 GMT -5
It's a good idea in the sense that you want to try to both make the final beating even sweeter and also get people to watch your whole show. So maybe you don't say exactly when the match will take place later, you just say that later on they'll be a rematch. That way casual fans will sit through the rest of the show, and hopefully you wow them enough with the rest that they tune in next week.
I do see your point that it's not the best idea, but there is a logic to it.
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Post by Spankymac is sick of the swiss on Jan 3, 2007 3:40:45 GMT -5
I still say that they should have just had Umaga beat down Cena and not wasted a perfectly good paycheck on that waste of oxygen Federline.
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Post by 8-BitAssassin on Jan 3, 2007 3:54:23 GMT -5
Quick reality check: nobody really expected Cena and Mr. Spears to have a "real" match. Nobody really expected K-Fed to train hard and become a well-oiled wrestling machine. Nobody expected a 5 star match- hell, nobody expected a damn competition out of this match. K-Fed was never going to showcase his technical prowess or even hit any high flying spot-monkey moves to even the odds with Cena and maybe, just maybe save face and try to win over the crowd.
If you thought otherwise, I'm afraid you have the wrong idea about pro wrestling- er, "sports entertainment."
Let's look at this strictly from a wrestling point of view, shall we? Kevin Federline, despite- nay- BECAUSE of his complete lack of talent and likability, is a heel. Now lest we deceive ourselves into believing otherwise, let's remember what a heel is there to do: make us hate them. Why? Pick a reason. To make the faces appear better by comparison and thus get a good reaction? Sure thing. To unite the crowd, no matter their individual tastes, by way of a common "enemy?" Bingo. To wrench an honest to god emotional response from people who otherwise know that it's just a show? Right on. Like I said, take your pick. They're all true.
Since the beginning of time, heels have had one thing in common: they fight dirty. Hell, some of them don't really even fight. They have someone else take out the face and they get all the credit for it. Happens All. The. Time. It always has been and always will be the sign of a heel to cheat to win, to interfere to win, and to generally make the crowd despise them.
K-Fed has one thing going for him that most other heels never did, though: he was hated by most everyone before ever stepping foot in a wrestling ring. He has no business there, making wrestling fans hate him even more. I wish the guy would get wished well in his future endeavors as much as the next smarkidy-markidy internet fan, but let's be honest... the man has every quality needed by a good heel save one. He can't wrestle. At all. Not even enough to put on what looks like a match before cheating. That's why he had better not stick around long. If he busted out with some actual moves, it would be another story entirely.
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Post by Timmy8271 on Jan 3, 2007 4:23:19 GMT -5
I was watching Countdown on MSNBC today and they were talking about Cena/KFed. Not only did they mention the match, They mentioned Umaga helping KFed win. Therfore, It makes the people that like to see KFed want to watch raw, and know about Umaga and Cena. It actually helps WWE in the short term. Long term? People won't remember.
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ldavis
Trap-Jaw
Fire and Skulls- a winning combo
Posts: 345
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Post by ldavis on Jan 3, 2007 5:48:04 GMT -5
Bah and again I say bah. I'm loving the hand wringing of oh no K-Fed beat John Cena. Oh the horrors! As if when it was announced as a No-DQ you couldn't see it coming, and if you couldn't well....that's another issue altogether.
K-Fed didn't beat John Cena. Umaga did. It's not like K-Fed suplexed him, slammed him around, hit his "I got Britney's money, bitch" finisher and beat him clean. If that happened, and I'd say yeah, that ranks an 8.9 on the stupid scale. Umaga did the work, laid Cena out, K-Fed cleaned up. Whooptee do. Hell if you want to sell someone getting laid out, then anyone should be able to beat the person who got laid out. That's the whole idea of being laid out.
Now Umaga is a bigger heel and seems like an actual threat to Cena, K-Fed's a bigger heel if the use him again, which I imagine they will and the Cena-Umaga feud gets a shot in the arm.
Plus they actually talked about it on the Tonight Show and MSNBC supposedly. I don't think wrestling has been talked about on mainstream media since the heyday of the The Rock and Austin anyways.
Plus in the end K-Fed got his ass kicked after all and if they use him again, he probably will again.
Seriously the whole save face for the WWE is ridiculous. This is the company that exploited Eddie Guerrero's death, had Katie Vick, Al Wilson and hired K-Fed in the first place knowing exactly what they'd get. There is no saving face. The WWE is trashy, has been for a while now. Don't delude yourself into thinking otherwise.
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Jiren
Patti Mayonnaise
Hearts Bayformers
Posts: 35,163
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Post by Jiren on Jan 3, 2007 6:23:27 GMT -5
To be honest i found K-fed to be one of the better heels on RAW (Not wrestling ability wise).
He gets more heat than Umaga, and dare i say Cena was actually liked by more than just the Pre pubesent boys & Girls when he was "Feuding" with Nitro & K-fed
He & Nitro made me mark for Cena AND I HATE CENA!!!!!
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Post by Loki on Jan 3, 2007 7:26:02 GMT -5
Since when has Pro Wrestling been a serious matter?
An entertainment show where men in spandex pretend to fight eachother to settle down their issues has lost "credibility" because a C-list celebrity (which is still more popular than 99% of pro wrestlers) won a no DQ match with the help of two other guys?
GIMME A BREAK!!!
All those 'net writerz and most of smart fans are clearly overreacting and throwing the toys out of the pram for no real reason. Other then showcasing their "wisdom"...
Pro Wrestling (and especially WWF/E) has had celebrities appearences in the last 20 years, so K-Fed isn't the first one and won't be the last one...
Over-the-top is pretty much synonymous with Pro Wrestling, so I don't really get why so many of us pretend/expect to watch a consistent and sensible product from one of the "lowest" forms of entertainment.
Oh, and BTW, nobody outside the (Internet) Wrestling Community gives a crap about WWE (not to mention TNA. ROH, and all the bush league feds), so K-Fed's appearence is indeed a good move from Vince. At least Pro Wrestling can get 2 minutes of fame thanks to Federline's antics.
From a business standpoint, a useless celebrity like Federline can generate more interest (and hence more potential viewers) than a 6 stars match with every IWC fan favourite.
WWE know they won't lose the markish fanbase (which watch out of habit/addiction). The smarkish fans will more or less stay for the same reasons, so I don't blame Vince for trying to appeal to more fans.
I don't like K-Fed, the storyline and the half-assed mainstream claims but at least they're trying to do something DIFFERENT instead of the same old same old we've been fed since the Attitude Era faded away.
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Post by Virt McGirt on Jan 3, 2007 7:52:15 GMT -5
...AND THE MCMAHONS STILL WONDER WHY NO ONE TAKES THEIR COMPANY SERIOUSLY?... Nah, I think they came to grips with that A LONG TIME AGO. ;D
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Post by willywonka666 on Jan 3, 2007 7:56:16 GMT -5
So Leno's making fun of this? He wrestled before Federline even considered it-I like Leno though
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Post by seanwalsh on Jan 3, 2007 8:43:03 GMT -5
The ultimate comparison is when David Arquette won the WCW World Title. Arquette pinned Eric Bischoff in a tag team match to win the belt. To Arquette's credit, he proved to be a standup guy, by donating all the money he made from wrestling to the families of Owen Hart and Brian Pillman. He gave the money to the Harts and Pillmans?!? I never knew this, and now respect Arquette much more than I did 15 minutes ago.
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Post by romafan87 on Jan 3, 2007 12:34:00 GMT -5
Since when has Pro Wrestling been a serious matter? An entertainment show where men in spandex pretend to fight eachother to settle down their issues has lost "credibility" because a C-list celebrity (which is still more popular than 99% of pro wrestlers) won a no DQ match with the help of two other guys? GIMME A BREAK!!! All those 'net writerz and most of smart fans are clearly overreacting and throwing the toys out of the pram for no real reason. Other then showcasing their "wisdom"... Pro Wrestling (and especially WWF/E) has had celebrities appearences in the last 20 years, so K-Fed isn't the first one and won't be the last one... Over-the-top is pretty much synonymous with Pro Wrestling, so I don't really get why so many of us pretend/expect to watch a consistent and sensible product from one of the "lowest" forms of entertainment. Oh, and BTW, nobody outside the (Internet) Wrestling Community gives a crap about WWE (not to mention TNA. ROH, and all the bush league feds), so K-Fed's appearence is indeed a good move from Vince. At least Pro Wrestling can get 2 minutes of fame thanks to Federline's antics. From a business standpoint, a useless celebrity like Federline can generate more interest (and hence more potential viewers) than a 6 stars match with every IWC fan favourite. WWE know they won't lose the markish fanbase (which watch out of habit/addiction). The smarkish fans will more or less stay for the same reasons, so I don't blame Vince for trying to appeal to more fans. I don't like K-Fed, the storyline and the half-assed mainstream claims but at least they're trying to do something DIFFERENT instead of the same old same old we've been fed since the Attitude Era faded away. This is what I was trying to say. Thank you.
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Post by lildude8218 on Jan 3, 2007 12:59:08 GMT -5
Anyone else notice the Irony of Jay freaking Leno, who wrestled a match in WCW, talking about this bring a joke? I found it more ironic when Jay Leno had Candice Michelle on his show within the last 18 months or so and laughed in her face when she said she was training to become a wrestler. Jay: And....haha....what's this about you training to become a wrestler? Candice: Yes, I've been working hard with my in-ring skills. *Jay laughing right in her face* Now if only Jay Leno had been a guest on the Candice Michelle show
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