|
Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Jun 22, 2011 15:29:34 GMT -5
Simmer down, folks. This does not need to get personal.
|
|
|
Post by Michael Coello on Jun 22, 2011 15:30:02 GMT -5
Every wrestler wasn't required to be a bad sports-entertainer or a guerrilla promo, backstage with crazy shaky camera thespian. But the wrestlers that were that (Hogan, Warrior, Piper, Heenan, etc.) got ahead, not the guys who were just wrestling in the ring for no reason, and it got more and more focused as time went on. In an era where most people that are considered over have gotten over or gotten more over via Youtube promos and twitter comments, as well as promos on TV, you can't get by, or exceed, on just ring skills alone.
|
|
|
Post by cabbageboy on Jun 22, 2011 15:38:30 GMT -5
I don't think anyone has a problem with a wrestling show having promos to build to a match, but half the time on Impact I don't seem to see anything that builds to anything at all. All of these Bischoff and Hogan promos are leading to nothing, and in addition they also have too many promos building to the same match (Angle/Jarrett).
Regardless of what anyone in TNA thinks, when you hype that "Wrestling Matters" most people think that it means your actual MATCHES matter. To say otherwise is to justify stuff that people don't want to see.
|
|
MrBRulzOK
Wade Wilson
Mr No-Pants Heathen
Something Witty Here.
Posts: 26,719
|
Post by MrBRulzOK on Jun 22, 2011 15:38:49 GMT -5
The problem is that TNA uses waaaaay too much seasoning. Think about it. Has there ever been a match that's gone on longer than any TNA promo? If there has then it has been a rare occassion for sure.
Really, you have shows where you can go nearly an hour without a single match up. No, instead you have to get a few dashes of salt, a pinch of paprika, a hint of tabasco, a sprinkling of pepper, a dab of oregano... and then when you finally get your dish it's in such a small portion that it makes you feel insulted that you waited so long for it. Plus you constantly have the chefs running back in to sprinkle even more seasoning on there while you're trying to simply digest it!
Sure, sometimes you might get lucky and get a completely undisturbed meal: No chefs running in; no foul taste left in your mouth afterwards; just a decent meal. Sometimes even a great one. But again you have to ask yourself is it really worth waiting all that time for such a dish when more often than not it's going to be either tainted, in such small portions that it'll never fill you up, occasionally big enough, but will be ruined when someone runs into the room and knocks it off the table, or even so horrible that you'll be vomiting all over the table after finishing it.
Do our meals from TNA really need so damn much seasoning?
|
|
|
Post by Perpetual Nirvana on Jun 22, 2011 15:39:47 GMT -5
Gunner and TNA in general need to put on their big-girl pants and suck it up. The so-called 'internet fans' are all they have left. Which apparently means that these internet fans can say whatever they want without apprehension because if you do correct them, you're offending these people that the worst they think they can do is keep doing what they were doing and just bitch LOUDER. Well...yeah. There's always gonna be someone complaining so what's the point?
|
|
Krimzon
Crow T. Robot
This guy is the man!
R.I.P. Deadpool
Posts: 43,870
|
Post by Krimzon on Jun 22, 2011 15:41:17 GMT -5
Simmer down, folks. This does not need to get personal. Yes it does! Gunner's honor is at stake!
|
|
|
Post by Michael Coello on Jun 22, 2011 15:42:02 GMT -5
Which apparently means that these internet fans can say whatever they want without apprehension because if you do correct them, you're offending these people that the worst they think they can do is keep doing what they were doing and just bitch LOUDER. Well...yeah. There's always gonna be someone complaining so what's the point? The same reason you're all so adamant to complain: you think it will help.
|
|
|
Post by Perpetual Nirvana on Jun 22, 2011 15:49:06 GMT -5
Well...yeah. There's always gonna be someone complaining so what's the point? The same reason you're all so adamant to complain: you think it will help. I haven't complained about anything in this thread so thanks for that. But have you never heard the expression that you can't please all of the people, all of the time? Do artists constanly call out people who bad mouth their work? Do directors go off on people who criticise their films? You know, Uwe Boll aside. Unless you're suggesting that nobody is allowed to criticise anything, ever. Though I wouldn't be surprised if that was your stance regarding TNA.
|
|
MrBRulzOK
Wade Wilson
Mr No-Pants Heathen
Something Witty Here.
Posts: 26,719
|
Post by MrBRulzOK on Jun 22, 2011 15:53:34 GMT -5
Well...yeah. There's always gonna be someone complaining so what's the point? The same reason you're all so adamant to complain: you think it will help. No, the reason most people complain is because it's a way to express their feeling about something. Think about it? What would be healthier? Being upset by something and holding all your feelings about it deep inside or finding a healthy forum and letting loose all that frustration stored up? And this is a message board after all. Would you rather everyone simply talk about how wonderful TNA is all the time and never say a bad thing about them? It's not like anyone is forcing you to read any of these negative threads, after all. Nobody is holding a gun to your head to make you read about how awful a wrestler someone thinks Velvet Sky is or how laughably bad something thinks Vince Russo's storylines are. You say that complaining doesn't matter, but honestly does defending any of these complaints matter either? Do you think that by defending this show so stubbornly that Dixie is going to send you a check for all your crusading against people who don't care for Impact Wrestling in one way or another? Or that she is going to express her heartfelt gratitude for being such a valiant protector of the company? And most of these people complaining don't always have something bad to say. Heck, when Impact Wrestling does something well than I'm more than happy to commend them for it. I'd have to think that I'm not the only one either. If I didn't care somewhat about Impact Wrestling then I wouldn't even be posting in this section.
|
|
babyfootball
Don Corleone
At least as good as Ron Garvin!
Posts: 1,320
|
Post by babyfootball on Jun 22, 2011 15:57:28 GMT -5
So, you want to combat my analogy by using one that has NO BEARING on my discussion, cause that is what you were doing. My point was that there is a point to promos and stuff along with wrestling. It's the preparations and seasoning for the main dish, yet all people want is the food without any cooking or anything the minute they step in until the minute they walk out, and that's not what anything in wrestling is about. But I don't think that's what (most) wrestling fans want, and I don't think that's what anybody here is saying. Most wrestling fans love good promos and skits and storylines, but the point is that wrestling is at it's best when everything makes sense and is compelling and, most of all, leads to a good match that makes for good viewing. After all, that is what wrestling is all about! What separates wrestling shows from shows like SNL is that it's not supposed to be two hours of random variety entertainment. It's supposed to lead to a match, inside the ring. That's why I'm a wrestling fan, and not a fan of variety/sketch comedy shows. Sure, there are some fans out there who would prefer total, non-stop non-psychology spotfests (Mrs. Dash), just like there are some fans that prefer ultraviolence (Tabasco sauce), some fans who prefer cartoony, oversized 'roid freaks (sugar and butter), and last but not least, some fans who would shell out a pretty penny for a DVD of nothing but bra-and-panties matches starring Harvey Wippleman(uhh... I got nothing). But I really do think that those of us who just want a good, well-rounded product that ultimately comes down to wrestling matches make up the majority of wrestling fans (note that I'm not saying anything about the general public of non-wrestling fans out there, a.k.a. the "casual, channel-surfing viewer"). Thus, wrestling is the "main course" in one's dining experience. Seasoning and everything is great, but nobody wants to eat a main course that is just a bunch of items that can be found in the spice aisle of your local grocer thrown together in a bowl by themselves. I don't see how this isn't the point you derived from the post by angryfan that you quoted that I initially quoted you on? Look, I didn't mean to get personal, but it seems to me that you feel so compelled to defend everything TNA/its talent does, that your defensiveness causes you to look for arguments that aren't there. It's frustrating. To stay on topic, I can understand Gunner being annoyed with the idiots out there who are so overbearingly negative about everything, but I really don't think that this represents the majority of so-called "internet wrestling fans." Let's face it, if you have 10 people, and 9 of them make totally rational, sane (if not always super-compelling) arguments, and 1 guy starts spouting off totally crazy, inane crap that only vaguely relates to the matter at hand, who's everybody going to remember? The 9 Bob Backlunds or the 1 Hulk Hogan?
|
|
babyfootball
Don Corleone
At least as good as Ron Garvin!
Posts: 1,320
|
Post by babyfootball on Jun 22, 2011 15:58:47 GMT -5
The same reason you're all so adamant to complain: you think it will help. No, the reason most people complain is because it's a way to express their feeling about something. Think about it? What would be healthier? Being upset by something and holding all your feelings about it deep inside or finding a healthy forum and letting loose all that frustration stored up? And this is a message board after all. Would you rather everyone simply talk about how wonderful TNA is all the time and never say a bad thing about them? It's not like anyone is forcing you to read any of these negative threads, after all. Nobody is holding a gun to your head to make you read about how awful a wrestler someone thinks Velvet Sky is or how laughably bad something thinks Vince Russo's storylines are. You say that complaining doesn't matter, but honestly does defending any of these complaints matter either? Do you think that by defending this show so stubbornly that Dixie is going to send you a check for all your crusading against people who don't care for Impact Wrestling in one way or another? Or that she is going to express her heartfelt gratitude for being such a valiant protector of the company? And most of these people complaining don't always have something bad to say. Heck, when Impact Wrestling does something well than I'm more than happy to commend them for it. I'd have to think that I'm not the only one either. If I didn't care somewhat about Impact Wrestling then I wouldn't even be posting in this section. Or... what this guy^ said.
|
|
ICBM
King Koopa
Didn't know we did status updates here now
Posts: 12,288
|
Post by ICBM on Jun 22, 2011 15:59:47 GMT -5
Meh, I understand but when u do this u sort of. Become a mark(don't tell him I called him a mark) He has sort of a point but foley sold it on tv as wrestling that mattered in wrestling matters
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2011 16:03:39 GMT -5
Company line, no surprise. Gunner's been around a while, loyal to TNA/Impact, and he's servicable. He's their Hardcore Holly, getting a "thank you" push. Why jeopardize that payday by saying anything beyond the script? My issue with the idea is this. If the skits and promos lead to nothing but more skits and promos (many of which are done backstage, then the lack of payoff will lead to something they don't want. If you tell me I'm going to see "wrestling" and I either shell out a good chunk of change or stand in line for hours, I expect to see people in the ring going full speed. I may get some promos that lead to stuff or build up to the big match, but the match IS the key and centerpiece to it all. I may go to a restaurant and be blown away by the atomosphere, the decor, the musical selection, and the incredibly friendly waitstaff, but ultimatly I'm there to eat a good meal. If the frienldy waiter brings me the best damn rolls I've ever had and is great with keeping my drink refilled, I'm a happy guy who will love the "extras". However, if I sit there for two horus and they keep promising the main course, but it never arrives, will I be happy? Hell no. And if a waiter or member of management told me that "it's the total experience that matters here, not just the meal" and that by demanding the food that I expected and not being happy to sit and enjoy the atmosphere I "don't get it" then feeling insulted is absolutely understandable on my part. Except, in your analogy, this isn't someone asking for a dinner, when all they get is rolls and water. It's someone demanding dinner the moment they step in, even when they haven't ordered it yet and all the ingredients are still in the pot. Except in his analogy, or sadly most TNA analogies, when it finally shows up it tastes like rotten feet And the reason I complain (which frankly I rarely do compared to most) is that I used to enjoy TNA and I still WANT to enjoy TNA. Right now, I don't and this makes me unhappy. Incidents such as these, to my mind at least, show a general insecurity at the heart of TNA. Guys like Gunner and Bischoff etc complaining about the internet not liking them, is like the prom queen wannabe complaining that people don't find them attractive. It comes across as petty, meaningless and does nothing but hurt their image. And that for me is the point. I really, REALLY want to like TNA. There are so many wrestlers there that I think are awesome and there have been times (most notably the late asylum and internet only era) where I've really enjoyed it. However, on top of the shows general lack of quality, imho, I'm being told by people inside the company that my opinion doesn't matter and voicing it makes me an idiot. How is this making me, an on the fence fan who would happily watch if the product appealed to me, add my viewership, live ticket and merchandise money to the franchise? It doesn't, it makes me think to hell with you, you petty little 7 year old crybabies.
|
|
|
Post by Bram wants to 'urt you on Jun 22, 2011 16:07:10 GMT -5
TNA: Wrestling Matters. But by "wrestling" we don't mean what you think we mean.
|
|
|
Post by gnr123 on Jun 22, 2011 16:11:29 GMT -5
This bantering against the IWC, TNA has been doing lately just show's you that they can't take constructive critism.
I admit, I haven't watched Impact the last 2 week's, or the PPV. But, when I watch a wrestling show, be it WWE or TNA, if something's good I'll say it's good, if something's bad I'll say it's bad. The stuff like having Bischoff and Hogan having a 20 minute promo every week that lead's to nothing, tha'ts bad. Bringing guy's back to use for the Destination X PPV, and haivng Samoa Joe as a more dominate factor in TNA, that's good.
This kind of thing they have against the IWC is just making TNA look like a bunch of whining babies who can't take cristism. Not everybody is gonna love your show, just like how not eveybody is gonnal ove WWE, but I raraley ever see a WWE superstar's have a rant against the IWC becuase WWE is above that, they understand the critism, but don't pay attention to it becuase most of it is from the Attitude Era smark's, or ROH fan's. Anyway, just becuase someone doesn't like what your doing, if your a respective person, you ignore them, and just don't care, not bash them.
|
|
|
Post by Kash Flagg on Jun 22, 2011 16:34:31 GMT -5
Glad to see things haven't changed.
|
|
|
Post by Kevin Hamilton on Jun 22, 2011 16:37:26 GMT -5
Simmer down, folks. This does not need to get personal. Yes it does! Gunner's honor is at stake! Where's Peter Cetera when ya need him?
|
|
|
Post by smokey1980 on Jun 22, 2011 16:44:16 GMT -5
I like Gunner, and I don't blame him. This is the line that Bischoff and Russo have been touting for a long time, and it makes sense for Gunner to back them up, especially considering he's getting pushed right now.
His argument is still weak and simplistic, though, because I hardly know anyone who has called for just random, meaningless matches and a show that's 100 percent wrestling. Everybody loves promos and angles. All anyone asks is that they make sense, and actually *build* interest in the matches. As a longtime viewer, it seems nearly indisputable that TNA often, not always, but often fails in this aspect.
To use the cooking analogy, of course the ingredients have to be there in a dish. But if you use the wrong ingredients, the wrong portions, the wrong combination, and are constantly changing recipes in the middle of the process, you end up with a crappy dish.
|
|
|
Post by Citizen Zero on Jun 22, 2011 16:54:53 GMT -5
TNA: Wrestling Matters. But by "wrestling" we don't mean what you think we mean. More like TNA: Butthurt Matters.
|
|
|
Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Jun 22, 2011 16:59:27 GMT -5
Simmer down, folks. This does not need to get personal. Yes it does! Gunner's honor is at stake! Damn rights it is! Poor Gunner, always gettin' so much hate. I got his back tho
|
|