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Post by mrfujiwara on Apr 30, 2009 15:24:39 GMT -5
You can't just think of your favorite ECW matches or shows and think that is a realistic idea of what made ECW great. ECW was amazing because of the TV Show. The segments got the talent over, the matches were clipped together so every match seemed exciting, they contained stars all on the verge of breaking out, and had amazing music for the time instead of the cheesy themes WWF and WCW were using. I do think people overate it sometimes(the wrestlers during shoot interviews to be specific), but it was DEFINITELY amazing.
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Post by Slingshot Suplay on Apr 30, 2009 15:41:23 GMT -5
Hardcore blood and guts aside, ECW had great matches and great talent throughout it's run and the fact that WCW and WWF were noticing an indy fed speaks volumes to me. Guys who were discarded by the 2 big feds were re-creating themselves and making names for themselves when the "creative geniuses" that were booking at the time had no idea how to use these guys.
Keep in mind, ECW was revolutionary because they were having actual entertaining 10- to 20 minute wrestling matches and giving interview time to guys who never really had mic time in the other feds. WWF was still doing "The New Generation" gimmick and were trying to be family friendly and steroid free, but only gave 3-5 minute matches against jobbers. WCW had identity problems too, trying to change styles from the Flair wrestling style to the Hulk Hogan 1980's style matches and booking.
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Post by Youngie on Apr 30, 2009 16:44:21 GMT -5
ECW brought in some great wrestlers: Eddy Guerrero, Malenko, Mysterio, Jericho and other guys who could legit wrestle. So they're good in my eyes. Fans were blood thirsty though.
Brian Pillman was great there too.
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Mozenrath
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Post by Mozenrath on Apr 30, 2009 16:45:56 GMT -5
The answer is, both.
It was awesome to watch and all, but overrated for the fact ECW fans will gleefully gloss over any mistakes they made. Not that it didn't have a lot of good since it was more or less a clipshow, so a lot of botches got the chopping block, but it wasn't perfect like they say.
Same goes for Attitude era WWF or the height of the nWo angle.
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Hiroshi Hase
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Post by Hiroshi Hase on Apr 30, 2009 16:49:25 GMT -5
Liked it a lot back in the day, but now it's kinda hard to watch sometimes as it's just one big clusterf***.
One of the things I found interesting and a bit ironic, is how ECW fans hated musclemen or guys who can't "work" but yet gave Sid a hero's welcome in places like New York and Philly.
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Post by Bobby Womack on Apr 30, 2009 18:25:05 GMT -5
Awesome. No other word describes it. I understand that the younger folks here don't think much of it. How many of them were actually old enough to watch it when it was in its' prime? I won't shy away from being a mark for the original ECW. It re-sparked my interest in wrestling as a whole. Couldn't get enough of the Attitude era. Without ECW, I wouldn't even bother watching it. The ECW stars on RAW back in 1997 were a big deal to my brother and I. It meant that ECW had made it. We watched ECW Hardcore TV religiously too. its rather arrogant to assume that if someone doesnt like what you like then they must be a new fan, i was watching at the time of ecw's peak and i found wcw at the time to be putting on a much better quality product, especially in ring wise You can't just think of your favorite ECW matches or shows and think that is a realistic idea of what made ECW great. ECW was amazing because of the TV Show. The segments got the talent over, the matches were clipped together so every match seemed exciting, they contained stars all on the verge of breaking out, and had amazing music for the time instead of the cheesy themes WWF and WCW were using. I do think people overate it sometimes(the wrestlers during shoot interviews to be specific), but it was DEFINITELY amazing. its easy to have great music when you can steal hit songs and use them without fear of being sued because nobodys heard of you |
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h
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Post by h on May 1, 2009 0:09:06 GMT -5
The original ECW was simply amazing. The skilled technicians, the luchadors, the hardcore wrestling, the Raven vs. Tommy Dreamer storyline, The Gangstas vs. The Eliminators, The Sandman going against everything that an athlete should be, the Rottens' Taipei death match, Sabu, the Blue World Order, Mikey Whipwreck as the quintessential underdog, Shane Douglas turning on wrestling's very history...truly groundbreaking, and truly a good time to know people who got the channel, taped the shows, and were willing to ship them in exchange for postage and the cost of a blank tape.
By 1998, it was time to pack up. It's an unfortunate reality that money was the determining factor. ECW was responsible for innovations, and WCW bought them. ECW was responsible for more innovations, and WCW bought them. When it seemed like everything they had was taken away, ECW kept thinking of new ideas. Come 1998, though, they had nothing left to offer. The massive Dudley clan had dwindled to the two least interesting members. The Full Blooded Italians just plain sucked. Justin Credible, Mike Awesome, Rhyno...absolutely nothing special. The last few years were a shadow of what the company once was.
Of course, now it's a shadow of the shadow of the company that it once was, so even dull 1998-2001 ECW was better than Vince McMahon's watered-down water version.
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Starlight Starbright
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Post by Starlight Starbright on May 1, 2009 0:31:50 GMT -5
^.. ..Although he was a late part, I still thought LSD was interesting. Many have made great points I will not repeat but I think original ECW was awesome but then it was so awesome, it peaked and then the rabid fans overrated it. They were so awesome the talent got stoled, part of the awesomeness was the overration kicking in. But yeah Credible, FBI, etc sucked.  |
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Post by weekendwarrior on May 1, 2009 0:46:18 GMT -5
It was both.
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Post by "UnHoly AltarBoy" Tyler Shane on May 1, 2009 0:54:25 GMT -5
I'll say both. I loved it, and I'll never forget the shows I went to at the Downingtown Farmers Market, or at the Arena, but its also very overrated these days. It was great, amazing even, but not as much as some would have you to believe. And thats from someone who watched damn near every last bit of it.
BTW: Hardcore TV was fun, and I'll never forget the channel, its burned into my brain. WGTW Channel 48, serving Burlington and Philadelphia. lol. They used to have indy wrestling on every night at 12 am. It was great. I miss the 90's.
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Post by derrtaysouth95 on May 1, 2009 10:00:06 GMT -5
It was awesome because it was different and it was the first big indy promotion stateside that ended up getting national attention.
At the same time however, it was overrated for what they were doing in their time compared to WWF & WCW.
ECW was awesomely overrated.
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Post by angryfan on May 1, 2009 10:09:43 GMT -5
I'll say both. I loved it, and I'll never forget the shows I went to at the Downingtown Farmers Market, or at the Arena, but its also very overrated these days. It was great, amazing even, but not as much as some would have you to believe. And thats from someone who watched damn near every last bit of it. BTW: Hardcore TV was fun, and I'll never forget the channel, its burned into my brain. WGTW Channel 48, serving Burlington and Philadelphia. lol. They used to have indy wrestling on every night at 12 am. It was great. I miss the 90's. I always saw Hardcore TV as a sign of true fan-dom. What I mean is, in my area, the times and days for airing were always changing, so it became an effort to find the show week to week. Plus, it was usually on at some ungodly hour, so I'd be up til 3:30 or 4 in the morning channel surfing with rabbit ears trying to find the show. Yet, I never felt like I was wasting my time. |
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Post by Joekishi on May 1, 2009 10:20:42 GMT -5
I loved my week in 1999. Monday-Nitro and RAW Wed-Thunder Thurs-Smackdown Fri-ECW Sat-Jakked, Saturday night, Hardcore TV. I remember staying up late in saturdays because in LA they'd always change the time of the show. Look i loved watching it, but i hated the non-sensical overbooking that they relied on near the end |
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on May 1, 2009 10:28:44 GMT -5
It was alright.
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Post by chunkylover53 on May 1, 2009 12:08:10 GMT -5
It was basically the Ross Perot of the three. It was full of ideas, but was not a threat to the bigger two and everybody knew it. I'm pretty much stuck in the middle.
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Post by Tea & Crumpets on May 1, 2009 13:24:13 GMT -5
Justin Credible, Mike Awesome, Rhyno...absolutely nothing special. ....... Mike Awesome, nothing special? The dude was amazing. 6'8" or so guy who could fly like a cruiserweight and do ultra-crisp power moves. Rhino was fun in ECW too. Credible wasn't great no. I never saw ECW back in the day, I have seen all I have seen of it through a mixture of the internet, and a copy of Anarchy Rulz 1999 I bought for £3 at Woolies 5 1/2 years back. And personally I love it. yes it had a lot of weak spots-The Gangstas I never enjoyed, nor the Public Enemy (the only time I like New Jack was the first tim I saw him on Anarchy Rulz 99, after that I realised he was just the same old same old.). ECW had its weaknesses but sure wasIMO great, it had a lot more good actual wrestling action than people will credit it, and it also had good actual hardcore wrestling-I dont consider hardcore wrestling to be garbage wrestling. Hardcore wrestling is using the weapons to ENHANCE the match, nto take the place of the match like New Jack and etc. did. I've seen a lot of good stuff and some bad stuff of ECW but as a whole package, I think it was very good, but could never have really reached the levle of WCW or WWE because of its style. Its greatest strength in its different-ness and originality (barring some of the FMW/Japan based ideas), was also its weakness as networks weren't keen on it. |
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Post by alanguitar1 on May 1, 2009 13:59:11 GMT -5
I loved their wrestling. Was never a fan of the ten minute "fast forward as they "fight" through the crowd" stuff the gangstas and eliminators and bruise brothers would do. Their wrestling however was awesome, van dam vs dudleys for the tag titles is great, cause they follow rules, etc, and lance, candido, etc, were all great there. And I like the looser atmosphere, where guys can cut their own promos, and also that it looks like it could take place in your town/it's not a big arena.
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Post by i.Sarita.com on May 1, 2009 14:21:19 GMT -5
Bilvis Wesley
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Post by Lenny: Smooth like Keith Stone on May 1, 2009 14:27:37 GMT -5
I thought for the most part it was very edgy and groundbreaking at the time. I would never go so far as to say it was amazing, since they had Wrestlecrap just like any other promotion did (95% of which was during the TNN days).
Honestly as far as the violence goes, I think some of today's promotions like CZW and IWA-MS are way more violent than the original ECW ever was (New Jack excluded -- he was always way over the top with violence).
The big draw of the original ECW was not necessarily the wrestlers or the angles. It was more about the bond between the promotion and its loyal fans. The reason people still chant "ECW" at Tommy Dreamer isn't necessarily because he was a spectacular wrestler. I think it's mainly because the original ECW was very much like a family -- a family that included the wrestlers and fans alike.
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2009 8:28:50 GMT -5
If it wasn't for ECW, I have no idea if I would be a wrestling fan to this day. The WWF was at a really low period and WCW seemed to focus more on Hulk Hogan and his buddies. I got the tapes because I'd see guys I remember from the "Big Two" like Shane Douglas, 2 Cold Scorpio & Cactus Jack (and the Funk Brothers) and wanted to see what they were up to. Plus, I'd read in the wrestling magazines a lot about this guy Sabu, and how he was setting the wrestling world on fire with "innovative offense".
Then I'd see guys like the Sandman & Public Enemy. Eddy Guerrero, a guy I remember from the When Worlds Collide PPV as a part of one of the best matches I've ever seen. I was hooked instantly.
Did it have crap? Sure it did. But Heyman & Company wasn't afraid to roll the dice and take a chance with something, what did they have to lose?
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